Returning from Parental Leave - Flexible Working Arrangement

Lfloretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:02
Last edited 06/02/2023 - 01:03

I am due to return to work after having a baby. I have requested to work part-time and have more WFH option. My boss informed me that the nature of my work (Project Management) is not suitable for part time. Feeling disappointed, I suggested reduced hours for Mon - Fri. He said he could accommodate that, but will put me under contract (which means I will pay my own super, no work cover etc.) I felt gutted when he said that because at that moment, it seemed like I have just been made a contractor and is no longer 'part of the company'. He assured me that nothing changed, but I am not too sure. He even mentioned that he will put in a clause to give 4 weeks notice if I were to leave under this contract arrangement. To me, it means that I will no longer get a promotion, yearly increment, work cover, etc. I really do not want to be a contractor. But I feel that I do not have a choice. Finding another job as part timer will be even harder.

Edit: Also, I do attend site, client meetings etc. No work cover seems very risky! Do I need to purchase my own insurance?

Honestly, I don't know what I'm asking. Just feeling disappointed and unsupported in my transition back to work. I have a toddler and a baby under 1. Part time arrangement (I.e 3 days per week or max 4 days) will be best.

Perhaps it is time for a change of career? Any advice?

Education & Work

Comments

  • Bafranz on 05/02/2023 - 22:03
    +9

    Think twice before you sign

  • Hybroid on 05/02/2023 - 22:07
    +6

    It's very very very very very very common for people that just had a baby (12 month maternity leave) to come back to work 4 days a week. Speak to your HR department if you have one. It's a non-issue whatsoever for Project Managers. You just have to work a tad harder during the week to keep up. Your manager sucks.

  • MS Paint on 05/02/2023 - 22:12
    +2

    Not totally relevant, but how long have you worked for this company?

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:25

      Slightly more than 1 year prior to taking leave

  • AndyC1 on 05/02/2023 - 22:16
    +7

    You will loose all of your long service, sick leave and redundancy entitlements if you sign up as a contractor. The contract should be about 30% more pay to cover the insurance, holiday pay, sick leave etc etc.

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:23

      Thank you for the % that way, I can work out the hourly rate. I am not keen to be a contractor, but it seems like it might head that way.

  • SS625 on 05/02/2023 - 22:16
    +3

    sounds like a small company, if you dont really like the company anyway just look for a new one, market is pretty hot right now i think

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:22
      -2

      I like my role, my boss is lovely. But because it is a small company, he is probanly trying to protect his business. I tried looking elsewhere. Part time roles are almost non-existant sadly.

      • SS625 on 05/02/2023 - 22:28
        +1

        yea make sense for a small company to not allow part time etc. I only work for big public company and part time after parental leave is a common thing

  • original15 on 05/02/2023 - 22:17

    Wouldn’t be rushing to sign the shift to contractor.
    How long have you been with this employer? Is your boss the owner?

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:20

      Yes, small company. Just me and him previously. Now we have a colleague that took over when i went on parental leave. I've worked there more than a year before going on parental leave

  • Rhys925 on 05/02/2023 - 22:27
    +1

    A lot of alarm bells here. I'd be seeking advice about your rights from whatever government fair work agencies are available in your state.

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:31

      I am in Victoria. I have checked Fair Work. It states that I have the right to request. And employer has to respond in 21 days. But they do have grounds for refusal if it affects their business/ too hard to accomodate.

      • jjjaar on 05/02/2023 - 22:37

        Is anyone else in the organisation working part time in any arrangement (either fewer days, or reduced hours across 5 days, or changing/flexiblility week to week)? If so, are any of them in similar roles to you?

        If others are able to do it, then they can obviously make it work and it’s not too hard to accomodate.

        If nobody else is doing it, then it might not be possible.

  • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:42

    No one else. The colleague who took over my role is doing full-time and very limited WFH arrangement.

    We handle our own projects so my boss is saying that no one else will know what is happening on the day that I don't work. I.e if anyone wants to reach me and I am not available. Therefore, I must work Mon to Fri.

