Interesting events taking place. Thinking of buying more. Anyone here selling or holding?
Bitcoin down 33% - Selling or Holding? (22/12/2017)
follow on 22/12/2017 - 20:10
Last edited 17/01/2018 - 19:43 by 1 other user
Last edited 17/01/2018 - 19:43 by 1 other user
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They can, since the transactions are only pseudo anonymous. Also, if you opened an account on an exchange and transferred AUD to the crypto-exchange, which I did, then they can track you. I do not know the capacity or technical expertise, but some of the people in ATO are quite bright.
Also, to the best of my knowledge, since the exchange is an Australian exchange, it will also send the ATO summary of your transactions.I suppose they have this one covered too:
- Buy crypto using an exchange
- Make lots of money trading
- Go overseas, open an overseas bank account
- Withdraw from that account
- Fly home, exchange USD for AUD
@GregMonarch:
If you trade on the domestic exchange, the details go to ATO.
Your best bet is overseas exchanges. But then, when you try to bring in money, you have to declare beyond a certain amount.
This method might work for a couple of thousands. But what of you made millions?@tomleonhart: Why? The tax on a few millions would be really substantial. I guess best would be to talk to a good accountant.
Why sell? google satoshi's living room
Sell. Don't turn your back on the central banking cartel, Australia.
Holding. This is a long game. Events of last few weeks/months are just a lot of naive idiots trying to make a quick buck piling into the market and driving the price too high too fast….of course they all follow the crowd and panic sell the second the price starts falling. I reckon a few whales are at work playing their naivety as well…
Yep, the whales are having a great old time. The huge profits they made as the market rose more than covers the cost of maintaining a reasonable price. The losers will be those late to the party.
Then since it has been falling again and it's all a scam to make them wealthy… Wouldn't these 'whales' all have sold out today/before today?
You need to ask the whales about their strategy.
have you sold your house to buy more BTC ?
Bitcoin never really made much sense to me as it wasn't directly tied to anything of any intrinsic value.. In hindsight I figure I underestimated the impact of the underworld.. (and those who monopolized early for cheap).. In the end it's worth what people are willing to pay for it at any given moment.
I used to play a computer game where they had an auction house.. I noticed that people would sell a certain item for cheap that was a bit of a random spawn and not easy, but there were enough players competing to sell it, which caused it to be cheap.. So every time I checked, I would purchase all of the ones that were cheaper than what I wanted to sell mine for..If mine were the only listing available I would mark it up 20-50x what I would have otherwise, which would be eventually purchased..
I kind of feel like bitcoin is a bit like that scenario..and the main winners are the ones who capitalized early on…Everyone else afterward is a cog on the wheel..The problem really is people will realize that it is the creators who benefit the most out of all this crypto stuff and there will be a gazillion different crypto technologies all trying to accomplish the same thing..Most people get into it for the quick buck and move to the next investment..
But in the end ..it is still monopoly money…that people are willing to accept.
Exactly. Why's the price so high? Cause someone had it before me? So the value they create is to have been in first. That's all.
I personally refuse to buy bitcoin. It is an aging technology now and will eventually die. High fees will kill it.
There are other cryptocurrencies which will be far better in the long run.
Those are called "shitcoins"
looks like I've upset 5 shitcoin peddlers
Xrp from ripple has a good future
Ripple and Ethereum have my vote.
Shows you don't have much knowledge about cryptocurrencies.
how do i buy these bits of coin?
Over the last 3 hours, I have been messing around with APIs and developing a Bitcoin Ticker so I can monitor BTC and several other cryptos and log data to file. During this time, the price of BTC has fallen from around $14,280 USD down to $13,000 neat. i.e. A $1,280 drop in less than 3 hours. Friends at work were trying really hard to talk me into buying some BTC on Friday morning (they were over $19,000 USD then). So glad I didn't …
so glad i sold at the peak (almost). didn't see this coming either.
Never knew why people will go crazy buying fake internet points in first place :-p.
because it's been highly profitable for the people who understand blockchain technology and the future of it.
It's not that hard to read a few books/websites that explain it… this information readily available that's why more people keep jumping on and hence the price goes up :)
Ya but this is not even best implementation of the blockchain tech, not only that there are other instruments which are better suited to financial acceptance. This was always more of a bubble.
