I Bought a Apartment by Myself. What Is My Girlfriend Entitled to IF We Break up?

Lbigbunj92 on 30/08/2023 - 16:20
Last edited 31/08/2023 - 13:00

Edit: Thanks all, really value all your input (and horror stories / regrets lol). I'll take all this info on board and consult with my family's lawyer accordingly!

I can’t seem to get a straight answer anywhere else online, so naturally, I’ve come to OzB

I’m in the fortunate position where I’ve been able to buy an apartment as a PPoR. I’m also in a de facto relationship with my girlfriend. We’ve been together for less than two years, and have been living together for 1 year (both on the lease). The intent would be that we both live together in this new PPoR. I bought the apartment using my funds only, and it’s only my name on the offer sheet and the contract.

We don’t have joint bank accounts. Up until this point, we have split the cost or take turns sharing the cost of the things we both reasonably consume together (i.e., lunches, bills, groceries). If we want/need to buy something for just ourselves (i.e., clothes, car insurance, petrol, social sports, etc.), we do that with our own money from our own accounts.

[I realise lots of couples have shared bank accounts and do the whole ‘shared account, plus two person accounts’ thing, but we’re not at that stage in our relationship yet. Or at least I’m not ready for that yet lol. One day I’m sure I will be, and perhaps that will dramatically change the scenario I’m describing and i'll seek advice accordingly.]

My intent for now was to just charge my partner “rent” of sorts to help contribute to the mortgage repayments of the PPoR for us both – I’d be happy to do this formally or informally. Consensus online seems to be that you charge half the marketplace rent for the same type of living situation you could find on the open market, which is basically in-line with what my intent was in the first place. Say, $180 a week to live in a 3bed 2bath apartment with me. I figured this would be a reasonable thing to do and would also help her to continue to build her own nest-egg for her to do whatever she wants with in the future – either with or without me.

The part where I’m worried is based on a work colleagues’ story. He reckons he has a “buddy” who was in the same position as me, and lost half his house when he broke up with his girlfriend even though she didn’t contribute to the cost of buying the house. This has naturally got me a bit freaked out, despite my best efforts to ignore stories about “buddies of mine” lol.

Can someone point me to the answers on this, or provide some advice?

Financial

Comments

  • wobblydrow on 30/08/2023 - 18:31
    +2

    So much bad/ignorant advice here. Their is no hard rule, essentially longer you are together, more chance asserts will be split in a more even way.

    What you need to understand is the division of assets is determined by the length or relationship, earning capacity of each party, what each party brought into the relationship and a host of other parameters.

    The division if assets in a short term (under 5 years) is essentially considered to be what you brought in is what you take out plus a reasonable settlement if anything generated in between. That's exactly what happened to a friend, who even had a child. Wife already had a house and gifted multi thousand at wedding, at seperation retained both, but they split investment property they had bought together.

    Have a look at a reasonable summary from an actual law firm here not the OZB lawyers abive

    https://www.armstronglegal.com.au/family-law/property-settle….

    • Thor Bargain God on 30/08/2023 - 20:54
      +3

      Yeah this is true. 5 years passes very fast though. I also wonder whether that outcome you describe was amicably agreed upon and if another outcome could have been derived if the parties chose a more adversarial stance. Remember the female partner who brought the majority of the assets got to retain them and this was possibly linked to the custody situation and child rearing responsibilities. If the man had brought these assets, the outcome could possibly have been different.

  • Sweet3st on 30/08/2023 - 18:46
    -4

    If I had a dollar for every post like this. You want to have all the benefits and comforts of a relationship without sharing any of 'your' wealth. The courts won't see it your way so the simple answer is to break up or live separately. You're either in a committed shared relationship or you're not. Simple.

    • franco cozzo on 30/08/2023 - 18:57
      +8

      …'benefits and comforts' dont pay for real estate honey!

