Car Accident - Other Driver Uninsured - International Licence Holder

Lwhatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 15:31
Last edited 02/04/2017 - 12:43 by 1 other user

Was at the lights stopped last night when a motorbike rider ran up the back of my car (Toorak rd exit off the Monash Freeway). He reckons he lost traction on the loose gravel (which meant he was literally in the gutter).

Anyway, he barely spoke any English, was not insured, could only provide a pic from his phone of his international drivers licence, and had no other form of ID.
I'm insured, and as you can expect, suspicious about all the details. Best I could do was take a pic of his number plate, drivers licence pic off his phone and call his phone to make sure it rang.

Insurance company could understand my suspicions, but said they'd manage from here. (debt collectors etc)

I'm not at fault, but as I didn't take out the hire car option in my policy (I thought that would only be an issue if I'm at fault!). They couldn't help me :(So now I have to drive around with my boot tied up for 10 days as I have to go to their panel beater and hire car (best they could offer me was a Hertz discount coupon)

It means an afternoon off and somehow managing without a car……….what a load of crock. Understandable if it was my fault. And to top it off - I'm fully expecting them to say they can't get the rear bumper for my car (2002 Ralliart). They tried this last time and offered to put a VRX front bumper as the Ralliart spoiler can't be sourced any more. Fortunately they were able to repair that one (it only had a small hole).

This time, I'm not so sure - the whole back of the car is stuffed with the boot unable to close.
yeah the rider is OK, but declined my offer of a lift home (his "supplied address" wasn't too far away)

tldr - I'm not at fault - but still not entitled to a loaner while the car is getting repaired

Automotive

Comments

  • [Deactivated] on 01/04/2017 - 15:45
    +8

    1. You are insured and didn't opt for a hire car, its not up to them to provide you with a hire car if you don't have the cover / option, as much as its crappy they have an obligation to only provide you with your policy inclusions, as much as thats a crock of crap I do understand your frustation

    2. Did you read the PDS from your insurer and who is the insurer?

    3. Good luck getting the other driver to pay for it, most likely on the next plane home within 2-3 weeks anyway and doesn't care less (skeptical about this guy you're trying to get to pay for damages etc)

    4. He had his licence on his phone? WTF, seriously? I would have called the police then and there rather than stuff around

    5. Is the boot the only damage?, I am not sure how you're out for afternoon without a car for a boot that won't shut??, possibly dropping it off might take some time out of your day but speak with the insurance company / panel beater

    6. Insurance company should be able to source parts and they'll make that call, sounds like a pretty crappy budget insurer by the sounds of the comments

    7. I would lodge a police report asap, ensure the other driver has no plans to leave the country and have your insurance company get the excess from him

    8. Opt for hire car coverage in future, there is a company notmyfault they may be able to give you a loan car as you're not a fault, they will then pass on the costs to your insurance company > other party, but ring them to discuss your situation

    • whooah1979 on 01/04/2017 - 17:00
      +1

      He had his licence on his phone? WTF, seriously? I would have called the police then and there rather than stuff around

      for what reason? is it an offence in vic to not carry a drivers licence?

      would lodge a police report asap, ensure the other driver has no plans to leave the country and have your insurance company get the excess from him

      vic police can't do that unless the other party has committed an offence that allows them to place a travel ban on the passport.

      • String name on 01/04/2017 - 17:27

        for what reason? is it an offence in vic to not carry a drivers licence?

        Was watching one of the Vic police shows and the officer said if a person has a full licence and over 26, they don't need to carry a licence on them. If a person has a provisional, learners or international licence they need to have it on them at all times while driving/riding.
        My source is…. not the best, but the person saying that was a traffic cop.

        So if you would have called the cops, they would have been busted for sure on at least one charge.

        vic police can't do that unless the other party has committed an offence…

        Yup, I've experience that first hand.

        • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2017 - 10:01
          +1

          The guy has crashed into someone else
          Doesn't have a proper licence (photo on the phone really?)
          Police need to turn up anyway if the OP suspected anything and should have been called end of story

          Common sense really isn't that common around these parts i take it

        • whatthecrappin on 02/04/2017 - 12:21

          @shawncro 222:

          I raised this with the insurance company at the time as they have the experience. They advised cops were not needed - yeah I'm surprised as well
          the licence was an interesting one. it wasnt the original, more like an offical translated one. As soon as the guy mentioned no insurance, and no hard copies of id, I was onto the insurance company straight away. I made all the calls on the side of the road, as I wanted to cover all bases with them before leaving the scene (the rider wasnt going anywhere). they took his licence details, but I've no idea how that 48 digit number helps

          Even if he had a hard copy of his licence, again, I've no idea how it would help - (international address)

          I basically trying to convince the insurance company that I think calling the cops was best as it was in their best interest (to validate his registration), but the insurance company would just get their debt collectors to followup on that. clearly they didnt care. best I could do was call his mobile, validate that my number appeared there (mentioned that its most likely a disposable sim)

          I also tried really hard to drive the guy home as his place of residence was close, as mentioned above he refused (wanted to stay with his bike)

        • whooah1979 on 02/04/2017 - 12:40

          @shawncro 222:

          Doesn't have a proper licence (photo on the phone really?)
          Police need to turn up anyway if the OP suspected anything and should have been called end of story

          is it a requirement in vic for drivers involved in a collision to show their driver licence to the other party?

          drivers in nsw must give particulars to all parties involved in a collision, but doesn't have to show their driver licence. they must show it to the police.

        • Scrooge McDuck on 02/04/2017 - 18:58

          @whatthecrappin:

          I raised this with the insurance company at the time as they have the experience. They advised cops were not needed - yeah I'm surprised as well
          the licence was an interesting one.

          Sometimes you just need to use your judgement to overrule what someone tells you, especially when you're dealing with a customer service representative. Most of us have received incorrect or otherwise bad advise from a CSR, insurance companies are no different.

        • Scrooge McDuck on 02/04/2017 - 19:15
          +1

          @Scrooge McDuck:

          When a foreign woman wounded my beloved historic sports car, I called the police ASAP.

          She had produced a foreign licence and was accusing me of being at fault for the crash. They took a while to come (an opportunistic tow truck driver showed up well before them — private sector efficiency!) but proved to be very useful. She was so delusional that she admitted the true facts of the crash to one of the officers, believing that I was at fault. The other officer suggested that they'd be charging her with negligent driving and this was later confirmed. She may have been charged with driving unlicensed too; she had been driving on her international licence for more than a year!

          Being self-insured, having that police report and her negligent driving charge to refer to saved me a lot of hassle when dealing with her insurer.

        • Scrooge McDuck on 02/04/2017 - 19:25
          +2

          @Scrooge McDuck:

          From the NSW Police website, but probably applies similarly to other states:

          If a driver suspects that false details have been provided or there is some other suspicious behaviour involved they should call police and, where required, they will attend the crash site.

          If a motorist at a crash site has reason to suspect another involved driver is unlicensed or there are other suspicious circumstances they should contact police. Police will determine if attendance is appropriate and will investigate the suspected licence offence.

          If a motorist at a crash site has reason to suspect an involved vehicle is unregistered or there are other suspicious circumstances they should contact police. Police will determine if attendance is required and will investigate the suspected registration offence.

          What if there is a conflict between the involved parties at the crash site? (e.g. drivers refusing to exchange particulars or arguing over who is at fault)
          If a driver is refusing to exchange details, call police and they will attend.
          If any party at a crash site is behaving aggressively, call police and they will attend to ensure there is no breach of the peace

          http://www.police.nsw.gov.au/community_issues/road_safety/cr…

          So unless you're familiar with the particular international licence produced, you have reasonable grounds to be suspicious and you should call the police. Even if you were familiar with their licence you wouldn't know how long they'd been driving on it and consequently whether they were driving on a valid licence.

        • geoffellis on 03/04/2017 - 08:32

          @Scrooge McDuck:

          She may have been charged with driving unlicensed too; she had been driving on her international licence for more than a year!

