Why Is US Return Policy for Stores So Much More Relaxed than Here?

PuntyBrah on 03/11/2022 - 12:15
Last edited 03/11/2022 - 12:28

First of all, I'm not born here, had always thought that Aus would be similar to US or other first world countries when it comes to consumer rights and freedom.

I'm geniune curious as to why there is such a huge difference to shopping experience here to US.

I'm sure everyone has experience shopping around and choosing between products, searching online and having some guy on the internet telling you to just buy both and return the one you don't like. That guy is most likely from the US, and you'd reply that you can't do that here…

What's the story behind this? why can't we have a more relax return policy from retailers? (or am I not shopping at the right store?)

As far as I know, change of mind returns mostly apply to unopened items in original packaging, I can't tell if I like a TV or speaker if I haven't tested them out…

General Discussion

Comments

    • Grazz989 on 06/11/2022 - 12:55

      This 100%.

      There's a reason why larger companies are easier to deal with here in straya and that's simply because they're more likely to actually have ACCC complaints reach them, which normally never happens.

      I've written to the ACCC before about a clear breach by a smaller Aussie company and gave full details, they just sent a copy/paste standard email outlining our rights. The same rights I just complained were breached. They did nothing about it.

      If the rights aren't enforced then they don't exist. Everyone brags about how strong our laws are here, but when you're arguing with Mr. Zheng about the laptop you bought in his small business computer store - he's going to do the minimum for you he can get away with, and he can get away with doing very little indeed!

      • Ramrunner on 06/11/2022 - 14:36

        Hm. Not sure I agree. I run a small computer store and our cusotmers are our biggest asset. Hence we bend over backwards if there are any problem (thankfully not often)

        HOWEVER

        Change of mind returns are something we don't do very often simple because once the box is opened we cannot sell it as new and with margings as low as 5-10% we then lose money on the item. Distributors and manufacturers certainly do not take any items back from us that have been opened so selling them as used is our only option.

        We simply cannot afford to do that often. I personally think we shouldn't have to either. If I buy a car and run it for a couple of weeks or a month and decided I'd rather have something else, unless there is something wrong with the car I can't return it. It's my own fault for picking the wrong car.

        There's reasons small shops like myself struggle to do change of mind returns and it's simply because we want to stay in business. Believe me it's not to get rich, although I wish I could.

        • Grazz989 on 06/11/2022 - 14:50
          +1

          My friend, I'm not talking about voluntary change of mind returns, I was commenting directly on "little action is taken against stores who ignore consumer rights or mislead customers about guarantees and who to contact and there's a general public attitude of 'suck it up and don't complain' if consumers get screwed over".

          I'm sure you're a paragon of moral excellence yourself, but in my experience small stores - especially but not limited to those run by first generation immigrants that aren't familiar with our culture and/or laws, will scrape for every penny and have an unspoken excuse that if they're cheaper than the competition then you deserve what you get and certainly not a refund or replacement if you get screwed over. Just look at MSY - except they got big enough to get caught doing it.

          As an example, I took a laptop to get a power jack resoldered into my local (Chinese-family run) PC store. I even brought in the laptop fully disassembled and told them it was fine to leave it disassembled, I'd do the rest of the job myself. They quoted me $80, which I thought was … acceptable for <30 minutes work. Took em 2 weeks to get it back to me, and it only worked for 2 weeks. Took it back and they tried to tell me that they won't do anything about it because the warranty on their work is only 1 month - Then tried to style it as them doing me a friendly favour when I pointed out it was still under warranty then. The exact same thing happened with the second 'fix' - Turns out they only soldiered the electrical connection, not the two tabs on the side which actually secure it to the board. Had to argue with them for several hours stretched over 3 days with half the greedy, scumsucking family over there to get a full refund, they kept offering me half refund as if that was being generous. They didn't know or give a (profanity) about consumer laws man, they just cared that I'd leave a bad google review!

  • hasher22 on 04/11/2022 - 14:16
    -1

    One factor is that America is pure capitalism, without goods and services their economy would fail instantly.

    Their main focus is to sell as many goods to consumers as possible, in return, their return policy is much more lenient to keep customers happy and to come back.

    On a macro scale, why does Amazon accept returns so easily? Cause they still turn a huge profit from the same customer.

