Billed for Kogan First Annual Membership Even Though Had No Payment Methods on File. T&Cs State There Are No Refunds for Annual

spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 06:36
Last edited 23/08/2023 - 12:31 by 1 other user

I was automatically billed $99 today for annual membership after free trial lapsed. Did not think to cancel at the time because, besides immediately losing benefits, on the membership page it states:
"You do not currently have a preferred payment method selected for your Kogan FIRST membership.
Add your preferred payment method to keep your Kogan FIRST benefits once your free trial ends.
We may charge another payment method on file if you do not add or select a preferred payment method in accordance to the Kogan FIRST terms and conditions.".

This is worded to sound like it would automatically cancel at the end of the free trial because I didn't save a payment method. If I didn't elect a payment method, it shouldn't be on file. But they billed me the annual fee using whatever they had from my sole purchase using the Kogan first trial for free shipping. But on the payment methods page I don't have anything saved, so I'm not sure how they would "charge another payment method on file". Seems very slimy from Ruslan Kogan's part

I sent a request to customer support to cancel and refund my membership but the worrying part is when you read the cancellation T&C's it says "If you cancel any time after signing up for a paid membership or converting from a free trial to a paid membership, you will not be refunded your membership fee regardless of whether you made any eligible purchases or have taken advantage of any Kogan FIRST benefits. You will continue to receive all Kogan FIRST benefits until the end of your Membership Period, but your membership will not be automatically renewed for a further Membership Period."

Anyone have thoughts on this?

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Comments

  • EightImmortals on 23/08/2023 - 07:19
    +1

    So how did they get your money if they didn't have any card on file?

    • Nugs on 23/08/2023 - 07:21
      +13

      Ruslan hackers
      .

      • mapax on 23/08/2023 - 07:38

        Lol. I actually chuckled out loud at that one.

    • EightImmortals on 23/08/2023 - 07:40
      +3

      Thanks to OP for updating the details.

      Looks like you're stuck with it.

      "I had one on file from my sole purchase using the Kogan first free trial for free shipping."
      "We may charge another payment method on file if you do not add or select a preferred payment method in accordance to the Kogan FIRST terms and conditions."

      Oh well, there you go.

  • prisonmike on 23/08/2023 - 07:22

    Magic of Kogan

  • djsweet on 23/08/2023 - 07:44
    +6

    You’ve been Koganed!

  • SmiTTy on 23/08/2023 - 07:54
    +1

    Thank u so much for reminding me to cancel my kogan first trial!! (sorry for your loss)

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 23/08/2023 - 07:58
    +2

    Might as well make use of the 1 year now to get your moneys worth…

  • JyeD on 23/08/2023 - 08:10
    +1

    I had a similar issue with Kogan automatically renewal.

    I signed up for the free trial to buy one thing so I didn’t have to pay for shipping. Went to go cancel afterward but it said that I was instantly going to lose benefits. But there was an option to ‘remind me to cancel 3 days before renewal date’, or something or other. So I selected that and remained a member.

    Fast forward to after the renewal date, I just randomly checked my transactions one day and saw that Kogan billed me for the membership. I went back through my emails and confirmed that I did not receive a reminder email to cancel.

    Que the customer contact. After explaining to Kogan customer support what had happened, they refused to refund me. Said it was in T&C’s. I basically didn’t take no as an answer and demanded to speak to a superior. Eventually they granted my wishes, refunded me my money and canceled my membership. But it was a bit of a battle.

    Not too sure how you will go with your case however, but good luck.

    • jv on 23/08/2023 - 09:49
      +3

      Why should they refund you?

      It was your mistake, not theirs.

      • DingoBilly on 23/08/2023 - 09:57
        +3

        JyeD was going to cancel but didn't predicated on the fact that Kogan would send them a reminder so they could make the decision later. By failing to send the reminder Kogan lapsed on their responsibility and JyeD would have cancelled it at the time rather than wait. So completely reasonable that Kogan should have to refund the money.

        • jv on 23/08/2023 - 10:00

          Kogan would send them a reminder

          Why would they send a reminder?