    • jjjaar on 05/02/2023 - 22:46
      +1

      Hmmm makes it tricky. Can you be “on call”? How often does someone need to reach you throughout the week?

      I would try sell it as a “we can do a trial run and see how it goes before working a new contract. If it works, this would be a great selling point for new staff, to have more flexible work.”

      • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 22:50

        It is tricky. I love my role. He is a good boss - but he is just trying to protect his business, I am sure. I suggested trial run, and that is also when he thinks contract will work best. That way, I can do as many hours, or as little as I can. I think being on-call will just mean that I end up working that day! How do we track the additional hours I put in on my off days?

  • Quantumcat on 05/02/2023 - 22:51
    +2

    What about working in the office some hours and from home some hours? But try to get your work done while you're in the office and just be available for people to message when you're at home. So you have your phone nearby but you basically spend your time with your kids. Eg you could work 8-12 in the office and 1-5 at home.

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:04
      +1

      That is most likely what will happen. Not to mention the travel time of 55 minutes one way… Also means that I will need to put both kids to childcare every day (not saving on childcare fees). It feels that I might as well work full time!

      • Quantumcat on 05/02/2023 - 23:08

        In that case - would he agree to let you work from home one day a week? You could again try to get everything done in the 4 days at the office and only have your phone available to respond to emails and messages.

        It would be funny if he agrees because he'll end up paying you 25% more and you'll only be doing a tiny bit more work than you would have if allowed to work part time.

        • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:23
          +1

          Yes, that is what the current discussion is at. Mon to Friday at reduced hours. Can probably WFH but not confirmed yet as there were too many floating suggestions during that meeting. Haha, I still need to do equavalent or almost equalavent amount of work as full time, as projects still needs to run. Basically, I need to work faster to get more done in less hours. I like your suggestions. Thank you!

      • TimOfEastBNE on 06/02/2023 - 09:29
        +2

        Seems like your WFH means you want to care for 2 x pre school aged children. That's not WFH, that's getting paid to look after children. Children that age need a lot of attention. I'm not surprised your boss doesn't like the idea, they are awake to it. Would you think they would be happy for you to just bring the children into the office every day? No? So you can't just have them at home and say you're working from home

        • Quantumcat on 06/02/2023 - 09:54

          OP would like to work part-time but isn't allowed because they need to be able to answer questions every day. It is a good compromise to try and get 5 days worth of work done in 4 days, then not try to get work done while looking after kids but be available to answer questions on the fifth day like the boss needs.

        • floretlw on 07/02/2023 - 00:59
          +1

          I guess you have assumed! I have never intended to have the little ones at home with me if I am working. That is why my preference is for 4 days of compressed hours work so on the 5th day I can catch up on domestic work. Kids will be going to childcare full time.

          • TimOfEastBNE on 07/02/2023 - 12:30
            -1

            @floretlw:

            Also means that I will need to put both kids to childcare every day

            I didn't assume, you said that going into the office meant that you had to put them in child care, the corollary being that you have the kids with you when at home. If you can fob off the kids to family when working from home, then why not fob them off when going to office?

            • floretlw on 07/02/2023 - 22:39
              +1

              @TimOfEastBNE: I don't have family here to watch the kids. If I can get 3 days part time work, then I will have the opportunity to spend 1 day with the kids and 1 day catching up on errands. If 4 days, then kids will be at childcare everyday. But at this stage, if I work compressed hours for all 5 days, I might as well just work full time 🤣. I guess I have come to a conclusion that I will need to change to a different role to be able to work part time.

  • onetwothreefour on 05/02/2023 - 23:11
    +4

    I can see it from the employers point of view.

    They recruited you for a full time position, trained you up then after 12 months you took some (assuming 12 months) maternity leave now you don't want to work full time anymore and the boss is the bad guy?

    • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:18
      +1

      I never say that my boss being the bad guy. I said he is a good boss (see my previous comments to others). I applied for 12 months paternity leave but is requesting to return at 7 months. Which he rejected and wants me to start after 12 months.

