Identity Declaration Form 1195 Citizenship

mickey888 on 28/11/2014 - 16:25
Last edited 30/11/2014 - 08:51

Hello Everyone

My partner and I granted pr last year and had been staying here 5 years to enter citizenship. We applied yesterday, and still finding people to sign our 1195 forms. As we both don't socialise much, and working in warehouse, it's hard to know anyone from the list for at least 12 months.

We both went to the police, GP, post office and even banks (opened more than 5 years), all said no, because they don't know us. We are not criminals. It's just we are not active in the communities, and because of this, I can't find anyone to sign.

Thank you for leading me to the right direction.

Otherwise, please advice on our next step.

General Discussion

closed Comments

  • pyramid on 28/11/2014 - 16:28
    +5

    Your colleague or co-worker or boss or owner of your workplace should know you and can sign for you.

    • mickey888 on 28/11/2014 - 16:30
      +1

      Nah…. There is a list of no1-38 occupation. None match them. It would be easier to ask them to sign.

      • zeke219 on 30/11/2014 - 16:48

        Hi, you can ask your doctor to sign it for you as long as you visited him 1 year before. As for other people, they can't do it, because it risks their job, and possibly their citizenship status.

        • Baysew on 30/11/2014 - 17:27
          +1

          Hi, you can ask your doctor to sign

          Please read rest of post. Doctor says - No

        • zeke219 on 30/11/2014 - 17:36

          @Baysew: From what he said, he probably went to a doctor that doesn't have records with them. Usually, if you establish a relationship with a doctor after few visits within a year or two, then HE/SHE considered as as someone can identify you as who you are.

        • Baysew on 30/11/2014 - 17:45

          @zeke219:

          This is what op HAS said

          By the way, the GP and dentist - You bring medicare card and come in, ' Hi how are you, long time no see' . When ask them to sign, ' I don't know you'

          Your comment is wrong.

          As for other people, they can't do it, because it risks their job, and possibly their citizenship status.

          There is no risk to citizenship status, people simply are honest and won't sign off on something that is not true.

  • tomatosauce on 28/11/2014 - 16:51
    +2

    Real Estate Agent if you are renting?

    • mickey888 on 28/11/2014 - 16:55

      Yes I m renting. But which occupation is that fall under?

      • tomatosauce on 28/11/2014 - 17:02

        I am not sure about the 1-38 occupation but they may happen to be JP. Is JP no good?

  • 2jzzzz on 28/11/2014 - 16:56
    +10

    Get out and socialise, be a good citizen.

    • mickey888 on 28/11/2014 - 16:57

      I m a good citizen.

      • Baysew on 28/11/2014 - 17:24
        +30

        If any Good Samaritan OZBARGAIN-er nearby Glen Waverley VIC would like to help us, we both are very grateful for your generous help.

        Please don't ask people to FASELY verify identity documents.

        WARNING: It is an offence under section 50 of the Australian
        Citizenship Act 2007 to deliberately make, or cause to make,
        a false or misleading statement, or conceal circumstances in
        relation to an application.

      • thejew on 28/11/2014 - 19:43
        +7

        THIS!

        A good Australian citizen avoids breaking the law!

        Fraud is breaking the law!

        Please don't ask people to FASELY verify identity documents.

        WARNING: It is an offence under section 50 of the Australian Citizenship Act 2007 to deliberately make, or cause to make, a false or misleading statement, or conceal circumstances in relation to an application.

        • Baysew on 28/11/2014 - 21:56
          +1

          Copy cat from Ballarat.

        • [Deactivated] on 29/11/2014 - 00:04
          +1

          Fraud is breaking the law!

          So much irony that you post that here. A place were for the past few years people have been trying to price match pricing errors to get products at an incorrect price which would be fraudulent. Oh cruel irony.

          That said, unless you personally know anyone on here, you cannot be helped as it would be against the law for them to sign.

        • PJC on 29/11/2014 - 00:52
          +6

          Trying to price match a pricing error is opportunism. It is not fraudulent because there has been no deception.

      • mickey888 on 30/11/2014 - 08:55
        -5

        Yes I m trying to break the law. Sorry …

  • Mokr on 28/11/2014 - 17:08

    Doesnt the person vouching need to fall into another category? Like professional body

  • whooah1979 on 28/11/2014 - 17:13
    +1

    out of interest. why do you want an australian citizenship? are you planning on getting a job in the public sector? joining the adf?

    • scrimshaw on 28/11/2014 - 17:50
      +2

      Makes you eligible for welfare support. However there is usually a waiting period, usually 6~10 years.

