I'm The "Noisy Neighbour":( - How to Reduce Noise Transfer to Next Door Apartment

mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 18:11
Last edited 19/11/2015 - 17:58

So I had a friend over to watch a DVD on Sat night and although we stopped watching the movie around midnight, we ended up talking (quietly) until around 4am.

My aggressive and highly volatile next door neighbour left a pretty rude note the next day complaining about the noise - apparently he could hear every word! - our duplex shares a (brick) party wall and has floor boards which I assume are shared across the two units.

Anyone have simple suggestions on how I can stop the transfer of my noise into his place? Would acoustic panels work, or are they only for improving the acoustics inside a room?

EDIT: Cheers for all the info folks, lots of good stuff to follow-up on. Man I love this site! You all rock! (but quietly, and not past midnight) :)

Home & Garden

Comments

  • adamren on 17/11/2015 - 18:48
    +3

    Apparently there is paint that does just as good a job. Heard about a year ago. Not sure if it's a final coat type of job or you have to paint over it again, if you don't like the colour already.

    But otherwise see where they would he hearing the noise. And chances are it was just the midnight movie and not the 4A.M. talking.

    Unless you were laughing loudly.

    So just get those soft spongy foam panels and place on wall where TV is. Just turn it turn after 9P.M. and turn surround sound etc off.

    Maybe use headphones if you can't move the TV.

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:38

      No, it was the 4am talking - he specifically mentioned certain topics we were discussing!

      I usually use headphones for radio/TV etc and don't have many guests over because he complains every time there is any noise…

        • elliot91 on 18/11/2015 - 16:16
          +99

          Nice try neighbor!

        • FrankMt on 18/11/2015 - 23:46
          +17

          I would be mad, what happened to respect between people? Dont mind a bit of noise but 4am is screwed up especially if your getting up for work at 6

        • [Deactivated] on 19/11/2015 - 13:14
          +1

          @jackary:
          I reckon. It's like buying a house next to an airport and complaining about air traffic noise. You're bound to get less tolerant neighbors and if you have 10 of them in close proximity, well I guess you're screwed for odds.

        • jackary on 19/11/2015 - 20:34
          +2

          @tshow: Thankyou! This is a great analogy.

          Just to downvote myself into oblivion, I bet this is the guy that whinges about noise, but then wakes up and slams every kitchen cabinet at 5am, and then does the same to every door and gate on his ever so entitled way off to work.

          I'm nearly developing an eye twitch remembering how frustrating living in apartment complexes could be sometimes. Glad I moved.

      • [Deactivated] on 22/11/2015 - 04:31

        They're not right.
        Many councils and state noise laws restrict the use of power tools, appliances and instuments to eg. 7am-7pm, and music or chatting can be played 24/7 outside with a clear peak/time -dB limitation.
        Normal life can go on 24/7 with just some limits.
        Over 40m (my area) between dwellings may have lower limits.

        They do this for a reason, people are also usually expected to be considerate, but 9-5 working people do not have the absolute 1st consideration in these matters.
        If you want to garden or paint your house at 3am, that's ok by state law (I understand), we have little freedom as it is, I do plenty in my shed after midnight but quitely, even cycle at night sometimes.
        It's called life.

        Your neighbour may be being simply a bully wanting to get things his own way, so due to your clear legal rights, he should probably ask nicely, or else you can play bagpipes for 1 hour p/day starting 7am, except 9am on Sunday.
        Been though this issue.

    • lemons4lime on 18/11/2015 - 14:35
      +4

      whats the paint called? - super intrigued about this

  • plmko on 17/11/2015 - 18:49
    +3

    Buy some foam (clark rubber or something) or hang a rug over the wall. Pot plants also work to some degree.

  • bringbring on 17/11/2015 - 18:53
    +4

    carpet! line your whole house with rugs. Walls and everything

    • airzone on 17/11/2015 - 21:08
      +10

      If you're going to do it, then do it with astroturf.

