Electric Vehicles FBT Free 1 July 2022!

We are due to replace vehicles in our business. Looking forward to trading our agricultural Utes for FBT
exempt EVs.

Thanks to Pegaxs the MVP for providing link: https://www.alp.org.au/policies/electric_car_discount/

Electric Car Discount will begin on 1 July 2022 and be reviewed after three years, in light of electric car take up at that time.

Australia lags the world on take up of electric cars.

Just 1.5 per cent of cars sold here are electric and plug-in hybrid – compared to 17 per cent in the United Kingdom, and 85 per cent in Norway.

In total, there are only around 24,000 registered electric cars on Australian roads, of around 15 million total cars.

This is despite growing enthusiasm for electric cars in Australia. A majority of Australians say they’d consider buying an electric model as their next car.

But electric cars remain unaffordable for most Australians.

There are no electric cars available in Australia for under $40,000, and just five for under $60,000.

In comparison, there are more than two dozen electric cars available in the UK for under AU$60,000 – including eight that are cheaper than the cheapest electric car in Australia.

As part of the Discount, Labor will exempt many electric cars from:

Import tariffs – a 5 per cent tax on some imported electric cars; and
Fringe benefits tax – a 47 per cent tax on electric cars that are provided through work for private use.
These exemptions will be available to all electric cars below the luxury car tax threshold for fuel efficient vehicles ($77,565 in 2020-21).

Comments

        • +1

          Outside holidays I can’t remember the last time I’ve done more than 170km in daily commute/errands.

  • Just want my Model Y.

    • +1

      I want my Model 3.

    • I want my MTV….

      • Money for nothing and EVs for free.

  • -2

    Not sure of the comparison to UK and Norway. Like great, they are totally different countries to AUS. They also have different longitudes and latitudes… doesn't make for a good argument

    • +2

      Why should they not be compared? Yes, Australia has much bigger distances than other countries, but the vast majority of our cars travel in cities just like over there. I’m sure that anyone who does bulk kms in Norway or UK still uses fossil fuel vehicles. Both those compared have implemented charging infrastructure as demand increased for EVs. We’ll do the same.

      Longitude and latitude make stuff all difference other than perhaps we rely on AC cooling while
      They need heating.

      • Longitude and latitude make stuff all difference other than perhaps we rely on AC cooling while

        It was less literally about that and more about the "appeal to authority" style argument

  • +1

    I won't be buying one I know that for sure - I don't own a car at all. Walking and Public transport all the way for me. I do have a license, so if needed I can hire a car.

    • +2

      A fren used to work in public transport. The amount of 💩 that is left on the seats by passengers made them want to vomit.

      • maybe it was Amber?

        • Imagine leakage.

    • I must be more careful because I first read your post from the corner of my eye & when read " Walking and Public transport all the way for me. ''' I read it as Wa#king on Public transport all the way for me".

  • +1

    The uptake of ev are several reasons. Fear of running out of power though there's a lot more changing points in Australia than people realise.

    Those countries UK etc are physically smaller meaning shorter potential trips and the populations much larger meaning there are more charging points. They are bigger markets due to their population size which has resulted in a wider range of ev to choose from(more brands choose to sell there instead of Australia). Pricing is as such more competitive.

    A proper electric 4x4 is not available in Australia unless you get one converted ( some excellent conversions are happening around Australia). If I had the cash I would be looking at one of these.

    • +1

      I though the uptake is 100%.
      There is no single electric car available in Australia.
      There is also very long waiting time if someone want to buy let's say EV6, Tesla etc.

      So I don't see any issue with the uptake. The issue is supply.

      • +2

        Yes, we don’t have supply. For the models available there are plenty of buyers.

        Sure, they don’t suit 4wd enthusiasts or those that travel ultra long distances or tow but they seem to suit everyone in the waiting list. They are perfectly suited for city commuting with occasional longer drives. I’ll bet that many of the EV owners still have large SUVs for towing and travel - at least the ones that are buying to reduce fuel costs, not the greenies.

    • -1

      Where is the site that list all charging points in the country???

      • +2

        On the internet.

  • +2

    As someone who knows nothing about FBT, how much of a benefit does this give to someone who works for the government and can salary sacrifice?