    • Some Human on 30/08/2023 - 20:24
      +7

      Found the gold digga

    • Thor Bargain God on 30/08/2023 - 21:15
      +2

      It is better to go in with your eyes wide open and be informed though, especially if there is a chance of it all crashing down. It is part of life and worth a gamble, but there are steps you can take to protect yourself and you probably shouldn't ask any Tom, Dick and Harry to move in, particularly when you might have more at stake. A couple of bad turns could mean the difference between being a comfortably self-funded retiree and a pensioner living hand to mouth in a caravan park. I just think the law is stacked and it is encouraging a lot of inequity and bad behaviour. I think it needs to return to the principles we had in place for the past several hundred years, where there was less capacity to take advantage of someone's kindness or personal good fortune.

    • ozbjunkie on 31/08/2023 - 08:31

      Are you telling me a relationship is where I exchange money for "physical comfort"?

      I thought there was another name for that arrangement.

      I'm an adult. I basically care for myself. I expect other adults to be similarly viable.

      Why do so many people seem to think that relationships should involve financial exchange from one party to another?

      Again, we have other forms of arrangement for that.

  • hasher22 on 30/08/2023 - 18:53
    +1

    All I can say is, prob best to break up now since it's under 2 years to POSSIBLY avoid legal disputes.

    Technically, "A de facto relationship is when two people are not married but live together, or have lived together as a couple on a genuine domestic basis" but the law is vague on how long, people say minimum 2 years but I couldn't find any official sources about the length.

    This isn't the USA where it's commonly a 50/50 split, in Australia it's based on contributions. For example, if you two moved in together and you paid 100% and she pays 0 rent, financially she has made zero contributions but if she does majority or all of the cooking, cleaning, renovations, bills etc…. your percentage will drop and she will be entitled to some of the property value when you break up. But also the split will become more equal as time goes on.

    Australia also does not technically have a "prenup", it's Binding Financial Agreement. And even this won't save you in court, the other party could disagree and it will be up to the court (if it goes that far) to decide what is fair.

  • Lunarboogie on 30/08/2023 - 18:54
    +13

    Your experience is what has become my most important advice to my own young sons. Do not move in with a girl unless you're going to marry her. Moving in half hearted like OP will end in tears. This isn't a joke - you can and will lose a lot. It happened to me, so I know from bitter experience.

    I have no truck with trying before buying but if you do do that, get a rental and that way your assets are more quarantined. By letting your squeeze move into your place, means you wear all the risks. While she enters with none yet stands to gain a lot. This doesn’t sound fair to me.

  • Breno785au on 30/08/2023 - 19:01

    I really hope the courts doesn't waste time on people like this. Judge Judy doesn't lol Not married? Don't care, work it out yourselves.

    • DogGunn on 30/08/2023 - 20:31
      +4

      what?

      • cupcake on 31/08/2023 - 16:30

        Judge Judy likes to say "You picked him!" when they picked a loser.
        He doesn't pay for diapers, he doesn't watch the baby, he cheated, yada yada, when he is taken to court for costs.

  • Eeples on 30/08/2023 - 19:02
    +1

    What was the discussion with your partner when you mentioned buying an apartment?

    How much percentage was the deposit? Let’s say $100,000 deposit.

    How much of that $100,000 was earned by you since you have lived together? (Because she has supported you, even emotionally, during that time, and so would have claim).

    Imo you need to talk to her……

    Tenants in common (as opposed to joint tenants) could be a good arrangement. It could be 60/40 as she didn’t contribute to the deposit.

    And you both pay the mortgage. (The share you pay each doesn’t need to be 60-40).

    Of course, when you split, the property settlement would include the apartment (probably would anyway) and she may try for better than 60/40 (so could you).

  • Trying2SaveABuck on 30/08/2023 - 19:04
    +2

    to quote Kanya 'when she leave your ass, she going to leave with half'

    • [Deactivated] on 30/08/2023 - 19:10
      -3

      Kanya

      has his bare butt on display whilst on holidays in Italy atm. Kanye needs to spend some $ to get himself some mental health help.