      • adamren on 18/11/2015 - 10:29

        Hehe. Except it's toxic. Got crazy levels of crap. But that's what happens when it's not made locally and on the cheap

        • airzone on 18/11/2015 - 11:09
          +5

          Whoops, looks like I will be redecorating on the weekend!

      • daewoo on 18/11/2015 - 15:37

        I've Astro-turfed the ceiling of my man-cave.

        It definitely helps with sound-reduction!

  • spackbace on 17/11/2015 - 18:56
    +1

    Don't think you weren't doing anything R-rated if they can apparently hear you gasbagging!

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:40
      +10

      The thought of him listening is a massive turn off, completely ruins it for me :)

      • Aarent on 19/11/2015 - 17:35
        +2

        no no no, you got it all wrong, the MORE you do IT, the higher chance he'll move out.

        YOU CAN DO EET! ALL NIGHT LOOONG! >:3

        • mad__llama on 19/11/2015 - 17:42
          +3

          Lol! Don't think there's much chance of that, he's been there for like 30-something years. Must have seen plenty of folks come and go (so to speak) :)

        • Aarent on 19/11/2015 - 18:31

          @mad__llama:

          "I'm trying to free your mind, mad_llama. But I can only show you the door. You're the one that has to walk through it." - Morpheus

  • [Deactivated] on 17/11/2015 - 19:05
    +3

    Carpeted walls are quite common in the apartments in russia the concrete walls seemed to echo noise
    So I'd say a nice feature wall using carpet looks nice and quite effective

    • [Deactivated] on 17/11/2015 - 22:09
      +1

      They're more like decorative rugs than carpet.

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:58

      No a bad idea - will look into it… would I have to cover the whole wall to get any effect?

    • ankor on 18/11/2015 - 22:01
      +7

      Touch the furry wall!

  • altomic on 17/11/2015 - 20:21
    +4

    can you hear the neighbour?

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:43
      +43

      Yes I can hear his TV - which usually plays until midnight most nights. He also screams/shrieks randomly during the night (night terrors/cobras?).
      However I'm a reasonable person who understands apartment living and so I sleep with earplugs. Which is what he should do as well…

      • KiLLUMiN4Ti on 18/11/2015 - 04:01
        +5

        Thanks 4 the laugh :-D
        http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5V7jvNyzmhY

      • verio on 18/11/2015 - 10:29
        -4

        I sleep with earplugs. Which is what he should do as well…

        Sorry mate, but if you are putting it this way, then it is you who should not be making noise at 4am and not him sleeping with earplugs.

        • mad__llama on 18/11/2015 - 15:32
          +7

          I've never lived in any place where a quiet conversation from neighbors could be heard at any time of day (at least not to the point where individual words could be made out), so I really didn't think we were disturbing but that's a fair cop and clearly I won't be doing it again at that hour.

          However, I'd like to be able to enjoy my home without the constant concern of how much noise I'm generating (and I'm not talking about heavy bass or loud parties, just quiet living) or having private conversations overheard -hence my asking for suggestions (as I know this is a problem that many folks have experienced from both sides).

        • jackary on 19/11/2015 - 09:53
          +10

          Right. So where do you draw the line? Is a crying baby at 4am okay and a TV is not? Should we divert the ambulance coming past your street sirens blazing as to not disturb your rest? What and when is noise appropriate to you? OP genuinely appears to want to reach a compromise here, so I don't quite understand the finger pointing game.

        • verio on 19/11/2015 - 10:17
          -3

          @jackary:

          OP genuinely appears to want to reach a compromise here

          Asking about acoustic panels is one thing and suggesting that his neighbour should sleep with earplugs just because he wants to have a chat with his mate at 4am is another.

          What and when is noise appropriate to you?

          Obviously, you can't control a crying baby and ambulance sirens is a also something that has a higher priority. However, if you want to spend the night watching tv or making other noise - make sure that your neighbours can't hear you.

