4K Rips Vs 1080 Blu-Ray Discs

QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 12:14
Last edited 12/09/2024 - 12:15

Recently got first 4K TV (S90C 55") - I have a collection of store bought 1080 bluray discs, which look pretty darn good upscaled to me for the ones I have tested out using xbox one/ps3 as bluray player.

Keen to hear thoughts from anyone more knowledgable, what is the threshold where 4K HDR encodes/rips outshine physical factory bluray discs - ie say a 10GB 4K HDR rip vs 1080 standard blu ray disc of the same film?

Or say a 3GB 4K HDR rip vs 1080 standard blu ray disc of the same film?

Or even 4K streaming files (Disney+, Prime , Netflix etc) vs 1080 standard blu ray discs?

How do such examples compare…Understand there are many permutations here…just wondering peoples real world experiences?

Computing 4k Ultra HD Blu-Ray

Comments

  • AustriaBargain on 12/09/2024 - 12:19
    +7

    You can get lossless 4K Blu ray rips.

    • HaydosK on 12/09/2024 - 12:29
      +6

      Remux is probably a more suitable word. There is no lossless films available anywhere (other than some movie theaters) as they would be up to 750gb per movie.

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 12:55

      yes, but such large file sizes are prohibitve IMO

      • Bruceflix on 12/09/2024 - 13:10
        +1

        Google East-digital

      • AustriaBargain on 12/09/2024 - 13:28

        Even the 20GB ones look better than 1080p imo. Though plenty of compressed rips are not done with such care to avoid artefacts on thing like a starry night sky which really spoils a movie imo. I think 4K streaming is better than 1080p blu ray too. You really can't go wrong with 4K in 2024 on a modern TV.

  • HaydosK on 12/09/2024 - 12:38
    +5

    I mean it depends on the movie. If you have space you should get the highest quality version available. If there is a movie shot in 4k and available digitally in 4k but they only physically released a 1080p Blu-ray aquire both and compare small parts. If you see lots of issues with the 4k version the Blu-ray is probably better but HDR and Dolby vision on the 4k might be worth keeping the 4k over the 1080p. This is rare though and most things will be a streaming exclusive or a mainstream movie with a physical 4k release. When you get the physical rips make sure they say remux in the title or if you are getting them legally via ripping discs use makemkv and don't compress them after that.

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 13:03

      yep, understand all that but looking for a sweet spot i guess, if that makes sense. large 4k remux files are prohibitive in many (most?) cases - and same can be applicable for standard 1080 bluray remuxes.

      for example, in my use case for the past decdade i have been perfectly content buying my favourite films on 1080 bluray for best quality, with 1-5gb rips files for other films on plex server.

      to continue this MO with 4K tech, id need to shell 500+ for a 4K player, 000's to replace my physical collection, and propable 000's more for TB of HDD space…

      • HaydosK on 12/09/2024 - 13:29
        +1

        What is prohibitive? Are you saying about the storage requirements? It depends on how many movies you want but you can get storage very cheap. You could also just get the blurays and use a used Blu-ray player from Facebook marketplace or a ub420 from Panasonic. You don't need a dv capable player because your TV is a Samsung and they only have HDR and hdr10. I don't know why you need so much space if you just use the player.

        • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:06

          thanks for reply, and you make perfect common sense but still 000's in outlay for new 4K discs/4K player and or new HDD space - im accustomed to $5 1080 blu rays for physical and 1-5Gb movie rips that have pretty much now filled my 50TB plex setup (inc TV series)…bit of a shift in mindset when talking $30 discs and 40+ GB remux files!

      • freefall101 on 12/09/2024 - 14:27

        A 16TB drive will hold 200 odd 4K remuxes, how many movies are you talking on storing?

        Plus why do you need to both have them on disk and plex? Keep a 5GB version on plex and use the disk for movie night. Then just rely on upscaling of your 1080p movies unless there's a release that's exceptionally better in 4K.

        • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:13

          havbe maybe 100 favourite films on retail 1080 BD discs, lots more + TV on plex server

          wouldnt be keeping physical / digital versions of each film….good advice cheers

  • Bruceflix on 12/09/2024 - 12:59

    Playback of 4k remux if DV p7 with lossless audio is limited to a very select group of devices. Keep that in mind.