          That only matters if she is on a permanent resident visa or has australian citizenship. If you are on temporary visas (student, backpacker, tourist, etc) then you can drive indefinitely on your international for as long as your visa and international license is valid

      • Ken1977 on 02/04/2017 - 14:35
        +4

        Isn't him breaking the law by not carrying his international drivers license commiting an offence.

    • GaryQ on 02/04/2017 - 07:45

      6 - One of my cars is an '85 Jaguar XJ6

      Recently suffered a long gouge down the rear passenger door (plus about an inch into the rear quarter panel) and a paint scrape. RACV told me where to take it for an assessment, and the guy said I would probably be offered a cash settlement and no repair because they are a 'quick fix' body shop and this would need specialised repair.

      I haven't taken it to my Jag guy yet - but he'll probably replace the door and spray paint all 4 doors to match. Then its a question of whether the $settlement - excess is worth more than the cost of repair.

      • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2017 - 10:03

        Horses for courses, it's repairable by the sounds of things so you're not going to be too bad off
        If it's not your fault and you have named the other driver then your excess should be paid by the other party

        However if this isn't the case and it's a 600 dollar repair job Vs 1500 for your excess then i know what option i would be looking at

      • Randxyz123 on 03/04/2017 - 13:53

        RACV have choice of repairer. Take it to your jag guy.

        If you weren't at fault the other driver will have to pay up. You won't need to pay a excess

    • berry580 on 02/04/2017 - 17:12
      +3

      "You are insured and didn't opt for a hire car, its not up to them to provide you with a hire car if you don't have the cover / option"

      OP can legally make the other pay for his car hire as long as he can prove his needs for it (which would be easy).

  • whatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 15:55

    was on the phone to insurance straight away and told them the whole lack of id is so sus that I'm sure he's going to do a runner. they werent too worried and deal with it all the time, they're debt recovery dept will take of it. I also mentioned calling the cops - they advised against it if the other guy isnt hurt

    insurance company have already confirmed I'm not at fault (damage to the back only) so I've got no excess.

    will chase up comment 8 though. not hopeful given lack of id from the other driver :( will also call my mechanic - he "might" be able to source the bumper - but every year when I drop the car off - he just says these cars are getting rarer and rarer. in about 40 years it'll be a collectors car lol. (it was limited when it came out) my old xc would be a collectors car and that was just a stock 1 of a million!

  • Godric on 01/04/2017 - 16:05
    +14

    What's the point of this post?

    • Well Wasted on 02/04/2017 - 09:39
      -2

      any vehicle accident that causes more than 1000 dollars damage total… should be reported to the police.

    • John on 03/04/2017 - 14:37

      having a whinge :D

  • whatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 16:27

    just a warning about loan cars and pretty annoyed about it. I see signs all over the place about free loan cars while your car is getting repaired and just assumed (incorrectly) that I would be covered when not at fault.

    another case of read the fine print I guess……….

    and of course - I'm actually surprised that an insurance company didnt insist I call the cops due to lack of hard identification. I was hoping there would be a process of crosschecking the number plates with the "assumed" place of residence. especially given the international licence

    • GaryQ on 02/04/2017 - 07:48
      +1

      A hire car option on your insurance is not the same as a loan car.

      Hire car option - costs you more on your premium, handy in this situation
      Loan car - whatever old bomb the panel beater has in the yard as a courtesy (free) option for their customers. Totally depends on the Panel Beater, but you could call them in advance or ask the insurer to steer you (heh) towards a shop that usually offers loan cars

  • Randxyz123 on 01/04/2017 - 16:38
    +1

    Try sheens panel service. They have loan cars as do many other body shop.

  • spackbace on 01/04/2017 - 17:01
    +2

    Ralliart (Magna) boot is same as the rest, it's just the spoiler that's different. Tbh de-winging looks sooo much better (and lowered)

    Post up on www.aussiemagna.com (or whatever it is now), plenty of help on there re: parts

    • whatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 17:04

      yep boot is the same. and you're right its all the spoilers. Ive kept mine stock all this time (way past the mod scene)
      the rear bumper has me worried, as I suspect they;re typically the parts that get damaged.
      as I'm not agreed value either I'm hoping it doesnt get down to an argument about an expensive spoiler…….

