Does Anyone Miss The Days of Made in Japan Electronics?

88mph on 22/11/2017 - 11:46
Last edited 22/11/2017 - 12:01 by 1 other user

To quote a famous line:
Doc - No wonder this circuit failed, it says 'Made in Japan'
Marty - Whadaya mean, Doc? All the best stuff is Made in Japan

I grew up in an average household in your run of the mill average developing country. I recall in the early 80’s my father bought a Hitachi colour TV, shortly after a National top loader VCR. I recall the VCR was worked fine until the late-90’s, and was retired due to lack of tapes and popularity of VCDs, not a fault. I got my first Walkman in 1985, a Sony WM-22. Sad as it sounds, my best friend, till it’s rubbers gave way around 1997 (I wasn’t too techy at the time, else would have surely repaired it). All this stuff was Made in Japan.

When I started earning for myself in the late nineties and moved out and started buying my stuff the transition away from Japan to other Asian plants had begun. Bought a Sony TV paired with a Panasonic VCR, both assembled outside Japan, lasted 3-4 years max. Rinsed and repeated a few times over the years… Was fortunate to bag a 2nd hand Made in Japan Sony HiFi FH-B7CD in the late-90’s, still works perfectly to this day. Even survived a trip in a suitcase when I migrated down under…

Most of the stuff I buy these days always seem to have a life expectancy of 3-4 years max, if lucky. Although I try to (as sanely possible) seek Made in Japan stuff, my last success was a Panasonic Plasma VT55 series TV back in 2011, touchwood still going strong.

  • Would you pay a bit extra to get a Made in Japan item, like the glory days of the 80’s to early 2000’s?
  • Or is it a lost hope?
  • Or will Japanese companies someday realise if they could (profitably) manufacture in Japan again, people might buy their stuff with added zeal?

Interested to hear some opinions…

Electrical & Electronics

Comments

    • [Deactivated] on 23/11/2017 - 16:05

      Did you get any fish on it?

  • atrorz on 23/11/2017 - 15:05
    +2

    i didnt see anyone mention it yet - but all the older products you're talking about are mechanical hardware, not much or any software required. The issue japan really had is that they had perfected the hardware, but they were left behind by software innovators. Tvs, phones, pbx's, all these things are basically now computers with a chassis - you don't make very much money on the hardware anymore, its all about patenting software and selling the software off (especially for ongoing software support subscriptions). You'll notice a lot of those big companies you mention are in the red each year, or just barely breaking even —- there was a total shift and unfortunately japan despite seeming so futuristic actually missed the boat here. When i first went to japan in 2011 (5 years after iPhone launched), i dont think i saw a single iphone, everyone had japanese phones and were still tapping away with physical buttons on Japanese made phones —— the last time i went, everyone had an iphone or android phone… just an example where they stuck to the more mechanical and missed the software boat again :(

    I think Hitachi was one who announced they would stop making consumer electronics and start concentrating on the big industrial stuff again and have turned a profit now.

    Having said that, i miss it too.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 15:36
      +1

      Interesting insights, thank you. Until you pointed it out, did not see it from a HW/SW angle. I also recall when the iPhone was the buzz down under, Japanese news clips had people with flip phones.

      • atrorz on 24/11/2017 - 13:27

        yep, very different now! :)

  • Andym on 23/11/2017 - 15:21
    +1

    There is no money for most businesses in making things last, companies like Apple now work on the idea of 18 month planned obsolescence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence. Many businesses are now adopting this type of model to stay profitable.

    I have Japanese audio equipment that was made in the 60's and 70's that still works and sounds better than anything you can buy today, the attention to detail and workmanship is amazing. The Japanese took Total Quality Management and combined it with their incredible work ethic and built beautiful electronics, cameras, cars, motorbikes etc. It was because of their great success that led to their downfall because as their products were bought more the value of the Yen went up and with that they couldn't produce the same quality for reasonable prices. That combined with the fact that they have little of their own natural resources make them more uncompetitive. So countries like Korea and China have taken their place as manufacturing power houses. They are still one of the worlds biggest economies, but they have being pretty much running stagnate for the last two decades.

