I have invested a fair bit in spaceship and it has been steadily declining since the start of the year. I'm getting worried as this is my life savings. Anything using them, how are you coping with this decline?
Thoughts on Spaceship Decline
lightfoot on 09/03/2022 - 16:22
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Some people just don’t know the difference between loss & potential loss.
does the amount of clients impact the unit price? if for instance there was a large number leaving over the fee change would that also drag down the value?
Yes it does.
No, it does not. It is dangerous to answer financial queries when you don't know what you are talking about.
Unit prices are not based on the supply and demand of a specific fund but rather the investments within. A unit price is simply the market value of all assets within the fund divided by the number of units on offer - the amount of people owning units is irrelevant. If 10% of a funds members leave, it has no direct bearing on the unit price.
The only reason it MAY impact the unit price is if the fund is very large and needs to sell down significant amounts of stock to provide capital to those exiting and that in turn results in said stocks dipping in price. Spaceship are too small to have any impact on FAANG stock price so this does not apply here.
Hey you're a member of The Movementarians too?
The people at Spaceship bought tech stocks during a boom in tech stocks and probably thought they were top stock pickers.
I withdrew my cash just after it started to crash. A bit down but still way higher than where I’d be if I left it in.
They bought Kogan at ~$18….enough said.
Don’t worry Bryna has a five year plan in place, it’ll bounce back.
Look at the sharemarket index chart from 1980 until now. Through the recession of late 1980s, 2000, 2009/10 it has gone relentlessly up (and further past they are smaller they look, like a tiny bump). Unless you really need the money for life saving surgery just keep dollar cost averaging.
I started investing in ETFs in July last year, I'm currently 3k in the red. Just have to keep DCAing and wait for it to pull back up.
The last time I looked at Spaceship a couple of years' ago, it was all about investing in tech shares with very little diversification. It looked like a disaster waiting to happen.
FAANG makes up 17% of the SPX. They're responsible for carrying the rest of the 83% 💩 stonks in the index.
Whole market is crushed at the moment, I'm sticking with them.
Never put in more than you can afford to lose.
Don't put all your eggs in one basket?
I re-read the OP and saw that he put his life savings in there…
Hopefully you invested before the start of this year OP? Like in 2019? Because I’d say that if you started investing then that there’s still a fair way for the market to fall back down to that level.
Share market goes up and down, but trended up since inception. You should be investing over multiple years, and not worrying about the (relatively minor) ups and downs along the way. The trend is what matters.
Never invest (gamble) what you're willing to lose.
Either sell and cut your losses, or hold and hope for it to go back up.
Yes i saw this Continuation of losses and withdrew all of my funds at a smaller loss earlier in the year. Put in Stocks via like Superhero, Stake, and thinktrade
Now combined all of my stocks, they are down at a greater loss.But at very least the investment is in good companies. So i expect in coming years to break even and go in profits.
But hey at very least in Australia we can claim tax deduction on these losses. That a big plus to us. Just withdraw slowly to get your losses back in form of tax deductions.
But some companies have seriously let me down so much
LIKE FML ZIP pay
I bought them at $6.7 dude, now they are like $1.7. this company is seriously driving me nutz. I will never ever invest in Zip again. I had lost so much money because of them
I bought them at $6.7 dude, now they are like $1.7.
You'll get 4x more stonks if you BTFD.
Yes, I am not buying any more of this F ed up company with poor managements, directors etc.
so buy a good company…
@Worf: https://www.canstar.com.au/investor-hub/australian-blue-chip…
Z1P is a growth stock and much riskier than investing in blue chip shares. I just invest in ETFs. Less potential profits but also less potential losses.
you know you can't claim a loss as a deduction. needs to be offset against a gain. otherwise you need to carry your losses until you do have a gain.
it can offset taxable salary from employer ?
Nope only from a gain like Mr Haj said. I’ve got a loss from 10 years ago that can still be used.