    Prob that's why Bunnings is killing it, cause their return policy is crazy good. They don't care if you return something opened or months later, they know they have a large market share to accept such returns.

    It's all reinforcement passive perspective over time. You know a store has a change of mind returns policy so you tend to buy there more often knowing you can take it back without hassle.

    Why would I buy from mitre 10 when I can buy from Bunnings knowing if something goes wrong, mitre 10 will prob ask me to contact the manufacturer, send it off for assessment etc…. Where Bunnings would just replace it on the spot. Which happened to my paint sprayer that died after 4 months of use. The Bunnings rep said "I can't test it due to safety reasons, so we trust you that it's faulty" and I got a new one on the spot. I was expecting them to test it and make sure the exchange is legit.

    Smaller stores, not so much.

    • jcsteadman on 04/11/2022 - 16:48
      +2

      What the heck are you on about lol.

      You're talking about the country like it's a single firm.

      • Firstly, there's no such things as a 'pure capitalism' economy.
      • Secondly, all economies would fail without goods and services in the modern sense - you'd be back to an agrarian society.
      • Thirdly, your implication that America's GDP is purely goods and services is ridiculous - they have a strong manufacturing base, maybe the 4th or 5th largest addition to their GPD.

      You're somewhat right in that, from a business management perspective, the reason returns are so easily accepted is because the return rate and associated costs is far lower than the gain from new and repeat trade. That's because they have a significantly larger population than us at 300-odd million so scale economies are much easier to reach.

      Bunnings built their business off of intense price wars and very clever unit economics, not really to do with their returns policy. However, it very much is a factor now in keeping return business, as you've mentioned.

      • saltysalt on 05/11/2022 - 22:24
        -1

        Nar yeah, America does take capitalism to a whole new level. It's pretty damn close to 'pure' capitalism and it's certainly unchecked.

  • kator on 04/11/2022 - 14:50

    ^^^ I was too slow with my comment.

    There was basically no return policy in Europe when I moved here 10 years ago.

    In my opinion this is just part of the capitalism and consumerism. I have noticed that I buy more as there is no risk. I just return what I don't need (but end up keeping a lot of small stuff).

    Also 10 years ago we checked the items in store (TV, shoes) and then went home and bought it online for a cheaper price. You didn't really buy unknown things.

    Now there are a lot more products on the market, brick and mortar stores cannot keep up with the variety. Nowadays, all you see is “not in stock” or you cannot buy what you want in store only online. Then you buy online without testing and end up wanting to return it.

    Internet shopping changed a lot over the last 10 years and some stores even counties haven't had time to catch up with their policies.

    That’s why Amazon got soooo big. You order with no risk as you can return pretty much anything with any reason. + don't lie about shipping times.
    People often take advantage of this and return things as faulty to get free return as well. So now Amazon has Amazon Warehouse where they can sell the returned products.

    The point is, if you can return it with no risk you end up buying more. More sales for the shops and they end up getting more profit despite the returns. The shops that cannot understand this will go bankrupt.

    They need to mimic Amazon. Amazon kills brick and mortar stores and very bad for the economy, but you need to admit what they do is brilliant from the consumer`s perspective.

    I stopped using ebay because of the constant lie and unknowns on shipping times. For example, I bought two products on the same day, one from Amazon, one from Ebay. Both arrived at the same time. However, Amazon told me that I will get it 18 Oct and ebay told me I will receive it 10 Oct. My ebay parcel was very late!
    So I got a bad experience with ebay even though the items were purchased at the same time and arrived at the same time! So Amazon again won me over when they told me the proper shipping time and didn't try to bs.

  • Poor Ass on 04/11/2022 - 15:13
    +1

    How dare you

    Australia number 1

  • johnno07 on 04/11/2022 - 15:59
    +1

    Massive rates of return absolutely has to be increasing the number of things going to landfill :S

  • McFly on 04/11/2022 - 16:27

    Main reason(s) - more people and (therefore) more competition.

  • Windows98 on 04/11/2022 - 16:46
    +1

    Anything that makes us different to the US is fine by me. Even this.

  • gromit on 04/11/2022 - 17:52
    +1

    In the US you get screwed in other areas, especially warranty and user rights for faulty goods. Generally Australian consumers have it significantly better with far greater protections.