    • +2

      I too would like to know.
      Looking at salary sacrificing a BYD atto

  • -6

    You have to get a qualified electrician to install the power unit… this will cost thousands.

    You will forever have battery anxiety… fear of running low.

    And in x amount of years, your battery will be no good - costing thousands to replace.

    • +7

      Wrong. A faster charger at home might cost a lot, but a 15a point won’t cost much and will likely charge fast enough for an overnight top up from commuting. For longer travel the fast charger network is building quickly.

      Wrong. When you ‘fill up’ every night at home range anxiety wont be a thing. It’ll be no more concerning that taking a long drive and planning where to stop for fuel. ‘But the charge will take ages’ enough range in the time you eat your lunch. It’s just a different way of doing things. Wouldn’t yo rather only every visit a servo on a long trip or for overpriced junk food?

      Wrong. 12-20 year expected battery life. By then it’s time for a new car and/or replacement batteries will be reasonably well available and most drivers would be looking at a new car by that time anyway.

    • +1

      This battery anxiety argument confuses me - what do you do when your petrol runs low?

    • +2

      If you believe the sky news narrative, then don’t buy one. But don’t spread your onp, lib/nat crap here. We are sick of it and voted for a change in direction.

      • +1

        Australia should be happy to know that energy prices are set to the moon.

        https://twitter.com/strikeextent/status/1529232760120147968
        "Prices for wholesale power in the 2022-23 financial year have surged almost five-fold in NSW over the past 12 months, and more than trebled in Victoria, Queensland and South Australia, according to energy adviser Energy Edge."

        • +1

          Thanks scummo for getting us to this point

          • +1

            @Vote for Pedro: Farkin Scum indeed

          • @Vote for Pedro: There is a new gov. People can now start to blame them for record-high energy prices.

            • @rektrading: Lol. 3 days. You can blame them for everything now. You’ve been watching paul murray on sky, haven’t you?

              • @Vote for Pedro: I don't know who that is.

                • @rektrading: Hahahahhahahahhahaah, ignore the substance of the point and focus on a side thought.

                  Still sad palmers uap and paulines onp failed miserably?

                  • @Vote for Pedro: I'm not interested in who wins Australian elections.

                    All gov will continue to debase fiat which will lead to higher energy prices.

                    • @rektrading: You clearly are because you make political commentary.

                      • @Vote for Pedro: Me making comments on Australian politics doesn't mean that I care who wins elections.

                        Left, right and centre are all the same.

                        I don't vote but if I did then I would be a single-issue voter and nobody fits the bill.

                        • @rektrading:

                          I don't vote

                          You have absolutely zero right to complain about the actions of any government be they left, right or centre.

                          • @Vote for Pedro: The right to freedom of opinion and expression is a basic human right.

                            I exercise my rights by not voting.

                            • @rektrading: No. You break the law. And you do so willingly without exercising your right to vote. So no, you have chosen to exclude yourself from the political discourse.

                              • @Vote for Pedro: Human rights are above all other rights.

                                How am I breaking the law?

                                • @rektrading: Oh no. You’re a sovereign citizen?

                                  Unfortunately (for you) you live in Australia. Our wonderful country has laws. One of those is compulsory voting for citizens. If you don’t vote, you have broken the law of our country.

                                  It’s quite simple really.

                                  • @Vote for Pedro:

                                    https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/12123794/redir
                                    @Willowtea on 13/05/2022 - 11:46

                                    You have the 'right to abstain'.

                                    There is no compulsion to vote.

                                    Only a compulsion to have one's name ticked off the role.

                                    Rock up, say hi, take the ballot, drop them in the box unfolded and walk out. Just don't feel the need to lecture the AEC workers on your disdain for the democratic process.

                                    https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/12123902/redir
                                    @Willowtea on 13/05/2022 - 12:01

                                    Did you read my post?

                                    The act of voting is not placing an actual vote. It is being marked as having attended, accepting and casting a ballot.

                                    Ballots can be blank. They are called INFORMAL votes.

                                    Source - Working for the AEC for over 15 years.

                                    • @rektrading: So you voted?

                                      Pasting your conversation with others is obnoxious. Do I look like your personal assistant to have to decipher that

                                      • @Vote for Pedro: @Willowtea knows more about how the AEC work than I do. They can explain the process better.