      • maximum on 29/11/2014 - 07:43
        +3

        You don't need to be a citizen for welfare- permanent residency is enough and the waiting period for most payments is 2 years. (The exception being pensions)
        Op probably just wants to be Australian. I would want to if I wasn't already.

      • [Deactivated] on 30/11/2014 - 06:41

        If welfare is good enough for me it's good enough for him.

      • ThadtheChad on 01/12/2014 - 14:11

        Also depending on the industry, easier to get baseline and other security clearances.

        Lastly, if the "wanderlust" bug bites you, then the Aussie passport is one that opens most doors:
        http://www.traveller.com.au/whats-the-best-passport-in-the-w…

    • brotherfranciz on 30/11/2014 - 14:05

      http://www.citizenship.gov.au/should_become/

      Responsibilities – what you will give Australia. As an Australian citizen you must:
      - obey the law;
      - defend Australia should the need arise;
      - serve on a jury if called to do so;
      - vote in federal and state or territory elections, and in a referendum.

      Privileges – what Australia will give you. As an Australian citizen you have the right to:
      - vote in federal and state or territory elections, and in a referendum;
      - apply for work in the Australian Public Service or in the Australian Defence Force;
      - seek election to parliament;
      - apply for an Australian passport and re-enter Australia freely;
      - receive help from an Australian official while overseas;
      - register children born overseas as Australian citizens by descent.

      • Scrooge McDuck on 30/11/2014 - 21:26
        +1

        defend Australia should the need arise;

        With what?

        Beer cans and barbie tongs?

  • tomatosauce on 28/11/2014 - 17:19

    How about a teacher if you ever attended any courses or a language school?

  • ifuggedxyz on 28/11/2014 - 17:48
    +1

    Do you have an accountant? He/she will be able to help.

  • scrimshaw on 28/11/2014 - 17:49

    Here a complete list of occupations the person signing must hold.

    http://www.citizenship.gov.au/applying/files/pid_docs/occupa…

    This is the easiest one:

    Justice of the peace

    There are JP's everywhere man. Go to a public library. Go to a shopping centre. Ask if there is a JP in that region. You will find one easily.

    • bonezAU on 28/11/2014 - 18:20
      +9

      You won't find one easily that has known you for over a year if you've never met them.

    • Baysew on 28/11/2014 - 18:20
      +2

      The problem is not so much finding a JP or who ever , but finding one that meets these conditions

      be an Australian citizen*, and
      have known you for at least one year, and
      not be related to you by birth, marriage or defacto relationship, and
      be easy to contact by telephone during normal working hours, should we need to contact them, and
      be currently working in a profession or occupation listed below.

      • scrimshaw on 28/11/2014 - 19:49

        Yeah, that could be difficult. But Op's lack of social interaction is also the main barrier. Make some small talk at your local post office, or chemist, or payroll officer for example and at least know their name and let them know yours.

    • [Deactivated] on 30/11/2014 - 06:42

      Get some of your friends to become JP's, I heard its like a weekend course or something like that, although there is a good chance I'm completely wrong.

      • ThadtheChad on 01/12/2014 - 14:14
        +1

        Being a JP is a seriously arduous undertaking. Goes through a number of vetting and approvals processes. :) It is not a weekend course by any stretch of imagination. My team lead is a JP, and it took him almost a year to get his JP sorted out.

    • c64 on 30/11/2014 - 19:11
      +3

      Here a complete list of occupations the person signing must hold.

      lol why is a chiropractor a reputable profession?

  • mskeggs on 28/11/2014 - 18:36
    +3

    The issue is they need to have known the OP for 12 months.
    Some ideas:
    - often Real Estate agents will be JPs or have a JP in the office.
    - Pharmacists if you get regular medication?
    - Try the GP again? Make a nuisance of yourself.
    - Dentist? Have you not been to the dentist in the last 5 years?
    - Who did your taxes?

    You aren't asking them to swear you are an angel, just that you are the person they have met/dealt with for longer than 12 months.
    Also, try someone in payroll at work? There is often somebody qualified as an accountant.

    • mickey888 on 28/11/2014 - 19:01
      +3

      I understand what you are saying. I am not asking them to swear I am a saint. I just need to progress the application.

      Pharmacists - Chemist warehouse, go in get medicine, pay $$, go home.
      GP - See them once a year, I do get sick. But no is a no. They don't know me.
      Dentist - same as GP
      Tax - did by ourselves
      Bank - Do banking and see them every month, anyway same as GP

      Will try to ring real estate agent and ask my supervisor on Monday.