        • jackary on 19/11/2015 - 10:36
          +3

          @brightaussie:

          Suggesting that his neighbour should sleep with earplugs

          It was equally suggested OP should too, though why are you focusing on one suggestion of many? The whole point of a forum is to exchange ideas, albeit ones that you find unreasonable

          You can't control a crying baby and ambulance sirens is also something that has a higher priority

          Uh, you can - but who are you to judge what is and isn't important, and why does it matter anyway? OP has made it pretty clear even if the sound was warranted, it would make little difference.

          Make sure that your neighbours can't hear you

          It's not plural, it's one neighbour. You're making out as if OP is a menace. Can I just repeat this is a shared complex. OP is not obliged to do this. The fact is he is "disturbing the peace" at best, something which would be difficult to argue from a regular conversation. OP has an equal right to enjoy his own living space and while I don't suggest a workable compromise is earplugs, just telling OP to be quiet in his own home is totally not on.

        • hayne on 19/11/2015 - 15:07
          -6

          @jackary:

          Wow, you know how to control a crying baby? You've cracked a conundrum that's confounded parents the world over. Figure out how to charge for it and you'll be a millionaire.

        • jackary on 19/11/2015 - 20:47

          Congratulations on missing my point

      • SlickMick on 18/11/2015 - 14:53
        +6

        you could get him a pair of earplugs and leave with a note "this is what I use when you're loud" - wouldn't hurt for him to know it's mutual.

        But then again, a bad relationship with a neighbour is better than a worse relationship with a neighbor, so I'm not suggesting antagonise him

        • mad__llama on 18/11/2015 - 15:34
          +1

          Yeah, thought about that. His general response in the past to attempts like that has been to ball up the note and throw it over the wall back into my property :)

        • BartholemewH on 19/11/2015 - 18:48

          @mad__llama:

          I must say, I like his style. Very direct.

      • Quotationz on 18/11/2015 - 20:56
        +2

        Ahhhhh COBRAS!!!

        • Brick50 on 19/11/2015 - 07:46
          +8

          That does sound racist, and no, "putting the brick in his car's windshield" won't help the situation

        • tomleonhart on 19/11/2015 - 07:51
          +8

          If you have problem with most of your neighbours, wouldn't you think maybe you are the problem?

        • Davros on 19/11/2015 - 09:11

          @Mattwilko: It certainly is racist and BS as well from what I have observed living in Asian nations that are generally incredibly noisy (karaoke at home, noisy funeral processions in early am, call to payer in early am, tooting motorcycle horns continually)
          Interestingly I never had a problem sleeping there but do back here in Australia with much lower noise levels.

        • frbargain on 19/11/2015 - 09:53
          +1

          How many east Asian neighbors have you had that have complained about noise levels? One? Great sample size.

        • phillay on 19/11/2015 - 11:47
          +1

          "Anyway, I don't want to stereotype or sound racist but based on my experience if your neighbour is east-asian, they are most likely have 0 tolerance & tend to complain even to little noise even though you already decrease your volume level to be 1-2 % in sound system. Perhaps a culture difference?"

          You don't want to but it does, so you might as well just start that paragraph with "Based on my…"

        • [Deactivated] on 19/11/2015 - 22:51
          -1

          By any chance are you south asian? You added a modifier to "Asians" and as a generalization (since we're throwing those around), those groups don't get along well often.

        • [Deactivated] on 20/11/2015 - 21:05
          -1

          15 noise complaining Asians dislike this

      • pufffdragon on 19/11/2015 - 10:31
        +1

        Have you told him that you can hear all his crap every night and that you have to use ear plugs to sleep as well? Maybe even slip him a note everyday to remind him of all his imperfections.

        You sound pretty reasonable though, but having to live to the point where you're using headphones to watch tv to not upset this wacko is a bit too much. All the best dude. Hope you can find a solution.