          It's pretty clear when you join how long the trial is….

          • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 10:46
            +3

            @jv: Because the person ticked the box saying they would be sent a reminder three days before the renewal was required and they weren’t sent the email.

            • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:07
              -3

              @try2bhelpful:

              Because the person ticked the box

              No they didn't

              • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 11:28
                +1

                @jv: “But there was an option to ‘remind me to cancel 3 days before renewal date’, or something or other. So I selected that and remained a member.”

                Yes they did.

  • Sinnerator on 23/08/2023 - 08:45
    +1

    Set reminders in your phone.
    You can do this for anything.

    • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 08:51
      -3

      the point was I purposefully didn't cancel because it didn't seem like they would charge me after the trial ended, and also because I would lose access to benefits if I did. I didn't have any payment methods saved when I checked, so i thought it would automatically cancel.

      "You do not currently have a preferred payment method selected for your Kogan FIRST membership.
      Add your preferred payment method to keep your Kogan FIRST benefits once your free trial ends.
      We may charge another payment method on file if you do not add or select a preferred payment method in accordance to the Kogan FIRST terms and conditions."

      • Baysew on 23/08/2023 - 09:15
        +2

        You have thought wrong, Kogan have advised what they will do and have done it. At least your benefits will continue. If you want to cancel a free trial, you have to do it before it expires.

        • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:05
          -1

          Yeah I know I tried to game it and it backfired. But in my defense it was worded to sound like it would cancel by itself because there were no saved payment methods. I didn't elect any payment method so they shouldn't hold it on file. But getting slapped the $99 without recourse to a change of mind refund is pretty bullshit IMO.
          No surprise all the usual snarky commenters come crawling out of their holes to defend Kogan's practices either.

          • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 11:07
            +1

            @spast1ka: If you feel you're entitled to recourse.. chargeback.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:09

            @spast1ka:

            But getting slapped the $99 without recourse

            You signed up for it.

            • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:11
              -1

              @jv: almost sounds like you work for Kogan judging from your comments on this post

              • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:12

                @spast1ka:

                almost sounds like you work for Kogan

                sounds like you work for Karen.

      • cookie2 on 23/08/2023 - 09:18
        +2

        I didn't think businesses were able to save payment information for later use, unless you agree to it. I thought they could only save enough to verify info if required. Use is 1 thing but storage is another matter. May be worth looking into further if you never agreed to the storage of your complete financial information.

        • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 10:50
          +3

          I agree that they shouldn’t hold your payment method unless you, explicitly, allow them to. This is how hackers get hold of personal details. I always delete card details from any account information so people can’t just use my card to order stuff. Yet another reason to avoid Kogan.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:10

            @try2bhelpful:

            unless you, explicitly, allow them to

            or unless they didn't remove it from their account…

            • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 11:30
              +1

              @jv: The OP explicitly stated they didn’t have a payment method nominated with their account.

          • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:30
            +2

            @try2bhelpful: I didn't have a payment method saved on file. But they still pulled it off the sole order on my account which had the payment method. Doesn't this imply that there's no way to actually remove your payment method from your account, short of deleting your account, and even then who knows?

      • jv on 23/08/2023 - 09:50
        +1

        the point was I purposefully didn't cancel

        Since you didn't cancel, I don't see why it is their problem…

        • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 11:35
          +2

          They didn’t cancel because they were letting the free trial run out. Any normal subscription service won’t just pluck a random account from your past history and apply that to a subscription. For a start the details might no longer be valid and using this might incur penalties for the subscriber. What this has done is reinforce the idea you never leave an open ended payment method on an account and what Kogan did was dodgy as hell. Personally I’m saying thanks for he heads up because I’m staying well away from them.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:37

            @try2bhelpful:

            Any normal subscription service won’t just pluck a random account

            It's not random.
            It was in their account.
            It was clear in the T&Cs that they would use a payment method from their account.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:38

            @try2bhelpful:

            the idea you never leave an open ended payment method

            Learn to read the T&Cs next time you make a purchase online.

            Some stores do it, others don't.

