After seeing some of the recent Solar installation posts it got me thinking about monitoring our household electricity use
I have a fronius inverter and would like some real-time consumption monitoring.
Any helpful advice about good real-time consumption monitoring would be appreciated
I’ve seen fronius has smart meters and also came across these guys
https://www.solaranalytics.com.au/
Any suggestions?
Thanks caped,
They “upgraded” to a smart meter but not one that is directly compatible with the inverter (it’s some generic brand that origin installed)
I’d have liked the option to install a fronius smart meter but they never mentioned it
Origin used to let me check the total usage on delayed basis but now they don’t even have that feature available on the app
I do have some smart plugs that give me individual outlet data in real-time but would really like some sort of whole house monitoring.
If you're in vic, check distributors portal for consumption so you don't have to worry when switching retailers. Data still about one day behind and only break out per half hour at most. If you have fronius it's no brainer not going with their smart meter, give you real time info and lots more. Solar analytics is better in terms of giving you production forecasts or notify you system failure (by comparing actual vs forecast) but that's just gimmicky and you will pay a lot more. And even when such failure you still need to go back to Fronius portal to investigate further.
I have Solar Analytics and I am very happy with it. I can see real-time consumption of different circuits like lighting, air conditioning, laundry, kitchen, etc
It has been very useful to know not just how much is being generated by the panels and how much is being fed into the grid; but also how much is being consumed at home and by what. That helps in rejigging the usage; like using laundry during the day. Solar Analytics also provides energy plan comparisons; which has been ok - it does give me recommendations for plans I can't get; but has still been useful in identifying some I was not aware of.
Thanks mrhyde
Very helpful
Can I ask:
1) do you have a compatible inverter that allowed you to go down that path of sign up?
2) how’d you find someone to install it/ set it up?
3) how much did it cost to the solar analytics stuff up and running?
Thanks in advance
1) I have a sungrow inverter. from consumption perspective; the solar analytics consumption monitor is installed in your switchboard - so it can measure consumption by circuit. For generation; yes; it needs a compatible inverter.
2) I had it installed at same time as the solar panels - so same electrician who did the panels also installed it and the solar company set it all up.
3) They had a deal with Sungrow inverters at the time for lifetime solar analytics for $100 on top.
Thanks MrHyde,
That sounds like a good deal that you got there
If it was say $500 extra for installation etc, now that you have used it for a bit, would you think it’s worth it?
@parsimonious one: It comes down to whether the information is useful or not. I found initially, that just knowing production and how much was being fed into the grid (with delay) was pretty useless. I wanted to know how much my real-time consumption was so that I could change behaviour. Solar Analytics gave me that. Over time, I started looking at it less and less.
I'm about to get an EV; the ChargeHQ app integrates with Solar Analytics so that it can use the data from there to then control how much electricity goes into the car - so, I am going to get further benefit of my installation ongoing now. So, $500; is still cheap compared to the EV Chargers in the market that provide the same ability built-in like the Zappi.
So, just for consumption monitoring - $500 would be too much… but combined with EV charging; still worth it.
I have the Fronius inverter with the Fronius smart meter (nothing to do with your energy retailers meter). The app will only show the currently produced solar energy provided by the inverter if you don't have the smart meter. The smart meter allows the app to show current total consumption. You can see whether you are importing or exporting to the grid.
I have considered Solar Analytics in the past but I'm not into the ongoing subscription plan type solution.
IOtaWatt is another product you can purchase without any ongoing subscription fees. You just buy the number of CT's that you need to cover all your different power circuits, AC, Hot water, pool etc etc. https://iotawatt.com/ I just googled it and can see that a local company is selling them. I haven't done the currency conversion to see it they are more expensive. You would need an electrician to install. Looks like fun if you are into apps and seeing what devices are using the most power.
Thanks densor
Would you recommend the fronius smart meter?
I had an electrician quote to install one recently but it was close to $1k (but he didn’t seem to really know about the fronius smart meter or seem that interested in doing the job) so I suspect he was just high balling to not get involved
Mine was installed when I had my system installed. I think it was $400 extra ? It only enables a view of your total usage (consumption) but does make the Fronius app much more useful. I can see instantly what the system is doing. If I see consumption jump by 700 watts I know the pool pump is running. If I see consumption has gone really high I know that my wife has turned on the air con !
I like gadgets which is why I'm considering the IoTaWatt system. You could configure to monitor import , export, solar production, individual consumption.
You would be better off with a powerpal which is free in victoria.
Solar inverter only gives you production data. That is net with your use which is what is given in your smart meter data.
You can also download 30 min usage data from your power distributor portal (Citipower, Powercor, Jemena, United Energy etc for Vic)
I got a Growatt installed recently with the monitoring unit and I don't use it. AGL app is more reflective of what I am actually pulling from the grid net. Don't even have a powerpal.
Thanks for that, I’ll have another look at the power pal.
It was couple of hundred dollars last time I checked and I got the impression it may be better to pay a bit extra to get a proper meter.
I’ll take another look
I run a Flukso.
The consumption clamp is on the input feed to the house (house side of the meter box), installed by a sparky.
