Need Basic Desktop PC, What to Look for to Ensure Fast Startup and Running

kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 16:19

I'm looking to replace a relative's desktop PC (about 10 years old?) which has been very slow to startup and run for a long time (eg, it takes at least 5 minutes to start up, and a few minutes to start an application like Excel or Edge). Haven't tried reinstalling everything from scratch, but the PC isn't suitable for Windows 11 so they've decided to get a new PC anyway.

Use of it is pretty much only browsing and Excel, Word.

The slowness of the current one is something I don't want to have in any way in the new one. I realise there may be something wrong with the current PC, but what would be a minimum or recommended value for money config that would be assured to be responsive? What sort of Windows 11 startup times and app startup times should I expect to get with a new system? I understand that I should get an SSD for the startup disk. And I guess 16GB RAM may be safer than 8GB? Does the CPU I get have much effect?

Computing Computer Desktop Computer

Comments

  • scrimshaw on 14/04/2024 - 16:27
    +22

    For basic tasks you really do not need very much, a system using a modern platform (that supports DDR4, NVME storage, USB 3) is going to be enough for light usage.

    This $239 Optiplex with a 9th Gen Intel processor for example is more than enough

    https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/837253

    Alternatively also look for a used Dell Optiplex 7070 (equipped with Core i5 9500) or some other similar refurb Lenovo or HP running at least 8th Gen or 9th Gen Intel CPU.

    Windows 11 officially only supports 8th gen or newer.

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:06

      Good idea, I had seen those on OZB before an had wondered if they'd be suitable.

      • RotundPolarBear on 14/04/2024 - 20:19
        +3

        which has been very slow to startup and run for a long time eg, it takes at least 5 minutes to start up

        I bought a refurb from the same seller of a HP Elitedesk with Windows 11 and it boots up in seconds. Takes longer for my monitor to turn on.

      • [Deactivated] on 15/04/2024 - 09:44
        +3

        Thought it might be helpful to speak from the perspective of someone who uses one of them almost 100% of the time for everything.

        I was just like you a few years ago, had seen a lot of those USFF (Ultra Small Form Factor) machines around starting from $150 up to sky is as high as one's wallet is thick. Primary intended use was to purely act as a machine to torrent, due to the exceptionally low power draw, they're almost dead silent (lack of noise is one of those things that's really challenging to quantify the value of until you experience it), and they're absolutely tiny.

        Over time I started doing all the normal things that we all do, browsing/productivity/media consumption/etc etc you know all the things that takes up the vast majority of everyone's usage and found that it did everything perfectly.

        Nowadays I edit all my photos (~70MB raw files), 3D modelling, CAD work, multiple virtual machines, etc that would be considered beyond the bar of "light" usage, and it handles them all perfectly fine. 4K movies plays flawlessly, not much of a gamer these days but light games and Switch emulation runs perfectly (fan does kick in for those alas it's still very quiet). For GPU intensive tasks like rendering that's when I use my main PC, though that's likely to be outside of the scope for most people.

        The pros are endless, $300-$400 (which is what I'm running right now, started with a $150 cheapie with a much older CPU) gets you a 10th gen Intel processor with 16GB of RAM and SSD is more than enough for everything and I'd like to think outside of gaming my use cases are more demanding above the norms. Could not be happier.

        [edit]
        Re your slow boot times/etc, as everyone's mentioned SSD is so cheap nowadays and is a big step up from mechanical HDDs, a clean configuration of Windows (removal of unnecessary apps/services/etc) gets a PC start in seconds.

      • tekisei on 16/04/2024 - 12:32

        For Dell Optiplex, I suggest looking at SFF rather than USFF size. Price should be similar.

        3 main reasons:
        Better cooling (bigger heatsink/fan).
        Usually has a DVD player, great for older relatives.
        Has a slot for a 3.5 inch hard drive - can put the long term archival stuff/old files in there as an accessable backup.

    • The Hawk on 15/04/2024 - 14:45

      For someone who clearly doesn't care too much, buy something like this that supports Windows 11 and be done.
      Pull the old drive out and put it into an external enclosure as backup (and make it easy to get stuff off the old computer).
      Consider 16GB RAM and 512GB storage the minimum for an easy life.