    The problem with Chinese made goods is that corruption and desire for wealth comes ahead of making the best product possible. Although saying that there are some manufactures that are making amazing products, but there is also lots of dodgy stuff as well. In time Chinese manufacturing will get better and then they will be priced out of the market as well. I don't believe many (if any) other countries could ever have the work ethic, soul and pride that the Japanese put into their products though, so it will be rare to see the quality lasting items we could buy in the past.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 15:38

      Thanks and I'm in your court.

  • carwashhair on 23/11/2017 - 15:27

    Whisky made in Japan. Except I break down, usually after it disappears!

    edit: Guess it's not electronic. Comment still stands though

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 15:41

      Agreed, it's a free country and an open forum, with minor deviations. E.g my BTTF references.

  • Cluster on 23/11/2017 - 15:39
    +1

    Japan is in long term economic and societal decline. I wish that wasn't the case as I liked Made in Japan electronics and other products, but it's true. Their birth rate is way under replacement level, with almost zero immigration intake. Population has been shrinking over the past five years and the working age population is rapidly declining. The government is massively in debt and almost 50% of the taxes collected every year go to paying interest on existing debt, and that's with near record low interest rates.

    Any innovation or new ideas are much more likely to be developed in China, where people are still very hungry for success and there's a large poor population yet to climb the economic ladder.

    Sony was once the pride of Japan and a source of huge innovation in the audio and video market. Now apart from the Playstation, what is Sony's signature product? Sony doesn't even manufacture its own LCD panels anymore. Every new Sony television has a Korean panel.

    Akai, Sanyo, Toshiba, Aiwa, all world famous companies that have collapsed or are selling off every profitable part to try and save themselves (Toshiba). Most cheaper Japanese brand products are now just rebadged Chinese OEM products. If you want a quality television with the latest technology most people think of Samsung and LG rather than Sony and Panasonic. Anyone wanting a quality smart phone heads for the American and Korean products.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 21:20

      Yes, many have said so. Once my Panasonic plasma fails, it's increasingly likely the replacement will be an LG OLED.

  • [Deactivated] on 23/11/2017 - 18:18

    Japan still make a lot of high end electrical equipment don't they? Capacitors for example, often see them advertised as high grade Japan caps.

  • [Deactivated] on 23/11/2017 - 18:18

    Japan still make a lot of high end electrical equipment don't they? Capacitors for example, often see them advertised as high grade Japan caps.

    • Andym on 23/11/2017 - 23:21

      Yes they still make high end gear, but it is usually much more expensive. The Japanese have always been very honorable regarding the quality in what they manufacture, but they can't compete against companies that charge a fraction of their price. You see a lot of Chinese copy components now that die or explode as soon as you use them. The Chinese copy everything to make a quick buck and often they are poorly manufactured with no quality control. I have a friend that uses a lot of electronic components and he said even the big chains are getting ripped off now by cheap Chinese knock offs, when they do mass buys. Some of the old Japanese Sansui, Kenwood and Rotel amplifiers I've owned had capacitors that have lasted over 40 years, which goes to show you the initial quality. I've had ten year old Chinese ones in amps that bulged or blew with no major use.

  • yarbles on 23/11/2017 - 19:23

    Planned obsolescence.
    Google the lightglobe conspiracy. Its on you tube. Get the english version.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 21:09

      I will, thank you. Got a few YouTube videos shortlisted, and a book to read thanks to this post.

      • yarbles on 24/11/2017 - 00:12

        No problem.

        Also add "Century of self" (creation of consumerism and manufactured consent)

        And "Psychographics 101"(where were at now).

        Everyone should watch these docos. They even make an unofficial trilogy os sorts.