      • spackbace on 01/04/2017 - 17:05

        You're still entitled to a spoiler on there! You could post up on that forum and try to source one if your insurers panel beater can't

  • whatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 17:01

    see thats the thing - insurance company requested their own panel beater? again I assumed that most of the big panel beaters were all approved for large insurance companies.
    shall make a couple of calls monday

    • spackbace on 01/04/2017 - 17:03
      +2

      Yep if you go cheap on insurance then you don't get choice of repairer :/

  • k-rokfm on 01/04/2017 - 18:09
    +2

    15 year old car with what sounds like some substantial damage. Your car will most likely be getting written off, so no need to find a replacement part.

    • Steptoe on 01/04/2017 - 23:36
      +2

      Yep, upgrade to a 380

      • spackbace on 02/04/2017 - 00:19
        +1

        Not overly an upgrade from a Ralliart :)

        • Steptoe on 02/04/2017 - 00:21

          Get a Lancer Ralliart, then flash with TEPHRA ECU

        • spackbace on 02/04/2017 - 00:57
          +2

          @Steptoe:

          But then you still drive a Lancer 😂

        • Steptoe on 02/04/2017 - 01:00
          +1

          @Spackbace:

          Well, better than a COLT RALLIART

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p32MW3ENEjk

        • spackbace on 02/04/2017 - 01:06

          @Steptoe:

          Well this is true…

        • whatthecrappin on 02/04/2017 - 11:29

          car actually goes pretty good. can beat most other v8s in reverse at the lights! LOL

          on a serious note, its in the wet at the lights on takeoff that it has serious problems. you can forget about a quick takeoff. once its going - no issues :)

        • spackbace on 02/04/2017 - 11:31

          @whatthecrappin:

          Yep FWD = torque steer :)

          That said there's a couple of FWD magnas pushing high power but having to use LSDs

        • Scrooge McDuck on 02/04/2017 - 19:31

          @Spackbace:

          But then you still drive a Lancer 😂

          Either way, you're still driving a Mitsubishi…

           

           

           

          BRING ON THE NEGZ!! 👅

        • PVA on 03/04/2017 - 21:16

          @Spackbace:
          there was an all wheel drive Magna at one stage wasnt there?

        • spackbace on 03/04/2017 - 21:40

          @PVA:

          Yeah awd auto

  • nomoneynoproblems on 01/04/2017 - 18:20
    +9

    Give it a few hours mate, the obligatory "I don't have insurance and hit a car" will surely pop up soon.

  • resubaehtgnolhcs on 01/04/2017 - 19:05
    +1

    For a hire car option you can use when it's not your fault: https://www.notmyfault.com.au/

    From what I understand they chase the other driver for the cost of a hire car. Makes it a good option when you don't have hire car cover on your policy.

    • oscargamer on 01/04/2017 - 19:29
      +2

      not really good

      if the 'at fault' car doesn't pay out, they chase you, for A LOT of money

      • resubaehtgnolhcs on 01/04/2017 - 20:24

        where do you get that info from? And define "A LOT of money". Why would they chase you, when according to their website "under Australian Law you are entitled to a free replacement car".

        • oscargamer on 02/04/2017 - 08:09
          +1

          http://moneymag.com.au/free-car-for-not-at-fault-driver/

          Only one of many explanations of how it works….

          Google is your friend

        • whooah1979 on 02/04/2017 - 08:54

          @oscargamer:

          http://moneymag.com.au/free-car-for-not-at-fault-driver/
          Only one of many explanations of how it works….
          Google is your friend

          good find. they (hire companies) hide this deep in their t&c hoping that the not-at-fault won't notice it when they apply.

          there was a post on either ozb or whirlpool where the hire company couldn't find or bill the faulty party. they then want back and gave the not-at-fault driver a bill shock.