Agree completely, think it's the effect of being the first household name that's given its success….Being featured on international and national news as well as popular tv shows such as big bang theory gave it a platform to promote it everyday joes …
it's truly interesting to watch as it involves so many variables that cant be predicted
The fact is Bitcoin has seen a parabolic rise that has now been broken.
People are now being hurt and are in denial.
Failed parabolic charts have happened many times in history as human behaviour repeats.
Doesn't mean it won't recover later, maybe much later, even possibly to new highs. That's unknown, but for now it's no longer one sided mania.More reading:
https://thestockbandit.com/parabolic/HODL – Hold on for dear life
Dutch tulip Middle Ages and Herding. are 2 English words I learnt from Bitcoin! lol
Absoloute mania IMO
The inefficient exchange of energy for a digital code with a inherent value many times below the asking price. Has to come crashing down at some stage.
But who knows, in these situations the proponents are always very right untill they are very very wrong
its going to go down more. Now is the time(and price) to rack up $XRP
xrp is quite high atm
HODL
How this token compared to Bitcoin?
https://thetulip.auction/#homeThere is only 1 token available.
This is surely scarce.
What is its chance of going up 100000000000000000000000% in 100 years?
I think that token is just a joke to make idiots giggle. Probably won't be worth anything
The value of bitcoin is its a currency outside the central banking system. If its traded as a commodity and hoarded. ..it has no value….
I agree. And, if the tax office are going to be monitoring / checking transaction histories and taxing any capital gains you make, then it is not outside government's scope / control system. (To register an account to buy/sell crypto now, you have to provide the same sort of information you provide to a bank). Cypto is NOT anonymous. Fees are high for BTC and others will rise as well. At least two of the big reasons for it being initially attractive are dead in the water. Frightening stuff.
And to hold a crypto currency (atleast BTC), realistically, people have to simply buy it by paying for it in dollars/currency. The whole point of moving away from a gov backed currency is then moot.
I ride the highs and lows like a true pirate.. I ain't never selling I just bought in a few hundred dollars to be part of the experience.. but if you want my financial advice which is worth less than your local baker who only knows how to bake bread and nothing else I would say to buy in until it reaches $15,000 USD again.
HODL and buy buy buy!
So many normies..now is when you should be buying and averaging down your costs.
Advice from a non normy? Are you covering all peoples potential losses based on your apparent clairvoyance? Will you put this in writing for us? Then we have a sure thing as you state, and if the site admins will back up your guarantee, I'll buy in this week for 100% sure wealth. Yeehaw.
Spoken like a true normie ;) Why you larping? You wanna get rich in a market with no regulation with a fail proof guarantee. Your post was not very clever, sorry.
The only thing you get when trying to pick bottoms is smelly fingers
Averaging down is a mugs game
Its a mugs game if you are playing the game in the stock market. You really havent played around crypto if you think you cant average down
I'm glad I come here. So many people who can predict financial markets weeks ahead with precise detail. I'd just have to guess otherwise. Thanks, I'm going to be rich.
Someone put up a link to cardano intro vid in another Bitcoin discussion here on ozb. I like the concept.
_
I wanna get on the crypto shit so going to buy a bit of cardano for long term hold. First time trader here.What are the advantages and disadvantages of using coinspot. Any suggestions.
Simply don't use coinspot unless u want to lose 6% straight away
I've noticed this, what are the safe exchanges with low fees? Getting destroyed on fees atm
Btcmarkets is good I went from AUD to ripple 0.85% I think easy verification and first deposit via bpay took 1-2 days.
What else would you use?
The verification process itself takes 2+ weeks.Took 15 mins for me. (Btcmarkets)
Same here, it took 2 weeks for them to send a letter for verification but worth the wait I would say. All those AUD to altcoins exchanges are rip-offs
Sometimes it takes that long. Like Soluble mine was very quick. It could be to do with what info people enter to get verified. e.g. I put phone number and drivers license.
Coinspot might be good for a first time user as they have a lot of alt coins you can buy with AUD, but the fees to buy are quite high (3-4% off memory).
I highly recommend BTC markets because the fees are only 0.85% and you can also place limit orders, and verification is instant (at least it was for me).