      • AustriaBargain on 05/02/2023 - 23:23

        So is this contract arrangement just for five months before you go back to regular work? Will you be available for regular full-time project management work in five months time? This sounds like a good compromise, doesn't sound like he's obliged to offer you any work for the next five months. This will keep you in the loop. In the future you may even find consulting by contract work suits you and makes you more money than you would as an employee.

        • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:32

          Actually, no.. He wants me to wait for my full 12 months leave and contract work is indefinite / ongoing even if i decide to do full-time next time.

          • AustriaBargain on 05/02/2023 - 23:41

            @floretlw: Well would it suit you? Are you good at selling yourself, do you really need the security of a full-time job. Instead of asking for raises you'd be telling people what you are worth.

            • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:52

              @AustriaBargain: Hmm… it is something that I have not considered. I've always been employed. We talked about equity in the business before but that is yet to come.

              What does it mean in terms of Clients? Will it be a conflict of interest if I get Clients on my own? He mentioned that he will put in clauses that says I need to give appropriate notice to leave even on contract, should i choose to leave in the future.

              • AustriaBargain on 06/02/2023 - 00:31

                @floretlw: You could see how this goes with your current boss/client. I bet for some people being a contractor can be very enriching. We usually hear about it in terms of shafting people out of benefits, but I bet there's loads of people working as contractors who are making more money than they ever would being a loyal employee. If you know you have the skills and experience, and the potential clients know it too, you might find they will come to you with offers, they would be trying to convince you to work for them instead of you convincing them like a normal job interview. I don't know how you would get the word out there. I guess at least you'd need good LinkedIn game.

      • onetwothreefour on 05/02/2023 - 23:51

        I never say that my boss being the bad guy.

        Well you did say you was disappointed and felt unsupported coming back to work.

        Did they have to get a contractor in for 12 months while you were on leave? Maybe that's why they don't want you to come back after 7 months.

        • floretlw on 05/02/2023 - 23:55

          Yes, I do feel disappointed that flexibility is not as what I'd like. That does not mean that my boss is a bad guy. I respect him for doing what is needed for the business - I just wish that things are different for me. He hired a full time to replace me. I think he just needed to get more projects to sustain 2 full-timers. Which explains why he thinks contract work will lessen his liability and overhead cost.

    • ozbargainer888 on 06/02/2023 - 18:57
      +1

      She stated many times she likes her boss. Also this is legislation - she has a right to 12 months of parental leave and then can request part time which he has offered a different arrangement in which she loses some benefits. She was only asking about options. People take all types of leave - it’s life mate.

  • AngoraFish on 06/02/2023 - 00:27
    +1

    I get that you like your current company, but seriously, have a look at local government. LGAs are crying out for decent project managers and local government is much more accommodating of flexible working arrangements than the private sector.

    There's also a huge amount of work in 'Big Build' state government work. Check the development area corporates too, like Stockland, Lend Lease, Denis Family Corporation and others. It's worth sending your resume around on spec and poking people on LinkedIn. There is no universe where a decent project manager should be struggling to find a four day a week job.

    Honestly, I don't think that either your boss or your company sounds that good in comparison to lots of others. Decent project managers are in super-high demand at the moment. Organizations will make sacrifices to bring good people on board. It's time to look around. 4 days a week is genuinely not a huge ask.

    Apply for jobs advertised as 'full time'. 4 days a week is enough to put a hat into the ring for those jobs.

  • TheMindsetTraveller on 06/02/2023 - 07:10

    I was in a similar position - had some time off in 2022 - and asked if there was any flexibility coming back. The new manager said either come back FT and resign. My previous manager would have said 'we would love to support your choices, how can we make it work?".

    Naturally, I left. It is a workers' market out there. Take a chance and find a new job if the current one won't support you 100%.

  • prisonmike on 06/02/2023 - 09:48
    +1

    Contract rates are usually higher than those on the permanent position. Get your employer to get you on the contract rates which should be inclusive of your super, work cover, leave entitlements etc.

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 06/02/2023 - 10:21
    -2

    Don't lose your entitlements or forgo your rights.

