Dr Nick Coatsworth Who Helped Lead Australia's Response to COVID - Recommends NO MORE JABS - OPINIONS

mickrb30 on 12/06/2024 - 21:12
Last edited 13/06/2024 - 08:06 by 1 other user

Dr Nick Coatsworth makes a STUNNING admission about the Covid jab

Dr Nick Coatsworth (left) who helped lead Australia's response to Covid-19, has made a shock revelation about vaccinations for the virus. And it's not the first controversial statement Dr Coatsworth - Australia's former deputy chief health officer - has made about the Covid vaccine. HE HAS WOKEN UP _ SAYS HE WILL NOT TAKE ANY MORE JABS - whats your SAY ? ?
Will you follow his lead, his advice ?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-13520171/doctor-n…

sorry spelled typo, Opinion wrong in heading, wont let me fix it know.

Health & Beauty COVID-19 Vaccination

Comments

      • Miss B on 14/06/2024 - 21:10

        With Tracy Grimshaw of all people. He's also involved in the Eucalyptus /Juniper weight loss drug scam stuff. He doesn't care where the money comes from. I'm guessing this article was to drum up viewership for their show. It could be the drug business he's involved in, but the show seems more likely given its meant to start in a few days.

  • morse on 13/06/2024 - 06:15

    Or you could just follow these recommendations based on your age, personal health factors and in consultation with your GP https://www.health.gov.au/our-work/covid-19-vaccines/getting…

    • Flying Ace on 14/06/2024 - 07:55
      +4

      Don’t be ridiculous. I’m getting my medical advice from YouTubers and “celebrities”, the way it should be.

  • Ugly on 13/06/2024 - 06:58
    +5

    He’s not alone
    https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/mul…

    • EightImmortals on 13/06/2024 - 07:39
      +1

      He should be in gaol not getting awards from King Chuck the 'tird.

      Never forget.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzfJGC1_yPo

    • Ughhh on 13/06/2024 - 07:57

      Among the recommendations in her submission were for greater access to high-quality N95 masks with associated mandates in healthcare facilities, a “concerted and sustained effort” to reduce Covid transmission in schools, a return to isolation for infected individuals during the infectious period with appropriate financial support, and expansion of hybrid work and education.

    • May4th on 13/06/2024 - 09:23
      -1

      Kerryn Phelps is much more fact focused and less about self promotion

  • prodrome on 13/06/2024 - 07:19
    +8

    This guy is a known nutjob.

    • EightImmortals on 13/06/2024 - 07:36
      +2

      Of course, government is full of them.

  • shaybisc on 13/06/2024 - 07:36

    I noticed the dreamy Dr Nick wandering off the reservation years ago.

  • altomic on 13/06/2024 - 07:53
    +1

    does any one remember that awesome song from 1997 - Opion Your Mind ’97 by U.S.U.R.A.

    altomic on 13/06/2024 - 07:53 (Collapsed - Offtopic. Show)
    • Loopholio on 13/06/2024 - 11:02
      +1

      Still slaps.

  • shaybisc on 13/06/2024 - 08:33
    +4

    He is probably right as far as he, a healthy young person, is concerned. After having 3 Covid vaccinations he doesn't need boosters.

    Science spoke with clinicians, vaccine researchers, and biostatisticians about how they view the value of these latest shots. Several cautioned against falling into extremist camps—boosters are worthless or everyone must get boosters. “I just want people to have tempered expectations,” says Natalie Dean, a biostatistician at Emory University who specializes in evaluating vaccines. “There is room for reasonable debate about how much added value there is for a young, healthy person.” Two years ago, with the pandemic raging and vaccines dramatically cutting serious illness and death, there was little doubt about their value for everyone. Now, Dean says, “We’re in a very different situation than we were a few years ago.”

    https://www.science.org/content/article/should-i-get-covid-1…

  • Kayrhcp on 13/06/2024 - 08:49
    +4

    If a person is shouting their news at you, they’re not giving you news.