      If the budget allows, buy a new keyboard/mouse and a 27" 1440p monitor. These are the parts people look at and touch and given the age of the old stuff just about anything is likely an improvement. I don't think I can understate just how much 'better' the upgrade feels with a new large screen and keyboard and mouse. Sure using the old screen and peripherals will save some $$ and give all the speed benefits, but I guarantee that a 27" screen would be MILES bigger than the old one and make all the difference… that and peoples eyes get crappier with age.

      Finally, you could swap out the desktop for a laptop, even keeping the keyboard/mouse/screen so they can still sit at the desk and work, but also get the flexibility to work anywhere else in the house should they need to.
      For example, my mother had a desktop and a dedicated computer room, had/has zero interest in computers and uses it for pretty basic things. When we upgraded her to a laptop she didn't really see the point and used it primarily in the room at the desk with an external keyboard and mouse, but over the years it's crept out of the older computer room more and more. I've even given her a dock and monitor but I don't think she's even set it up.

      Feel free to do the same but with a shiny new machine if they really want new and a warranty.

    • ReaperX22 on 15/04/2024 - 16:34

      Agree with this. And given they clearly don't upgrade often, definitely consider 9 or 10th gen. Probably worth spending the extra 50-100 bucks over 8th or older just for (in theory) longer support and a tiny bit more performance.. But even my parents moved to a 6th gen windows 11 box without issues and it's plenty fast for their basic use.

      Just ensure 16gb of ram, and also these boxes can take a 2.5 inch Sata drive, so throw in a cheap 500gb ssd or something if they need the extra storage.

    • HeWhoKnows on 21/04/2024 - 22:23

      But a 10 year old system should still run fast !!!!

      The following is suggested

      1) Run Advanced System Care FREE to give the PC a decent tune up
      2) Run a Defrag program such as Auslogics DiskDefrag and select the "Defrag and optimize" option

      You should see a signifcant improvment after that but also..

      3) Check the computer has at least 8GB RAM
      4) Run CrystalDiskInfo to ensure the hard disk doesnt have any issues
      5) To really bump up performance exchange the old hard disk with either a new or good second hand SSD
      You can use CrystalDiskInfo to check condition of SSD - it displays SSD Health as a percentage.

      Pls note OP
      ALL COMPUTERS SLOW DOWN OVER TIME!
      Its all about the Windows updates weighing down the computer.
      The computer itself contInues to function the same.
      Thats why you must regularly run a PC tune up program like ADVANCED SYSTEM CARE

      • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:07

        A tower form would suit better as it can be put under the desk and be accessible as the desk doesn't have much room on it.

      • iminabrons on 15/04/2024 - 11:27
        +7

        Sir, it may be possible that your monitor is stuck in first gear!! Try to put it into at least 3rd or 4th gear.
        Newer monitors now have automatic gears. I know it seems a bit fancy-nancy for a traditionalist like yourself but I hear the younger generation, i.e. Baby Boomers, are all for it.šŸ˜Š

      • Jerome87 on 15/04/2024 - 11:56
        +1

        Don't know why you were negged. I thought it was funny. Maybe it was the lack of precision? - the speed of the signal will be 5.04 km/h if a one-way signal travels 1.4m in 1 second

      • Gnostikos on 16/04/2024 - 12:42
        +2

        Nah, that's not it.

        It's the fact that the 1s always travel freely through a cable but the 0s will get stuck in any kinks/bends along the way.

        You have to make sure any cables are fully straightened to ensure optimal bandwidth.

      • idonotknowwhy on 17/04/2024 - 08:36
        +1

        This used to be a factor with parallel connections. Eg, you can't easily repair damaged traces for data lines on old machines, because it throws the timing off. Data on some lines will arrive too early or too late.

  • Nillionaire on 14/04/2024 - 16:58
    +1

    budget please

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:07
      +1

      I haven't bought a PC for a very long time, so I don't know - under $1000?

  • oscargamer on 14/04/2024 - 17:06
    +16

    Just replace HDD with SSD. The change is astronomical

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:08
      +4

      Good idea. I would still have the issue of not being able to go to Win 11 and Win 10 becoming obsolete.

      • oscargamer on 14/04/2024 - 19:20
        +3

        Sure, but it might make it OK for a bit and if not, just re-use the SSD in the new build !!