    Suggest going back full time, after a week say it's not working and you need flexible hours - onus is on the employer from there. You'll be in a stronger position that now.

    Very common situation sadly.

  • JimmyF on 06/02/2023 - 10:44
    +1

    No work cover seems very risky! Do I need to purchase my own insurance?

    You'll still have work cover, but I find it odd that you have raised this like 3 times. Are you planning to 'use' it?

    Also are you confusing work cover with P&I insurance? I've contacted lots and always had work cover, but had to supply my own P&I insurance.

    Honestly, I don't know what I'm asking. Just feeling disappointed and unsupported in my transition back to work. I have a toddler and a baby under 1. Part time arrangement (I.e 3 days per week or max 4 days) will be best.

    While it is disappointing, the work place doesn't have to adjust the job to suit the employees requirements. Your PM role is a 5 day a week job, they just can't make it a 3 day a week job because you want it. As you said, you had only been there 1 year before taking parental leave.

    • floretlw on 07/02/2023 - 01:03

      I was taken aback when my boss mentioned about work cover and how it is expensive. He isn't willing to pay for additional work cover someone who is doing part time as the cost is the same for someone working full time. Just wondering if this is something I will need to get on my own, if I were to accept his offer.

      • JimmyF on 07/02/2023 - 09:28

        You'll have work cover, this is a employer paid thing, not an employee paid thing.

        Employers must have WorkCover insurance if they:

        • employ workers in Victoria; and
        • expect to pay more than $7,500 in wages and benefits in the next financial year
        • floretlw on 07/02/2023 - 22:44

          That is why he is leaning towards contract - I will no longer be employed by the company. I will be a contractor with my own ABN. Therefore saving the cost of work cover from his point of view.

  • Donaldhump on 06/02/2023 - 11:01
    +1

    no deal.

    lose security, pending LSL

    red flags in my eyes, they are essentially asking you to quit, and resign as a contractor. i'd demand 30% more pay

    • Drakesy on 06/02/2023 - 14:50

      OP is requesting a change to their own contract though, the business does have recourse.

      A worker on restricted hours no longer can undertake the same amount of work previously - hence a change to contract.

      If i was the OP i'd request a transition to another department that doesn't handle Project management - somewhere where you can work at your own pace. Or possibly another workplace - the market is great right now.

      Part time work and project management tend to not go hand in hand.

      • Donaldhump on 06/02/2023 - 15:50

        whole things smells, pretty unreasonable work place to not consider a 4 day week, feel like they are trying to trick person into quitting and discharging liability like LSL / potential redundancy.

        • Drakesy on 06/02/2023 - 18:44

          I mean it is rough.

          But from the business' perspective i've seen people come back to restricted hours and try to do the same job under part time hours and it just never worked.

          The person who came back from mat leave never got ahead of their workload and fell further behind (as they were doing 4 day restricted hours for what was unequivocally a full time job)
          If the company was to take away their workload then they'd need to

          a) Increase the workload on their employees (a bit unfair burdening other workers because someone had a baby)
          b) Take on a new part time contractor to take on the workload, extremely inefficient and never really works in theory.

  • freefall101 on 06/02/2023 - 11:04

    Any other companies (particularly larger ones) you'd like to work for? I'd call around and have a chat with them and some recruiters, places don't advertise part time/reduced hours but are often very willing to accomodate them. Particularly with the current lack of employees.

    Depends what kind of projects though. IT has seen a big drop off in terms of ads, I think hiring is drying up there a bit and likely signals job cuts to come.

  • Drakesy on 06/02/2023 - 11:30
    +1

    I'm sorry but project managers do have to be in the office.
    I'm one and you can't effectively run a project from home on restricted hours.
    We had part time project managers, if the project went tits up on a day they weren't in the whole thing would grind to a halt.

    But it would come down to the nature of the projects i guess.

  • particle on 06/02/2023 - 12:22
    +2

    You are right in being concerned about signing for this change. Going from full time to contractor is a huge risk to you - a reason a company switches a person from full time to contractor is to easily terminate them without making them redundant.

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