      • RefusdClassification on 20/11/2015 - 03:08
        +1

        The problem with earplugs is they create a warm, moist environment inside your ears that is ideal for fungi and bacteria to breed in.

  • outlander on 17/11/2015 - 20:28
    +17

    Easy solution. If you're going to have a 'friend' over, don't 'talk' up against the wall. Either 'talk' in a bed, or invite your neighbour to join the party.

    • evol on 17/11/2015 - 21:05
      +2

      ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ayyyyy

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:45
      +5

      Maybe you should meet him first before you offer :) I'd sooner give up sex forever than have him join in!

      Oh and talking in the bedroom would be even worse since both bedrooms share the party wall :/

      • Scrooge McDuck on 18/11/2015 - 18:37
        +5

        both bedrooms share the party wall :/

        What an enormous design oversight! O_O

        • mad__llama on 19/11/2015 - 17:54

          Totally agree - guess it was built in a different era (1970s)

      • outlander on 18/11/2015 - 21:38
        +1

        Woahhh, hey hey hey, who said anything about sex? I'm just talking about talking here.

        Though, you know he doesn't have to be a physical part of it. He could just watch whether he likes it or not

      • ankor on 18/11/2015 - 22:06
        +5

        One night, gf passed out drunk. My bedroom adjoined 2 other neighbours bedrooms. Friday night midnight and all i hear is synchronised moaning. At least the neighbours had a good night that night.

        • neonlight on 19/11/2015 - 20:16

          Synchronised moaning… Sounds like an opera. Your neighbour certainty was easily aroused. I hope it's a she not a he.

    • kma on 18/11/2015 - 21:23
      -2

      Depends what sorta 'friend' (with or without benifits) is coming over :-D

  • serpserpserp on 17/11/2015 - 20:54
    +4

    Can you post a picture of this party wall?

    • cupcake on 18/11/2015 - 22:36

      Parting wall lol I wanna see too. It's a party wall if everyone's invited. Just don't stay past 4am :P

  • kywst on 17/11/2015 - 21:12
    +1

    Foam will help. The "party wall" should be core filled so about 20cm of concrete thick + stud and plaster providing a chamber either side that the noise must travel through. so when I read your neighbour could hear your whispered conversations I immediately thought he must have been really trying. Maybe check to see if the party wall is solid or keep an out for old mate.

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:49
      +1

      So foam attached to the outside of the wall? The wall is pretty solid - I think either brick of cinder blocks, plaster covered?

  • Vampyr on 17/11/2015 - 21:46
    +2

    Your sound issues aren't through the brick wall. It's most likely being carried along the floor boards. Good luck!

    • inherentchoice on 17/11/2015 - 22:47
      +2

      So in that case just put down a plush rug to stop the floor boards absorbing so much noise?

      • Vampyr on 17/11/2015 - 22:54
        +4

        I should also mention that it could be through open windows etc.

        The plush rug would act just as much to dampen the floor boards as it would to absorb sound before it made it to the floor boards.

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:54

      Ahh, thought that might be part of the problem. I already have a rug covering part of the room… maybe need a few more.

      Would those polystyrene insulating blocks you can fit under the floorboards help? e.g. http://expol.com.au/

      • Vampyr on 17/11/2015 - 22:57
        +6

        If your neighbour is reasonable, tell him you are trying to cut down the noise. Ask if you could listen from his side whilst you have someone talk from your apartment. Then, listen for the source of the sound. EG windows, floor, wall etc. Then tackle the problem. It's very hard / expensive to throw products at a problem without properly identifying the source.

        • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 23:03
          +5

          Understood but he's literally the opposite of reasonable - there is no way he'd allow anyone in his house.

          He's so nuts that he has put up a high wall around his unit with a locked gate and no way to ring a doorbell. If you want to talk to him you have to stand outside his fence and yell, hoping that he hears you - and usually he just ignores you.