@bobwokeup: Really can it be carried forward ? Like i mean if e.g. sell it now at a greater loss (and claim it in a couple years against like property capital gains or another stock capital gains tax? or you mean hold it until that financial year which I would planning to sell them and deduct against gain in the same financial year?
That is ordinary income, not a capital gain. I think it can be against capital gains from other asset classes such as property (and crypto now too I guess?)
No, only gains from selling shares at profit
@buckster: OMG i was so uneducated about it, I thought losses could be offset from salary's tax. I hope i can make a profit in future good enough to offset my losses.
@USER DC: Yeah capital losses are only deductible from capital gains. But they can carry forward a few years so it isn't like you need to immediately sell something at profit if you sell something at loss
@buckster: I really wish i knew this before, I thought they could offset tax from salary, or Dividend payments. But no the stupid government made it no easy. they will take all the profits but wont share the losses. I'll be ditching the current government coming election.
The amount of money i had lost is a bit too big for me, So i will sell my shares ASAP just to break even ASAP.
probably would never invest in shares.@USER DC: I wouldn’t sell I would HODL until the price goes back up. If you did sell and make a loss you can claim that against a future share/crypto gain.
Spaceship is nothing more than modern marketing with some fancy graphic design created to dupe millennials out of their money. Their fees as a percentage are horrendous and their investment strategy is awful. But because they are the ‘shiny new thing’ and their marketing and image is modern and fresh it appeals to the younger naïve crowd. They have made a killing fleecing the uninformed Tik-Toc crowd. Low cost index ETFs consistently over time beat any professional stock picker, and Spaceship isn’t even professional!
Don't they just invest in ETFs? Thought their fee was 0% for first $5,000
Aren't all microinvesting apps more expensive than traditional investing? Isn't that the cost of trading in smaller volumes? Lol it is probably a great service for younger people with less money and less income.Think they changed their fee structure since then. There was a whole post about it for people wanting to leave.
The fee structure is now $2.50 per month if you have $100 or more invested. That's 30% per annum in fees. There isn't a fund on the planet as expensive as SpaceShip for microinvesting.
Surely it's not $2.50 per month per $100? So yeah it'd be ~30% if you only had $100 invested but would be a lot less if you had a larger amount invested (though yeah still on the high side for the industry).
@apsilon: It's a flat $2.50 per month. You can "trade" as much as you like (deposit / withdraw), no other fees.
https://www.spaceship.com.au/important-documents/fee-changes…
I was hoping you might invest in me. You should get a return once you find me. If not maybe you could invest in guns and tanks that way when WW3 starts you have a head start on everyone else and jack up the price and sell them. Just looking forward and no they never go down in price.
HODL
Management fee is eating up monthly :(
Being reactionary the second the market goes down is how you lose money. Invest, wait a few years, then come back.
The only truth about the sharemarket is that you make a profit/loss when you SELL.
It’s been going down ever since I joined up over 6 months ago.
You can now buy the same stonks cheaper.
Markets don't only ever go up. I'm sure if you did some research before 'investing' your life savings you would know this.
That being said spaceship, raiz and all these other back yard mobs make fees from the lazy.
webjet shares are down :(
HODL - simple
Luckily I got out of spaceship when they massively increased their fees just before Christmas.
The timing of their fee announcement was perfect. They timed the top of the market and gave people warning to leave.
I only have a few thousand in Spaceship and it was performing well last yr.
But now they've got account keeping fees, and my account is also in the red.
Not too concerned about being in the red, but the account fees on top of that are a bit annoying.When it gets slightly into the green, I'll most likely cash out… not a fan anymore.
Also used to like reading the emails, but now some of them sound a bit desperate, like they're trying to hold on to their users.
Some of their investments choices are performing very poorly too…but the account fees on top of that are a bit annoying.
It's always better to buy spot instead of managed funds or ETF.
No fees, no worries.
The emails got very cringe very quickly haha
Helloo I’m in a similar position actually where I have $2.2k in but have a negative return of $800. Question, are you still going to invest in it while waiting for it go back to green ?