  • JIMB0 on 13/06/2024 - 09:08

    Couldn't this go in the other thread?

    https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/850212

    • buckster on 14/06/2024 - 22:30

      If only

  • smartazz104 on 13/06/2024 - 09:11
    +1

    HE HAS WOKEN UP

    Oh has he now…

    • May4th on 13/06/2024 - 09:32
      +1

      he toed the line until it was the popular thing to do not to do so. everything he has done is purely for self promotion, he can't care two hoots about what's right or wrong

    • HerpinDerp on 13/06/2024 - 09:54
      +9

      Man, this dribble is almost on the JV 200IQ level.

      Last time I checked I haven't been struck off for slagging shit on medicare and other flaws in our health system. Maybe that's my mandated microchip talking right?

      What's my knowledeably worth?

    • Loopholio on 13/06/2024 - 11:10
      +3

      @mickrb30 do you also have an opinion on gang stalkers, neutral net and 5G everything?

      Maybe try disconnecting from your chosen news source for a few weeks, clear you head and close your mind. Opening your mind is how the gummet gets in!

      • mickrb30 on 13/06/2024 - 21:25
        -3

        opinions don't count if your not qualified in that field, i only gave you a link,
        you make your own uneducated opinion in the matter
        maybe you wake up, maybe you have different beliefs,
        take the jab by the litre if you like, BUT no one including the government should force you to take it,
        threaten your employment, your earning capacity to provide for yourself and family.
        And no one should critisize people whether the take the jab or not
        look at Sweden,they did NOT die off, or were no worse than other countries.
        need to look at real life events, real life data, and open you partially shut eyes and engage your brain

        • HerpinDerp on 13/06/2024 - 21:45
          +2

          No, you made an inane statement. I am evidence that your statement is incorrect. I'm still waiting to get struck off.

          Do I need to be an immunologist now to tell you, the uneducated, that I'm uneducated now?

          I'll give you some real life data. I have a (profanity) idiotic autoimmune disease triggered by a common virus we all get once and generally laugh about. I wish I could have minimised my risk with a shot. My differential diagnosis was cancer at 28.

          Want to keep going? Do you have ANY remaining family or friends that still need their eyes and brain opened?

        • El cheepo on 14/06/2024 - 10:23

          i only gave you a link,

          Not fair, how are you supposed to yell at the sheep to “do their own research” if your giving out links for free!

          Thats first rule of anti vax club

          you make your own uneducated opinion in the matter.

          Dude literally said he is working as a medical professional in some form.
          What is your professional link to the medical world?

          (Fwiw, this is the Internet - everyone can lie, but i call fair bump play on to this lol)

    • smartazz104 on 13/06/2024 - 14:31

      He now works as a doctor in Canberra and is contracted to Nine-Fairfax channels and newspapers as a presenter and health expert.

      So now he's controlled by Nine-Fairfax, nothing to do with "having balls".

    • morse on 14/06/2024 - 02:42
      +3

      I’m not a doctor but I’m being CONTROLLED BY THE GOVERNMENT too!

      I can’t go out in public naked, take things from the supermarket without paying for them, drive my car as fast as I’d like to. Not only that but they make me pay taxes, rates, have insurance. They’re also collecting details about me and putting them in databases (and that information can be used to further control me). If that’s what they do to regular citizens, I can’t imagine the controls they have over doctors!!

      • bigticket on 14/06/2024 - 17:27
        +1

        I can’t go out in public naked

        Probably no on wants to see you naked as you don't want to see others naked in the streets. Surely, VR goggles will solve your problem.

        take things from the supermarket without paying for them

        Surely you don't want your personal possessions taken from your home. But your logic suggests otherwise.

        drive my car as fast as I’d like to

        Surely you don't want people hooning outside your childrens school. Maybe you don't like children.

        Your comments are nonsensical.

        • morse on 15/06/2024 - 02:57

          This was a satirical comment.

  • morebunnings on 13/06/2024 - 09:31
    +1

    I've had 2 covid jabs, knocked me out for a few days each time. Then got covid end of 2022 and it was really mild.

    So I stopped getting the Jab as I'm not worried about getting covid. For me it was really mild, way milder than Influenza, which hits me so bad that one time I ended up in hospital.

    Since 2022 we've had 2 waves of covid go through the office and I didn't catch it, or was completely asymptomatic, both times.

    I do however get the influenza jab every year. Its really weird that the flu knocks me for six, but I'm pretty much immune to covid (or a super spreader, who knows).