      • belongsinforums on 30/08/2023 - 20:52
        +1

        Your boy was getting brain to be fair

      • Protractor on 31/08/2023 - 10:38

        I think he was either bottle fed from the getgo, or plucked off his Mummies mammies too soon.

        • [Deactivated] on 31/08/2023 - 10:55

          I think the death of his mother may have contributed to his decline.

          • Protractor on 31/08/2023 - 12:26

            @[Deactivated]: Possibly. He needs to honour the loss then, and replace the bizarre with some respect for her memory. Very hard when your papped 24/7, but if he suddenly becomes 'boring' they will move on.

            • [Deactivated] on 31/08/2023 - 12:33

              @Protractor: I don't think boring is in his vocab. He has his own church.

  • trapper on 30/08/2023 - 19:07
    +9

    The clock stared the moment you began living together as a couple.

    After two years you are in a de-facto relationship whether you want it to be or not.

    Are you going to marry this girl? If not, then do not live with her for more than two years.

  • randomusername2017 on 30/08/2023 - 19:26
    +7

    Prevention (Qualified advice) is definitely cheaper than Cure (property settlement).

  • Dreamcast on 30/08/2023 - 19:46
    +14

    (profanity) me! There's usually the thread that reminds me not to have kids and now there's threads that tell me that being single ain't bad.

    This might sound over the top…. But just from your point of view, I would say before all this, ask yourself if can you see yourself long term with your partner? Do you want to get married one day and if so, is she the right one? Do you think she'd make a good mother (if you plan to have kids)? What are her values?, etc, etc, etc.

    It's best to think about who you are going to be with long term and if you're right for each other. I know the most pleasant of people can turn sour and this isn't about mitigating a potential outcome/situation, but rather choosing the right one where you don't need to think about this sort of stuff.

    Also make sure you have someone who can communicate no matter their emotional state. So if things do go south, at least you can talk through it like adults.

    Good luck mate!

    • ChillBro on 30/08/2023 - 21:04

      now there's threads that tell me that being single ain't bad

      Lmao it must be the ozbargain way

    • trapper on 30/08/2023 - 22:19
      +2

      There's usually the thread that reminds me not to have kids

      Kids are the reason it's worth risking it all. No greater reward in life.

      • Protractor on 31/08/2023 - 10:39
        +2

        That's called invested projection

        • trapper on 06/09/2023 - 11:19

          That's called invested projection

          No this isn't it.

          Millions of years of evolutionary development have honed our brain's reward systems to promote the propagation of our species.

          This is precisely why sex itself is inherently pleasurable. Consider a virgin attempting to argue that the pleasure derived from sex is just a result of 'invested projection'. lol

          Similarly, the act of having and raising your own children triggers a reward system in our brains that is undeniable to anyone who has experienced it.

          It really is the greatest reward most people will ever experience, but undoubtably difficult to understand if you haven't done it.

          • Protractor on 06/09/2023 - 12:15

            @trapper: It's invested projection because the 'joy' of children is not backwards compatible, because of the very 'reward system' you're using to support. In other words not only do non parents not know of 'waht they are missing out on' parents can no longer rationally see what THEY are missing out on. There may very well be a hormonal buzz involved with having kids, but no-one puts them back, ppl are programmed to defend the decision. Know anyone in your circle who admits they regret having kids, and if so how do their peers perceive them?
            As a further observation, it's common for ppl with kids to pressure those without out them to join the throng.
            The problem with a circular debate on the pros and cons is there's no time machine to compare the two scenarios. With VS without. Check out what social media users say about independent women who choose not to have kids. This reaction seems to be driven by the greener end of the emotive spectrum.
            Each to their own on having children, or not, but in this day and age it has become a risk laden laden future, never seen in millennia as we look ahead. I'd like to be a fly on the wall for the parental convos explaining how 'things can only get better' when EVERYTHING indicates, they won't.

            This reward syndrome. Take a look at Dennis Leary's take on human pleasures in a lifetime (orgasm)

            • trapper on 06/09/2023 - 12:27

              @Protractor: Know anyone who regrets ever having sex? Maybe some people do, but it's very rare.