        • doodo477 on 03/04/2017 - 13:59

          @whooah1979: My understanding if a person is at fault they're required to cover the cost (consequential loss) of a rental vehicle for the duration of the car being out of action to the owner (with or without) cover from their insurance company. Then there is the whole option of the at fault driver being sued due to negligence. Insurance only covers you for a small part of your liabilities.

      • peterlong1952 on 02/04/2017 - 08:23
        +1

        My wife has used notmyfault.com.au twice and has had no hassles in getting them to chase up the insurance company for the cost of hire. Its a good company.

        • oscargamer on 02/04/2017 - 09:44
          +4

          never said it wasn't

          all i was highlighting, is that if they can't recover their money from the other driver, then they would chase the OP for the bill

          so long as people enter contracts knowing everything, that's fine

        • syousef on 03/04/2017 - 17:21

          @oscargamer:

          So you're gambling on someone with an international license being successfully chased….wouldn't do it!

        • oscargamer on 03/04/2017 - 19:06
          +1

          @syousef:

          and that is is my point exactly !

          if the o/s idiot can't be located, then the OP pays for the hire car

    • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2017 - 10:04

      As i mentioned

    • myfuturej on 02/04/2017 - 23:12
      +1

      Notmyfault is really good. We also do not have hire car option in our insurance, had a bad accidenf which required 7 weeks to repair. My partner needs to travel 180km everyday for work, 6 days a week. (Eventually we moved closer, another story). But we used notmyfault's hire car for free for that time. 8 months later, they said that the other person's insurance refused to pay, but shouldn't be a concern for us, just giving a fyi they will go to court. Never heard from them after and no effect on our own insurance.

      • love2buy on 03/04/2017 - 18:17

        Interestingly a paradox would occur if you had an accident in that notmyfaultcar and it was your fault.

  • whatthecrappin on 01/04/2017 - 20:29

    is that for real? might have to have an interesting discussion with the insurance company on Monday. they basically said I can claim against the other parties insurance………oh wait………….then they said its a civil matter. this blurb is really interesting thought.

    HELPFUL GOVERNMENT LINKS
    If you find yourself saying it wasn’t my fault after an accident you were involved in then under Australian Law you are entitled to a free replacement car. Insurance companies don’t readily advertise this given the fact that they will be the ones paying for the costs incurred.

    oscargamer might be onto something - I doubt its going to apply when the guy skips the country

    will try them as well and check the fine print this time

  • Brucet on 02/04/2017 - 08:29

    If you have comprehensives cover for your car.Just inform your insurance company and they will do the rest for you.FIX.

    • Euphemistic on 02/04/2017 - 08:42

      Point of the story is that there might not be a replacement car provided without some form of hassle.

  • decryption on 02/04/2017 - 10:07
    +2

    Last year I had a tradie smash into the back of me on the freeway (he was tailgating, car in front of me stopped, so I stopped and car behind me wasn't paying attention) and my insurance doesn't offer a hire car either. So I used https://www.notmyfault.com.au/ and they gave me a car to use for the entire time my car was getting repaired. Costs me nothing - they slug the other guy with the costs. If they don't have insurance, they sue him for ya to get the cash, haha. Why should you be without a set of wheels because some (profanity) doesn't know how to keep their distance?

    • Baysew on 02/04/2017 - 13:29

      You need to read previous post

      If they don't have insurance, they sue him for ya to get the cash, haha.

      Apparently not. It's dependant on the other guy having insurance.

  • whatthecrappin on 02/04/2017 - 11:15

    I've got full Comp, just not the hire option. More concerned that. They won't be able to track him down when it comes times to pay for the hire car. Insurance will cover the repair, just all the hassles around getting it fixed which is annoying

    • oscargamer on 02/04/2017 - 11:24

      and that's the whole point…..

  • HeWhoKnows on 02/04/2017 - 13:04
    +2

    Since you have insurance you got nothing to worry about.
    Just go with a repairer that offers free loan cars. there are quite a few around.