    • Assburg on 13/06/2024 - 09:43
      +13

      Not sure if this is a satirical post but… it sounds like the vaccine worked for you.

      • morebunnings on 13/06/2024 - 09:58
        +3

        Not Satirical, just being honest.

        What's weird to me is I got the same 2 jabs as everyone else in my office at around the same time (we all went when there was a center set up near our office).

        It seems the jab worked better on me than my co-workers, as they all have gotten knocked out by covid this year, while I seem to be fine.

        • altomic on 13/06/2024 - 11:08

          my experience was near identical to yours.

          I've had 2 jabs and both time I was KO'd for 48 -72 hours. just felt extremely exhausted/lethargic.

          I stopped having further vaccinations after that. - I'm not against vaccinations at all. just being KO'd isn't great (yes and neither is having severe covid)

          I've since had Covid twice (that I know of) and both times it really KO'd me for about 3 days .

          I do get an annual flu jab and did get the flu last year anyway (RAT test was not positive), and that really screwed me over for a week. -I'm aware that "Flu" is not a specific flu and there are variants.

          • mrdean on 14/06/2024 - 08:41

            @altomic:

            I've had 2 jabs and both time I was KO'd for 48 -72 hours. just felt extremely exhausted/lethargic.

            If KO'd meant you weren't able to do things you'd normally do during the day, like go to work, do things around the house, then according to regulators who collect safety data post injection, that would be classified as a SAE (Serious Adverse Event).

            You should make sure to report it each time (if) it happens after any prophylactic injection. The integrity of the post market authorisation safety surveillance systems depend on it.

    • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 09:52
      +6

      you are aware right that it was most likely really mild as you had the Jab right?

      • morebunnings on 13/06/2024 - 09:58

        Yes.

        What's weird to me is I got the same 2 jabs as everyone else in my office at around the same time (we all went when there was a center set up near our office).

        It seems the jab worked better on me than my co-workers, as they all have gotten knocked out by covid this year, while I seem to be fine.

        • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 11:29

          different peoples systems react differently. Also wouldn't suprise me if "some" of those knocked out by covid were also mild but being positive is a perfect excuse to say how badly affected you are for extra timeoff or some leniency in work schedules.

  • DingoBilly on 13/06/2024 - 09:31
    +2

    As soon as you see the appeal to authority (leader of Australia's covid response) - you know it will be a low quality article.

  • GordonD on 13/06/2024 - 10:22
    +2

    On one hand he is someone who we were told was an expert whose opinion we should trust.

    On the other hand he is speaking now to promote a new TV program, and the way to get headlines for yourself and it is to say controversial and populist things.

  • WastedWombat on 13/06/2024 - 10:39
    +6

    Vax also affected me permanently..

    It made me very sexy and hot as (profanity). DYOR

    • fredblogs on 13/06/2024 - 13:45
      +4

      Can confirm, I only subscribed to WastedWombat's OF after they got the vax

  • JuliaH on 13/06/2024 - 11:08
    +1

    “Daily Mail” rarely has any scientific credentials behind its reporting. Same in the UK version.

  • spurf on 13/06/2024 - 11:14
    +13

    Unlike the current variant, COVID wasn't a mild illness in the early days. Do people not remember the initial outbreaks after it left China? Hospitals in Italy being overwhelmed? The failed "let it rip" policies? I'm currently at home looking after my kid who has COVID but is barely unwell, and am grateful Australia was spared the worst of it.

    • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 11:48
      +4

      conspiracy nutters like the OP only see black and white when it comes to there pet conspiracy. We don't need the jab now therefore we never needed it and it was all a conspiracy.

      reminds me of all the people claiming y2k was overblown and a waste of money and just a conspiracy for IT consulting money. It appeared that way precisely because we spent so much time and money addressing the critical issues at the time.

      • Vita85 on 13/06/2024 - 12:19
        -6

        Ahaha, you think Y2K was real. Wow, no point even arguing with someone that delusional. Yes the government, big pharma and media were all telling the truth. You can sleep well knowing they have no other agenda.

        • DingoBilly on 13/06/2024 - 12:24
          +6

          How do you even reply to this?