If you want to buy alts, buy ETH from BTC markets, transfer to Binance (no verification needed for most purposes), and buy the coin of choice there with ETH. Much cheaper, and its what a lot of people are using internationally.
Just hold until it's worth 1 mill.
A bird in hand my boys, a bird in hand!!!
It's just the people who don't understand it and needed money for christmas gifts who sold out. It was the people who couldn't really afford to invest real money into it getting out.
Chuck $500 into, what's the risk? DYOR
The concept of money is based on trust, ie it is essentially an IOU, and is normally tied to a countries wealth and is backed with gold reserves or proven assets.
What is Bitcoin backed by? It is essentially one person's imagination, and has no inherent value, save for what the believers are willing to pay for it.
I believe it's a pyramid scheme, albeit a fancy one, and will have the same outcome as all pyramid schemes.
Rather than just neg this comment if you disagree, could you rebut my comments with healthy discussion?
Thanks.
Negged
At least the dutch had some tulips to show for it.
@tony76 It has been a long time since the US dollar was backed by the gold reserve, because there is not enough liquidity in physical gold for the US. We are so used to thinking money and government are mutually inclusive that we cannot imagine a world where money belongs to the individual and is not monopolised by the government. Why does a financial currency that was earned by an individual's honest work be valued by a centralised authority?
The idea of cryptocurrency is a trustless limited ecosystem that is decentralised and its worth be determined by the collective. It has a maximum number of coins unlike the dollar which does not have a limit in circulation. If you put in the time, money and effort for bitcoin, you are rewarded by the system with bitcoins in an adaptive decentralised manner (these days its very centralised due to the hash power that top miners control). You dont have to trust your accountant to not forget a 0 at the end.
Of course everything is in the very early stages but the technology has every chance to finally usher in an era where money and government arent the same entity and you are in control of your own money.
backed with gold reserves
This hasn't been the case since Nixon took the USD off the gold standard in 1971. And since the USD is the world's reserve currency, every other currency isn't backed by gold.proven assets
Like oil? Forcing every other country to buy oil with the USD lest there be war and sanctions is a great asset indeed.What is Bitcoin backed by?
Trust. The block-chain was designed so we don't need a central authority to trust in when exchanging value.But if you trust the the central banking system, the Quantitative Easing band-aids and the fractional-reserve banking mechanics, then yeah, cryptocurrencies are pretty useless.
"The Creature from Jekyll Island : A Second Look at the Federal Reserve" is a good read on how the central banking system works.
Or if that's too long: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFDe5kUUyT0I understand what you're saying because I said it too. But what I didn't get at the time was, 'real' money is called fiat (fake/artificial) currency for a reason.
First money was something rare - gold and silver (which is also fake, since it was found in DIRT, lol). Then someone came up with the idea of storing the gold securely in one place and instead issuing paper money, whose 'value' was backed/guaranteed by the gold. But then they separated the gold from the paper money, making paper/plastic money an I.O.U. - government promises it's worth $x.
So the only value paper money has today, is because everyone around you says it has value. The value of money is an opinion - an illusion. No more, no less, than bitcoin too is an opinion/illusion. The only reason we don't think of money as without value, is because everyone around us has said it does for so long.
Since they're both illusions, neither is safer/riskier than the other - until they are - and no-one knows when, or even if, either will happen. Just because government promises the cash you have today will still have value tomorrow, doesn't really mean zip. Real estate was a 'safe' investment too. Until the GFC hit and plenty of people in the USA handed back the keys and paid rent. So were managed funds - until Australian pensioners lost huge chunks of value.
Why bitcoin though? Sure, cryptos might be the future, but bitcoin is inherently flawed. It's a proof of concept that really has no place as a currency or an investment.
If i sold btc everytime it was down 33%, i'd have a lot less money
If u like high risk go for it if not buy shares.
Shares with dividends, you mean. ;-p Otherwise they too are high risk.
I've tried many times to research the stock market. Despite what all the 'experts' claim - it's also gambling. Less risker than other forms of gambling perhaps, but still gambling. You can pick apart a prospectus and do all the research you like. But you never know 100% if some crim in the company is fudging the books (ala Enron).
yup. FU Dick Smith
Cashew nuts salted is more valuable than Bitcoin to me.