              The pleasure of sex is not 'invested projection', the 'hormonal buzz' is very real.

              • Protractor on 06/09/2023 - 12:40

                @trapper: I don't dispute that. I dispute the 'no greater reward in life'.
                You forgot IMHO
                ; )

      • try2bhelpful on 31/08/2023 - 10:41

        You forgot the IMHO.

        • Protractor on 06/09/2023 - 12:35

          That part is a gimme

    • [Deactivated] on 30/08/2023 - 19:57

      I had to buy half my house back after paying it off (contributing 96% of the repayments), her wage is about double mine as well.

      Aha … unbelievable but do tell us more

      Plus the future family line is not in a firm position.

      No idea what this means

      • andresampras on 30/08/2023 - 20:04

        Assuming her wage was double jono's even when they were together, he was spending some of that shared income too.

          • Trying2SaveABuck on 30/08/2023 - 20:59
            +1

            @jonathan111:

            she was into feminism, any discussion about money turned into an argument

            hate to say this but if this wasn't a red flag for you early on….. then you losing half your shit is on you…..

            surely prior to marriage and children you knew she was a gold digger and an idiot

              • Trying2SaveABuck on 30/08/2023 - 21:06
                +3

                @jonathan111:

                prior she was an actual nun

                Catholics dont believe in divorce [or they are not meant to]

                look i feel for you becuz the system 'hates' men as you can see from some other OPs comments the deck will always be stacked against us blokes no matter whos fault it is.

                facts are you would give up all your money to have your children [i know i would] despite how shit your ex was you got children and hopefully they love you and you love them and that is worth more then money.

                if you never got with this bird you might never have had your children so even if you 'could' change history if youre being honest you wouldnt

        • [Deactivated] on 30/08/2023 - 20:10

          Of course! Shared being the operative word when in a couple.

  • lonewolf on 30/08/2023 - 20:10
    +8

    You need to speak with people who have gone through this, You can get taken to the cleaners even if you bought it yourself, she doesnt contribute anything to the place and you dont get married. I got married and got taken to the cleaners, as most guys i know who have gone through divorces (with no kids like me) . But i also know guys who had a girlfriend living with them and when they broke up, she still went after their money even though the place was theirs, the guys paid for most living expenses , trips etc and still the girls got a couple of hundred K out of them (for being a girlfriend). Society is too unjust in this area and its very one sided. You can fight it but then you spend a lot of time and money with lawyers and courts etc. Otherwise you end up paying what she wants to fleece out of you.

  • mungas on 30/08/2023 - 20:24

    Establish a loan trust, you ‘gift’ the value of the property to the loan trust, and the loan trust lends it back to you with a registered mortgage over the property.

    Common asset protection strategy

    • HardQuiz on 30/08/2023 - 20:31

      This really works?

      • DogGunn on 30/08/2023 - 20:34
        +2

        No

      • mskeggs on 30/08/2023 - 20:50
        +5

        It can work against bankruptcy, but the family court can look through arrangements made to avoid settlements.
        In any case, OP has a deposit for a flat. Setting up a trust, working out exotic finance to include a trust arrangement will be costly to establish and maintain, and require an uncompetitive interest rate.

        It is a ‘maybe’ strategy if you had lots of wealth.

    • DogGunn on 30/08/2023 - 20:33
      +2

      Do you think the family court will just go, oh, it's in a trust controlled by the respondent, can't touch it?

      • mungas on 30/08/2023 - 20:51

        If you’re concerned that you’re considered a beneficiary (which is what I think you’re referring to), you don’t include yourself as an eligible beneficiary in the deed, and you also don't act as a trustee

        • DogGunn on 30/08/2023 - 22:29
          +1

          No, I'm responding to the fact that the court would simply look at how you're attempting to avoid any property adjustments and either set aside an instrument establishing the trust or making the real property part of the trust, or just consider the trust matrimonial property for adjustment.