                                        And no, I don't vote.

                                        • @rektrading: So what was the point of posting that rubbish. You are literally a waste of time and a law breaker to top it off.

                                          • @Vote for Pedro: Are you always this grumpy or did you've a bad day?

                                            • @rektrading: Are your responses always obnoxious or intentionally obtuse?

                                              You say you don’t vote. So it’s quite simple. If you are required by law to vote and you don’t (without an excuse allowable by law) you have broken the law. On top of that, if you have chosen to break the law, you have no right to be pissed off with the political landscape.

                                              • @Vote for Pedro: I'm indifferent to how Australia is governed.

                                                Why would you say that I'm pissed off?

                                                • @rektrading: You’re also a law breaker.

                                                  • -1

                                                    @Vote for Pedro: What is the penalty for law-breaking?

                                                    • +1

                                                      @rektrading: Round of applause for you.

                                                      You didn’t vote, and yet here you are telling people to blame the new government. I think that says more about you than about the state of affairs of our political discourse.

                                                      • -1

                                                        @Vote for Pedro: What is the penalty for law-breaking?

                                                        • +1

                                                          @rektrading: Round of applause for you.

                                                          You didn’t vote, and yet here you are telling people to blame the new government. I think that says more about you than about the state of affairs of our political discourse.

                                                          • -1

                                                            @Vote for Pedro: I'll take that as there is no penalty.

                                                            • @rektrading: You’re missing the point. You come here, talk australian politics but then say you don’t vote.

                                                              Regardless of the penalty, your political opinion carries zero weight because you don’t exercise your duty to vote within the society you live.

        • I don't think energy prices have gone up five-fold…

  • +1

    Anyone interested in a bz4x when they hit our shores? There’s also a cool little fj compact, albeit toy looking.

  • -1

    We are due to replace vehicles in our business. Looking forward to trading our agricultural Utes for FBT
    exempt EVs.

    The problem is providing work vehicle for private use. Don't do it then problem solved.

    • -1

      ? The point of exempting fbt is so the company can buy you an electric car for private use

      • +1

        Correct. Probably not a very well thought out political brain fart.

        If I was a company buying a company car exclusively for company business no FBT problem.

        If I was the same company letting staff use it for private purposes will be saddled with FBT.

        You see the easy way is no private use.

        Wondering if you did stuff that would not be FBT exempt in said BEV it will also be FBT exempt (non business related staff entertainment etc).

        I guess I can just setup a business for the benefit of having BEV.

        Imagine paying accountant $1k a year to do the books and then making your Model 3 for private use totally tax deductible. For a private person having to otherwise buy a Model 3 from after tax dollars on 37% tax rate it is worth it.

        • -1

          Your wording is very scattered and hard to follow but I'll reply to this point:

          Wondering if you did stuff that would not be FBT exempt in said BEV it will also be FBT exempt

          That's the point of the policy. For employers to be able to provide EVs to employees for total personal use, without the burden of FBT.

          • +1

            @Scantu:

            That's the point of the policy. For employers to be able to provide EVs to employees for total personal use, without the burden of FBT.

            My point is. Why would I run a company and give people free usage of assets, a fast depreciating asset at that.

            People who think getting a company car for private use is a benefit (that might attract FBT which is a free hit for the government) I'd suggest taking them to the doctors to get checked out.

            • +1

              @netjock: What the hell are you talking about. It's an incentive employers can offer employees.

        • +1

          Not paying FBT does not give you a tax deduction, just means you are not paying the additional tax.

          • +1

            @Aureus: FBT is not tax deductible.

            Once Labour removes it on BEVs then there is nothing stopping 100% private use. Setup a shell company, buy a model 3 and get GST credit, put everything else through the company because there is no FBT as deterrent.

            You know FBT is to stop people avoiding tax by putting everything personal use through a company right?

            Nothing against Albo but I think it is a really bad brain fart.

            If he wants increased up take don't do it the round about way.

            Maybe they'll remove FBT and employer can install solar on your roof top too.

            • +2

              @netjock: You should probably stop talking about this as you clearly don't understand it. 1 you need a company with income for that to even be effective, 2 the point is employers put more EVs in the market and provide them as incentives to employees

              • +1

                @Scantu:

                1 you need a company with income for that to even be effective

                Cars just don't appear from thin air. Like you can buy a $60k car on the company when the company accounts have no cash. Saying company needs an income is clutching at straws.

