Toyota 86 deposit dilemma

Lhuybo on 01/01/2013 - 23:31

Hi Ozbargain Community,

Long time 'viewer' first time posting anything of any real significance here that i have been unable to locate on the internet and thought "perhaps the ozbargain community can help". I recently been shopping around for a new toyota 86 which I was going to get under a novated lease. In doing my research which ozbargain has taught me, I've called every dealer under the sun in Melbourne. Eventually after speaking to most dealers they said they do not provide fleet discounts and i eventually took this as gospel (silly me thinking car salesman are trustworthy). I eventually negotiated a decent price of 40k drive away for the GTS manual and paid the $500 deposit subject to a test drive as it was the last Saturday for the year and that's the best time to get a car deal. During my discussion that car salesman said no fleet discount available etc. Come Monday 31/12/2012 the leasing company I was speaking to said that I should get a quote from their preferred fleet manager (another dealer). Did so and turns out they do provide fleet discounts on this vehicle which the other car salesman lied to me about and the alternative dealer gave me the price of $38200 drive away. Now scouring the internet I found that I could get out of the contract which I signed and gave the $500 deposit for but it would cost me $800 in total ($400 or 2% which is $800 if cancelled within the three day cooling off period).

I was wondering if someone knows what my rights or options are with regards to 're-negotiating' with the contract already signed as it was conditional 'subject to a test drive', or if there was some way I could cancel the contract get my deposit back and sign up for the car at 38k at another dealer. Please let me know.

Automotive

Comments

  • Car-la-la on 02/01/2013 - 00:05
    +10

    may i suggest paragraphs?

  • zhenjie on 02/01/2013 - 00:30

    Without seeing the contract no one can really comment. Read through it and find any areas that you may exploit. Can talk to other owners and dealers at OZTF86 Toyota 86 fourms

    • scotty on 02/01/2013 - 09:26

      Did you spell your site wrong? :)

      • zhenjie on 02/01/2013 - 11:39
        +1

        bad NYE hangover sigh

  • neil on 02/01/2013 - 00:40

    Relevant consumer affairs page for buying a new car. Exactly as you say, you will have to pay $800. Go in and tell them another dealer offered you $38,200. If you can't negotiate another $1000 off, then cancel and walk away.

    Since you only gave them $500, they may just keep that.

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 00:58

    My main gripe was the no fleet discount and going down the deceptive conduct path. But as car salesman I'm sure it's water tight but we will see.

    Will upload a copy tomorrow when I have access to a scanner.
    Zhenjie. Yeah been scouring those forums and most appear on a case by case basis.
    I'm still in the three cooling off day period so max would be 800 ….

    The other dealer told me to tell the current one that I can't get finance and as a result I can get out of it. Once send a letter or something to that effect I'm free to do whatever. It's more once I tell them I've been to another dealer I think that ace up my sleeve is gone and everything turns sour and they make my life he'll.

    • [Deactivated] on 02/01/2013 - 04:21
      +2

      Just a comment, but when a dealer says no fleet discount, it can mean.

      That they dont offer fleet discounts on that vehicle,. If they have a limited amount of stock they wont do it.

      Obviously in the wording, which will be hard to prove, they would like you to interpret this as something that no dealer offers. Clever but at the same time being technically correct.

      Did they actually say that Toyota does not offer fleet discounts or did they say their dealership doesn't do fleet discounts (on this model). Or something in between which could be construed by you especially after trying a number of dealers who said something similar.

      And then the only way you got the fleet discount was thru the contact at the leasing company who is entitled to the fleet discount. The dealers wont volunteer something if they dont need to.

      And I honestly believe in all negotiations with dealers they are the professionals, which makes it hard for you me or the average joe to ever come out on top. Guess thats why I hang onto my cars longer as I hate going through the buying ritual.

      If you are a member of a car club NRMA RAC etc call the legal assistance people. Though as the other dealer says (and he should know) the no finance thing might be one avenue at the end.

  • abandc2003 on 02/01/2013 - 01:08
    +4

    Just a thought - since it's "subject to the test drive" - can't you take the test drive and say you don't like it? Or is that wishful thinking?

    • tonyjzx on 02/01/2013 - 01:57

      this^^^

      i test driven a few cars and i basically told them i wouldnt be buying becuase i didn't like features or characteristics A, B & C etc.