    • ninetyNineCents on 25/11/2017 - 17:28

      Technology doesnt need planned obsolescence, nobody wants an iphone from 10 years ago, everyone basically wants the latest or next version.

  • Aniseed Steed on 23/11/2017 - 19:44

    I have a Sonab 85 S turntable (re-badged Yamaha CS50P) and a Rotel RX-203 stereo receiver from the 70s and they're still going strong. They don't make them like they used to.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 21:14

      My father had a Rotel amp and Pioneer turntable from the 70's. Can't recall the models though as I couldn't read back then… The turntable is no more, but the Rotel still works, even after an episode of some 'creatures' laying eggs inside and shorting a few circuits. They got in thru the headphone jack apparently.

  • [Deactivated] on 23/11/2017 - 20:17
    +1

    Good Porn are still Made in Japan.

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 21:18
      +1

      I'd concur, If it wasn't frequently pixelated.

      • neonlight on 27/11/2017 - 15:25

        Unfortunately the good old days of Tokyo hot and the like, quality has dropped dramatically.

        I think due to poor economy, less money is spent in that industry and less stars on them lol

    • Ragnarok1983 on 24/11/2017 - 00:08
      -1

      Just like cars, German porn is better.

      • itsdougie on 25/11/2017 - 10:58

        Depends what you are into, the squeals of a japanese girl enjoying sex or the screams of a slave being dominated by a much older dominatrix.

  • CHIEFMEGADETH on 23/11/2017 - 21:20

    Sure do :(
    I remember when JVC was made in Japan and i got great TV and VCR's. Now they sell JVC at big W and they look awful and cheap :(

    • 88mph on 23/11/2017 - 21:24
      +1

      Ah yes, JVC, the grand Japan Victor Company.
      These days more like Jimbo's Vice Centre…

    • neonlight on 27/11/2017 - 15:27
      +1

      The days when you saw game shows, with winner got the whole JVC entertainment set. You actually felt was good prize but now you wouldn't touch

  • ninjataki on 23/11/2017 - 23:02
    +1

    I lived in Japan for a year and the domestic market is extremely strong, easy to get quality made in Japan there at a very competitive price. The voltage conversion is a big killer between them and us though, guess it makes it economically non-viable to a degree when talking international sales.

    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 07:41

      Seems like it, yes.

  • Ragnarok1983 on 23/11/2017 - 23:28
    +1

    Japan's corporate culture holds them back from innovation in the digital age. Long working (and often unproductive) overtime, slow wage growth for the young, rigid top level management by declining birth rate, relatively low female participation in the workforce post marriage/birth.

    • FatBlanket on 24/11/2017 - 07:18
      +1

      It's a double edged sword. It's their very different culture that makes Made In Japan = Quality. I wonder if they can cut out the bad and Leave the good undamaged.

  • matt-ozb on 24/11/2017 - 00:16
    -1

    Made in Japan is old school. I now search for Made in China when looking for quality.

    • ninjataki on 24/11/2017 - 10:00

      lol, Japan = quality then and now, time never changed that fact. 'China' and the word quality dont marry, china and cheap/popular and perfect though

      • matt-ozb on 24/11/2017 - 13:42

        Plenty of great quality manufacturing comes out of China … Like a MacBook for example. Lol

        • ninjataki on 24/11/2017 - 13:48

          :) looks like you got me there. Enjoy the BF sales!

  • sharecare on 24/11/2017 - 00:27

    Bought a Panasonic camcorder and camera from DWI few years ago made in Japan.

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 24/11/2017 - 07:04

    Cheap
    Quality
    Reliability

    Pick 2

  • FatBlanket on 24/11/2017 - 07:15
    +1

    You can still buy made in Japan electronics is just that no one wants to pay for it. For example they make the best keyboards on the planet but they're $250-$400 a pop. They make a walkman that's $1000-$6000, rice cookers that are $200-$1000 etc. I had a great time last month browsing the electronics stores in Japan. They still make a lot of incredibly well made stuff that no one outside of Japan buys because they want cheap.