          Y2K did occur - it's pretty well documented. Maybe you should do some reading.
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_2000_problem

        • SBOB on 13/06/2024 - 12:33
          +3

          you think Y2K was real. Wow, no point even arguing with someone that delusional

          blinks
          wow…

        • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 12:57
          +1

          I worked fixing and assessing various hospital systems at the time. people would have died if various y2k bugs hadn't been addressed. One particular hospital device I worked on would lock up and stop functioning at midnight as the date reset screwed the logging function which in turn was synchronous and hence the device literally stopped dead, soon after the patient would also.

          • ssfps on 14/06/2024 - 00:37
            +1

            @gromit: When people say that "y2k wasn't real", they're referring to the media sensation around it, they aren't actually suggesting years were never stored as 2 digits…

            • gromit on 14/06/2024 - 07:18

              @ssfps: The problem was while the media sensation was very over hyped, it was very much real. Without the enormous effort in decommissioning or fixing old shit everything from banks to hospitals and businesses would have seen outages and potentially deaths all over the place. So many people don't seem to understand how a simple date can cause so much pain and all the systems that were potentially going to cause deaths got a lot of attention to test and fix them.

              I worked on various systems in hospitals, 1 bank and a couple of private enterprises. Just from the systems we fixed the imapcts ranged from people dieing in hospitals because critical devices stopped, Bank transfers failing, people not getting paid as their work period calculated to a negative value for the month and lots of other minor issues.

              If we had the same situation today the impact would be even worse as date and time has become even more critical in calculations, Things like Oauth/Kerberos/SAML are all critically dependent on date/time being accurate.

        • Cluster on 13/06/2024 - 13:11
          +1

          The fun part is we'll get echoes of Y2K in 2030, as a cheap and easy fix for some legacy systems was to simply leave two digit dates and move everything forward 30 years. 05 became 2005, 30 became 2030. 31 becomes… 1931.

          Unix has a year 2038 problem. The vast majority of systems will be retired by then, but there's always that legacy system hanging around somewhere that no one pays attention to until it stops working.

          Plenty of really old systems still in use every day.

          San Francisco's train system relies on 5.25" floppy disks
          https://www.wired.com/story/san-francisco-muni-trains-floppy…

          • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 13:15
            +2

            @Cluster: Yep, perhaps we should let the 2030 and 2038 dates just role by. Be amusing to see how many things are still reliant on old code or legacy systems. Might be an enlightening experience for people like Vita85 to see how many things are critically reliant on date and time functions.

          • SBOB on 13/06/2024 - 13:36
            +1

            @Cluster:

            The fun part is we'll get echoes of Y2K in 2030, as a cheap and easy fix for some legacy systems was to simply leave two digit dates and move everything forward 30 years.

            Redlion protocol converters had their own version just a few months ago in March ,
            ("1997 Timestamp Issue", due to the way their higher frequency time counter was implemented)
            https://www.redlion.net/support/software-firmware/red-lion-s…

        • Randolph Duke on 13/06/2024 - 13:47

          Maybe Y2K wasn’t a big deal because companies spent millions in the lead up updating code to ensure there would be no issues. A vaccine for preventable coding bugs, you might say.

    • chichi on 13/06/2024 - 12:28

      Current variant isn’t mild btw.

    • LFO on 13/06/2024 - 13:18
      +3

      Hospitals in Italy being overwhelmed?

      And Sweden doing absolutely nothing and surviving …

      • gromit on 13/06/2024 - 14:50
        +1

        surviving? sure. however 27,000 people didn't and despite Swedish government doing nothing a large portion of population chose to mostly self isolate once the cases and deaths started to skyrocket.

    • GordonD on 13/06/2024 - 15:17
      +1

      Unlike the current variant, COVID wasn't a mild illness in the early days. Do people not remember the initial outbreaks after it left China? Hospitals in Italy being overwhelmed? The failed "let it rip" policies?

      One of the most convincing arguments that COVID is a "real" illness, is that it has a different victim profile to the other previous respiratory epidemics. Flu kills right across the age spectrum. But in the case of COVID nearly everyone it kills is old, with existing medical conditions. And it always, from the start, has been mostly mild for young healthy people.

      Hospitals in places like Italy were overwhelmed with old people who got it, because it is a country with a lot of old people.