        • fleetoiler on 17/11/2015 - 23:58

          See my longer cmment/ramble below. Maybe try his way of communicating - a note under the door or in letter box - and see if he can spare 5 minutes to help YOU spend money/time/effort on the problem which will make the rest of his life a whole lot quieter for very little effort on his part. If he won't allow you in, perhaps he might at least offer some info that helps you narrow down the worst of the sounds getting through?

        • Charity on 18/11/2015 - 16:27
          +42

          @mad__llama: just wait until 4am and talk to him through the living room wall ☺

        • serpserpserp on 18/11/2015 - 21:13
          +2

          @Charity:

          Haha I was just about to suggest the same thing.

        • Terra Australis on 19/11/2015 - 11:32
          +2

          @mad__llama: Tell him that the noise issue persists if he doesn't help you.

  • inherentchoice on 17/11/2015 - 22:43
    +2

    Is there a gap under the main entrance door to you apartment? Even a cheap door draught stopper can stop noise getting out and in.

    http://ebay.com.au/itm/271968212588

    If this works then maybe consider attaching a decent door seal.

    • mad__llama on 17/11/2015 - 22:55

      No gap, already have a door seal.

  • fleetoiler on 17/11/2015 - 23:52
    +3

    I'm also interested in sound dampeners and will be following this thread - but for dampening the thumping bass/dubstep/low-freq-sounds. The neighbours have quite the quality speakers and industrial-club-dubstep-electro-beats taste in music, and we have a raised qlder with bare floorboards. Does the carpet/rugs/etc need to be in the source room (i.e. next door?) for it to work or will it help if we cover our floor/walls? Earplugs don't do a thing the bass seems to just travel up through the floor and vibrate into your skull.

    Unlike OP situation, I have an ok relationship with the boys nezt door and am willing to work together with them to keep everyone happy, am thinking I might buy them a rug or two if that will help, heh.

    As far as suggestions for OP - you mention he slipped a note to you and he wsa a bit of a recluse - perhaps if you cannot get in contact with him to help solve the problem, you try doing the same, write him a note and express that you are really wanting to dampen the noise but you need a tiny bit of his help to pinpoint where & what noise is getting through, it will only take 5 minutes and he doesn't have to do anything, his life will be so much easier, etc etc, sugar coat it as much as you feel neccessary to 'get your foor in the door' so to speak. It sounds like you're already very reasonable & compromising your lifestyle activities for little return. Hopefully if you can convey that it is in his best interests to be slightly inconvenienced now, then you will make his grumpy little isolated life so much more quiet & boring in the future he will jump at the chance. Maybe wordsmith that a little, he sounds like a right toss. He has the TV on 'til midnight then complains to YOU about the noise? Perhaps he just needs a few noise complaints himself… j/k probably not good to poke the bear in this case.

    • mad__llama on 18/11/2015 - 00:39

      Cheers fleetoiler - Keep a watch, if I find anything useful I'll add to the post.

      I have tried to speak to him before about the noise - his response then and in his latest note is that he considers any noise after midnight a violation of his peace and that's the end of the story. The fact that this is exactly the second time I've made any noise after 10pm in the 2+ years I've been living here doesn't seem to register with him - there is no give-and-take in the "relationship".

      He is at best very volatile and I'm not certain exactly what he is capable of, hence unwilling to push too far - my car is parked outside my unit and I don't have any fencing at all, so I feel somewhat vulnerable. He's one of these asses who has clearly lived his life intimidating others with crazy and that seems to be his entire repertoire for dealing with people (not just myself). Example: every note ends with vague threats like "I'll be watching" or "your provocation has been noted and will not be forgotten" etc.

      Having said that I'll give some thought to the idea of approaching him - I'd really like to be able to have people over and not get stressed about kicking them out well before midnight on a freaking Saturday night!