    • McFly on 04/11/2022 - 18:24

      In the US you get screwed in other areas

      Are you getting the US confused with Greece?

      • gromit on 05/11/2022 - 08:23

        Not at all, both will leaving you feeling similarly dirty.

  • FlyingMiffy on 04/11/2022 - 18:45

    Scale - logistics, supply chain and volume. If every customer buys two and returns one, the assumption is that you have the stock levels to manage that kinda of service. And if you stock at that level, you need to market to be able to sell it eventually. None of those factors are possible in a country of only 26 miilion.

  • GrueHunter on 04/11/2022 - 18:53
    +1

    "I can't make up my mind or do basic research. Why don't stores make it easier for me to inconvenience them at their expense?"

  • Ramrunner on 04/11/2022 - 19:05
    +2

    Uhm, because small business needs some protection? As an SMB owner, I cannot send used items back to the distributor so if customers were allowed to return anything they'd used and not wanted any more, I would be broke within weeks. I'm actually wondering how US stores do it. Where do all these used items go? I can't resell them for the same price and there's bugger all margin in my industry so…..

  • Willy Beamish on 04/11/2022 - 19:48
    +3

    Your returns for change of mind cost someone money somewhere.

    • paloverde88 on 04/11/2022 - 20:03
      -2

      More like it costs some executives their bonus

  • natedogg118 on 04/11/2022 - 22:27
    +1

    Haven't heard someone refer to America as a first world country in a while… I suppose your point of view might depend on your gender and the degree of body autonomy you enjoy.

  • quick-dry on 05/11/2022 - 00:18

    is there also a historical element of American consumerism involving much more "mail order" / catalog shopping than other places which did not do this to the same extent?

    If you had that as a background context you'd be more conditioned to expect it over time and it'd just be a "done thing", whereas we don't have that as much, so it isn't. On the other hand we have other basic expectations that come from more consumer rights regarding warranty/fitness-for-purpose/etc.

  • Cluster on 05/11/2022 - 01:22
    +2

    What more consumer rights do you want?

    We have a right to a product replacement or refund if it's faulty. We even have a right to a statutory warranty, where you can claim a repair outside of the warranty period if it's reasonably assumed the product should last longer than X years.

    We don't have a right to change of mind returns, which is a very good thing. You bought it? You own it. Don't want it? Shouldn't have bought it.

    As for customer service in terms of the sales person helping you decide, who does that? How can any sales person be an expert on every item in store? They'll just feed you the usual BS that 'oh, I have that at home!' and 'you look really good in that!'

    I rely on my own research and generally know what I want before I walk into the store.

  • haemolysis on 05/11/2022 - 02:17
    +5

    I think it’s a bit gross to buy things with the intention of testing them out and returning if you don’t like - even if the store allows it.

    It’s wasteful. You’re not only doubling the freight, but the product you “tested” will then be either discarded or sold as a used. They won’t be able to resell it new once seals are broken.

    Can you do so? Sure, nobody is stopping you.

    But you can also put your recyclables in general waste …it doesn’t mean you SHOULD.

  • greatlamp on 05/11/2022 - 04:09

    These generous return policies are worn by the manufacturer/distributor not the retailer.

    What you observe is that retailers in the USA have a lot more monopoly power. This isn't a good thing unless you happen to be of the select few millionaires who own these chains. Literally everyone else pays, the manufacturer, the retail staff. The consumer thinks they are winning while wondering why there is so much poverty and crime in their society

  • joelmuzz on 05/11/2022 - 08:33

    There's more competition there so to survive at the top they compete with extreemly generous returns policies. Things like accepting a returned tent after a week of use just because you decided it was annoying to assemble.

    We have more statutory rights here, but in most cases big USA sellers choose to be more generous.

    • ozwolf on 05/11/2022 - 13:47

      Yeah, it is most likely the competition whereas more monopoly like businesses here

  • donrisotto on 05/11/2022 - 09:00

    You absolutely can return almost anything.
    (not stinky underwear or shoes)

    there may be a restocking fee. they have to tell you there's a restocking fee before you buy it.

    importantly: you shouldn't just say "I changed my mind".

    read the actual consumer law.

    Use "The product wasn't fit for its intended purpose." (the term is so effing vague it could mean anything, like I wanted this dryer but it didn't fit in the space I had, or I wanted this intel CPU but it turns out my motherboard was AMD, or I wanted this rug but the colour didn't match the drapes)

    I find that works 99% of the time.