      Very few places "let it rip". Sweden was the closest to that, where they didn't close the schools or have shutdowns. And looking back it ended up with pretty much the same number of COVID-related deaths as the similar countries around it, without its government going into huge debt trying to keep the economy afloat during the shutdowns. Shutting everything down and not shutting everything down turned out to be about equally effective in terms of deaths, with the latter not leaving the country with a big debt to pay back after the pandemic. In the end, no matter what you did, most people got a case of it, because the vaccines when they arrived were not effective at preventing getting infected or passing it on as it was hoped earlier on they would. Shutting everything down until the vaccines were available to prevent everyone getting infected didn't work because they didn't.

      • ssfps on 14/06/2024 - 00:41
        +4

        Flu kills right across the age spectrum.

        Almost all flu deaths are old age or with comorbidity, just the same as covid, and any other respiratory illness. In fact, ABS tracks deaths by "respiratory illness" - i'm not sure when they started tracking "the flu" separately, maybe around 10 years ago?

        Very first result from a google search:
        https://www.statista.com/statistics/1127698/influenza-us-dea…

        During the 2021-2022 flu season in the United States, around 4,977 people died from influenza. The vast majority of deaths due to influenza occur among the elderly, with those aged 65 years and older accounting for 4,115 deaths during the 2021-2022 flu season.

    • buckster on 14/06/2024 - 22:33

      Yep, they don't remember/believe those initial outbreaks were fake/whatever stupid excuse they can think of to blindly pretend they're correct

  • t_c on 13/06/2024 - 11:22

    If Dr Phelps, the former Australian Medical Association president claims vaxine injury, pretty sure most rational people are going to believe ozbargain consensus that anyone antivax is a total cooker.

    • GordonD on 13/06/2024 - 15:36
      +5

      I was a member of the COVID/vaccine support organisation, Coverse, that Phelps became the spokesvictim for. I quit it because of her. I quit it because the story that she told the media - and the media ran it because she was telling it - was discrediting a legitimate cause. What she claimed is that both she and her partner ended up with long term injuries from the COVID vaccine. There are people who were injured by the COVID vaccine. I was one of them. But they were rare to very rare. The probability that both she and her partner got it was close to zero. I formed the opinion from listening to her story that she was either exaggerating, fibbing, or it was a case of #MeToo!. That is women having the tendency to exaggerate what happened to themself to sympathise with and identify with other women who really are victims.

  • azero on 13/06/2024 - 11:26
    -2

    It is essentially - do you let a lot of old people die from covid or a small number of young people die from the possible complications of the vaccine.

    I don't think it was an easy decision to make or to know if they were making the right decision at the time.

    • trapper on 13/06/2024 - 13:10
      +7

      The vaccine didn't prevent transmission though, the whole 'protect nana' thing was a lie.

      Nana needed the vaccine, not the grandkids.

      • xslasherzz on 13/06/2024 - 20:46
        +4

        Shhh…. Get out of here, how dare you actually do some thinking.

        • Ughhh on 14/06/2024 - 08:38
          -1

          Err coming from a guy who does thinks reduce and prevent means the same thing. Great thinking indeed.

      • morse on 14/06/2024 - 02:59

        Actually it reduces (not eliminates) transmission and therefore overall risk to Nana. The vaccine means that when people are exposed to COVID they are less likely to get sick from it or have less severe illness. It reduces overall circulation of the virus in the community and therefore nana’s community. The grandkids shouldn’t get it as the risk outweighs the benefits. If some adults choose not to be vaccinated now, it is of less consequence to others as the majority of the population is vaccinated.

        • trapper on 20/06/2024 - 17:06

          It reduces overall circulation of the virus in the community

          This is not true at all though. The virus spread easily through every community, even those with very high levels of vaccination.

          • Ughhh on 20/06/2024 - 19:31
            -2

            @trapper: If people are sick for a shorter period, and not as severe, that can help reduce spread. The vaccine doesn't stop/block one from catching it, like it's some kind of shield from Fortnite ffs.

  • Brianqpr on 13/06/2024 - 11:37
    -2

    Here we go again….

    Current strains of covid are not as dangerous as it was early on. This is normal for viruses as they mutate. The vaccines were clearly effective in getting us out of lockdowns but are less needed now.