Ok
You're nuts.
I got into Crypto earlier this year when Bitcoin was about $1500 each and purchased about 75 coins. At the time it was a huge risk and basically all of my savings which was basically my home deposit. Everyone around me said not to do it. My GF even threatened to leave me.I thought I was ahead of the game and most of the mainstream won't be able to catch up as it would be not be affordable in 2018, I was right. My GF then and now my fiance have basically become Bitcoin advisers to 200 people lol, friends friend, cousins coming out of woodwork, etc. It is like winning the lotto only better because you feel that this belongs to you as you risked everything to get it. Not saying it will be all rosy as it could all end up in shit tomorrow so only dump money in that you can afford to lose. I did risk everything (5 years of savings) but I was single and didn't have kids or a mortgage (renting).
Are you for real? Did you cash out and buy a house?
Don't need to cash out. You can use BTC to pay your banks and other BPAY facilities
You were single but had a GF then who is now your fiance?
by GF he probably meant a not so serious relationship those days but fiance he meant he is now committed to marry her, a more serious relationship.
"GF even threatened to leave me" - so if bitcoin did not turn out how it has turned out recently, would she have left you?
Just saying brother… Once you sign on the dotted line, it is like a down payment of 50% to her in eye of Family Court.
Now I am not suggesting anything, but someone wise told me that if he/she can't handle me at my worst, he/she doesn't deserve me at my best.
Good luck and all the best. Just a stranger online mumbling out his/her 2 cents, I am not in position to judge nor am I judging.
WOW, well done - you've truly got balls of steel.
How much tax do you have to pay?
Don't need to cash out so No tax. You can use BTC to pay your banks and other BPAY facilities
Proof or it never happened.
username 'dreamscene' noted
My GF then and now my fiance have basically become Bitcoin advisers to 200 people
And started peddling shitcoins on ozbargain:
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/348085?page=2#comment-5390…
I admire your no guts no glory bet on Bitcoin. This is certainly something I could never do.
Hope you keep all those winnings mate.
If I were in your position, I would invest most of it in Vanguard High Growth ETF and live happily ever after.
Also, I hope like hell you protect yourself from your GF getting her hands on any of your money.
Real investors like me wont start buying until it hits $50k. The extra financial infusion of fresh funds will then cause its value to increase by a factor of 2.5 within 36 - 48 hours.
LOL, I'm waiting till it hits a million, and then I'm buying up big.
if ninetyNineCents is a "Real" investor then I wonder if that makes you a Really Real investor?
Sell sell sell if you've made money then sell.
A lot of people are comparing this to gambling. So lets use an example.
This guy reckons BTC will be $1m by the end of 2020.
That means as of right now you're roughly getting back 62 to 1 if he is right.
Now you have to assess the "true odds". If you think there is >1.6% chance what he is saying will happen, then in gambling terms you have an edge.
Having bought when it dipped to 15k, i'm now 5-6k per btc richer :)
Assuming you have the whole BTC.
How does the taxing of cryptocurrencies like bitcoin work? If i were to buy low and sell high and then keep this profit in AUD on the exchange would it still count as accessible income? Or does it become accessible income once I withdraw the money from the exchange into my bank account?
Started with 3k, turned it into 4k.
Diversified into other crypto markets and other products.
Today closed a trade making $50 from $200 :D
Also earnt about 700 euro in passive income, all this month alone.The Winklevoss twins have become billionaires from Bitcoin. Whereas journalists and news reporters (who are not even remotely rich) are telling you not to invest. Do you trust the people with results or people with none?
Speculate all you want, if you believe Bitcoin will crash, then you now have the option to buy bear futures and make money when it crashes.Remember that currencies are not backed by gold anymore, merely the idea it has value.
Gold is massively destructive for the environment to mine too, not to mention inflated in price as it is constantly mined.
Recognise, that news outlets do not have your interest at heart.
Recognise that you should not take investment advice from non-investors.
For as long as you work for your money, you will never reach a point where you can stop working, the system was not designed to allow you to retire.Have the Winklevoss boys made a billion out of it, or just hold it? If the later, they are pretty much pulling the strings? These are my legit concerns.
One of them will turn out to be the evil twin.
How will the ATO find out out your bitcoin transaction ? :-)