      • Viper8 on 15/04/2024 - 18:25
        +1

        Not until Oct 2025.

    • rickxs on 15/04/2024 - 04:31
      -2

      ssd then install tiny10>[tiny11]

    • lechuck123 on 15/04/2024 - 17:17
      +1

      I was going to say the same thing. I did this recently for a friend, his PC went from approx 20min startup to instant startup.

      He was gaming on this PC too but he was using an old plated HDD for windows. I switched to an NVME drive.

      Even if your computer doesn't support NVME, a regular SSD would make a big difference.

  • TiredKitty78 on 14/04/2024 - 17:27
    +8

    10 years old? Probably the cut off to when we really started going with SSDs as standard.

    Honestly, first step, get an SSD. If you're using a HDD in the old PC, it will be night and day using a SSD. You might fine the machine runs fine for what you want to use it for then. An that an unusable desktop goes to a very fine, ok, no complaints basic but easy to use machine with just switching out the HDD for a SSD. Plus, chuck some more cheap RAM at it. A 1 minutes video here to show the difference a SSD can make.

    NOTE: CONFIRM WHAT HARDWARE IS COMPATIBLE WITH YOUR MACHINE YOURSELF BEFORE BUYING. I'M MAKING SOME ASSUMPTIONS HERE

    10 years old? I'll assume DDR3 RAM…

    $42 16gb here at Amazon

    …and SATA 3 for the new SSD on a motherboard that probably does not support the newer m.2 format, and again the newer NVME drives of the m.2 format….and there's something new about pcie drives……anyway SATA 3.

    A $90 Silicone Power Ace A55 in the chunky 2.5inch form here at amazon

    And given how old the machine is, it might be cheap enough to get a faster CPU if you can find one. Let's assume socket 1155 long outdated iirc, likely second hand CPU might range from $50-$100 and i wouldn't pay more even though it's getting into 'so old/hard to find, it's vintage' prices. In which, you may be better off trying to find a better motherboard that can take your older parts, but possible have some of the 'new to you features' like possibly taking a SATA 3 m.2 SSD….

    There's a used i7 here for $83, not sure how reputable the seller is though…

    Aliexpress if you want to risk it for $60 here and $60 here from long running stores which is worth something….

    I'll say it again, before anything else, get an SSD drive. And your parents can use the desktop till it dies….

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:09

      Thanks for the detailed reply! Good idea re: SSD. I would still have the issue of not being able to go to Win 11 and Win 10 becoming obsolete.

      • Caped Baldy on 15/04/2024 - 14:56
        +2

        What do you mean by obsolete? It's just not supported by M$, it'll still work and since they're doing basic stuff it's not too big of an issue imo.

      • TiredKitty78 on 15/04/2024 - 19:03

        Really, the requirements for win 11 don't seem a lot. And you might have the little newer software systems it requires. A quick google suggests if the pc is only about 10 years old, you might have a just new enough processor.

        AND if you don't, honestly, a newer motherboard that supports the older hardware might be possible.

        But $50 for a ssd will make a massive difference, then probably more RAM.

        Other then that, around $150-$200? You might as well do what others recommend, and get a refurbished business thin client which already has a 'newer' cpu, ssd, motherboard, and should run win 11. You could possible pop in a nothing fancy graphics card to for when one of the kids wants to try out playing some games.

  • BewareOfThe Dog on 14/04/2024 - 17:55
    -7

    I don't like supporting one of the greediest/stingiest companies on the planet, but depending on your budget, an M1 Macbook Air (Refurb/2nd hand), with 8GB, will beat most Intel 16GB units any day, given what you have said. :)

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 19:09
      +2

      I think changing OS would be a bridge too far for them.

      • BewareOfThe Dog on 14/04/2024 - 20:39
        -3

        Admittedly Windows OS is easier to use than MacOS, but MacOS is far more flexible and easier to use than IOS.

        Do they own Iphones?

        • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 21:09

          No, and don't use their mobile phone much at all.

    • smartazz104 on 16/04/2024 - 07:17
      +2

      I don't like supporting one of the greediest/stingiest companies on the planet

      Let us know when you find a company that is none of those things.

