Same Rate of Pay for 5 Years

Lfeesie on 22/07/2022 - 20:54

Hi all,

Hoping I can have your thoughts on this one -

My dad signed onto an eba in 2015 with a nominal expiry date of 2017. Under this eba his last prescribed pay rise was December 2016. It turns out he hasn't had a single cent pay rise since. There is no mechanism in the eba for future rises post expiry date however this pay freeze seems more than a little unreasonable. Dad is a diligent worker who always puts the company first, he never takes sick leave - has over 130 days accrued.
I’m just a little shocked and disappointed but have no idea what advice to give.

Thanks in advance!

Education & Work

Comments

  • cookie2 on 22/07/2022 - 21:01
    +3

    Call fwa and look at the award that covers the sector, if not eba. Also get your dad to join a union (if not already) and then discuss with them. But be prepared…unions move slowly.

    • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 10:30

      Depends on the union but on EA they move quickly if there is workplace membership density.

      • feesie on 23/07/2022 - 19:58

        There isn’t density unfortunately - that’s how I think this award lapsed - a significant reduction in workforce in the state dad works in

        • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 20:25
          +2

          Encourage people to join the union and then call them to assist in negotiating a deal. What industry is your dad in?

          I note your response below re my BOOT comment. Unfortunately you reading it isn’t going to force the employer to do anything. Even then, they can simply apply to terminate the agreement and then the terms and conditions could revert to the award and be worse than the agreement (except for pay)

          It’s a tricky industrial system we have here that is skewed in the employers favour.

          • cookie2 on 23/07/2022 - 20:56

            @Vote for Pedro: My workplace is still working off an eba that expired 10 years ago. No joke! Actually that is a joke.

  • AndyC1 on 22/07/2022 - 21:26
    +9

    The company does not care about their staff and as such I would recommend he move to another company.

  • JIMB0 on 22/07/2022 - 21:40
    +8

    He needs to find out why the EBA wasn't renewed. Also use some of the sick leave.

  • mrvaluepack on 22/07/2022 - 21:42
    +4

    Sick days mean nothing, its just an "insurance" for your dad if he suffers a long term illness. Better start using it up before moving companies.

    • cookie2 on 22/07/2022 - 22:05
      +2

      The reference to sick leave is just op reflecting on how long and how well (according to minimal workplace disturbance) their dad has worked at the job.

  • garetz on 22/07/2022 - 22:17
    +1

    once an eba expires it should either be renegotiated or renewed with your consent, if they did not do that then you should seek legal advice.

  • tsunamisurfer on 22/07/2022 - 22:49

    Does sick leave accrue?

    I thought if it is not used for the year it is gone?

    • Benoffie on 22/07/2022 - 22:52
      +1

      For most people in permanent jobs, it accrues. But you can no longer cash it out when you leave.

      Many people accumulate sick leave thinking they might need it. However, there comes a point where having too much leave is stupid.

      He has over 4 months leave. He should at least be trying to halve it. Claim Covid or, if he's had it, long Covid.

      • tsunamisurfer on 22/07/2022 - 22:55
        -3

        No. Sick leave is when you are sick not claiming to have false ailments.

        Disgusting suggestion.

        • Benoffie on 22/07/2022 - 22:59
          +6

          No. Sick leave is for managing the wellbeing of the worker. One could very well argue that the employer has failed in their duty of care by allowing this person to accrue 130 days. That's 13 years of no sick leave. There is very little way that he has suffered no day of being unfit for work - either physically, mentally or emotionally.

          Sick leave is there to ensure workers stay healthy and fit. It can and should be taken for mental health and wellbeing reasons. Unfortunately, bosses are frequently idiots and require 'sickness' and medical certificates. Just ask the AMA which is blasting the business community for hammering Medicare for piece of paper.

          He is entitled to those days. He should take them in any way he sees fit.

  • whatwasherproblem on 22/07/2022 - 23:09
    +3

    this pay freeze seems more than a little unreasonable.

    Well yeah, if he's stayed at the same pay since 2016 then at this point he's losing nearly 10% of his paycheck to inflation alone.

    Dad is a diligent worker who always puts the company first

    They say there's one born every minute.

  • lamparnon77 on 23/07/2022 - 00:52
    +1

    Oh yikes I would be looking at leaving the company. They are effectively giving him a paycut each year!

  • coffeeinmyveins on 23/07/2022 - 10:07
    +3

    . Dad is a diligent worker who always puts the company first, he never takes sick leave - has over 130 days accrued

    Your dad is the best employee

    No pay rises in five years and never takes sick leave!!! Businesses will love to have suckers like him

    Seriously. Wow.

  • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 10:28

    Get him to speak to his union. Let us know what they say.

    There are some risks for the employer as well. When it came into force it probably met the BOOT test. It may no longer do so and open the employer to claims.

    This is why unions are important. Otherwise you need expensive lawyers to do it for you.

    • feesie on 23/07/2022 - 19:56

      Thankyou - I didn’t even think of this - I will dig out the award and look into it.

  • zonra on 23/07/2022 - 11:34
    +1

    Dad is a diligent worker who always puts the company first, he never takes sick leave - has over 130 days accrued.

    It's sad but this often means nothing in terms of career progression and pay rise. Only the squeaky wheels get oiled.
    Don't try to change how your employer treat you, change your employer.

    • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 11:54

      Or join a union and get your workmates to do the same and then use the collective power to negotiate a new fair deal. Moving on just leaves the same problem for the next sucker.

      We need to all do our little bit to make our part of the world better. If we all did that the collective action by everyone else would make a huge global impact

      • JIMB0 on 23/07/2022 - 12:47

        Good luck with that. Too many people these days are mortgaged up to the eyeballs and too afraid to makes moves against the company.

        • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 14:09
          +1

          And thats the capitalist system. An obedient workforce that cops it sweet

  • th123 on 23/07/2022 - 17:54
    +1

    he never takes sick leave - has over 130 days accrued.

    You know, this isn't a badge of honour. if you're sick or unwell, physically or mentally, use the days.

    • feesie on 23/07/2022 - 19:52
      +1

      Whilst he is genuinely rarely sick - has needed perhaps half a dozen days off in my memory - it turns out his employer also “encourages” them to use their banked rdos first.

      • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 20:27
        +4

        This is not on. Rdos are yours to use as you earned them. Sick days are for when you are sick. Why do people cop this rubbish from employers?

  • [Deactivated] on 23/07/2022 - 21:19
    -1

    There is only one circumstance where you deserve a pay rise in a job. Only one:

    • when the company is at risk of losing you and wants/needs you to stay.

    That's it. That's the only reason you ever deserve a pay rise. If the company wants to gift you a raise for any other reason then that's on them.

    Want more money? Find another job. The best - and usually only - time to negotiate pay is when you're applying for a job. So… start looking.

    • Vote for Pedro on 23/07/2022 - 22:06

      Only relevant for highly skilled in demand roles. The other 70% can cop it sweet ey?

  • Bigboomboom on 25/07/2022 - 12:22

    It's nominal expiry not actual expiry, it can continue indefinitely, but EBA needs to be not worse off than the Award it's based on. So minimum pay rate without increase must be equal or higher than current minimum pay in the award. Unless the Award pay rate hasn't increased in 5 years as well or the EBA minimum pay rate is way higher than it originally, it doesn't make sense.

    I used to be in the Building & Construction Industry, and our EBA for VIC employees "expired" ages ago (like 2015) but pay rate has to increase every year in line with the CFMEU guide line. It was minimum 5% increase every year.

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