My wife works for a company where one of the Directors has a habit of constantly talking on his phone while driving. Being a bit tech challenged, he doesn't use Bluetooth, but talks into the handset, and has therefore racked up a stack of fines, to the point where he is about to lose his license. So he has offered some of his employees cash to take the points (not for the phone ones as they are obviously pull-over fines, but for some of the other camera fines like speeding, and red light offences).
What would you do if he asked you?
Would You Take Someone Else's Driving Infringement Points for Cash?
billy_bob on 10/06/2016 - 19:02
Last edited 15/06/2016 - 14:57
Last edited 15/06/2016 - 14:57
Poll Options
- 1211. Take the money as you have plenty of points left.
- 1032. Politely decline.
- 2973. Tell him to suck it up, and accept the consequences for his actions.
Comments
Hey some have standards. Like that teen giving sexual favours to buy gucci bag.
not sure about vic, but in sydney the market rate is $1000/point.
where'd you pull that number out of?
OzBlackmarket
Now I need to go and check out that sister website…
Well to be fair, ACtually $1000 / point isnt effective enough
The first 4 points should be cost reasonable enough as it's not that harmful (9-12 points left) when your point got deducted, $250 - $650 /point (gradually increase as the point deducted)
The last 4 point should cost $ 2400- $7000 (1-4 points left )That's quite a fair rate in my opinion :p
Googled it. Was disappointed.
out of the milky way perhaps?
… no, this is the amount different people in western sydney have offered me on several occassions which leads me to believe this is the "going rate".K that makes sense because I live in the northern suburbs and the rate is about 2.5k per point
When he calls your extension to ask what you've decided you should simply respond like this:
If they're mobile phone fines it won't be possible to pass them off to someone else. Why? He would have been stopped by police, identified and issued a ticket. If he tries to pass them to another person saying "it wasn't me driving" he will get in trouble for that reason.
Exactly! I looked through all the comments and was surprised no-one had thought about this earlier!
The combined IQ of this thread is not very high. I was actually sad to see how long this post took.
If they're mobile phone fines it won't be possible to pass them off to someone else.
From the OP:
talks into the handset, and has therefore racked up a stack of fines, to the point where he is about to lose his license.
Perhaps the latest infringement was recorded by a camera.
how much was he offering on top of the fine?
What does that matter? It would only be the starting point for negotiation if you agreed to do it.
Hence this very old joke:
Man: Would you sleep with me for $1,000,000?
Woman: …YES!
Man: How about $50?
Woman: What do you think what a person I am?
Man: We have established what you are, madam. We are now merely haggling over the price.I just wanted to know how much he thought it was worth.
It matters a lot… like I imagine majority of people would do it for $1,000,000. But $100? Probably not. At some point the boss is not going to pay any more, and each person has at least a base minimum they would need to do it. Everyone has a price in the end though.
contact ACA, they would love a crazy story like this - can see them now chasing him down the road with a camera crew in tow.
Its not worth your piece of mind. Its fraud and if the state Police ever decide to use the photo evidence you could be in serious trouble. Also, there are real dollars saved on safe driver discounts (ie. zero demerit points) for car insurance and drivers licence.
I never in my life expected to qualify for a safe drivers discount but one day I returned to zero demerit points without expecting it. The safe driver discounts save me about $100 per year on each vehicles NSW greenslip (>$600 the last 3 years for 3 vehicles) plus saved me $162 on renewing the 10 year NSW Gold drivers licence.
Its a cool story I tell to all my car and motorcycle friends. There are pro's and con's in everything. Even in being suspended or dragged into court or famously gossiped about. Let your boss lose his licence. It's not that scary and who knows what good might come out of it.
Take the money on the condition that he also installs hands free kit in the car. There is an issue of road safety here.
How would you feel if you took the money and he then hit and killed a child. The only reason he was able to drive was because you took his demerit point!
No way, he's already had the hands free kit option and now he has to pay the price. He would have known he was thin on points and did it anyway. Not your job to bail him out or he won't learn.
No way, he's already had the hands free kit option and now he has to pay the price.
And better he pay that price to me than to State Revenue.
Not your job to bail him out or he won't learn.
Those aren't mutually exclusive.
By price I mean license suspension and inconvenience of that, I'm not talking about money directly
I know, but paying a premium to someone to take his points and having his license suspended are both penalties — paying a price.
I agree he should pay a price. Depending on the type of person he is he may cop his penalty but not change his behaviour. If the loss of points till now has not altered his behaviour there is no guarantee that losing his drivers license will.
It would be better if the authorities would force him to install hands free in his car as well as loss of license.
If someone took his points, then he would have an obligation to them and if that person put the condition of changing his habit then surely that is a win for everyone. The penalties are not there to penalise per se but to modify behaviours.
When I worked in fast food, my sleazy manager used to strongarm indian immigrants into taking on his points.