    • GordonD on 13/06/2024 - 15:41

      Current strains of covid are not as dangerous as it was early on. This is normal for viruses as they mutate.

      Correct. They evolve in the direction of becoming more infectious and less fatal. Because they are more likely to be passed on to evolve even further if they don't kill their host and so have the opportunity to be passed to more victims.

      • trapper on 13/06/2024 - 19:01

        Not just less fatal, but less serious altogether.

        If a person is sick enough to stay at home, that alone reduces the competitiveness of that particular strain.

  • Gehirn on 13/06/2024 - 13:11

    Why do I need opinions when this is pinned at the top of this section of the forum?

    Is it True? Find accurate, evidence-based answers to questions or misinformation about COVID-19 vaccines.

    • Cluster on 13/06/2024 - 13:16
      -2

      Right from January 2020 some people simply would not believe any information from experts in the field, but would believe any random comment on Facebook. This hasn't changed.

      I wonder how many people still think 5G mobile was responsible for COVID. That was a hot theory in early 2020. Seems to have died down.

      • ssfps on 14/06/2024 - 00:46
        +2

        Right from January 2020 some people simply would not believe any information from experts in the field

        They didn't have any data in January 2020, of course that didn't stop the fearmongering.

        Remember, it wasn't until ~mid 2020 that they actually started to get real figures instead of wild and almost baseless extrapolations.
        Recall they revised the death rates when 'the experts' realized two orders of magnitude more people were infected than they had previously thought, but that they were asymptomatic (or non-severe)?

  • LFO on 13/06/2024 - 13:14

    Nick Coatsworth Who Helped Lead Australia's Response to COVID

    Gosh!
    I never heard of nor seen that guy …

    OzBargain news does it again.

  • dogboy on 13/06/2024 - 13:51

    Great, now we are celebrating anti-intellectualism here in Australia as well. The US republican stupidity is like a virus attacking all the dumbest people in society who think they are special because they aren't sheep and think for themselves when really they just thrive on fake news from social media and perpetuate it to others like them who have no critical thinking skills.

    • TEER3X on 13/06/2024 - 20:46

      The US republican stupidity is like a virus attacking all the dumbest people in society who think they are special because they aren't sheep and think for themselves when really they just thrive on fake news from social media and perpetuate it to others like them who have no critical thinking skills.

      I'm stealing this

  • THL on 13/06/2024 - 13:57
    +1

    The number of typos and grammar mistakes is something even a vaccine can't cure and that's all we need to know about it.

  • 91rs on 13/06/2024 - 15:01
    +8

    Don't need his advice to know I wont be taking any more shots.
    Don't need his commentary on how we were lied to, how the things we were told the vaccine would do, never was able to do (stop transmission being a huge one).
    Very doubtful that it ever did enough for the average person, the oldies are always at risk of flus etc, this was a great money making exercise with no liability for injuries (or deaths) all the while the countries that funded where it came from and the country that it was first let loose in watched the pandemic response of the rest of the world, during that time everyone was distracted they then went about censoring reports and documents about its origin to save face.

    I got the 3 I've had under duress to continue to be able to work at the time so I could pay my bills & travel as part of my job, nothing more.

    Given the lies and deceit basically from day one with covid and the amount of things that have come out since I've lost a lot of trust in medical "experts" and others in that field who were so forceful with zero actual science behind things.
    I didn't really have much trust or faith in government but that has been completely eliminated now. Heads should have been rolling over what happened yet most escaped fine, some even think some of the premiers are some kind of hero or god. Shocking really.

    I do feel bad for those with injuries or those who've had their life expectancy cut dramatically without really knowing over this. I know a couple of people with permanent injuries which impact daily life, plenty think they're faking it as they don't want to believe them.
    The back pedaling from those who were so vengeful toward those who didn't want it or merely questioned the vaccine has been amazing to watch, some truly horrible people out there, neighbors, people you work with etc all based on govt approved lines to condemn and shame others.

    I still got it several times, most were enough to have to take time off during the illness, but no worse than other serious flus I've had in the past.