  • shaybisc on 30/08/2023 - 20:29
    +2

    De facto is in effect part paying off the mortgage. The only thing she didn't contribute to is the deposit on the flat.

  • mskeggs on 30/08/2023 - 20:44
    +23

    Lots of wild stuff in this thread.
    Think of it this way. You don’t have a unit, you have a deposit and a big debt.
    If you live in a de facto relationship everything in that relationship is considered if there is a future property split.
    Who paid what. Who did more or less chores. Who did what with future kids. Who delayed their dreams to help the other reach theirs. Who helped with the other one’s sick relative. These are much broader issues than just who paid what.

    It would be hard to imagine a relationship where one partner came out as the major contributor in all dimensions, and even if it were the case, the other person could argue they had diminished capacity so it was only fair they contributed to their best.

    So my very strong suggestion to you is to either build a shared relationship together, where you both contribute financially and otherwise to make something bigger than you could do alone - or make it clear to your romantic interest that you aren’t interested in such a partnership and you will only continue romantically as individuals, and they will need to make suitable arrangements.

    If you say you want to be treated as an individual, but then your actions (offering a cheap deal on housing, providing caring and support, building a life together) show you did indeed rely on each other for more than a transactional relationship, then a future court will treat any property settlement through that lens.

    You will have a chance to show you contributed the deposit, but contributions from your partner towards housing (even if you call it ‘rent’) will likely be viewed as if they contributed to the mortgage. And you probably don’t want to pay tax on the income from their rent anyway.

    Basically, if you don’t want to be treated as a couple for a future property settlement, you need to not be a couple - there isn’t a way to ‘trick’ the court that can withstand the other party claiming against it. Anybody advocating for trusts or pre-nuptial arrangements is giving you advice only applicable in potentially retaining substantial wealth, if you brought that to a relationship. The deposit on a flat isn’t that. The legal fees to resolve a challenge would easily be more than just splitting it.

    If you are in a relationship you think will be a good one long term, invest in it and don’t get tied up in this kind of thinking. If you are in a relationship that you think might end in unpleasant disagreement in the short term, maybe buying a unit is the catalyst to think harder about that.

    • UFO on 30/08/2023 - 22:43
      +1

      good advice

    • lonewolf on 31/08/2023 - 13:04
      +2

      I agree with a lot of this but I do have to say in the current western society, I dont think its smart for guys to just go into it thinking this is a good long term relationship, It will be fine and not be smart about it. Because sadly the way it is, it is the guys that generally get screwed over if it does end, no matter what happened during or how it ended.

      I went into it think all that you wrote about and i came out completely scammed and partly because everyone kept telling me (the guy) to just go along with everything and think positive and be positive and it will work out. I just know too many guys who have been in this situation in the past 5 years or so.

      I do wonder what if the property is bought by his parents and its under their name but he gives his parents money every month and they use that to pay the loan? Is that property safe then?

    • Yarra Warrior on 01/09/2023 - 14:20
      -1

      These things are well said.
      In short, definitely OP must be prepared for what OP is doing as an intended arrangement. This is true for OP's case as the G/F contributes to the mortgage as a "rent" plus things that she has been doing for OP.
      Majority of the court's outcome exactly take these into consideration.

      Whether OP sees that fair or not, it does not change the outcome as it is simply how the Judges give their verdict within the Family law.

  • IM-Cheap on 30/08/2023 - 20:46
    +3

    Advice from a lawyer when we were doing our BFA (prenup) - get the other person to pay for groceries or other expenses but not rent or bills related to the property.

  • Logical on 30/08/2023 - 20:51
    +5

    Rent out the apartment you are buying yourself. Do no move into it at all. Get another place to rent together and share the rental costs with GF.

    • UFO on 30/08/2023 - 22:41
      +2

      Will still be asset. Will still need splitting later on. No getting around it, regardless of who's name its in.

      • Logical on 30/08/2023 - 23:26
        +2

        Asset of course. However, will be able to demonstrate ownership prior to any defacto relationship taking place. This is a great thing in the Court's eyes and will definitely assist OP in getting best security over the property.