My generation figures comes direct from the inverter by Bluetooth although a second clamp connected to the Flukso could also achieve this..
Everything gets uploaded to PVOutput.org
Consumption minus generation = import (or export)
That looks pretty affordable, did the electrician have any concerns about installing it?
Does it give real-time monitoring?
He was a little confused about where to install it for some reason.
But otherwise no concerns.
I used to use the "Energy Control" App for live monitoring, but it doesn't appear to be available anymore.
Guard Flukso was another. Doesn't appear to be available on the Play Store anymore either, but it's here
https://apkpure.com/guard-flukso/it.erkert.guardiaenergia to sideload.
I haven't used them for years though. Once you get used to the way your system produces and knowledge of how your appliances pull power, you can almost just look out the window to work out whether it's time to turn on the dishwasher yet.
My Flukso was installed back in 2014. I had to replace a dead Wall Wart for it earlier this year, and there's been a couple of days downtime for the Flukso.net server, but otherwise pretty reliable.
I loved my Fronius smart meter & Hot water relay (electric hot Water) when in QlD on my 5.2kw system.
You set it to turn the hot water on at say 2000 watts generation and off at say 4000 watts generation.
As your in Vic you probably have gas as well.
Now in WA where only one choice of provider in Synergy, i went with solar analytics.
It was $750 installed including the lifetime user fees.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/737tihyhpurgtpq/Solar.PNG?dl=0
Thanks aust.
I have solar analytics. It is expensive, and it can only monitor 6 circuits, and 2 circuits will be taken up by solar and grid. What's good about solar analytics is there's nothing for you to really think about and they pro-actively report zero generation and below expectation performance.
But there is another far cheaper and far better option if you have just a little patience to learn a few things.
Iotawatt https://iotawatt.com/ is an incredible device much cheaper than solar analytics and can be DIY installed if you have a GPO in your meter box. Otherwise cheap for an electrician to install. It monitors 14 circuits (!) And can export data to pvoutput and has incredibly powerful and flexible graphing capability built in with which you can recreate all of the best graphs from other systems (solar analytics, pvoutput, fronious, and more). For example, I have made a graph that tells me which portion of consumption is 100% "free" because it is excess of our export limit and therefore there is no foregone feed in tariff for that usage. I have not seen any other system produce a graph like this.
Pvoutput https://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=78510 (my system) costs a $15 donation per year and gives you a pro-active zero generation alert via email (like solar analytics) plus some incredible data analytics based on expected performance and your grid and feed in costs (net savings/earnings). Much more comprehensive than solar analytics and there are some nice apps to display the data on your phone, too.
I also have a fronius smart meter which I was intending to use to automatically turn on the heat pump hot water system at the optimum time, but it turns out that time is pretty much always 11am regardless so there's no real need for it. The fronius system does have one nice graph, but I have easily recreated that in iotawatt. So I would say fronius smart meter is not necessary.
I can't really imagine a use case for monitoring individual circuits in a home environment?
Just seems like unnecessary overkill.
Not at all. I found it very handy to see how much power AC, HWS, power points, lights, oven are using individually.
By not lumping everything into a single "consumption" category, and having real time data, it is easy to determine the usage for individual appliances connected to a power point and make a decision about whether it is worth ensuring those devices are not left in standby, or time shift their usage, etc.
It's also interesting and useful to see year on year if your AC usage (for example) has increased or what percentage of your overall usage is from your HWS, etc.
If you're going to invest in any kind of local monitoring, which I think is a very good idea, especially one with a pro-active alert for zero generation or degraded performance, you might as well get the system that is the best value and most capable.
if your AC usage (for example) has increased or what percentage of your overall usage is from your HWS, etc.
I can see this sort of thing being useful.
Everything else you can just see as spikes above background usage as you turn things on and off.
For the people here with a Fronius inverter, particularly those that also have the Fronius smart meter, have a look at using this: http://fronius-powermon.duckdns.org/
Yeah is pretty handy. I had to use this CORS add-on to get it to work (whitelisted without enabling CORS for everything)
Photovoltaic Monitor is also a good app for checking real-time stats on Android.
Note every user has to use a CORS plugin, as the instructions say.
Without a smart management system to keep you informed you will not get best value from your solar system. The Fronius system will do that, but something that shows input and output to mains is better. There are plenty of options.
If you are considering getting an EV in the future, suggest you consider getting a Fronius smart meter. This can help you use V2H to power your home from your car if you have correct options in the future. (Not many EVs are V2H enabled at present).
I have a Fronius inverter and smart meter.
What can I say, it works. I don't know if it's any better or worse than the others but it's good having it all integrated in solarweb. You can set your feed in tariffs and the reports will show your costs for the day taking in to account power generated, used and exported.
It integrates nicely with Home Assistant too, so I can run stuff when there is excess power. For example the kids rooms at the back of the house can get quite cold even though it might be sunny enough so I have automations that check the room temps and if under a set level and there is excess solar turns on a column heater in there. If there's not enough solar power they switch off.
When I installed solar my meter was upgraded to a smart meter. I get data a couples days after from AGL. Did you get a new meter?
Alternatively, you could buy smart plugs that monitor usage at each outlet.