The reward? more shifts.Hungry Jacks?
7/11?
You know it. Anil the dill.
what race was he?
Formula Ford by all accounts
Sri lanken. I called him indian once, and he blew his lid
"I am NOT one of those Indians! Do I look Indian? I am from Sri Lanka!"appropriate username?
when you say strongarm, do you mean there was an implied threat of unfavourable treatment if they didn't take his points? or was it just a very crappy offer (ie more shifts for points)?
the former is very scummy, but the latter… well also a bit low, but I'd be kind of meh about it
With fat fingers on the phone…..I hit the wrong vote option.
I actually had a call last night from a single mother with 2 kids who excuse was always running late and latest fine will give her points for losing licence.
The tears and stuff didn't work.
I gave her a serving of my own for her stupidity, turns out she also took points from one of her friends and then when she asked the same, got told to get lost.I have an unblemished record and it will remain that way.
What was she offering?
A sob story and tears……
If 12 points doesn't persuade you to slow down……there's not much hope.
You can cry on cue?
Could you teach me that?She can always apply for a good behaviour period:
https://www.service.nsw.gov.au/transaction/apply-good-behavi…Or hire a lawyer to contest it in court where she can try the tears on a judge.
I don't have kids but my most scary incidents in Canberra have been at round abouts where a mum in a SUV/van fails to giveway, usually because they are yelling at children in the rear. I can't understand why emotional and inattentive mothers rush knowing that they are risking the lives of other road users. Its not my business if they don't want to value their own + offspring's lives but I've no sympathy for a mum who's a terrible driver and takes risks.
If he ended up killing someone on the road because he was still allowed to keep driving due to your generous points donation could you live with it I guess is the real question. Personally my answer is no. Someone like that shouldnt be on the roads because it's only a matter of time until they hurt or kill someone. They need to learn that their actions are wrong and they wont if theyre allowed to buy their way out of the system. Politely decline.
How much more deadly is a driver on 12 points versus 11?
He has run out of point so the real question is how deadly is he with only 1 point left and a string of fines and lost points for dangerous driving behaviour?
12 times more deadly using the Ozbargain linear regression models on the likelihood-ratio test.
do the math. 1 point more deadly. ONE ENTIRE DEADLY POINT
Don Gedditt. Getting busted talking on the mobile is an identified offence, ie the identity of the offender is known and registered on the spot. A latent "twadn't moi" won't cut the mustard…
Agreed, even the Einfeld defence of a dead professor driving didn't work and that was a speeding camera that didn't ID the driver…
Better to use his bribe money towards Uber or a driver.
how much money are we talking about?
Not enough. Don't bother. Unless you are broke that is…
I think around $200 - $300, but he sounded desperate, so might go higher….
lol, it so isn't worth it. What a cheapskate to boot. $2-300 to possibly ruin your life. How can a director not have a car that doesn't have bluetooth, today?!?!?!?!
With many people in the office knowing about it, all it takes is one pissed off person to dob someone in and for the police to look at it and you're all screwed.
this person and this case - exact same scenario. See how it panned out.
Shortened version: Takes the rap for the boss in 1996. Is undertaking a law degree. In 2006, TEN YEARS LATER, is denied entry to practice law because she is not of good fame and character (see -a liar).Jackson (previously known as Subramaniam) v Legal Practitioners Admission Board [2006] NSWSC 1338 (5 December 2006)
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/nsw/supreme_ct/2006/1338.…
I have an overseas license do i have unlimited points to lose?
the word is that they dont bother following up on overseas licences.
Yes, unless you are planning on getting a local licence at some point. In that case, the points would be transferred.
Awesome, the Op should contact me then
No. If you accumulate 12 points on an international licence the RTA will suspend your right to drive in the state.
A question to ask is why is he not willing to transfer it over to his family member (wife/parents)…is there more to the story than actually mentioned…were other offenses committed prior/post infringement that he is trying to pass on?
If family members refrained from accepting the deal than others should be wary!
Prob used up their demerit points too already the degenerate.
or they've told him to take a hike :)
Yeh tell me $250 per point!!
Its actually more common than you all realize.
There were stories on the news where people were going to pokies outlet and finding old people that may need the cash.The pension does not pay much at all so the old folks get to have a bit of extra pocket money.
Prob get downvoted for telling the truth but whatever, these things all happen.
That being said i prob wouldnt do it with my boss, just friends or family…
I have never done it and i have never received a fine.Pardon my silly question, but would this process involve essentially contacting the police and telling them that another person was driving the vehicle at the time, and not, for instance like in this case, the OP's supervisor?
As an aside; IMO, if the above mentions of jail time penalties are accurate, there is just no way I would even consider this. Not to mention how hideous prison is, but moreso having a possible criminal record can really affect a lot of things in your life.
I dont think you're contacting police, it goes to the office of state revenue afaik.