  • nekro on 30/08/2023 - 20:52
    +5

    Better off banging hookers these days.

    • Trying2SaveABuck on 31/08/2023 - 09:27
      +4

      Better off banging hookers these days.

      has it ever not been?

    • Lunarboogie on 31/08/2023 - 10:23

      And cheaper that way. Probably more satisfying too.

  • dtc on 30/08/2023 - 21:26
    +8

    Its threads like these (and every time this issue is raised) that confirm at least 90% of people on the internet are quite happy to very confidently make assertions about things they know nothing about and yet they are also unwilling to spend any time researching beyond 'let me check my preconceived yet wholly uninformed bias and, yes, it agrees with me so I'll state it as fact'.

    • mehow on 31/08/2023 - 10:28

      oh really? I beg to differ. Alot of the 'assertions' are spot on from my experience

  • therooftop on 30/08/2023 - 21:46
    +4

    I hope op is getting lots of sex in exchange for half his property

  • AndyC1 on 30/08/2023 - 21:58
    +2

    Ask a lawyer as it can vary depending on allot of things.

    • SteveB00 on 31/08/2023 - 08:36
      +1

      *a lot

  • miwahni on 30/08/2023 - 22:04
    +2

    When looking at your assets in the event of a split, don't forget that your liabilities will also be taken into account. So say for example your unit is worth $600k but you have a $500k loan against it, then the $600k plus your cash plus her cash (her nest egg?) plus both your super accounts and any other asset values will be added up, then the loan $500k plus any other debts subtracted - even if she wins "50/50" it's only 50% of the equity, not of the entire asset value.
    If she's got any sense at all she won't want to go to court over it, as court costs can rapidly diminish anything in the pot (you'd need to have a quite high overall equity amount to make court costs justifiable) but will seek an consent agreement via solicitor. You can negotiate this.
    But of course if she has no sense at all then all bets are off.

    • trapper on 30/08/2023 - 22:16
      +3

      If she's got any sense at all she won't want to go to court over it, as court costs can rapidly diminish anything in the pot

      She has nothing to lose. If it came to that, it will be OP being forced to give away 50% or end up with even less after the lawyers take the majority.

      • UFO on 30/08/2023 - 22:40
        +2

        yep!

        She'll have nothing to lose by putting the squeeze on.
        She doesn't ask, she gets nothing.
        She asks and the lawyers get most of it, she still 'wins' knowing she's cost you money… and she still gets 'something'.

      • lonewolf on 31/08/2023 - 13:10
        +6

        yup, even though I paid for everything and supported my ex while she kept changing jobs or career paths, she ended up in some jobs making more than me and a new career path etc. When she left, she told me ( i think it came from her friends or maybe her), "Its my job to take as much from you as i can, and its your job to stop me". As she never contributed her share, My parents kept giving us cash to help me pay for the loan as well as cost of living etc. So not only did i lose a lot of money on the property, but also the new car that she took and i had no car. I also ended up losing cash from my parents.

        It was my fault, I shouldnt have let it happen like that, But part of the problem i kept coming across, is the whole society / people telling me, its fine if you put in more than her or that she doesnt put in what she said she would or pay the bill she said she would. You are together now so it all belongs to both of you and it may just take her more time to feel comfortable etc. Basically the vast majority of people / society still had the idea as i was the man, when it comes to finance, it was my job and duty to be providing even if she earned the same or more than me .

        So when she left (and we didnt have any major issues or arguments or fights, she got bored). she decided to take as much as she can as she was basically of the idea thats what she is supposed to do in a divorce. Again society / media or wherever she got that idea from.

        • OzBarAnon on 01/09/2023 - 12:09
          +2

          "We didn't have any major issues or arguments or fights, she got bored."
          Truly one of the most depressing things I've ever read.