    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 07:39

      That's interesting, If it wasn't for the voltage difference I'd suppose boutique sites may have popped up offering fans like us options…

    • [Deactivated] on 24/11/2017 - 08:02

      i've been told japanese electronics and small appliances made for their domestic market are made more cheaply than export because the japanese trend is to replace them every 1 or 2 years. it's part of their culture to throw away. like how houses there always depreciate to nearly no value. they buy the land to build new homes instead.

      this was back in the 80s/90s though. the advice was japanese electronics then was cheaper in price and better made when bought outside of japan.

  • Piranha2004 on 24/11/2017 - 08:26

    A "Made in Japan" thread and no mention of Eneloops? Sacrilege!

    But yeah, Japanese stuff was way better and lasted much longer (especially the Sanyo eneloops!)

    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 08:40

      My apologies, as a recent sign up to Ozbargain, I missed the Eneloops phase. Also, don't have much need for batteries. Rookie, yes I know…

  • nurbsenvi on 24/11/2017 - 10:11

    No, progress was too slow back then

    Yes I am nostalgic of the era when things were simpler

  • tomsco on 24/11/2017 - 11:24

    I miss 90s Nintendo… but that is part nostalgia.

  • kaleidoscope on 24/11/2017 - 12:41

    As long as strict quality control is maintained, i really don’t mind where the manufactoring takes place.
    Have owned many sony products and will continue to buy them. Still have a functioning ps1, ps3 🙂.

  • sweetnipples on 24/11/2017 - 13:11

    Yes, i miss the quality HiFi stuff that used to come out of Japan in the 80's
    Luxman Class A Mono Blocks and Pre Amp…. Sadly they were never cheap, they went straight from $$$ Retail to $$$$ Collectable ;(
    Many other notable products and brands coming out of Japan in that era.

  • willister on 24/11/2017 - 14:01
    +1

    1) No. I simply find Korean stuff about 80% of Japanese quality and in some fields like OLED are superior whilst offering a much more attractive price. I grew up in the late 80s and 90s so I too was quite acquainted to the glory days of Japanese electronics. My fridge is a Samsung, one of my TVs is a Samsung - all were purchased when I moved into my current place in 2005 and are still working as new.

    2) Not so a lost hope per se, but they've simply moved on in the economic cycle. The same thing happened to West German and American electronics and cameras (way before my time) but I've read about them. The Koreans and to a lesser extent Chinese (leading) brands are doing to Japan what Japan did to American and West German brands in the 70s and 80s. The Japanese simply took Western developed concepts and improved upon them, they were excellent in miniaturisation, reliability and in general mechanical things. Times have moved on, we live in the era of most things covered by software instead of hardware - the Japanese really prided themselves on this but today it's not really the be all and end all. In addition, these days mobiles have basically destroyed most other electronic peripherals.

    Think about what you really need today say even living in an apartment:

    • Whitegoods - Fridge, Washer, Air Conditioner/Heater. Most of these would last a minimum a few years and are once in a blue moon replacements.
    • TV and Tablet. These days TVs are reliable even some Chinese brands and tablets would cover the you entertainment needs.

    Pre 2000s you'd need to buy a lot of peripheral crap like Hi-Fi systems, recorders, walkmans, desktop PCs etc…

    3) Japanese companies have simply lost it and are really moving out of consumer electronics. Whilst any money would be good for the country, they simply cannot compete in such an environment, especially with China in it's current state. Nothing lasts forever and its simply the economic cycle of up and coming countries wanting a piece of a lucrative pie. Added to that, Japanese companies became too arrogant, their Keiratsu type structure unraveled and squandered lost opportunities.