            You have a choice whether you go ahead and agree or not…

          • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:39
            +1

            @try2bhelpful: lol don't bother to argue with jv you will get a brain aneurysm >.<

            • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 12:26
              +2

              @spast1ka: Yeah I know. Migraine kicking in.

              Personally I think this whole thing shows a fault in these systems that should be remedied. A resubscription should require a nominated account on the personal details that can be removed. If there is no details the subscription lapses. Part of the problem with people being able to cancel subscription services is the organisations have an open ended credit card they can charge against. They will keep charging you whilst they argue you haven’t cancelled properly.

              I, generally, remove the autorenewals because they will, often, offer you a better deal when you get close to the end of your time.

              From what the OP has experienced Kogan is crossed off my list.

  • itsfuze on 23/08/2023 - 09:26
    +1

    I was once successful in getting a refund of Kogan First, but I caught it like five minutes after they charged me and went straight to email or live chat.

  • Duckie2hh on 23/08/2023 - 09:39
    +4

    TLDR

    I purposefully didn't cancel

  • DashCam AKA Rolts on 23/08/2023 - 10:38
    +2

    OP tried to scam Kogan, by not cancelling and thinking that Kogan didn't have any payment method to charge for ongoing member benefits.
    Narrator: But Kogan did.

  • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 10:59
    +2

    So… You read all the t&C's..but just assumed they did not apply to your special circumstances.

    Genius 🏅

    Username checks out…

  • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 11:07

    OP. Thanks for the reminder. I just deleted my Catch of the Day account because they won’t let you keep an account open without a payment method on file. Been meaning to do that for a while.

    • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:08

      you're welcome! hope people can learn from my blunder and wake up to these sneaky practices from Kogan and co

      • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:11

        these sneaky practices

        How is it sneaky? It is clear in the T&Cs when you join…

        • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:17
          +1

          by keeping a payment method on file Kogan can charge you whatever the hell they want. and even if you don't have a payment method saved like I did, they will scrounge around for the last payment method you used for an order.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:39

            @spast1ka:

            by keeping a payment method on file Kogan can charge you whatever the hell they want

            it says so when you make a purchase.

            many online stores do this…

          • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 11:48

            @spast1ka:

            last payment method you used

            So they did have an agreed saved payment method.

            Either don't provide one or use single use disposable cards…

            • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 11:52

              @randomusername2017: Won't go as far as to say it was agreed to be saved, just because it was used once. I didn't save any cards under Payment Methods. What if I only wanted to use it for that one purchase, or it was already over drafted and using it anymore would incur a penalty?

              But yes, will be more careful in the future and stick to Revolut virtual disposable cards.

              • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 11:56

                @spast1ka:

                Won't go as far as to say it was agreed

                Permission granted when you agreed to the t&c of that initial transaction. You would have needed to remove that card prior to commencing the trial.

                Future reference

                • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 12:01

                  @randomusername2017: That is exactly where I went and there were no saved cards in my account. They straight up used a payment method that had been used in the past, but wasn't saved in my Payment Methods.
                  In fact Kogan doesn't even require you to elect a payment method upon signing for the free trial. You can give it a try now and you will see what I mean

                  • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 12:13

                    @spast1ka:

                    That is exactly where I went

                    Screenshot that at the time?.. you might have a chance at chargeback if there was no method to remove saved payment.

                    used a payment method that had been used in the past

                    Unfortunately you agreed to that when initially providing the payment method.

        • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 11:41
          +1

          I know you just like to wind people up but this is a serious issue.

          Frankly I would be finding the relevant fraud authorities and reporting this. Kogan are holding details for a past payment method and using them inappropriately. They could argue that the T&Cs cover this but they should be a lot more explicit than this.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:43
            -2

            @try2bhelpful:

            this is a serious issue.

            The 'serious issue' is people not taking responsibility for their own actions and just blaming others.
            This is called the 'Dan Effect'.

            • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 12:33
              +1

              @jv: Ahhhh JV, why not surprised you would sideline to one if your hobby horses. However, this one is so lame we had to shoot it.