      By the way, the GP and dentist - You bring medicare card and come in, ' Hi how are you, long time no see' . When ask them to sign, ' I don't know you'

      • pandabun on 29/11/2014 - 07:54

        You sound like the old me till we moved to a close knitted property where we have local dentist, doctors, public gym, etc. We tend to go to the same one as it's just so convenient and over time, without even trying, people get to know us.

      • JayEmmGee on 29/11/2014 - 12:26
        +1

        It depends what they want from "know" on the form. I would argue being a patient at a doctor or dentist for over a year means they "know" you, as well as being a banking customer

        • xuqi on 29/11/2014 - 13:41
          -2

          No point arguing any point. If anyone does not feel comfortable in signing the form, then it is their choice.

          This whole thread should be nuked, with the inclusion of the post informing the OP, that he is on the forum soliciting fraudulent behaviour.

        • mickey888 on 30/11/2014 - 09:13

          @xuqi:
          Yes, I agree, no point arguing. It's your choice.
          Same here at ozbargain, I been here long, 'know' some great/famous member. But do they know me? - Point no 1
          Point 2 - it's your freedom and your choice entirely. Why would I want to force anyone?
          Point 3 - I haven't done fraud yet. I am about to …hmmm maybe this thread should close down
          Point 4 - I am asking for advise
          Point 5 - nothing to say

        • voteoften on 30/11/2014 - 21:13

          @mickey888:

          Inducing, soliciting or conspiring to commit fraud. Could be a crime.

      • Love a bargain on 29/11/2014 - 17:35
        +2

        How many doctors have you been to in the past?

        I've heard doctors would often be willing to sign the form for you as long as he/she has record of having seeing you over a year ago. Worth trying if you have been to more than one doctor in the past. Arguably, this will also work for some other professions on that list (e.g. dentist, chiropractor, physiotherapist, etc) but might be harder for others like post office staff since they don't keep record of when they've seen you and are not required to ID you when they serve you.

        The company's accountant might be a viable option (depending on the size of your company and your role of course).

        Or else, get to know someone who qualify now and you can apply in a year's time.

  • Baysew on 28/11/2014 - 20:12
    +7

    I have got the solution !

    Number 25

    Member of the Parliament of the Commonwealth, a State, a Territory Legislature, or a local government authority of a State or Territory

    Go see you local politician.

    Explain your problem to them.
    Visit them regularly so they get to know you and your partner.
    You can complain to them and work towards them signing off on your documents at the same time.

    They might even have another solution.

    Join a sporting group. Often there will be someone that may help.
    (I'm trying to resist saying if football or cricket will be automatically accepted)

    Any migrant groups you could join ?

    • Baysew on 30/11/2014 - 20:31

      I'm trying to resist saying if football or cricket will be automatically accepted

      But it helps if you can spin the ball a little

      Fawad Ahmed

  • PJC on 28/11/2014 - 21:07
    +4

    Try your Bank Manager. Having looked after your money for over a year, it would be truthful to say he/she has known you. You don't have to be best mates. A similar argument could be used with your reluctant GP. If he/she has been prescribing to you, and you have the same Medicare card, it is honest to declare he/she has known you for a year.

  • dp1 on 29/11/2014 - 15:22

    Do you have children - what about their teacher?
    Neighbours you have crossed paths with for over a year - make an effort to get to know them and you might find one of them happens to be a nurse, vet, midwife, Australia Post employee, ex-defence forces etc.
    Get a cat and get to know your local vet that way.
    If your social circle is restricted you need to fix this and the problem will fix itself. Get to know people at work and you might be surprised what you find out about them - they might be working at a warehouse now but they may have a more interesting past, especially older people.

    • Love a bargain on 29/11/2014 - 17:40

      "be currently working in a profession or occupation listed below" - so someone's occupation in the past doesn't count

      • YTW on 30/11/2014 - 00:41
        +2

        One of his workmates could be a JP. It would be worth asking around. Especially in the finance department if there is one.

        I'm a Comm. Dec. and had a woman at a playgroup I was attending lamenting that she didn't know anyone who could sign a form for her - I took a look and could do it for her, much to her surprise. She'd never thought to ask at playgroup, ironically there were two of us there that day who were qualified to sign what she needed.

    • mickey888 on 30/11/2014 - 08:42

      No children. Only my partner and I.
      Neighbours -left and right -retiree
      No pets.

      Yes. Bit anti social. But do hang out on certain night with friends

      Workmates - previous trades, chippies, brickie, chef, etc - now working in warehouse. Yes, previous doesn't count.

