AmEx Dispute Charge Question Fraudulent Charge

vegemite2008 on 03/12/2024 - 23:13
Last edited 03/12/2024 - 23:19

Hi,

I had my AMEX card for over 20 years now.

I always keep it secure.

During the month of October, I discovered 3 charges that I did not recognise.

The companies (3) are AI businesses in the US, where you can buy credits to use their services to process data.

I contacted AMEX and lodged a dispute, AMEX refunded the money.

I cancelled my card and I was sent a new one with a new cc number.

I contacted the businesses in the US and explained that I did not authorise the purchases. No response.

End of November, I once again had 2 charges (same amount) from the same companies (2 of them).

I don't use the AMEX card very often so I am 100% certain that I have not used their services.

I lodged a dispute again with AMEX but this time they told me that I have to pay. I reopened the dispute again.

I use the card for business only. There are about 4 merchants that have my card on file for direct debit. Can it be the case that one of their payment processor companies has been hacked?

The companies in question are:

KREA AI SAN FRANCISCO

WRITEHUMAN AI MIDLOTHIAN

STRAICO MIAMI

Financial

Related Stores

American Express
American Express

Comments

  • mskeggs on 03/12/2024 - 23:31

    Are you saying the new charges were against the replacement card number?

    • vegemite2008 on 03/12/2024 - 23:56

      The one in October was against the old number (that I cancelled) and the one in November was against the new one.

      I suspect my card has been linked to a subscription (direct debit) service for these companies. The charges was identical both times.

      Maybe existing subscriptions were carried over to the replacement card. I cannot figure this one out, yet…

      • CyberMurning on 04/12/2024 - 07:52
        +6

        Nope the 2 cards are unique if the numbers are different. No carry forward subscriptions
        Hmm but below poster said about token. Oh well… we need someone working in a bank to confirm.

      • Porker on 04/12/2024 - 10:17

        I had a monthly subscription which was attached to a credit card.

        Once that card expired, I deduced that the subscription would stop but noticed it kept on going and then noticed that the charge was being made against my new replacement card, which had a different number and expiry. The card details in my account for the subscription were the old ones and was marked 'expired'.

        I found it odd that the service / subscription continued for months without asking for new payment details which lead me to look into it.

        I don't know how that was even possible, but it was occurring. I think @troy1976 explanation below gives some insight.

        • CyberMurning on 04/12/2024 - 11:14

          yeah weird but i remember when changing card the bank will send notification about
          beware your current subscriptions will no longer work you need to update them manually with the new card number something like that

  • troy1976 on 04/12/2024 - 00:35
    +12

    Not entirely same situation but similar. I've had Amex since the late 1990s - only issue I had in that time were some fraudulent purchases back in 2008/9 which were reversed/cleared no problem. Earlier this year I had a number of 'google ads' appear, starting with $2 charges and then escalating.

    I check my card every couple of days so I picked this up quickly. First call to AMEX was a story of how they wouldn't do anything until they posted, and that the $2 was a test charge. I am aware of test charges, but I knew I hadn't bought anything recently that should have been doing that. Naturally the charges did post and bigger amounts started cascading through.

    I cancelled my card because they weren't doing anything about what I knew were fraudulent (or mistaken at best). The charges stopped. I get a new card and because I couldn't remember my security code (not PIN) which I wouldn't have set since probably the issue back in 2008/9 I couldn't activate the new card. New charges from 'google ads' start appearing even with an unactivated card.

    I ring AMEX again and this time instead of being patronised I was put through to the security team where they appeared to actually listen to what I was saying (ie I hadn't made any purchases, nor had I ever had a google ad account). They reversed all the charges and while I got the usual letter two weeks later saying they would make me pay if they decided they weren't fraudulent, I never heard anymore.

    As far as I can tell:
    - getting a new card does nothing because of the token created once an authorised purchase is made through a particular vendor, so even an unactivated (replacement) card can still be charged (until the credit card company cancels that token, which I believe they finally did for me); and
    - I do suspect there are compromised 'actors' somewhere in payment chains, whether it's those letting brute force card attacks make endless attempts, an issue with google itself or just particular vendors (or their payment processors).

    Not sure if this helps but I feel your frustration.

    • HardQuiz on 04/12/2024 - 03:28
      +4

      Iā€™m giving you an upvote because someone negged you šŸ¤·šŸ»ā€ā™‚ļø

      • troy1976 on 04/12/2024 - 13:47

        Thank you :-) When I recounted this on a reddit thread a few months back I also got negged by someone, maybe a Google fan? Which was odd because I've had gmail since it was invite only and owned a dozen Nexus/Pixel devices since then. The internet is weird.

  • vegemite2008 on 04/12/2024 - 02:51

    Thank you for your reply.

  • ytthr on 04/12/2024 - 08:05

    I had a similar problem with Coles mastercard and Adobe, After 3 card replacements the charges just kept coming every month.
    Eventually with assistance from AFCA it was sorted.

  • 87percent on 04/12/2024 - 10:46
    +1

    How the hell can a charge against another card happen? So basically getting a new card does nothing?

    • CyberMurning on 04/12/2024 - 11:15
      +1

      yeah how? if true then that is defeat the purpose of getting a card replaced (due to missing lost or fraud)

  • vegemite2008 on 04/12/2024 - 13:35

    The stupid thing is that amex allowed the same disputed charges that happened in Oct to be charged in November as new transactions. I would have thought that a red flag would have been raised šŸ¤”.

  • Meho2026 on 04/12/2024 - 14:05

    Go to AFCA

  • vegemite2008 on 04/12/2024 - 15:41

    I just spoke to amex customer service fraud section.

    They have now blocked the merchants. The 2 last disputes are still pending but I know that they will refund the money.

    Stressful but an important learning exercise.

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