          • jv on 23/08/2023 - 11:44

            @try2bhelpful:

            I would be finding the relevant fraud authorities and reporting this.

            Go for it….

            Let us know how it turns out…

            • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 12:31

              @jv: Hopefully with a change in how these things are managed. It would only take an active resubscription rather than a passive one to fix this. If you withdraw the credit card the permission to charge it lapses.

              • jv on 23/08/2023 - 12:45

                @try2bhelpful:

                If you withdraw the credit card the permission to charge it lapses.

                Then you could just do a charge back… Problem solved.

                In this case though, it seems the OP did not withdraw their card from their account. They used it for a previous purchase and left it in the account.

                • try2bhelpful on 23/08/2023 - 12:54
                  +1

                  @jv: No the card was not listed under the account, it was Kogan that decided to charge against the card it had used previously. That is a different thing. However, to clarify the whole situation it would be better if the legal rules were changed so ongoing charges is not the default action. If you withdraw the payment method then the charging lapses. It will stop the whole debacle around things like gyms making it very difficult to cancel your membership.

                  • jv on 23/08/2023 - 13:05

                    @try2bhelpful:

                    No the card was not listed under the account

                    If they are sure about that, why don't they just do a charge back?

  • spast1ka on 23/08/2023 - 13:07

    Just a heads up, but Kogan's dodgy billing practices extends to their other offerings like Kogan Mobile. If you had tried one of their 30 Day prepaid starter sims, there is no option on the website to cancel it after the first month, and it will be a recurring debit. Their FAQs outline how to remove the stored payment method but you can't actually do it, the 'remove card' button is non existent so you have to call up customer service, who confirmed that this is indeed the case with all their 30 day starter packs. They designed it to entrap you into recurring billing by means of inconvenience.

    • randomusername2017 on 23/08/2023 - 13:27

      Sure there's no check box to disable autorenew?

      Been a few years but never had a problem disabling it that way.

  • freefall101 on 23/08/2023 - 13:23

    We may charge another payment method on file if you do not add or select a preferred payment method in accordance to the Kogan FIRST terms and conditions.

    That seems pretty straightforward to me…

    Anyway, this is why I tend not to use free trials and, if I do, I put a reminder in my calendar to make sure it's cancelled.

  • ankti231 on 23/08/2023 - 14:10

    They will refund you if you contact them. It's even one of their subject options because it happens so often.

  • CodeXD on 23/08/2023 - 14:12

    Did not think to cancel at the time

    We may charge another payment method on file if you do not add or select a preferred payment method in accordance to the Kogan FIRST terms and conditions.

    It sounds very clear cut and the fact that you knew about it and didn't cancel I would say the onus is on you.

    When you signed up, there is a clear T&C that after the trial period, you will be charged for the membership. The fact that you interpreted something wrongly, whether intentionally or not caused by Kogan's wording, does not resolve you out of that responsibility.

  • hongd on 05/09/2023 - 16:42

    I was once too successful in getting a refund of Kogan First.
    I noticed the charge the next day and called the customer care team to know there is "FIRST" membership (while I didn't really know what the charge was for).
    It was purchased along with a 365-day sim plan. It was ticked BY DEFAULT when the order as placed!
    The lesson tells me to place the order carefully.

  • Palindrome777 on 14/11/2023 - 12:40
    +1

    I read this post recently as I too had forgotten to cancel my free trial. I sent an email to customer service explaining my dilemma and how I really don't require a full year membership and surprisingly just received a reply through customer service that they have refunded me. I was not expecting a quick resolve if any so it's worth a shot if this happens to you also.

    ;Thanks for getting in touch.

    I understand that you want to cancel your membership and be refunded. Rest assured that this will be taken care of as soon as possible so there's nothing for you to worry about. Let me go ahead and make your day today.

    Don't worry I will do my best to help you throughout the process.

    I’ve gone ahead and cancelled your Kogan First membership, which will be refunded back to your original payment method.

    We’ll send you an email once your refund has been processed, just keep in mind that it may take 3-5 business days for the funds to show up in your account.

    Hope this helps!

    Please let me know if you require any further assistance, I'll be more than happy to help.

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