The thing is, it's a statutory declaration, if caught can be 5 years in jail
You'd have to be stupid, unless of course it's family.
Why the double standards? Isn't it still wrong even if it's family?
Some people will do anything for family
Hypothetically, let's say u take the cash. He then goes on to drive and hits someone and kills them. How's that gona work for your conscious?
Laws are there for a reason. The problem is people don't think they apply to them. There are reasons why demerit points exist and it's not all cash fines.
Imagine this prick goes on to kill your child.
Now please answer the question.
This. Even on OzBargain, there are some things more important than money.
Why would it weigh on his conscious?
I mean, how would you feel if you didn't take the money, and then the boss lost his license, made himself feel bad, started drinking, abused his wife and kids etc.?
It's a similar issue where you've indirectly caused something, but ultimately you're not responsible either way.
In one he didn't break the law nor was he legally accountable.
I think OP would likely still remain conscious when told the news. Unless OP was particularly feeble or frail.
His conscience on the other hand…
I'll be like "Hellz no!". I'm sorry but at the end of the day they need to drive responsibly and no one else decides their actions. I don't want to raise my insurance premiums either because of that.
The better poll option would have been: How much would you have to be 'paid' to take demerit points for the boss?
Because everyone here would have their price for which their morals would go, "nah, I'll take the cash thanks!".
Decline. Anonymously report him. Find another job.
This +1000!
While squaredonut is missing his balls, he actually has some!
95% of commenters are entertaining the thought of taking the boss's money. So Australian! Such gambling! Deep thought! Little risk!
Why are you the authority on what is Australian?
Not losing your source of income, not putting yourself through the stress of finding another job in this current market, not dobbing someone in and not ruining a reference when you could just turn the offer down is what I would call Australian.
We have a very different opinion on what it means to be Australian, and as you say 95% of fellow Australians seem to be leaning far away from your point of view.
You could have suggested the OP not to do the favour for the boss, that's fine - but your suggestion that OP should leave their job is significantly morally worse than suggesting they just turn the bosses offer down.
How much cash?
50 cent per point for you
Just get someone to bloody pair his phone with the car. Then every time he gets in, boom, connected. Then you just tell the dropkick that THIS BUTTON on the steering wheel answers it.
Honestly don't know how this sort of simpleton manages to be a boss.
Maybe there's a good reason no one wants tog
go with the boss to the car 🚗Honestly don't know how this sort of simpleton manages to be a boss.
Whilst I wholeheartedly agree, you'd honestly be surprised by the number of barely literate halfwits that occupy senior management positions within the industry I work (Gov & NGO)…it's not what you know, it's the other nepotistic dullards you know that matters! :/
I am questioning the trust and honesty of that doctor !!!!! I feel sorry for his/her patients .
"My wife works for a company where one of the Directors has a habit of constantly talking on his phone while driving"
Optometrists - that's what eye doctors are called :)
iDoctors
HUH i am I missing something? if he got caught on the phone… then by who? Police? then how can you provide someone else licence details. make no sense!!!!
Yes, good point, I was wondering that myself…I'm also interested in the response to this question.
Apologies for the confusion. He has had multiple fines, most from using his phone, but in this case, speed camera, so transferring the points is quite easy to do, as others have pointed out, even though it's illegal, and morally wrong.
i have 10 left. and it was an accident 2 yrs ago, when will it reset to 13 again?
Demerit points expire after 3 years in most States.
His idea would only work for speed/red light camera offences.
You can't do a stat dec for a fine where the driver has already been identified by police during the traffic stop.
It's possible that the boss has been pinned multiple times for talking on the phone and it's a speeding trap ticket that is pushing them over the line of losing their licence.
It's also possible that they were pinned at a red light camera and the photo evidence can make out a driver on a phone but not the actual driver.
It's also possible that they were pinned at a red light camera and the photo evidence can make out a driver on a phone but not the actual driver.
I doubt they have the technology to automatically identify a driver on a phone and it's very unlikely a human is checking every photo.
Put it this way - if this technology existed, why not just set up fixed/moving cameras to target people on phones, people without seat belts, people with hands our of windows (yes - this is illegal), engaging in other dangerous activities (eg sex) inside cars.
Since when sex inside cars is illegal? Probably many OZbargainers would not have been born if it was illegal.
Since when sex inside cars is illegal?
All depends on the context - getting/giving a blowjob/handjob/reach around/lapdance while the car is moving is 'dangerous driving'.
If the car is stationary and there's people around, it's probably lewd behavior or indecent exposure.
If the car is stationary and there's no one around. it probably didn't happen, so it's just plain old lying.
That depends on the relationship i guess, if my boss is my close friend n i can tell that he learnt his lesson, then probably i will take it once.
In your case, tht depends on how close your wife n her boss i guess.I don't want them very close..
$6k? What a rip. Can get them for as low as an iPad 2:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Wang-Shangkun-Anhui-Provinc…