  • No ONE on 29/11/2014 - 17:49

    You must have either a teacher or a JP Doctor who know you for at least 12 months. If none of them, I guess you are in a very bad situation.

  • andyken on 29/11/2014 - 17:54

    Who is your accountant? or get one by asking them to do your tax next year :)

  • thepigs on 29/11/2014 - 19:54
    -7

    I'll do it for $500.

    • mickey888 on 30/11/2014 - 09:16
      -3

      Thanks! I saved $500 at ozbargain

    • umoddbro on 30/11/2014 - 19:37
      -3

      I'll do it for $400!

  • TtiGeR on 29/11/2014 - 20:32
    +13

    I know someone who was in the exact same situation.

    He rang DIBP (Department of Immigration and Border Protection), they gave him a different option. I don't remember what exactly it was and he's overseas at the moment. But I recall it required signatures from two citizens (just general public) who know you instead of one citizen from the list.

    Check with DIBP. It's not something uncommon.

    • lolmao on 30/11/2014 - 00:27

      this

    • mickey888 on 30/11/2014 - 08:36
      -2

      Really? Thank you for pointing me to the right direction. I do have friends (citizen) but not on the list, even my circle is small. I would ring DIBP straight away on Monday.

      To be honest, the list shows that how midget I am without that kind of friends in community. Little discrimination I would say. But what can I do? With powerful friend, make life so much easier…

      • voteoften on 30/11/2014 - 21:16
        +4

        Discrimination? I find that offensive. You are the one not interacting. It's your choice.

      • TtiGeR on 01/12/2014 - 07:50
        +4

        The guy I was referring to called me last night from overseas. I asked him about the citizenship story but he couldn't remember much (well, it's two years ago).

        All he remembered was he called DIBP (was DIAC at the time) and was initially told he must find someone on the list to do the from. He visited a DIAC (DIBP) office and complained on the basis that the Citizenship Act did not mention such occupation/profession list/requirement at all. They later gave him a different option but he couldn't recall the exact requirements. He said I signed something for him (I don't think it was for the citizenship but for the passport application).

        DIBP is well known for its inconsistency so you might need some luck (as well as patience) finding the right person to help you.

        Good luck!

        • TtiGeR on 01/12/2014 - 13:59
          +16

          Okay. I managed to call 131 880 during the lunch break for you. The lady initially insisted it's a mandatory requirement. I asked for a supervisor. She then checked with a supervisor and came back saying the 1 year requirement can be lowered to 2-3 months but at the discretion of a case officer. It's a case-by-case thing and the supervisor suggested making a paper application with a cover letter explaining why the applicant is not able to find someone to complete the identity declaration. Once the application is processed, the case officer will contact the applicant with further instructions. I asked if it's possible to waive the "known me for a year" requirement completely. She said it's very unlikely unless the applicant has very special circumstances e.g. disability, mental illness. But again, she said it's all at the discretion of a case officer.

        • Baysew on 01/12/2014 - 14:20
          +3

          @TtiGeR:

          Okay. I managed to call 131 880 during the lunch break for you.

          Well Done ! Deeds speak louder than comments.
          And you have done a good deed on a good deals site.

        • Love a bargain on 01/12/2014 - 14:27
          +1

          @TtiGeR:

          Good on you mate! However, I wonder if a shortened period of say 2-3 months (or even if it's waived altogether) is gonna be of any help to the OP considering they don't currently know anyone in any of the prescribed occupations/positions and their social circle is unlikely to change in the near future.

          It's unlikely that a JP will consider him/herself to "know" you simply because you walked up to him/her, introduced youself and showed your driver license.

        • TtiGeR on 01/12/2014 - 17:26

          @Love a bargain:

          When I say waived altogether, I meant they waive the identity declaration requirement so this form is no longer needed. :)

          I did ask why don't they verify/confirm someone's identity by checking the passport in person. The answer was to prevent fraud / identity theft because many people do no look like the photos on their foreign passports. The mechanism is in place for risk mitigation.

          Anyway, it's all at the discretion of a case officer. The case officer can decide what other evidence(s) is/are required to prove OP's identity.

        • mickey888 on 01/12/2014 - 19:25
          +3

          @TtiGeR:
          WOW! Thanks! But I called too. The guy also passed it to his supervisor. Long story short, he said I should make a statuary declaration saying I don't have anyone from the list and get sign by jp. Then get anyone knowing me preferably 2 citizen to sign as well. And yes, it's all depends on case officer.

          Wow again for you! 1000 likes for u !!!

        • Love a bargain on 01/12/2014 - 19:39

          @mickey888: That's good news! Again, this shows how inconsistent they are.