  • Candour on 02/01/2013 - 08:04

    try going in with a legal person who can negotiate carefully and subtly advise them that yuo may go to consumer affairs [waste of time in nsw] for misrepresentation but only if you cant beg and cajole them to return your money for goodwill
    ask them to match and beat the offer
    they are crooks
    like real estate agents
    nsw consumer affairs would wash their hands and ask you to go to the tribunal [problem solved for them]
    maybe vic is better?
    where are you anyway?

    • [Deactivated] on 02/01/2013 - 08:21
      +2

      Its Melb according to profile.

      Looks like the only way out reading the Vic website is

      Did they give you the form

      FORM 4
      Regulation 10
      Motor Car Traders Act 1986
      COOLING-OFF RIGHTS AND WAIVING YOUR COOLING-OFF RIGHTS
      SUMMARY
      YOUR RIGHT TO COOL OFF

      If not then they are in breach.

      Also the 3 days cooling off time is clear days

      Clear days do not include weekends or public holidays.

      as for the condition

      as it was conditional 'subject to a test drive'

      I guess thats where the legal opinion is important. Does this mean you just need to take it for test drive, or does it mean you have to take and approve of it after a test drive.

      Now to get out of that it might be a better argument if you haven't bought elsewhere. Hard to say I test drove the car and didn't like it when you have bought a similar car.

      Guess the real issue is how much do you save on fleet discount. That probably determines how much time you spend on this.

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 09:44

    Thanks Oz Pete, They did give me a form 4 which does stipulate the 400 or 2% ($800) which ever is higher if i get out within the three days. (I still fall under that today as it was purcahsed on a saturday and tuesday was public holiday). It was subject to test drive so if i drove it and said i didn't like it would that be grounds to get my money back? I am not so sure.

    Ive done some maths and worse case scenario i'm forced to cough up the extra $300 and pay $800.
    then go off and purcahse through the other dealer who is $38,200 so i'm still ahead by $1,000 and i also get free accident assist (lifetime towing for the life of the car). I think i'm just hoping to have my cake an eat it too, or worst case scenario just 'have the cake'.

    I'm just making sure i strategise correctly before i call him the one i signed the contract at. i did call him on monday and i do expect a call from him. It gets a bit grey i feel though and i'm best to be proactive.

    • hesokay on 02/01/2013 - 11:43

      i agree, walk away and dont pay the $300

  • [Deactivated] on 02/01/2013 - 10:58
    +2

    It was subject to test drive so if i drove it and said i didn't like it would that be grounds to get my money back?

    Well, I guess that's up to legal interpretation, which I dont know about.

    Maybe when you contact him, act a little dumb and say you want the test drive now, otherwise if you are not happy, then you wont be able to cancel? You are reading the contract literally etc and you are no lawyer etc

    Like saying = but the section says I only have 3 days, so I must have the test drive now, in case I find it isnt suitable. (dont say why its not suitable)

    See what he says. Eg Oh I cant arrange for the Test Drive until saturday. Ok then I want the contract rescinded and then re-sign a contractafter the Test drive.

    He says - But i cant offer you the same deal.
    You, then if you cant I'll just have to live with that.

    If he says its ok today, then do Test drive and cancel. Its not suitable…. Again no worse off than you are now…

    Just some devious thoughts…

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 11:22
    +1

    I like your devious thinking ozpete. its about time the buyers get a one up on the sales man. I called him up and he couldn't give me a test drive today because its 'not available' as it's the boss's car and he's on holiday so I can't get permission until 'saturday'.

    I said what would happen to my deposit since i can't 'cool off within three days' without a test drive. He said he would give me back my money if i drove it and found it unsuitable. Lets hope he sticks to that. didn't mention anythign about another dealer so i still have that ace up my sleeve when i get down to it. He didn't want to rescind the contract and he goes its alot of unnecessary paper work, if we were to proceed. he assured me he would have no trouble selling the vehicle so i could get back my $500 deposit.

    So come saturday i'll ask him to draw up a new contract as i want to ensure that it gets delivered by Feb 6 date. so either he will a: rescind the old contract or b: try to add things to the old contract and when he does that i'll renegotiate price etc.

    So here's hoping to a more positive saturday~! this gave me a sleepless night last night but thanks everyone for your advice and feedback~! I'll keep you posted.

    • [Deactivated] on 02/01/2013 - 13:04
      +2

      Just suggest you text or email him, thanking him for the drive and saying that it wasn't suitable etc, that way you have something dated and traceable.