      • jenkemjunkie on 18/11/2015 - 09:26
        +4

        I'd pull his card. If he's dropping notes and afraid of a face to face confrontation then I'd tell him to kick rocks. I wouldn't worry about repercussions because he's all talk. It's pretty easy to set up a webcam to watch your car. I'd keep his notes and notify the police that you are receiving threats from a creepy recluse neighbour and that he is 'watching me' and perhaps 'peeping through your windows.' Embellish a few details, 'he's been leaving notes all around your own house'… Again I know this isn't reasonable, but you're playing his game. People are offering good advice here, but unfortunately that advice rarely works with neighbours like yours because they aren't on planet reasonable with the same social decorum. This guys hobby is to find something to complain about. If he was deaf he'd still complain about the noise.

        I have dealt with people like this before. I'd never do duplex or complex living ever again. I'm a bastard though. Hear the sound from his TV? I'd blow the speakers on it with radio equipment and he'd have no idea ;).

        • Speckled Jim on 18/11/2015 - 11:44

          Let's assume OP is renting: he's screwed.

          Nearly everyone has a camera in their phone. All Mr Grumpy has to do is record anything that disturbs his peace and quiet. He sends video(s) to agent/tenancy tribunal/council/police and OP has to look for a solution. Of which, I can't add much except check your window seals and close any internal doors between your HT system and the neighbouring unit.

          But even if OP is an owner-occupier, every local council has noise abatement by-laws. Use of noisy power tools (such as those used in home renovations) are covered in many residential districts, and 1800 or 1900 is usually time to down-tools. I sometimes push this a little in the summer months, as a "reasonable person" would have to concede daylight hours and one of the perks of DST is more light for your home projects after work hours…

          Music and parties are obviously much later! There's usually no set time; if someone has a gripe and authorities agree it's reasonable, the noisy party has to tone it down.

        • jenkemjunkie on 18/11/2015 - 13:52
          -1

          I'd hardly worry about being issued a noise abatement direction for the situation the OP has described. Nor would I worry about being evicted. Even though I'd be wanting to move as soon as possible.

          But yeah power tools and parties and you're a good neighbour…got it! OP don't belt sand your walls at 3am whilst having a party…even then, we all know how slow the council or agency are to act.

        • Speckled Jim on 18/11/2015 - 14:14
          +1

          @docholliday:
          Agents can be slack if they're managing the property. Depends who it is.

          But Councils hesitant to issue infringement notices and collect money?
          You're obviously not a rate payer.

        • jenkemjunkie on 18/11/2015 - 14:40
          -1

          @mcmonte:

          Firstly it's power tools and you talking about your projects and daylight savings…now its infringement notices and their correlation to revenue raising and my residential status?

          You need to work on how you draw your parallels.

        • mad__llama on 18/11/2015 - 15:24

          I'd never do duplex or complex living ever again.

          Learning that lesson well and clear :/
          This is not the first duplex I've lived but I think every other has had the bedrooms separate from the party walls.

        • Speckled Jim on 19/11/2015 - 10:11

          @docholliday:
          You missed the point. All Councils are strapped for cash. Or so they claim. I suspect they piss it away as all levels of Government do.

          Many Councils have guidelines for power tools, but not for music/movies/parties/4am drunk-talk.

          It's down to what's reasonable, and if Mr Grumpy-neighbour isn't reasonable and he can produce video evidence of his disturbance, Council can fine the offending party.

          This is in addition to Strata rules for the complex, which may have curfew times. This is also in addition to all Tenancy agreements signed by the applicant that includes (paraphrasing):
          "Applicant agrees to not interfere with the quiet enjoyment of neighbouring residents."

          But renting or not, there can be consequences if someone has a gripe and they choose to pursue it.

        • Speckled Jim on 19/11/2015 - 10:26

          @mad__llama:

          We're lucky. This villa complex has ours and the adjoining unit under the same roof, separated by a concrete block wall dividing the garages. There can still be issues though, as the neighbour had converted their garage to a bedroom.

          Hey, if starting or working on my car disturbs them, sorry but they made that choice with full knowledge there's a garage adjacent. Haven't had any complaints, but I suspect a few tenants wished they had a better look at the property before signing.