                2 the point is employers put more EVs in the market and provide them as incentives to employees

                So would you rather drive your BEV 1hr each way to work as an incentive or work from home? I am not giving employees a car and have them work from home too.

                Foolish policy. Might as well give everyone a go by giving everyone a chance at a subsidy.

            • +2

              @netjock: I understand. Your right, but as tablewhale said you will need a company with income (from multiple sources, can't just be a contractor). I am sure there will be lots of interest, but that's the point.

              • +1

                @Aureus:

                (from multiple sources, can't just be a contractor). I am sure there will be lots of interest, but that's the point.

                I run a family office (I invest my own capital for a return on the stock market). Even remove FBT I won't do it. Appreciating vs depreciating assets. I sometimes think what kind of company and employee would you need to think a car is worth it vs cash.

                • +2

                  @netjock:

                  I sometimes think what kind of company and employee would you need to think a car is worth it vs cash.

                  I'm sorry you really don't know what your talking about and I fear for whatever rinky dink operation you're running. A company offers it as an incentive because they can attain the car cheaper than a private person would.

                  Cars just don't appear from thin air. Like you can buy a $60k car on the company when the company accounts have no cash. Saying company needs an income is clutching at straws.

                  It's.not clutching at straws it's literally the core of the scheme though I doubt youd Understand that. You need to have income to offset expenses. Otherwise there is no point.

                  So would you rather drive your BEV 1hr each way to work as an incentive or work from home? I am not giving employees a car and have them work from home too.

                  Why do you think I care what your personal opinion is, I've never asked. You don't understand the policy fundamentally and yet you critique it. Shows you how full of shit most people are.

                  • +1

                    @Scantu:

                    Why do you think I care what your personal opinion is, I've never asked

                    Same here. Look up!

                    • +1

                      @netjock: I haven't given you my personal opinion lol just facts about how the scheme works.

                      That's the difference between you and I.

                      • +1

                        @Scantu:

                        I haven't given you my personal opinion lol just facts about how the scheme works.

                        You an accountant or works in policy at the ATO?

                        You're just imagining it working.

                        That's the difference between you and I.

                        • +1

                          @netjock: No, what I've told you is facts about how the scheme works as labor proposed it. Labor said: "No FBT on X vehicles". So now I'm telling you what a corporate purchase sans FBT looks like.

                          What's wrong with you lol accept you don't really understand the scheme and move on.

                          • +1

                            @Scantu: I was thinking the same.

                            If you have your own business (through a trust or company), start being your only employee and you can suddenly claim 100% of a car that would otherwise not be deductible at all. Due to no FBT = no drawbacks.

                            Feels very broken.

                            • @Heiks9000: Oh you won't even need to be an employee, just as a director is fine afaik.

                              It's on purpose, to put higher demand on services and utilities for EVs and flood the second hand market with EVs a few years down the line.

                              • @Scantu: Plenty of trashed EVs flooding the second hand market.

                                Like second hand company cars are popular right now. (Sarcasm)

                                • @netjock: So because you don't understand how the policy works you've just shifted to attacking the proposed outcome, which also shows your lack of understanding of the second hand market? Nice

                                  • -1

                                    @Scantu: You don't know how the policy works. Read the Labour website. It is just all pie in the sky.

                                    If normal people can't get their hands on an EV. 12 month wait on a model 3. Giving zero FBT is going to suddenly increase supply?

                                    So you are an accountant/ATO policy expert and second hard car market expert?

                                    I think you are really telling us you have a strong opinion but zero expertise.

                                    • +1

                                      @netjock: I'm just letting you know, you aren't worth my time with this and I'm only doing this for other people reading:

                                      Site: https://www.alp.org.au/policies/electric_car_discount/

                                      "Labor will exempt many electric cars from" "Fringe benefits tax".

                                      This means that an employer purchasing an electric vehicle, for an employee's personal use, will NOT have to pay Fringe on it. If you own a small company like I do, I can effectively get a discount of my top marginal on a new EV, resulting ultimately in a discount of anywhere between 25-47% discount.

                                      For larger companies, this gives them the opportunity to offer EV's as an employment package to employees at a cheaper cost than it would be for the employee to buy it themselves.