    • trapper on 13/06/2024 - 19:14

      Given the lies and deceit basically from day one with covid and the amount of things that have come out since I've lost a lot of trust in medical "experts" and others in that field who were so forceful with zero actual science behind things.

      This is a big one. I think without a proper reckoning, the erosion of public trust in science and medicine may endure for a very long time.

      Hopefully, parents do not lose faith in vaccines altogether; measles in particular is a major cause for concern.

      • 91rs on 13/06/2024 - 22:12
        +1

        Hopefully not (people losing faith in vaccines altogether), I'm more than on board for known vaccines for things that actually work, immunisations for children and adults where required (whooping cough, measles etc), there has been increases in some of those since covid in some regions which is troubling given how under control it had been. BCG/TB has seen an increase in the USA of >15% since 2020. Stuff that was decreasing.

    • MessyG on 13/06/2024 - 19:30
      -2

      I keep seeing people say they were told it would stop transmission but all I ever saw was that it would reduce severity of disease, thereby reducing pressure on the public hospital system. I saw a lot of information changing very quickly which is to be expected but that's not lies, that's just information changing quickly.

      I also saw a lot of terrible behaviour by many, many humans, and lost my faith in people in general, from governments to individuals. To only lose faith in government is quite the interesting position to take.

      • 91rs on 13/06/2024 - 22:04
        +4

        Oh I never had much faith in other people hahaha, but it was interesting to watch how vicious people got toward each other, the willingness to dob on others for the slightest thing or to call them out in public (saw this several times in Melbourne, people making scenes about people without masks and trying to shame people).

        There was a lot of pushing that it would stop transmission, something spread globally, friends and colleagues in the EU, USA and throughout SE Asia who had read and heard the same thing from major news outlets, its come out a while ago that they knew all along that it never had the ability to stop spread, but would help with compliance if that was not mentioned.
        Information did change but many things were already established facts that were ignored just to get people on board.

        That was just vaccine related, there were other things like the $1.3 billion for 4000 ICU beds in April 2020 for Victoria that was announced and never happened, just smoke and mirrors. This could have actually helped our already struggling health care system, but no accountability and no results.

        • Diji on 14/06/2024 - 12:39
          +2

          saw this several times in Melbourne, people making scenes about people without masks and trying to shame people

          Interesting, I only saw the opposite. People having a go at those wearing a mask and spitting at them in an attempt to use the fear of infection as a weapon.

        • MessyG on 14/06/2024 - 17:16
          -2

          People are still pushing that 4000 ICU beds line? It never happened because it never needed to happen - there weren't 4000 people sick enough to need it. Which is a good thing right? The government saw what happened in Italy and New York and said okay, here's what we've got if it's needed. We still don't need that kind of ICU funding here.

          I'm not saying they didn't make some bad decisions (towers, closing playgrounds and not vaccinating teachers immediately were my top 3), but that wasn't one of them.

          I truly don't know where that idea it would stop transmission came from, because the publication at the time was looking at disease severity and mortality. It sounds like that was misinterpreted en masse.

      • whyisave on 14/06/2024 - 00:24
        +1

        I keep seeing people say they were told it would stop transmission

        That was the reason, why restaurants, pubs,… private corporate spaces
        did not let anyone [patrons] on their premise, who did not get jabbed.

        • MessyG on 14/06/2024 - 17:16

          I thought it was to prevent liability from people saying they caught it on premises then claiming comp if they got extremely sick or died from it.

          • whyisave on 14/06/2024 - 18:10
            +2

            @MessyG: How could you catch a virus that is floating in the air, within a designated floor-space but not in the parking lot of a shopping centre (private property) and likewise?

            Was there a precedence of catching air-borne illnesses on private property and then suing the owner or tenant of that property?

            I saw some online comments (so, this is anecdotal) of people didn't allowing people into their homes without proving jab status ?
            I understand if a RAT was used, because having someone infectious around is not a good thing, but disclosing a private medical status cannot be the basis for denying entry.
            It would have been the belief and the marketing , at the beginning, that it reduces transmissability, because this was in 2021 and RAT became available end of 2021 - start of 2022.

            • MessyG on 14/06/2024 - 20:27
              -1

              @whyisave: I totally agree there was some really ignorant behaviour but I genuinely don't remember any kind of official communication about vaccines preventing transmission. Healthcare workers had to get it due to it being an extremely high risk profession with repeated exposure, but my understanding was that it was left up to workplaces to decide.