      Enjoy your "drive"

  • vietbargain on 02/01/2013 - 11:37
    +1

    86 GTS delivered by Feb 6 … i remember reading on smh there was an 18+ month waiting list for it!

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 12:00
    +1

    There is a 12 month wait but i was able to pick it up from somebody who cancelled it. The dealer called back saying he got word from his boss that i can test drive today so it looks like i need to be on my game today and come prepared to rescind the contract. i'm bringing a friend to make the car sound even more 'unsuitable' because if i just say its unsuitable he'll be trying to break down each and every concern and i may fold like a cheap suit.

    • Gecko on 02/01/2013 - 12:21
      +3

      Say you've got 2 kids and another on the way with your partner and thought it may suit, but not enough room in the back for school stuff, groceries and a baby seat. Act dumb with that story and I'm sure it'll go fine.

      Edit: Oh yeah, if you use my story, you owe me a ride! I am extremely jealous :)

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 12:54
    +4

    Yeah i'm bringing an expectant mother who is posing as my wife for this rouse. If you don't plan ahead you plan to fail!

  • m0nkeycheese on 02/01/2013 - 13:18
    +8

    I've done this before.. Was on a used car tho. Paid a deposit pending a test drive. Couldn't drive it that day as they were having a 'sale' and there was too much crap in the way. When I came back later I noticed the ute had a bad paint job as they had wet it down the day before and I didn't notice it. Mentioned that and they offered to respray it at no extra cost.

    Took for a test drive said I didn't like it, wanted deposit back. Manager had a go at me blah blah I said I didn't like how it drove blah blah accused me of a few things, then my wife started to cry. That was the clincher.. Guys can't handle women crying. It was genuine tho, he was a real bastard. Got deposit back. Never again.

    Moral of the story.. Bring a gal get her to cry lol

  • huybo on 02/01/2013 - 14:41
    +7

    haha if not i will have to mentally picture getting another "pricing error" by harvey norman. Brings tears to many eyes.

  • bombcat on 03/01/2013 - 16:49
    +1

    From my past experience as a salemen in a new car dealership. You will get your full deposit back if you have put "subject to a test drive" on your contract. Go for a test drive, and tell them the car is so much slower than your expectation/what you heard in the ads ect. They will try to convince or upsell you. You just need to stand your ground strongly. I had dealt whit this many times.

    • otherPerson on 03/01/2013 - 18:29

      I agree. Especially on such an easy to sell car. Money back in full. I just had a virtually identical thing happen with a client today and he got his money back in full from the more expensive dealer.

  • huybo on 03/01/2013 - 19:04
    +7

    Just to update you guys on the situation. I went for the test drive and so i had to play the song and dance of how to bring up i'm not interested. I said i didn't feel i got bang for my buck and i am paying over the odds for the car.
    The conversation turned sour at this point as he got angry and said "you want bang for your buck, there's a corolla for about 26k".

    So due to his lack of etiquette i just bit the bullet and told him i can get a better deal elsewhere. This was followed by "if u have the quote bring it in next time and we'll see" with a smirk on his face. I wiped that smirk off his face when i showed him the quote there and then, he shut up for a bit saying he can't put in the discount and said he would 'prove it to me'. Lo and behold the discount was applied and accepted with a non sincere 'apology' from him saying 'he didn't know cause other discounts aren't able to be applied'. It got discounted to the point it would be negligible for me to cancel it and purchase the car from the other dealer as i would forfeit some funds. So to keep the peace i negotiated my way down to 38900.

    Not quite the 38200 but worth the effort of the song and dance and a win for the ozbargain community!

    • scotty on 03/01/2013 - 22:04

      Great story. Thanks for sharing with us.

    • [Deactivated] on 03/01/2013 - 23:49
      +1

      Well done. Hope you enjoy the car. Might I suggest number plates OZB-86S.

  • easternculture on 03/01/2013 - 22:27
    -1

    I did hear a rumour that the Toyota 86 will drop in price considerably in 2013 due to Toyota sourcing parts from Subaru i.e base model for $26000

    But its rumours for now

    • [Deactivated] on 03/01/2013 - 23:52
      +1

      These things seem to be selling like hotcakes with long wait times, so I can't see why they would cut the price. If that rumour is true, I simply see Toyota pocketing the profit and passing none on. It's straight from the first page of the Australian retail handbook (ask Gerry).

      • easternculture on 04/01/2013 - 00:15

        it was from an Australian article somewhere , cant seem to find it but if i do ill post the url

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