                                      These are ACTUAL FACTS about the policy and how it works. These are not my opinions.

                                      YOU have given your actual opinions, and given how hard it has been for you to comprehend the basic concept of the policy proposed, I do not care to debate you on your opinion of it because it is not worth anything - given your difficulty in understanding this very simple policy.

                                      • @Scantu:

                                        These are ACTUAL FACTS about the policy and how it works

                                        The web page is a policy not pass into law therefore not a fact.

                                        It also doesn't prescribe how it works. You're basically pitching a promise as a fact.

                                        Good luck. We'll see given election promises (I am party agnostic) are going to add $8bn to the deficit, lets so who gets to pay for it.

                                        • @netjock: Nice goalpost shifting, I've always wondered, with people like you are you self aware of how bad you are at this sort of thing or are you genuinely so out of touch that you don't understand that you are wrong and that causes you to keep going? Man up and admit you said a dumb thing.

                                          Why do you keep giving me your personal opinion about the policy, I never asked for it, nor have I given you mine.

                                          • @Scantu: The personal attacks keep coming hey?

                                            If you read the ALP website the assumption you save 47% on FBT is wrong. There is no personal tax bracket of 47%. It tops out at 45%.

                                            You should read up on how FBT works. There is very little benefit for the business. So I doubt companies would be racing out to buy EVs and hand it to new joiners like laptops.

                                            You can just dream. But I bet you are going to get disappointed.

                                            • +2

                                              @netjock: 🤣🤣🤣

                                              "If you read the ALP website the assumption you save 47% on FBT is wrong. There is no personal tax bracket of 47%. It tops out at 45%."

                                              You literally don't understand FBT. Like, you foundationally don't understand FBT.

                                              https://www.ato.gov.au/rates/fbt/
                                              https://www.ato.gov.au/General/fringe-benefits-tax-(fbt)/

                                              Please, keep posting, I'm not even proving you wrong at this point you're just doing it yourself.

                                              • -1

                                                @Scantu: So ALP sold voters a saving on a company tax? How many average people are going to pocket that as a saving. I have been saying at all along. No employer is going to be running a fleet so people can use company cars 100%, not even 50% for personal use. Good luck getting companies to buy in.

                                                The 5% tariff cuts won't apply to EV made in China, South Korea and US because we already have free trade agreements with those countries.

                                                Good luck realising the savings. It is like a junk policy for a simple minded.

                                                Like I said before you expressed your unasked for opinion. No private use. No FBT problem. It is a solution to a problem that doesn't really exist. Except for those who are dodging tax (private use going unreported) and giving an avenue to bring it into light.

  • -1

    Recharge points?where?

    • +1

      Same argument was had when petrol cars came out.
      Didn't stop them from eradicating horse drawn transport in a decade

      And in your own home.
      That's something you can't do with a petrol car.

    • +2

      You obviously aren’t looking for them. There are more and more all the time.

      Need more EVs to get more charge points.

      The main charge point will be at home, overnight, for most drivers.

      • -1

        And yet noone can show me a map link that I can plan a trip further than 400km (average mileage for EV vehicle in one charge) . Also battery deterioration will happen over time therefore it will get lower and lower

        Without enough public charge stations I won't bother with EV

        • +1

          I’ve seen Tesla’s up the pacific highway on summer holidays. A couple recently drove a Nissan Leaf from Hobart to Sydney and that’s hardly a long range EV.

          The infrastructure is not missing. It’s just in the development phase. There are websites and apps hat will help you find charge points. Most EVs have something but into their satnav.

          Sure, if you travel more than 200km from home in a different direction every week an EV probably isn’t for you. But in reality, how often do you do that sort of travel?

  • +1

    Time to get rid of the LCT which is a import tariff in all but name which no longer has any purpose since we killed our car industry.

    • +1

      Why? It is for those who can afford luxury cars as the name suggests.

    • +1

      I’m all for removing it for EVs, but keep it on ICE luxury cars.

      • Keep it for everyone who can afford it. Before you know it there will be tax breaks for marginal electorates.

  • +3

    Will the FBT exemption help in a novated or associate lease situation?

    • Absolutely, businesses and novated fleets are the main beneficiaries of this legislation

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