Hey fellas,
Was wondering you guys think about buying the GWM Haval Jolion or Ute for the long run. Toyota is just unjustifiably expensive and the queue is very long. I plan to keep the car for a while and since this is a relatively new Chinese company I was wondering what others thought of it. Would appreciate pros and cons from people who already have the car.
Bruv no one in their right mind will pay 51k for an MG. You are dreaming of you think you would get even quarter of what you bought it for if you try to sell it lol.
My dad bought a Haval H6 Hybrid and I am thoroughly impressed by it, I drive a Lexus RX 350h and have to say the Haval is great value, the Haval has more torque through the electric motors, stays in electric drive in more scenarios, and the interior design is done well, it doesn't feel cheap, it is also surprisingly quiet and the ride comfortable, obviously not as good as the Lexus which costs twice as much, but it's not far off either, certainly above average. If I was choosing between the Haval H6 Hybrid and a direct competitor like Rav4 Hybrid, I would be quite torn as the Haval drives and rides better, has more features for the money, but reliability remains to be seen, that's where Toyota is proven. I'd probably get the Haval.
Pro - 7 year unlimited km warranty, they are making a loss to saturate the market
Cons - It from Chyna…..CHYNNNA they are tracking you
After the first 5 services it gets expensive so maybe that's how they make up their loss
On all of these (chinese car threads) posts, people that have never even set foot in one bag them out and 99% of real world owners love them and say they are great?
I believe it is called "confirmation bias".
A purchaser is much less likely to show up their own error in making a bad purchase by shouting it out from the hilltops.
They are much more likely to keep quiet about it, or instead "confirm" the wisdom of their own purchase.
Accordingly, it is more difficult to get a true representation.
I don't think that applies to owners. It is very rare for someone to have dozens of problems and claim it is awesome. People are not afraid to write negative reviews. The confirmation bias applies to people who spit on other brands and everything negative confirms their view.
I only did one module of statistics at university as part of my degree in accounting/economics.
It was people far more qualified than me in the field of statistics to postulate the foundation of the premise that I just pointed to above.
Being lesser qualified than these people, with a much greater grounding in complex mathematics/statistical sampling than I do, I have a tendency to accept their guidance.
@Leadfoot6: If you were right reviews from customers would be meaningless, because they would be always positive. Yet they provide a lot of value, because they are not always positive.
I am not saying people never defend their bad purchase, but how often does it happen? I feel it does not happen that often. Feel free to link me a research that says otherwise.
I would even argue the opposite happens. The happy customers never write anything and only the unhappy do.
@Mistredo: "[…..]
It makes us feel good about ourselves
Another reason we sometimes show confirmation bias is that it protects our self-esteem.
No one likes feeling bad about themselves — and realizing that a belief we value is false can have this effect. Deeply held views often form our identities, so disproving them can sometimes be painful. We might even believe being wrong suggests we lack intelligence. As a result, we often look for information that supports rather than disproves our existing beliefs.2
This can also explain why confirmation bias extends to groups. In an influential 2002 peer-reviewed paper, clinical psychologist Harriet Lerner and political psychologist Phillip Tetlock posit that when we interact with others, we tend to adopt similar beliefs in order to better fit into the group.
They call this confirmatory thought, “a one-sided attempt to rationalize a particular point of view.” This is juxtaposed with exploratory thought, which entails “even-handed consideration of alternative points of view.”3 Confirmatory thought in interpersonal settings can produce “groupthink,” in which the desire for conformity in the group results in dysfunctional decision making. So, while confirmation bias is often an individual phenomenon, it can also take place in groups of people.
[…..]"
An understanding of such behaviour goes back a long way:
"How it all started
Confirmation bias was known to the ancient Greeks. It was written about by the classical historian Thucydides, who observed that people “entrust to careless hope” what they wish to be true. By contrast, they “use […] reason to thrust aside” what they do not wish to be true."
https://thedecisionlab.com/biases/confirmation-bias
Of course, higher resale values would suggest overall quality.
My experience in selling new and used cars for many years, amongst other information, suggest that resale values of Chinese made vehicles are located in an item of bathroom plumbing.
a belief we value
This is the important bit. Confirmation bias applies to beliefs and not purchases. Yeah, if somebody buys a Chinese car, because they believe Chinese cars are best, yeah, they will probably defend their belief, but most people buy stuff, because it is in their price range and matches their expectation. People who have beliefs and are emotional about cars don't buy cars in this segment.
Most Haval owners will tell you it is not the best car, but it is good enough for the price compared to other cars.
@Mistredo: "Confirmation bias applies to beliefs and not purchases."
I'm not sure that you are qualified to make such a bold statement.
Do you have a degree in statistics or allied field?
@Leadfoot6: What are you even arguing for? Are you trying to say everybody is biased and we shouldn't trust anyone?
Do you have a degree in statistics or allied field?
Do you? Not that it would matter, because confirmation bias is from psychology.
Its actually the other way around. You mostly wont be writing reviews if you are happy but will jump Up and down if you have smallest issues.
I remember thinking of complaining when my car manufacturer didnt provided the updated copy of user manual.. lol 😂
I'm not the one who has done the research on matters relating to confirmation bias.