          • lonewolf on 01/09/2023 - 17:45
            +2

            @OzBarAnon: It was my fault in terms of not knowing how to handle it, She always seemed aloof except for pushing to get married, buy a house, buy a car , go on holidays, basically money / status things. So I was always busy trying to get these things done to keep her happy. But i should have picked up on red flags, like how her friends sometimes used to joke that she gets easily bored with her boyfriends once she has them , and that was the catch. She seems keen when you start dating, comes after you hard, but once she had the "prize" the interest wanes ..

  • JIMB0 on 30/08/2023 - 22:22
    +2

    If you charge someone rent to share your property with you then you have to declare it as income and pay tax on it. Also the portion of your house that was rented out becomes subject to capital gains tax when you sell. The other option is a domestic arrangement where they are a friend or relative and give you an amount to cover expenses incurred (food, bills etc.) You're not meant to make a profit on this however you don't have to declare it.

    As others have said, with short term relationships of less than 5 years you generally leave with what you entered the relationship with. The rest is split based on contributions. Having children changes this completely as the children have needs that must be taken care of. Longer 10+ year relationships gets the entitlement closer to 50:50 no matter who contributed what. Lawyers are massively expensive and usually end up taking a large chunk.

  • jonathan111 on 30/08/2023 - 22:29
    +1

    Steve Harvey's wife reportedly demanded half of the comedian’s net worth after being caught cheat!ng on him.

    He is a famous relationship guru

    • Eeples on 31/08/2023 - 00:48

      I never knew Steve Harvey was a comedian.

  • UFO on 30/08/2023 - 22:38
    +3

    Hahaha… charging her "rent" isn't going to do anything mate. You'll be classed as a defacto relationship in every measure… and all she'll have to do is show she's contributed to the household (cooking, cleaning, supporting you/pets/hobbies whatever) and your goose will be cooked.

    Best to combine everything. Trying to separate it for just in cases isn't going to do diddly. Split it 50/50, all payments, all bills, everything.
    Trying to do it all on your own in the hopes of keeping it separate will be a mute point in a year or two when she and you are 'two peas in a pod' in the place.

    Prenups mean jack, there's no escaping the commitment you are making each other by living together.
    Even renting. The money you squirrel away while living together is also up for grabs if she can demonstrate that she's contributed to it (doesn't have to be monetary…. supporting you in making that money is enough).

    People have no clue on how little power you have once you live with someone in a relationship.

    • SteveB00 on 31/08/2023 - 08:40

      *moot point

  • screensaver on 30/08/2023 - 22:51

    Put a tenant in one place and then you and her buy a property together to pay off together

  • Some Human on 31/08/2023 - 00:56
    +4

    Something to keep in mind is you never truly know a person until money is involved and people these days are getting more and more selfish.

    You sort of have to weigh up whether being in a relationship is worth the risk of losing a chunk of what you've worked hard for.

  • Aerith-Waifu on 31/08/2023 - 01:30
    +2

    If you don't see her as marriage material, then you need to think about what you are going to be like in 11 months time.

    • SteveB00 on 31/08/2023 - 08:40
      +3

      48% of Australian marriages end in divorce.

  • TailsK on 31/08/2023 - 06:55

    Are you planning to break up?

  • tessel on 31/08/2023 - 07:19

    Yup, very good chance she could take half.

  • David 1969 on 31/08/2023 - 08:16
    +2

    If you're already thinking about "The End" at this point in the relationship, then your subconscious is already setting you up for that because you know deep down that it's not going to last.

    Anyone head over heels and content would NOT be thinking about this scenario………..

    End it now before you're a whole lot poorer…..sex is sex, love is love, and money is divided by courts when the sh*t hits the fan!!!!!

    • taradavey on 31/08/2023 - 09:48
      +1

      If OP wasnt considering worst case scenario that would be incredibly irresponsible when purchasing a major asset such as a home.

  • zacks on 31/08/2023 - 08:18

    Based on what you've described, she's already entitled to half of it. Cheaper to keep her. Other benefits with that too.