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 13:03

      yes thanks

    • HaydosK on 12/09/2024 - 13:31
      +1

      They have a Samsung and hope to buy a Blu-ray player so the only option will be HDR10 or hdr10+

      • Bruceflix on 12/09/2024 - 13:32

        Well spotted

  • [Deactivated] on 12/09/2024 - 13:07
    +6

    A 3-10GB 4K rip would be junk quality taken from a streaming service, or some morons poor quality amateur home job at substantially compressing down a 4K Blu-ray file, wrecking the high quality compression work that was done on the title by an industry professional.

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:16

      have good rips well recognised for size vs quality tradeoff, not from morons, thanks for reply and valid point on industry professionals

      • [Deactivated] on 13/09/2024 - 13:58

        @pointless martyr - Done by who, and well recognised by who?

        OzBargain certainly isn’t where you would go to ask the question you have, a site like the Blu-ray.com forums is where you would go to discuss these questions.

  • chingy213 on 12/09/2024 - 14:07
    +4
    1. first find out if the 4k movie is real 4k. Go here https://www.digiraw.com/DVD-4K-Bluray-ripping-service/4K-UHD…
    2. If its real 4k, 100% get the 4k remux
    3. If its not real 4k, stick with the bluray 1080p version. There will be no benefit of getting the 4k version.
    • HaydosK on 12/09/2024 - 14:21
      +3

      Not necessarily true. Upscaling (not ai upscaling, That looks like 🤮 most of the time), higher file size (as it will be closer to the size and bitrate of the master and will be encoded in the more efficient h265 codec) and a HDR master (if done well) will make the 4k Blu-ray version better than the regular Blu-ray.

      • xylarr on 13/09/2024 - 11:52

        I was going to note the same. You're not comparing apples with apples because of the different codecs (h265 vs h264).

        • HaydosK on 13/09/2024 - 15:32

          Yeah

    • Randolph Duke on 12/09/2024 - 14:29
      +3

      If its not real 4k, stick with the bluray 1080p version. There will be no benefit of getting the 4k version.

      That’s very misleading. Pacific Rim is a 2K DI and considered one of the best looking 4K discs on the format.

      • chingy213 on 13/09/2024 - 13:24

        For the majority of my films, about 20tb worth, on my 86 inch tv, there is no difference between fake 4k 1080p and UHD. Thats from my personal experience with hundreds of films.

        • HaydosK on 13/09/2024 - 15:28

          Well yeah. I don't know if anyone here has seen visually lossless 1080p video before. I have and the quality blows you away. The upscaling is really good on a professional level and doesn't need to do much because of how much detail is in even the original 1080p files. The compression on the 4k disc will close the gap in quality.

        • Randolph Duke on 13/09/2024 - 20:40

          For the majority of my films, about 20tb worth, on my 86 inch tv, there is no difference between fake 4k 1080p and UHD. Thats from my personal experience with hundreds of films.

          IMO, the biggest benefit of 4K spec is HDR/wide colour gamut rather than resolution, although resolution is nice. A 2K DI doesn’t preclude either HDR or WGC when upscaled to 4K

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:17

      thanks for reply and link, have a great night

    • S Baldrick on 13/09/2024 - 10:40
      +1

      If its not real 4k, stick with the bluray 1080p version. There will be no benefit of getting the 4k version.

      Not quite.

  • p1 ama on 12/09/2024 - 14:54
    +2

    As with most things, generally it depends on a whole host of factors including what the original source material is, what codecs are being used, the quality of the encode. You can always try and see for yourself with A/B testing.

    If your concern is file sizes, then the new AV1 codec should offer significantly better video quality vs. H264 at the same bitrate.

    Something probably worth keeping in mind is that the differences at regular viewing distances for a 55" TV is going to be relatively minimal. It would be a bigger difference for something like an 85" TV where it'll be big enough to magnify the artefacts present in low bitrate content.

    • AustriaBargain on 12/09/2024 - 15:38

      Just choose the Golden Popcorn rips 🍿

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:19

      good points….looking to avoid the rabbit hole of A/B testing first hand…hence picking the wisdom of all you good folks… cheers!

  • spackbace on 12/09/2024 - 16:12
    +1

    Why not just choose a few and decide for yourself?