    • greatlamp on 05/11/2022 - 09:26
      +2

      The product wasn't fit for its intended purpose

      Unortunately a lot of people misinterpret this statement. If you read the ACL, the meaning is not fit for it's advertised or purported purpose (including if it was recommend to you). The customer cannot buy something that is clearly unsuited (like an Intel CPU for an AMD board), then say it wasn't "fit for purpose". The product never claimed to be compatible. It isn't whatever purpose the customer decides.

      I'm sure this works with apathetic teenagers working in a big box store, but if you try this in a small business and they refuse to give you a full refund on your used, change of mind goods, (the typical situation people try this on) please don't start screaming about the ACL like a Karen, you will lose.

    • happydude on 05/11/2022 - 18:18

      I wanted this dryer but it didn't fit in the space I had
      I wanted this intel CPU but it turns out my motherboard was AMD
      I wanted this rug but the colour didn't match the drapes

      I agree with @greatlamp. None of these are covered by s54.

      • donrisotto on 07/11/2022 - 02:17

        No they aren't but you don't need to explain.

  • paloverde88 on 05/11/2022 - 09:55
    +1

    The thing is American are so used to returning success they will return anything a coffee a meal etc. they are also not people who are easily embarrassed it’s in the culture they doggy bags foods in the restaurant while still munching they top up hundred times for all you can eat they take up a restaurant seat over a bottomless coffee or ice tea without ordering food. Newspapers are sold in DIY honesty not by humans. These are all acceptable in American culture. Did you think their consumers will ask for less in anywhere else in their lives including shopping?

    • Hangryuman on 05/11/2022 - 13:44

      US citizens are FREE ! (to be complete R Souls)

  • Zapwap on 05/11/2022 - 10:29
    -1

    America is a great place.. speech is free.. you're also freely able to expose the fact that you're an idiot.. oh and hassle free returns too

  • Hangryuman on 05/11/2022 - 13:42

    competition - the US as the world centre of Capitalism worshipping the Holey Dollar

    they have to compete for customers - which they have done by offering no questions refunds

    this led to a whole industry of people buying fancy clothing for special events and then returning them for a full refund the next day

    which I believe finally pushed large stores to say they will no longer accept returns for used clothing or somesuch

    Similar happened in Oz during COVID - Woolworths announced changes of returns policy -

    first overbought toilet paper when people had the runs - 12 Mar 2020 - https://au.news.yahoo.com/woolworths-introduces-major-change…

    20 Oct 2020 for change of mind returns - https://au.news.yahoo.com/shoppers-up-in-arms-over-woolworth…

    and now it looks like you can exchange for change of mind - but not get a refund - https://www.woolworths.com.au/shop/discover/about-us/returns…

  • drfuzzy on 05/11/2022 - 15:40

    Americans carry guns. And they like to use them.
    If an American wants a refund - they can have it.

  • peekabooo on 05/11/2022 - 16:36

    The wages are high here in lower end jobs like packing, restocking, courier. The overhead cost is just too much.

  • Empharand on 05/11/2022 - 20:23

    In the case of returning after opening, do what most people do and return claiming there is a warranty issue… Get creative.

    The bigger chains don't really care and will just process the return + refund or exchange, smaller chains and/or your family run small-business are more likely to inspect the product to ensure you aren't talking BS - They're generally the ones that have much more to lose (eg. Time processing the return + time issuing a return request to the supplier + packaging up the product ready for transit etc)

    Having worked in a previous Warranty Admistration job, I can assure you it's common practice.

    • saltysalt on 05/11/2022 - 22:08
      +1

      Honestly I find this kind of behaviour pretty on the nose.

  • saltysalt on 05/11/2022 - 22:06
    +1

    You're dead right. I really notice it over here too that 'change of mind' returns aren't usually possible where in the US sales staff at big stores will encourage you to just buy and return anything for no reason. We actually have much better consumer protections with faulty good ect. but large stores in the US take it to another level. Sometimes I wish it were better here but it's probably a good thing because the amount of waste from returns in the US seems excessive.

    • Vita85 on 06/11/2022 - 11:02
      +2

      I prefer the better consumer protection after purchase. The US warranties are laughably bad.

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