        • mickey888 on 01/12/2014 - 19:41

          @Love a bargain: yes hope everything goes well

  • RockyRaccoon on 30/11/2014 - 11:47
    +2

    YOU dont need to see them regularly - where the hell did you get this idea?

    They just have to have known you over 12 months. So a yearly visit is fine.

    • m2000 on 30/11/2014 - 20:21

      I agree, not sure why the GP was reluctant to sign, as he/she should have the "written" record of the visit(s)and patient's personal details which should match the applicant details.
      I also understand the GP may not recognize you (they may see thousands of patients?) , but from the written records and your proof of ID that should be good enough.

  • vr4indian on 30/11/2014 - 12:43

    where can we GP in the list? I dont see one but people are recommanding to approach GP..

  • abh_gup on 30/11/2014 - 13:27
    +1

    This is an issue for many people, especially if you've migrated from abroad. I know heaps of people in the same situation (or who were). Especially, if you are/were a student or have language barriers (not necessarily simply being introvert), it's fairly 'unfair' that one of the new-comers would know people from that list too well.

    sucks, but try get drunk. many of the people here in australia, no matter what profession, love drinking up and chatting at pubs and get togethers. if that's a path to take to make some contacts, start drinking… lol.

    for me, contacts though work colleagues build references quicker. so you may just start a conversation with as many as you can, and 'generally' discuss the issue.

    • expertreader on 30/11/2014 - 14:45

      Sorry, but I have to point out that your statement " especially if you are migrating from abroad" made me laugh…. I get what you are saying but it's a moot point. …

  • Franconian on 30/11/2014 - 13:34

    I'm in the same situation. My GP refuses to sign.

  • expertreader on 30/11/2014 - 14:47

    You can try and find out to see if anyone at your workplace is a JP. Usually you will find that someone in HR is a JP.

    • Baysew on 30/11/2014 - 17:30

      You can try and find out to see if anyone at your workplace is a JP

      As per previous comments, the sticking point is the person signing off must have known you for at least one year

      • expertreader on 01/12/2014 - 08:51

        If you have been working at the same place for a year then I don't see any reason why HR wouldn't sign. You spend major part of your day when you are awake at work.

        • Franconian on 01/12/2014 - 12:14

          Is HR somebody from the specified persons listed on it?

        • Baysew on 01/12/2014 - 12:37

          Do HR departments work in a warehouse ?

        • elf888 on 01/12/2014 - 16:00

          @Baysew:
          At least during the interview.

  • ostsee on 30/11/2014 - 22:58

    most of immigration agents are JP so you can go ask them to sign for you.

    i assume you have one…

    • Love a bargain on 01/12/2014 - 14:18

      i assume you have one…

      That's a bold assumption. The use of immigration agents aren't mandatory (just like the use of tax agents).

    • mickey888 on 01/12/2014 - 19:35

      No. I don't have one

  • ThadtheChad on 01/12/2014 - 14:23
    +2

    I was in a similar situation a little while ago. I've moved around a fair bit as part of work, and fortunately or unfortunately (depending on how you see it), my health has been quite good thus far. As a result, I've rarely visited doctors/dentists (I know the latter should have been more regular :) ).

    This "requirement" is quite archaic to be honest. A lot fewer people go to banks these days. Unless you are "settled" and not a transient yuppie (like me/my partner), GPs/pharmacists change on a regular basis. We've been very lucky that I have a bunch of ex-colleagues in a bank and my line manager is also a JP. My partner's place of work is a large organisation and she knows a few people from the legal department.

    Had we worked in different industries, we'd be quite buggered tbh. This requirement is an anachronism that should be replaced with something more "in-line" with the principle of the whole practice. Get 2x Australian Citizens to provide character references. Easy enough and a lot more pragmatic.

    • mickey888 on 01/12/2014 - 19:40
      +1

      Yes you are lucky. I called up today. Hopefully the case officer will understand. I also have asked around my workplace. Seems like I would be writing a stat declaration and getting my supervisor and 2nd in hand (both citizen, know me at least a year) to sign even though they are not on the list.

  • flatwhitepls on 01/12/2014 - 16:52

    If you really don't have anyone to sign it then you simply don't. Go out and socialise, apply next year…

  • mickey888 on 01/12/2014 - 19:52
    +6

    Thank you everyone for all the effort in this forum. I am grateful and thankful for all good/bad/neutral comments. If you think I am rude in any ways, I sincerely apologise.

    And lastly not to forget, to TtiGeR, whom actually called to DIBP for me.

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