These qualified people, statisticians and market researchers, are paid professionals in this area.
Unlike me, or you.
I defer to their judgement and research.
They publish papers on the topic.
Argue with them, not me.
I am merely pointing to their body of work.
Incorrect, A lot of Australians would say how it is doesn't matter if its free or a trillion buckeroos.
I have seen it and surprised you haven't
You, likewise , are arguing.
This is, or is supposed to be, a discussion forum, despite the fact that a number of my pertinent comments have been "hidden" due to "downvoting".
I have not experienced this process on other forums that I have been involved with.
I'm not sure what right is conferred on others to "downvote" comments, other than the rights of "mob rule".
I believe that this is a real weakness of how this site is operated.
(on reflection, this might be a programmed, or automated, function rather than being an actual decision by moderators but still needs review to promote fairness )
And no, my degree is in accounting/economics, where the concept of confirmation bias was introduced to me via my admittedly brief(only 1 module/semester/6 months) studies in statistics.
Accordingly, I rely on those more formally qualified in that field than myself to offer some guidance.
"I believe that this is a real weakness of how this site is operated." I may disagree with a lot of your content, but you nailed it there bruh.
Sweeping it under the carpet is the most Aussie thing on earth. We hate mirrors and introspection.
Can’t say for the long run but I own a 2022 Haval Jolion ask me anything you want to know
If you’re after a Ute and can’t wait, I’d suggest a Mitsubishi Triton.
If I recall, a number of these Chinese branded cars are precious Gen engine tech from GM and others.
Whilst not the same, friend’s LDV ute has mostly been good but has had electronics issues which needed to be fixed twice.
Mahindra S11.
Eaton diffs, Mahindra engine and gearbox. Good warranty.
If you are looking at a Hilux it's definitely a step down but it you are looking at 79 series probably on par or slightly better for comfort and features.
2.5T towing hurts a bit.
Half the price of a new Amarok. 😭
Just looked up Mahindra. Sounds like some indian shitbox worse than Chinese cars.
The market they seem to be slotting into is the 79 series. Not cutting edge, just reliable. Check the Facebook group, interesting reading as most owners seem suprisingly happy. Very few seconds hand (reflector of low sold numbers? or people very happy with them?).
I have looked through both L60 and S6, S10 and S11 and for a work ute any of the Mahindra look better than the LDV imo.
(Have not test driven any though)
I bought a Haval Jolion, I had to get a bigger car as we had a baby. I need a car quickly in July when he was born.
Had it 9 months, review:
Has all the tech you will need, decent size especially in the back. Cheap for what you get
Cons.
Lacks oomph, especially going up hills. The lane keep assist is annoying but you can just turn it off.
Would I buy it again if everything else was available, maybe not. I'd defo check out the mid level hybrid as I think it would solve the under power issue
I'm sorry you had to buy one. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Haval is like the condom of cars. You drive it once, then drop it off at the wrecking yard. If you use it twice you will probably end up with issues.
I'm seeing the same ill advise when the Korean car landed in Australia, likewise when the Japanese car into the Australian markets. Back than we still have Ford and Holden to choose from but now it is not the case. Whether you like it or not time have change and there isn't many choice as before.
While yes, I see that in the future these car brands will feature heavily, and the quality will get there. Like Japan and Korean cars it took a number of generations to become what they are today
We bought a Haval H6 Ultra awe back in May/June 2022. So far it has been amazing.
I drive BMW X6 and we sold my partners car and went with the Haval. The haval has more feature set than my bummer.
It does feel premium driving. The only set back is the acceleration and turbo takes a little to kick in. But on the mechanical side we haven't had a single issue.
Lol premium. Right.
You know how stupid you look when you just keep bagging out a brand with no context….
Tell us all where did GWM hurt you?
Don't take it out on me that you made a poor choice and bought a car that is unreliable and screams cheap arse whenever someone sees it mate.
@jatbinks: Haha I'm really not concerned about how others perceive mine or my wife's car.
I'm not that insecure. You'll be alot happier once you learn that no one gives a shit how much money you have or what you own.
@creesy: You obviously do otherwise you wouldn't be going off at some random person on the internet for having an opinion. Lol.
@jatbinks: Not at all was trying to gauge what your bad experience with haval or GWM was?
Most people are just of the "CHINa BAd" camp
Saw it all years ago with Kia and before that Hyundai.
Also the cheap arse comment the car I bought my wife from haval was priced similarly to other cars I looked at from other manufacturers (ie. Was only 6k less than the top specced X-Trail). Ultimately the choice was made based on wait times for vehicles, had a baby due and couldn't wait.
If something costs close to the same as something else from another manufacturer am I still a cheap arse. I don't get it
I have a aug 2021 built haval h6 ultra and have nearly clocked up 30000 km. Not one problem the whole time. Lovely to drive and spacious for the family.
I had a brand new 2019 GWM Steed for two years. I did nothing but sealed road driving and once went on a dirt road.