          Generally, what about the growing trend of residential downsizing, and the inverse trend of AV receivers gaining more power (9.2 anyone?) I foresee much potential aggro.

        • jenkemjunkie on 19/11/2015 - 12:06
          +2

          @mcmonte:

          No I didn't miss the point. Your point is hardly analogous to the OPs situation. You are talking about power tools and parties. The OP has a neighbour complaining about chatter through the walls. Then you make the crazy conclusion that the OP is stuffed if he/she is renting and if Mr. Grumpy records some household sounds that emanate from the OPs premises. Then you try and speak legal when you really have no idea the elements that comprise those terms and phrases of 'reasonable person'. Nor do you know how a tribunal or court would assess the situation.

          So let me define the reasonable person test in this situation for you if Mr. Grumpy does imply the OP is being a private nuisance under tort law, it will take a while until I actually get to it:

          Yes. Noise is considered under private nuisance as outlined in Munro v Southern Dairies Ltd [1955] VLR 332. However, we must ascertain whether this 'interferes' with Mr. Grumpy's 'quiet enjoyment' (as stated in your 'paraphrased' strata laws) really makes 'common sense'. This common sense test is defined in Bamford v Turnley (1862) 3 B & S 62 at 83-4. It was stated that There is a test of ʻcommon senseʼ, based on the notion that neighbours must expect to ʻgive and takeʼ, live and let liveʼ in the course of normal and reasonable use of property. This is also known as the 'Neighbourhood Principle.'

          Using this 'neighbourhood principle' Inferred from the facts the OP has given, it is common sense that a person in a duplex sharing a party wall will no doubt hear the day to day musings of the neighbour, be it watching the TV or quietly chatting. The OPs chatting and TV watching is a trivial matter, she is not using power tools at midnight disturbing the whole neighbourhood, nor is she having parties that disturb the neighbourhood causing a public nuisance. She is watching TV with a friend in the privacy of her home totally unaware that her neighbour can hear anything. This triviality will imply that Mr. Grumpy will not have a cause of action to bring. (Kennaway v Thompson (1981) QB 88; Andreae v Selfridge [1937] 3 All ER 255).

          If the action is somehow brought which would exhibit actual incompetence on behalf of who is hearing the claims, all the OP will have to show is that he/she will be exempted from liability of nuisance if the OP shows that his/her conduct is : a) necessary for the common/ordinary use/occupation of land/houses, and b) done with proper consideration for the interests of neigbouring occupiers: (Southwark London Borough Council v Tanner & Ors [2001] 1 AC 1 at 21.)

          I could keep going and satisfy these elements but there's no point. However, I will leave this with you. The law tries to strike a fair balance between the plaintiffʼs right to undisturbed enjoyment of land, and the defendantʼs right to lawfully use his property: (Halsey v Esso Petroleum Co Ltd [1961] 2 All ER 145). In doing this I will outline the pertinent issue of this 'Reasonable person' thing you are trying to talk to me about. A reasonable person has to endure noises and other interferences that constitute the ordinary incidents of life in our particular locality.The duration, time of day, frequency and extent of the interference will be relevant in determining whether it is unreasonable. This again is outlined in Andreae v Selfridge [1937] 3 All ER 255. The OPs situation given that this is not a regular occurrence and could be construed as not being malicious and a regular living activity, the courts would find it difficult to see noise from the OP as being unreasonable.

          In my experience, and going by your previous comment history you could probably infer what I do, a noise abatement direction or order is not an infringement notice. It would not on first instance contain any monetary fine. The fine would only be issued by a court if the OP failed to followed the direction or order.