  • solidussnake on 14/04/2024 - 18:05

    As others have said the refurb units or the $799 entry gaming units would more than surpass their needs

  • Jugganautx on 14/04/2024 - 18:34
    +1

    Buy one of those Lenovo mini PCs for $150

    Does everything you want it to other than gaming.

  • GordonD on 14/04/2024 - 19:26
    +2

    OP, without being critical, can I suggest that if you have to ask us, they have asked the wrong person to get them a new PC.

    The first question we'd ask is what do they mean by "new". Do they mean brand new with a warranty, or just a better replacement for the old one. The second question we'd ask is whether they have a budget, or an expectation about how much they are happy to pay.

    If they just want a better replacement, and only need it for office and internet use, there are plenty of refurbished ex-lease small form factor business computers around, including here on OzBargain. What you have to do is make sure the one you choose has a new enough CPU in it that it'll run Windows 11, and you can fit an M.2 NVME drive in it. With one on here, those things will be discussed here, and you'll get the answers.

    If they want a brand new computer, well, you'll get Windows 11 compatibility, Windows 11, and an M.2 NVMe drive. To get just basic office and internet functionalty you don't need an old style big boxy computer. You probably just need some sort of mini PC. Again, you'll see products like that discussed here on OzBargain, though they might come directly from China, and that makes their warranty questionable. But any computer store will have something similar, only at a higher price.

    I have a newish mini PC with a decent processor, and an M.2 NVMe drive, of course. It takes 4 seconds from pressing the ON button to being ready to use, and 1 second to load any app. Next to it I have a refurbished ex-business computer with a low-power processor, and again an M.2 NVMe drive. It takes 14 seconds to being ready to use, and 2 seconds to load apps. I upgraded both of them from 8 to 16 GB of RAM when I could get some 2nd hand DDR4 SODIMMs cheap, but I really didn't notice any improvement in speed for loading and office/basic apps.

    • kiitos on 14/04/2024 - 23:07

      Thanks, I have a PC older than theirs that has been running really well, touch wood. I had expected theirs to do even better, but it's performance has been terrible. I probably should have tried troubleshooting it more, but at this point just seeking to have something to replace it that will more future proof and just want to not have a repeat of the current PC's performance. Thanks for the timings and suggestions.

      • TiredKitty78 on 15/04/2024 - 19:09

        Don't forget, parts also fail.

        The HDD might be failing - so i hope they have backups.

        And they have probably NEVER opened the desktop to clean the case and fans of dust, which could affect the components.

        I will say, has any one really, ever, changed the thermal paste on the cpu? If that is overheating, it could be causing slow downs of the pc, even shut downs.

        Thermal paste should be replaced every few years. And i'd check the heatsink is 'seated' and functioning properly. Thermal paste can be had for like $7 from jaycar.

  • brendanm on 14/04/2024 - 19:54
    +4

    A) get an SSD
    B) don't worry about win11

  • tight-ass on 14/04/2024 - 21:47
    +1

    What about a mini PC?

    I just replaced my dads desktop PC with one of these -
    https://www.amazon.com.au/gp/aw/d/B0CPY5M4S3?psc=1&ref=ppx_pā€¦

    It's super fast for what he needs and the conpact size is a big bonus.

    • CrispyChrispy on 14/04/2024 - 22:32
      +5

      OP doesn't need an expensive machine, any one of those $200 refurb office PCs will do the job just fine

  • altomic on 14/04/2024 - 23:36

    A) get an SSD
    B) don't worry about win11

    I get my desktops from hard rubbish. So they are pretty old. My current rig is a dell optiplex 9020 with 128 GB ssd and 12 gb ram (8+4) , win 10. It boots to home screen in ~15 seconds.

    I only need a desktop as a terminal for WFH, to play Civ 4, and interwebbing.

    Adding a SSD as will improve start up time crazily. I could never go back to a HDD.

    • TiredKitty78 on 15/04/2024 - 19:11

      SSD ftw.

      What do you mean by 'hard rubbish' like left on the verge or the tip?

      • altomic on 16/04/2024 - 08:16
        +1

        Verge and /or tip.

        Which ever. I have a few spare pc boxes in the spare room.