    For example, Japan was light years ahead of the world in the late 90s and early 2000s, their flip phones from local brands could be used to surf the internet way before the iphone came out but they never really exported this tech outside Japan and basically were too arrogant to do so. They also never took the Koreans and Chinese seriously….remember the days back in the Trinitron monitors? The Japanese only sold them to fellow Japanese counterparts, essentially how it worked was that large Japanese companies would do the R&D and sell it to other Japanese companies essentially keeping the tech all Japanese….ditto with stuff like MD players.

    You also then have what I'd call "leading costs" - Japan did took American concepts like OLED, car battery tech and spent millions in R&D only to be undercut by Korean and Chinese companies. Once market share and profit is lost, $ dry up and you are simply left with nothing to spend on R&D and slip behind. Korea would probably experience this once they lead…

    These days Japanese companies simply shift their focus on heavy industry and aerospace where margins are higher and it is harder for direct competitors like China and Korea to enter. Look at MHI (Mitsubishi) focusing on planes, Panasonic in car batteries and avionics (aero electronics), Hitachi on Train systems, Fujitsu in cloud computing, Sony on cameras and lenses/entertainment.

    The Japanese still lead in very few advanced manufacturing such as capacitors and stuff like machinery to build stuff like mobile phones e.g. the seperator machine to create OLEDs for Samsung/LG is produced by Canon Sekki - one of only two companies in the world that can produce them (the other one is also Japanese). Essentially I can safely say the Japanese could have held onto the consumer electronics sector, it was more of a management issue….the iphone could easily have become a Sony et al. product….remember they had the tech and products and approached the market with a more International mindset. They could have also controlled the software ecosystem as well - they produce decent games so I can't see why they cant do a O/S.

    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 14:23

      Interesting insights, thank you.

      I thought LG was fully independent in OLED manufacture, apparently not.

      As a side note, what you labelled 'peripheral crap' aka component audio of that era, in my opinion sounds a lot better (and truer to the natural form) than your usual soundbar or random bluetooth speaker, which is what this generation is growing up with.

      • willister on 24/11/2017 - 14:52
        +1

        http://appleinsider.com/articles/16/12/21/apples-plans-for-a…

        Have a read of the 2nd paragraph…

        '….With only 343 employees, Canon Tokki spent the last 20 years perfecting the machines suppliers like Samsung, LG and Sharp use to manufacture OLED screens. According to the report, almost all OLED panels in production are built using the firm's equipment…"

        If you can use a comparison like a cake, Samsung/LG know how to make the cake (OLED) but still need the utensils from Japan/others to transform the raw materials into OLED. Companies from Taiwan/China can't even make the cake…

        • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 14:57

          Then I guess Japan (still) is the icing on the cake ;)

        • willister on 24/11/2017 - 15:01

          @88mph:

          They still hold the key ingredients but probably not earning as much, as we all know branding earns big bucks….look at Coca Cola, LV etc. etc.

          Consumer Electronics is very cut throat and volatile…one day you are tech king, get complancent/arrogant and suddenly you see your market rate fall..

          The Japanese wanna do planes, advanced equipment (lens) and monopolise that…name 1 camera brand outside Japanese ones? LOL

          Bear in mind also, we seem to travel a lot these days compared to the 80s/90s/2000s…so near enough tech is good enough for the masses hence you get rubbish sound bars etc. etc. You can buy a kickass sound system sure, but are people willing to also fork out $40+ for a truly Blu Ray disc to make it really work?

          I still have a hand me down hi fi system from an uncle who purchased an amplifier, equaliser, double cassette deck tape and CD player in 1988/89. Took him two years to save up and purchased gradually…sound quality is excellent, arguably you'd be hard pressed to find one to match these days brand new on market. Whole set is from Pioneer….but man, it cost him $4K back then for the entire set and what good is it today? LOL…

  • Aceboy884 on 24/11/2017 - 14:22
    -1

    what is the difference between Chinese and Japanese? i thought all asians are the same

  • forumninja on 24/11/2017 - 15:25

    Japanese quality not what it once was:
    Mitsubishi Materials shares tumble after firm says units falsified product data: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mitsubishi-ma-scandal/mit…
    Mitsubishi division falsified some product data: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-42096165

    • willister on 24/11/2017 - 16:02

      More like quality was always like as it is today. Difference was back then news could be covered up easier….the Internet has exposed a lot of things whilst also providing fake news.