    Download a 20gb rip (usually from a latest streaming movie), then get a remux. Mad Max Fury Road would be a good base I think

    Or also try stremio + torrentio (plus rdb if you want to)

    Personally I only deal with 4k remux files where possible. I don't want to have to go and re-download everything

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:29

      thanks for reply SB…so you have been DLing your fav films for server storage in full 4K remux in recent years? that approach seems well ahead of the curve im currently on…

      havent been down the RBD/stremio path yet…if that remains sustainable it seems the way of the furutre … no more maintaining plex servers and dozens of TB of space….especaially now that streaming services are so splintered acrss platforms and content, not to mention adds and quality tiers

      • spackbace on 13/09/2024 - 10:10

        Correct, I've gone through the different paths (ext hdd etc) and a few years ago bit the bullet and bought a nas and slowly filled it up. Movie library is around 1,000 movies now, with the majority being 4K remux, but I need to go back and cull a few as it's getting full and I cbf replacing a hdd for a bigger one right now!

        For the setup, I do have a 4K projector as well as 5.2.2 surround, so I figure my plex/media setup gives me the best experience.

        That said, people in the house don't care if they just watch something on streaming!

        • QuickToThePointless on 14/09/2024 - 13:03

          as an aside to my OP, im almost at a cross roads on this sort of thing…have been running a i3 HTPC since 2011 with 5 HDD + OS SSD crammed in it. it works fine as plex server for current needs but with windows 10 support coming to an end next year, Its days are numbered.

          i have a cheap i5 dell 8500 optiplex which i was thinking of adding a 5 bay JBOD to use as plex server but am unsure on finer aspects such as overall brand reliability of JBOD enclosures, spin up/power down cycles realtive to plex availabililty etc etc…a pretty mixed bag of research online.

          Perhaps a NAS may be the way to go, may i ask your though prosses in deciding the NAS route/ what model you bought/cost etc?

          cheers mate

          • spackbace on 16/09/2024 - 13:37

            @QuickToThePointless: I bought the Synology 5-bay, just to ensure I had the necessary space (once you consider that 1 drive is redundancy). I think I paid around $850-$900 at the time? Later added an external UPS for it, just for those times the power shuts and the 5 drives are shut off, which I figured wasn't exactly ideal!

            It does what I need to. I don't get it to do heaps, which I'm sure I could do, but for now I use it for a Plex server and Qbittorrent is installed for direct downloading to the drives.

  • simplystu on 12/09/2024 - 18:59

    It really depends on use case/etc.

    If it's your FAV movie of all time (that you like watching it again/again) … Then 4K == worth it + cost.

    If making a big night of it (with family/friends) - 4K sources are in realm of ok.

    But for one-off "single view" … 4K sources best to pass.
    Just my opinion.

    Lastly …
    Don't confuse 4k TV (capabilities) with 4K sources.
    2 slightly different things.

    • QuickToThePointless on 12/09/2024 - 21:40

      your points are much in line in my way of thinking, thanks for your response & have a great night!

  • Triceratops on 13/09/2024 - 19:42

    While one may be technically better than the other. To me it comes down to whether or not I would get more enjoyment from the 4K. In my case the 1080P is good enough and while I can tell the difference in a comparison it's not big enough to concern me.

  • OpayuOnam on 13/09/2024 - 20:02
    +1

    As a very general rule of thumb:
    2160p Remux (Bluray) > 1080p Remix (Bluray) > 2160p H265 larger than 20gb or so > 1080p H265 larger than 15gb or so > 2160p webrip > 1080p webrip

    • QuickToThePointless on 14/09/2024 - 12:55

      good answer, the kind i was looking for…is this anecdotal first hand observations?

      or do you have a link to some sort of AV tech article? would be keen to have a read…cheers

      • OpayuOnam on 14/09/2024 - 13:38
        +1

        It's my own experience, based on many years of watching.

        On a 65inch or below screen the difference is not as severe, but it's that one single scene where you see the compression artefacts and ends up ruining the experience…
        On a large (100+ inch projector screen) it's easily distinguishable, and a compressed webrip 4k is noticeably worse than a Bluray remux.

        Lastly, if you're super pedantic, do look at individual 4k Bluray release reviews, while the whole 2k upscale doesn't bother me as much, what you want to look out for is the 4k releases that do a lot of post and end up ruining the movie. Of the top of my head pirates of the Carribbean 1080p Bluray looks much better than the 4k variant due to weird colour grading and removal of film grain.

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