        They all fire up. They sit there waiting patiently for the current box to die and then i swap over ram, ssd and video card (dual monitors)

  • OMGJL on 15/04/2024 - 01:47

    for a new PC, for your use case (Browsing/Word/Excel), assume you don't have a excel sheet with thousands of formulas.

    SSD > capacity of RAM > CPU >= Cooling > everything else.

    can make up a list for you if you are

    interested in a new PC,
    have more definitive price,
    have more detailed requirement(like do you do anything else than browsing/word/excel?)

    and which store you prefer.

  • biozet on 15/04/2024 - 08:17

    to maintain a fast start up you should avoid some things, read others, click somethings, not clicks others, say yes to somethings and no to others and probably (not) install a virus protection program but definitely don't install more than one virus protection program.

  • BigBirdy on 15/04/2024 - 08:23
    +1

    If your old PC is taking 5 mins to startup, it's not just slow hardware, but probably also a software issue, meaning it would need more than upgrading (to) SSD, RAM or CPU. It'll probably need a fresh install of Windows and all Apps.
    A refurbished Lenovo/Dell/HP are not bad value, but personally I'd look at one of the budget new mini PCs, eg Kamrui i5-12450H 16GB RAM, 500GB NVME (~$400 on Amazon) or Trigkey R7-5800 32GB RAM, 500GB NVME (~$550 on Amazon).

  • PeterSnoot on 15/04/2024 - 08:25
    +3

    Given this is OzBargain, a zero dollar cost option is to reset Windows. That may give a surprising boost in performance if they have accumulated a lot of crud over the years.

    Replacing a HDD with SSD would be the best bang for buck on the same machine and the SSD could be re-used.

  • panos on 15/04/2024 - 08:59
    -6

    Geesus someone mentioned a tower under a desk this is 2024 get a flippin laptop, I gave up on towers years ago and building your pc, just not worth it anymore.

    • OzBarAnon on 16/04/2024 - 11:30

      The value from a box is better. With a laptop, you're paying for things like a screen, keyboard, touchpad, portability, that OP's friend may not even need. Assuming they're retaining the monitor and peripherals, and they're continuing to keep it in the same spot like they are now, they can get more performance for the same price.

  • lilbudgie on 15/04/2024 - 09:27

    This is going to be a divisive answer but have you looked at a MacMini. If they want a computer to last many MANY years and one that starts instantly and works so well for a price not that different than a windows desktop. Love them or hate them Mac's do last forever. My previous one was 12 years old. To be fair I am old and I cant be bothered with all the tweaks and mods that most here love I just want to turn it on and have it work perfectly and have great back up and support when it doesn't The couple of times I have actually had to get support have been operator error (surprise surpriseLOL]. Of course you have to factor in the learning curve if they are not familiar with apple but geez if this old chook can master it anyone can.

    • CrispyChrispy on 15/04/2024 - 12:32

      tbf my i7-2600 Optiplex 990 is still going strong; have added different dGPUs over the years for a budget gaming machine and it hasn't missed a beat. Runs AAA games surprisingly well paired with a RX 570 from back in the day XD

    • Marty131 on 16/04/2024 - 12:39

      learning curve for user going from Windows to Mac would surely be too steep?

  • bazingaa on 15/04/2024 - 11:35

    get Lenovo (M700)/Dell (3040) USFF PC with SSD from deals <$100 with i5-6500, and more RAM if needed

    • gromit on 15/04/2024 - 15:06

      So upgrade from a machine that doesn't support win 11 to another machine that doesn't support win 11. Small Form factor machines are great but if going down this road go to something with at least a 9th gen in it or equiv AMD offering.

      • bazingaa on 15/04/2024 - 17:45

        I use Win11 Pro on M700 for Hyper-V

        • gromit on 15/04/2024 - 18:03
          +1

          you can even use it on lower CPU's, but it isn't officially supported and if you are replacing a machine why buy something so dated and on the verge of obsolescence when you can spend a little more and have something that might actually last another decade.

          • bazingaa on 16/04/2024 - 09:40

            @gromit: 9th gen is around $250 or so, isn't it?