          Lastly, noise offences are hard to prosecute, and it's not just me saying that. Report 88 done by the NSW Justice department have suggested reforms to the difficulty in prosecuting noise offences. Using NSW as an example it stated The elements that the prosecution had to prove to establish that a person had breached a noise control notice under s 41 of the Noise Control Act 1975 (NSW). Given the OPS situation, the report also found the value of the Noise Control Act 1975 (NSW) is limited by the very poor acoustical standard and lack of vibration dampening features in most multiple residential dwellings.

          And these fines you speak of and the REVENUE RAISING: The Commission was advised during consultations that councils make considerable use of penalty notices
          for pollution offences, but that they are not so often used for noise offences. Sure the councils can be seen as revenue raising but not for noise offences.

          I will finish this off by saying that the OP can follow whatever advice they have been given, and all my advice would be is that he/she really doesn't have to worry and she should stand up for herself, and she would not be stuffed if Mr. Grumpy had a camera phone. I'd also tell you that if you'd ever have a neighbourhood or council issue you should probably seek a lawyer, your interpretations of the law and 'knowledge' of council practices will do you a massive disservice.

          EDIT: I just read your comment regarding your neighbour converting their garage into a bedroom. Welcome to duplex and complex living. They attract the worst neighbours. Garages are for cars and I will devote mine strictly for wrenching on mine when I have time.

        • mad__llama on 19/11/2015 - 23:49

          @docholliday:

          Whoah. That is… definitive! And actually quite interesting too. Cheers Doc, if I ever need to take this further I know where I'm turning :)

        • Speckled Jim on 20/11/2015 - 12:27

          @docholliday:
          You failed to see the distinctions I was making.

          1. Using a hammer or power tools is one thing; there's often a down-tools time.

          2. Parties are another matter, and we all have opinions on what's reasonable there.
            I don't see a weakness in video evidence if it were produced. There'd be a created and modified date and time-stamp on the file, and depending on the device/recording software, those could also be OSD overlayed on the footage. Sure, the audio could be manipulated by boosting it, but there's a very real possibility that would also boost hiss in the quiet passages (unless there's a noise gate or similar in the software).

          3. As for the 4am talk, yes it's perfectly fine, dandy and agreeable.

          The problem is, we're hearing just one side of the story (albeit, an OzB member so we're a little biased). The neighbour was obviously wound-up already from the party music.

          There follows an "after-party" gathering and those present may not be sober. So what the OP writes as "talking quietly" is totally subjective and relative, given their state of intoxication.

          It's not uncommon to be much louder when even a little tiddly, and not realise it. Happens to the best of us.

          If the neighbour were to shoot video in his room at 4am and conversation could be heard in the recording, wouldn't you expect Council would order an inspection of the building to ensure it was up to code?

          You question the enforcement side of the issue. My advice on this is based on information from two Police Radio operators I've spoken to on this matter when I was working in the security industry (NSW & TAS).
          I'd hope they would be in a position to know!

        • Speckled Jim on 20/11/2015 - 12:30

          I just read your comment regarding your neighbour converting their garage into a bedroom. Welcome to duplex and complex living. They attract the worst neighbours. Garages are for cars and I will devote mine strictly for wrenching on mine when I have time.

          Yes, we briefly considered following suit with our garage.
          But then we'd have to park on the street. And where would all the bulk purchases go?
          It's quite the mini warehouse in there.

      • [Deactivated] on 19/11/2015 - 11:15

        Turn his power off at the swtich box and wait for him …..

    • Vampyr on 18/11/2015 - 07:35

      Yeah Flee, it's MUCH more effective to control the problem at the source…

      Damping at your end will also help, though.

  • kima on 18/11/2015 - 07:36
    +1

    insulation can help a lot, every gap you leave is a weakness for sound to get through. if your neighbour is that bad then its probably not the best venue for you to have friends over until midnight.

    • mad__llama on 18/11/2015 - 15:20

      As in ceiling insulation?

      • ankor on 18/11/2015 - 22:09
        +3

        No, the neighbour. Wrap him up in foam padding!?

      • kima on 19/11/2015 - 20:44

        ceiling walls and floor

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