  • axlfan on 24/11/2017 - 16:49

    I miss it too but we need to get with the times. Other countries offer cheaper and reliable manufacturing options and so even the big Japanese brands shifted their manufacturing industry to countries like China, Taiwan, Vietnam, Malaysia and India etc.

    Also it would not be economically feasible for those companies…Nobody would buy their products due to inflated prices.

  • TRAVELO on 24/11/2017 - 17:37

    My Leica D-Lux 109 is made in Japan

  • scissorspaperrock on 24/11/2017 - 19:41

    Sony gave up being a Japanese only brand early on,

    I worked for Sony in 2005, mainly repairing high end equipment (tv cameras, amp's etc)

    Then one day, they requested i repair a VCR, (Yes back in the days we repaired items, rather than trashing)

    Opened up the VCR to find it covered in Samsung Stickers… (Samsung were a cheap, below average quality back then)

    • Though working for Sony i was able to pilfer 5 x Sony tritron flat screen 21" screen CRT's that were destined for the Bin.
    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 20:34

      Good on you rescuing those Trinitrons, reminds me of the foraging I do for Made in Japan VCRs, Stereo systems, and Component units each year when hard rubbish season rolls by…

  • HeWhoKnows on 24/11/2017 - 21:03
    +1

    Made in Japan electronics and other devices last forever

  • Regie69 on 24/11/2017 - 21:39

    The best radio controlled stuff came from Japan and Taiwan

    • 88mph on 24/11/2017 - 23:12

      My first radio controlled car was Made in Taiwan…

      • Regie69 on 25/11/2017 - 16:10

        I thought no mine was also

  • hhbb555 on 25/11/2017 - 06:43

    I think the quality of things that are made in japan nowaday is different than what it used to be
    https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/2372546

    I use a cheaper sony tv that definitely not made in Japan, and 5+ years on without any issue.

    That’s said, you could still few Japanese stuff easily (easier than other stuff) like rice cookers, hot water bottle and the likes (tiger, zojirushi)

  • ninetyNineCents on 25/11/2017 - 17:25

    Its not a question of where a product is made, all products are made to a price point. People today most of the time dont want to spend a lot and want more for their money. You cant expect anybody to make a premium product when a significant proportion of the market only want to spend $10. We all know that German means quality but you cant expect BMW to make a $10k car that matches a $100k car.

    • 88mph on 25/11/2017 - 17:45

      Agreed, that is never in doubt. However, for someone who may be willing to pay, say 20% more for a Made in Japan product (assuming it maintains the same standards of its 1980-90's counterparts), it certainly would be good to have avenues to get them.

      But as many have pointed out, it's not profitably feasible nor the manufacturing ideology of the present day.

  • Marcsie on 25/11/2017 - 20:19

    I do miss “Made in Japan” shops in Melbourne :)

    • 88mph on 26/11/2017 - 06:28

      Don't know if you're kidding, but sounds like a place I'd hang out a fair bit :)

  • askme69 on 26/11/2017 - 01:54

    Same can be said about clothing for example skate brands t-shirt back in the early 2000's were $30 or so a shirt, but the quality was good and they lasted for years with heavy use.

    Today the same shirt is $50, the material is so thin it's see through and they are made in China for a fraction of the cost.

    I don't buy them anymore, I try amd support commonwealth countries first and the USA. If I really have to, I'll by Chinese

    • 88mph on 26/11/2017 - 06:26

      Although I wasn't in Australia in the early 2000s like you were, I've heard similar stories via mates about Rivers products.

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