  • Brucet on 02/04/2017 - 20:52

    Most of the panel beater repairer offer free loan cars. Why not shop around find one.

  • Matt P on 02/04/2017 - 21:32
    +1

    http://www.right2drive.com.au/

    give this a shot for a loaner

    • Gaz1 on 03/04/2017 - 14:19

      Looks like a great service - anyone had any experience with this?

  • whatthecrappin on 02/04/2017 - 21:34

    You're right most offer loan cars - and I incorrectly assumed I could go to any major repairer. But when I called AAMI they gave me a choice of 2 in my area. I enquired about the loan car and they said I wasnt covered. Normally it would be covered by the party at fault insurance company, but this guy of course doesnt have insurance………………….

    I've got 2 companies now to follow up for loaners. Only concern is the guy at fault will leave the country and I end up paying for it anyway

    worth a shot and yeah - I'll ask the questions up front! Never assume when it comes to insurance matters ;)

    • syousef on 03/04/2017 - 17:28
      -1

      Good old AAMI. A few years ago my wife was T-boned at a roundabout and the car written off. She was not at fault. AAMI were had the car written off and sold for scrap in under 48 hours. By the time they let us know where we could go to take personal effects out of it, when I showed up it turned out it had been sold on and moved. They eventually (weeks later) had someone go through the car and give us what they could pull out of it, but we were not able to go out and pull stuff out ourselves. If we wanted to try at one point they offer we go across town and try to find the car ourselves at a scrap yard but they took that offer back.

      Next time I'll bloody well strip the car at the scene given half a chance. At the time I was worried about my under 2 year old daughter who was in the back seat on the side of the collision when it happened. Thankfully unhurt in the end. Just the wife and kids shaken.

      Very unpleasant experience.

      • whatthecrappin on 03/04/2017 - 19:56

        during the hail storms years ago in vic, our window was broken and 2 curtains out of 6 in the room were shredded.

        I thought it would be like a car - ie they colour match the curtains!

        how wrong I was - as they couldnt match the curtains they offered to replace 2 curtains…………….

        tell me again how exactly does that help me?

        imagine if it was a car! paint doesnt exist, we can paint that door yellow for you…..its up to you to spray your black car yellow to match……..

        I am still with them though, I've had far worse experiences with other insurance companies.

        • syousef on 04/04/2017 - 12:30

          In your shoes if I wanted matching curtains and they were willing to give me cash, I'd have sold my old ones and bought a new set. You'd still be out of pocket but not as much. Scummy though.

        • whatthecrappin on 04/04/2017 - 17:15
          +1

          @syousef:

          pretty much what I had to do - not ideal, but what choice did I have?

      • bdl on 03/04/2017 - 23:04
        +1

        You're lucky AAMI didn't try and sell your daughter! :(

  • Piranha2004 on 03/04/2017 - 15:09

    The reason the hire car hasnt been allowed in this instance because the other party is uninsured. Hire cars have been organised when I or anyone in my family has been in a not at fault accident (never had hire car option). Depends on the insurance company though.

    • whatthecrappin on 03/04/2017 - 19:53

      really does depend on the insurance. if the other guy was insured apparently I could chase up the hire car with his insurance. AAMI wouldnt help. best they could do was offer me a hertz discount coupon (I never actually received it though)

      lesson here is read the fine print…………..when paying for my insurance I just assumed that I'd be covered if not at fault!

  • danksp0re on 03/04/2017 - 22:17

    No valid ID: call the cops. Haven't you seen Hwy Patrol

    • [Deactivated] on 04/04/2017 - 01:27

      If the guy is driving unlicensed - surely cops will want to stop them and fine them etc

      • whatthecrappin on 04/04/2017 - 17:16

        raises another question - so having a photo of your international licence isnt enough

        mind you - he could have produced the original (which would look like a photocopy) - I've no idea if its real or not!

        • [Deactivated] on 05/04/2017 - 08:09

          Who cares what you think. If he doesn't have a license with him - he is driving unlicensed and is at fault by default

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