            • gromit on 16/04/2024 - 11:12

              @bazingaa: yeah around that. I actually just did a brand new Beelink with a Ryzen 5560U 16GB of ram and 1TB SSD for ~$380 just before xmas. You don't have to spend a lot to get a very capable modern machine. That was for my mother for similar use case, the size makes it perfect so she can put it in her hand bag and bring it to me if she has any technical issues.

  • SlartiBartFozz on 15/04/2024 - 14:12

    I suggest an Asus pn64 or similar system, with a good amount 32gb+ of ram M2. Drop your old drives into an external enclosure if you need to keep using them. Total could be under $1000.
    Performance as good as you can get for anything except gaming.

    • CrispyChrispy on 15/04/2024 - 14:33

      Why would OP need such an expensive system?

  • pformag on 15/04/2024 - 16:38
    +1

    Optiplex 7070, with 9500T. Great machine for basic office and web browsing. Almost instant on, and can run a couple of screens.

  • ripesashimi on 15/04/2024 - 16:40

    I would buy a new machine instead of just replacing bits because Sata SSD and DDR3 ram cant be reused on new machine.

    Look for something with m2, DDR4 and most importanly a USB4/TB4 port so that you can connect to everything released in the next 5 years.

  • Roman Sandstorm on 15/04/2024 - 17:47
    +4

    Perfect use case for something like an Optiplex Micro.

    For under $400 you'll get a tiny dinner-plate sized box, with 8-16 GB DDR4 RAM, 128-256 GB SSD, at least 9th gen i5 CPU, heaps of ports, plus legit OEM Windows 10 licence.

    Win 10 will be fine for the next decade (just do Windows Updates regularly), but if Win 11 is really desired, there's a 30-second Registry hack to enable it to install. (Plus, as it's a Dell,, and Win 10 activated already, Win 11 activates - even with the hack.)

    There are numerous refurbishers; I've used Aust Computer Traders for multiple machines.

    The Dell Optiplexes just seem to go forever. I have a couple at the office from 2012, in use daily, never an issue.

  • RefusdClassification on 15/04/2024 - 19:24

    As others have mentioned, the only mandatory thing is a SSD (just get the cheapest, there is very little difference in real world performace). If you're not playing 3d games or running AI programs or multimedia editing, get the cheapest everything. Modern CPUs automatically overclock cores as needed; for browsing, Word and Excel probably only 1 core will be maxxed at at a time. A have an older relative who uses a Mini PC for a similar workload; the Mini PC uses up so little space compared to my tower.

    The only thing I wouldn't cut corners on is a monitor. I would recommend a Dell IPS 27 inch 2560 x 1440 resolution monitor, or equivalent from another company. Or a 24 inch 1920 x 1200 monitor (16:10 aspect ratio is better for Word Processing and Browsing). If they need extra storage (eg for photos or downloads), a portable USB HDD is fine.

  • vid_ghost on 16/04/2024 - 16:03
    -3

    DDR4 - FAST START UP

    DDR5 - SLOW START UP

    FACT. :)

    Easy just get an intel i5 12400 (with the built in graphics) 32GB DDR4 3200, Intel B660 Motherboard (DDR4) and 1TB nvme 4.0 drive

    if you ever want to play the latest high end games you can add an dedicated GPU later down the road

    Or just get this *i5-12400F PC for $778) - https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/841479
    RTX 4060 Gaming PCs with 16GB RAM, 500GB NVME, i5-12400F: $778 + Post @ TechFast

    • A-mak on 17/04/2024 - 16:04

      my pc starts up quicker than I can take a sip of my coffee and it's ddr5.

      FACT. :)

      My nvme being 7400MB/s read probably helps tho.

  • A-mak on 17/04/2024 - 16:09

    Just be careful OP, many people simply stating "GET SSD", you don't want "an ssd" which could end up being SATA (550MB/s read speed). You want an M.2/NVME (2000MB/s+ read speed).

    This is what can help greatly with boot time and especially opening programs.

    2x8gb sticks of ram will perform better than 1x16gb of the same type/brand provided they have been installed correctly (dual-channel mode) altho a single 8gb may be enough for basic usage.

    • tekisei on 17/04/2024 - 17:05
      +2

      10 year old computer would be Haswell/Devil Canyon - the vast majority of motherboards at that time did not even have an M.2 slot.

      A SATA SSD would already be an amazing improvement over a HDD for boot drive.

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