              • whyisave on 14/06/2024 - 20:34
                +1

                @MessyG: You could be right that the messaging may not say "prevent" , and if I find something, I'll post back but
                here is an example from Royal Australian College of GPs (RACGP) , circa 2021 October

                COVID-19 vaccination reduces household transmission up to 97%
                https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/covid-19-vaccinati…

                Ending COVID lockdown by targeting transmission with vaccination [UNSW]
                https://www.unsw.edu.au/medicine-health/our-schools/populati…

                Now that you've seen these links, that article may not even stay online (like many, many others) in the future, because they all get removed, but Internet archivists use Archive links to back them up, to preserve history.

              • mrdean on 14/06/2024 - 20:56
                +4

                @MessyG:

                but I genuinely don't remember any kind of official communication about vaccines preventing transmission.

                Don't worrry MessyG there were plenty of misinformed hcw's repeating the narrative:

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5H_AfEWPvM
                "I got the vaccine predominately because vaccination is one way to reduce the spread of covid19 in the community, it's one way to open up the community & let people go about doing what they would do normally, in terms of their work…." Associate Professor Deepak Bhonagiri

                Others repeated the line about getting the countermeasures to protect others in the community:
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-qKIhhhlVQ

                Or how about herd immunity from this neurologist:
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=md7t7OJ_hlg
                "….also it helps to achieve herd immunity which will help prevent the spread of the virus"

                "Official communication" they may be not, but misinformed apparently so.

                • Ughhh on 15/06/2024 - 02:33
                  -2

                  @mrdean: Another one who struggles with the English language and differentiating prevent vs reduce. I would be angry all the time too if I was this confused.

                  • trapper on 19/06/2024 - 11:32
                    -1

                    @Ughhh: Reduce means to make smaller.

                    The spread was not made smaller, it spread everywhere across Australia and the world. The spread was not reduced.

    • whyisave on 14/06/2024 - 00:22
      +2

      all based on

      yes, it was a giant Stanley Milgram experiment in real-time..
      most people, end up relaying authoritative directives,
      even if their conscience said otherwise.

  • GordonD on 13/06/2024 - 15:59
    +4

    I don't know anyone who was so smart they have gotten everything right, or so dumb they have gotten everything wrong. And especially got everything right when it came to predicting and anticipating the future.

    The COVID pandemic was new territory that no-one knew for sure the best way to navigate.

    Anyone suggesting the experts got everything right, that there was nothing they said that could be questioned, is just being foolish. But they didn't get it seriously wrong. And they'd be less likely to get it wrong the next time if they and their most vocal supporters would listen to the people who are saying they didn't get everything right.

    The obvious thing they got wrong was being too optimistic about how effective the vaccines would be at preventing infection and re-infection, and relying on shutting everything down until the vaccines were available to keep COVID from spreading until they were, at which point they expected rapid mass vaccination to kill the virus dead fast. That's what hasn't worked.

    • whyisave on 14/06/2024 - 18:23
      +1

      The COVID pandemic was new territory that no-one knew for sure the best way to navigate.

      Since it was classified by W.H.O. as new, ie. novel, existing medical procedures were instructed by W.H.O. to be abandoned.

      ( W.H.O. declared it to be a 'pandemic' even though the definition at the time was different, to what endemic meant )

      The pneumonia-like symptoms , would have been diagnosed as a respitatory illness and prescribed anti-biotics to treat it like that and monitor for improvements.

      Doctors are taught, trained and practice treating for symptoms. This is how it was treated in non-developed countries.
      In developed countries, a doctor would work within a medical system (eg. hospitals) or have registration with an organisation.
      Those hospitals and organisational bodies, repeated the same W.H.O. directive / instruction of changing the work-instructions / protocols and treat Covid , according to W.H.O. guidelines.

      So, there was a top-down, controlled approach to covid and all the moving parts (eg. media, news, videos online of Chinese people collapsing, fear in airports, etc.) added to that panic & hysteria, for medical establishments to follow W.H.O. guidance for treating covid.

Login or Join to leave a comment
Login Join