The DPF would go off every like forth trip even if it was a long one. Super annoying as you had to do a sequence to burn it off for 20 mins. If you were in a hurry, better off catching public transport and leaving it in limp mode until you got back…
The car started to rust while I owned it, which was very unfortunate the dealer stated “external factors” which was rain water and the occasional wash it had… The cars quality or rather lack of quality can’t stand our east coast…
GWM did sweet FA, getting in contact with this was impossible, no dealer wouldn’t hand me the info. The website numbers went to roadside assistance. Contact forms went unread.
I have to contact fair trading to get a response from them… And when I did hear from them my god were they not only difficult they were rude to boot..
I ended up selling for more than I bought it, go figure, to a dealer. I kind of wish I kept it to see what would have happened with fair trading..
They are trash, legit trash. Same as LDV do a quick google and have a look at the story about LDV and the lifeguard…
I dunno about haval they might be great, but not sure if it's justifiable to say that Toyota are unjustifiably expensive, especially when it comes to their diesel vehicles. I've had a 80s land cruiser, 79, a Hilux and a fortuner in my family. The first three got over 800,000kms before being sold and never had any major issues. The forty is newish so can't comment yet except 235000k in and no issues.
Had friends with tritons with constant issues. Navs seen ok though, and dmax.
I'd stay away. The infotainment software is buggy and makes it useless half the time. GWM are unhelpful and not able to fix the issues for over six months for a brand new car. Not worth it.. I shouldve got MG probably works better than this rubbish
You seriously expect MG to be any different? They are both bottom of the ladder due to pricing
If your biggest gripe is the infotainment then MG isn't gonna help- that's the most often mentioned issue in people who have one… unless Haval doesn't have Android Auto or Apple Carplay you can use instead (hence infotainment issues not really a dealbreaker). Other biggest complaint is that the "feel cheap"… but that's probably cause they are cheap. In fact some of the issues mentioned in this thread (overactive lane keep, "feeling cheap") are true of MG as well. Its also true that occasionally a person will write about a lemon in both brands.
I own a H6GT and I'm happy with it. Bought of for the wife to replace a 2 door Toyota when our baby was born.
Excellent car service from haval is great nothing has broken or failed to operate as it should. Sure some cheap materials are used here and there but I couldn't justify the extra $12k for the equivalent specced Kia or Hyundai.
People are a bit scared of brands they don't know….think xaiomi many years ago.
Haval manufacture and sell a rediculous amount of cars in china yearly.
But then again I'm not part of the ozbargain elite. Maybe I should have bought the Lamborghini Urus.
So I have personal experience with the Cannon.
I bought it when it was first released into the Australian Markets at got the Cannon L - for $37K.
I had a few issues along the road and tbh it wasn’t that bad at all. The car is a little underpowered compared to a Ford Ranger but again, half the price.
Initially all the accessories were from AliExpress but now a lot of locals are importing and selling. Savagetech seems to be the biggest ones.
People are taking them off road and no issues. The fuel economy wasn’t bad and overall premium Ute for the price and tech.
I managed to drive 50K Kms in the first year so that was a good usage for me. Capped price serving helped and then parts became available more readily so you can service it yourself.
I had an issue with the seatbelt but on the wrong way and it was replaced under warranty, managed to hit a bollard and needed to replaced the door and front side panel, parts took over a month to come but were repaired.
Drove another 20k Kms and thought I don’t really need a Ute as work was giving me one, so I decided to sell it and still managed to get $26K for it privately and plenty of interest as in the same price range you get 10-12 year old hiluxs with 300k Kms.
You get a lot of people saying it’s Chinese and crap but for the price you pay it was perfect. Any questions reach out
Do they still have asbestos gaskets?
I've got the gwm ute. Engine is smaller. It's got a 3 tonne towing capacity less than the 3.5, I don't plan to tow and don't even have a tow bar. Happy with my ute
Hi OP,
2 of my friends bought the H6 about a year ago and no complaints. Car is quite conformable and is more than suitable if you intend to drive it for 10 years and don't expect resale value. It's hard to change OzB bros opinions since this forum has only seen posts about complaints and good news stories are generally not reported.
Appreciate the comment but 1 year isnt really a significant amount of time
Had to drive one once for work absolute piece of garbage
I bought a brand new Great Wall X200 back in 2014 for $22k. Fort he first six years, I had absolutely no issues (apart from the weak acceleration which was common for that car).
In 2021, it began stalling when accelerating from a stop, and when it did start, the acceleration was even weaker than usual.
Had it towed to my mechanic who fixed it for $1.5k, and told me the timing belt would need to be replaced within the next 6 months, which would cost another $2.5k.
I never fixed the timing belt and traded it in for $5.5k.
I personally would not buy a Great Wall/GWM again any time soon, especially if you are looking to keep the car for an extended period of time.
Thanks
timing belt needs replaced in many cars, How many kms did you do on it?
It was between 60k - 70k km.
The best car I have ever had, I had toyota corolla then BMW X1 then Subaru outback. What was the worst? Subaru outback.
I recently purchased a MG ZS EV. Paid 47k for the top of the range after government rebates. It only has 320KM range (Realistically around 270km - 280km) and i am very happy with it. It has gone up in price recently to 51k and the long range version (440km so same as a base Model 3) just came out but that is 59k.