  • USER DC on 31/08/2023 - 08:26

    Welcome to another life chapter
    This makes me remind of that shorts video where husband tells her wife to pay rent because to her house was on rent but instead he was paying just having the house on his name.

  • Sinnerator on 31/08/2023 - 08:27

    you are worried about an asset worth between $500K to $1mil ???
    and you haven't gone to see a lawyer?
    in this case you get what you pay for

  • afah0447 on 31/08/2023 - 08:46
    +3

    Danger danger danger!

    Sirens, warning lights, explosions!

    You are setting yourself up to give her half your apartment if she leaves you for some other bloke.

    Get some legal advice fast before she wises up and realises she has options.

  • ipv6ready on 31/08/2023 - 08:58

    Get advice than talk with her.

    If you saved and paid for the deposit, mortgage payment goes out from you sole bank account, plus you dont have any joint bank accounts but having these thoughts….. Get yourself organised and have a discussion with your partner NOW.

    It would be reasonable for your partner to agree to a formal piece of paper as a rent payer, if the above is true.

    However if she is not agreeable now, it will turn ugly in two or three years down the road, if the relationship does turn sour.

    In two or three years time including the time already in relationship without a formal agreement you are considered married with common property, no ifs, no buts even if childless.

    Even now this talk might turn out little sad as this could sow a seed of doubt in the relationship leading to a break up but compared to trying to sort out a verbal agreement three or four years in to a relationship.

    In four five years time, if you went to court, your partner could say, "I thought we were going to get married, we were in a real relationship, I spent sooo many hours cleaning, preparing food and sacrificed XYZ for his/hers career" -> get ready for significant financial outlay, if your rebuttal is He/She is lying.

    Where as you have a formal agreement, and end up in court 5 years from now, the judge would more likely put limits and consider your partners contribution as more as a renter, even though your partner still have claim for some joint assets.

    • Protractor on 31/08/2023 - 10:43

      She's watching the thread and taking notes. There is no way to get ahead of the game, now……

  • dono2 on 31/08/2023 - 09:28
    +4

    Best way to protect yourself would be to put the place in one of your parents names you may have to pay stamp duty again though.

    Then on paper you have nothing to your name.

    • afah0447 on 31/08/2023 - 11:38
      +1

      I like this idea but it's a stingy indictment on the state of modern society.

      • matt-ozb on 01/09/2023 - 01:35

        But true and the OP can't change that

  • 82norm on 31/08/2023 - 09:40

    Have you spoken to her?

  • nizzkid on 31/08/2023 - 09:45
    -1

    In short, DON'T live there.
    DON'T have her go there for ANY reason.
    DON'T spend ANY money on it that you make during your relationship.

    • mskeggs on 01/09/2023 - 17:15

      What do you think this would achieve?

  • Jaxy on 31/08/2023 - 09:52
    -4

    Absolutely nothing, if you aren't married AND she did not have any sort of written agreement or paid into the purchase, she is entitled to nothing.

    • mehow on 31/08/2023 - 10:47
      +1

      yeah but if she thinks she is and challenges it, then it will cost an arm and aleg in legal fees.

      • Jaxy on 01/09/2023 - 02:39

        And he can counter sue for vexatious litigation or to recover his fees. Without a contract in play there is nothing she can claim, any lawyer who takes up her case is either hard up for business or just wasting their time.

  • HelpMeiCantSee on 31/08/2023 - 09:57
    +1

    If she’s nasty, legally she will be able to take half. The law is really poo in this regard.

    • dtc on 31/08/2023 - 10:27
      -1

      You are entirely wrong. The law doesnt say she will be able to take half, nasty or not. Why cant people do some very basic research; people have even posted links you can click on to minimise the effort you need to go to in order to inform yourself.

      I realise that spouting biased nonsense probably makes you feel better, but surely its embarrassing?

    • kingsville on 31/08/2023 - 18:08

      I do not think this is true.

      https://www.familyrelationships.gov.au/ is a useful resource

      For example: "When working out what is fair, the court will look at … direct financial contributions by each party to the relationship"

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