I have $2.2k in but have a negative return of $800. Question, are you still going to invest in it while waiting for it go back to green ?
You should buy when it's red and sell when it's green.
Do what every bad investor does. Sell everything while the market is down. Crystallise your losses wait till it rises again. Then get back in at the high point reinvesting all your money. Then rinse and repeat till your broke.
Or don’t look at the daily fluctuations. Think of it as long term investment 10 years or more investment and be happier.
Or just stick it in Superannuation
You are investing in a managed funds with 'high growth" ( assuming you are on the universe portfolio) shares. To start with, your horizon should be 5-7 years or even 10 years. At this moment, all high growth shares (vs value shares) are down 30% on average. Unless you need cash super urgently, just hold, they will come back eventually.
Spaceship has gone downhill esp after they introduced higher fees. Just stick to ETF
You are gambling. Good luck mate. Thanks for supporting the spaceship
Those saying HODL are wrong.
What do you do when Ozbargain has a special?
Buy! This is the cheapest it’s been in months, buy all the Spaceships!
i like this
Buy more! (Of something different)
Investing your life savings into one sector is pretty stupid.
Spreading money around in different markets to balance a portfolio is silly.
Find a market and/or assets with asymmetric bets, go in hard and with high conviction.
How's that working out for OP
The lizard 🧠 in people is their biggest enemy when it comes to investing.
People like OP have zero conviction when they invest. They think it's cool to throw a bit of money in the market and call themselves an investor or trader.
OP like all scared money doesn't have a plan. They FOMO when they see green and sell when it turns red. OP should train their lizard 🧠 to buy more when the price is down and sell when it starts to go up.
Apps like these are dangerous if you don’t understand where your money is actually going.
The number of people at work I’ve had to educate is astounding.
So many people think it’s a savings account with good interest. They don’t understand it’s an investment account and everything could be wiped out if the market crashes.
Apps like these are dangerous if you don’t understand
The majority of people with pensions and super funds don't know where their money is invested. They think the money is safe because the scheme is supported by the feds.
They don’t understand it’s an investment account and everything could be wiped out if the market crashes.
Most people don't understand that pension and super funds can damp to -99.99% if the market crashes.
I pulled out when they announced the $2.50 per month. So lucky I did because now I can put in $10,000 worth which will make the $2.50 worth it. But not sure when
Their new fee structure is actually very cheap if you invest $100k or more. It works out to be way cheaper than Vanguard's VTS/VEU combo.
If you invest 7 figures, its even cheaper. I'm wondering if I should transfer my etfs from selfwealth, just a bit worried on their custodian model with IB.
I'm wondering if I should transfer my etfs from selfwealt
You may get 👊 with CGT.
The problem is that they are picking their own investments whereas VTS is an index and therefore is not at risk of shitty stock selection.
Its mixed well enough for me. There is a limit on how much diversification affects ones portfolio after holding more than 20 stocks.
https://www.investopedia.com/investing/dangers-over-diversif…
The whole point of Spaceship is to dollar cost average ie. Invest regularly regardless of price so the overall gain is in line long term. Yes its down at the moment but if you are still investing then as the market trends up over time your investments tick up overall. Spaceship is where I DCA money, LICs and ETFs are hard to DCA due to brokerage costs.
You can easily DCA into Raiz, which invests in ETFs. Stockspot is another app that lets you DCA into ETFs I think (haven’t used it but pretty sure it’s similar to Raiz), also Six Park. I’m not sure if Vanguard still offer their retail funds but they were another option.
My Raiz portfolio is doing a lot better than my Spaceship one did even on the Aggressive portfolio, for obvious reasons (I.e. it’s much more diversified).
DCA and BTD unless you really need the money
i don't like spaceship though as an actively managed fund with $$ fees and heavy exposure to NASDAQ/tech
unless you have a lot of faith in the team i'd just go for a broad ETF like DHHF/VDHG
or yolo with BTC/TSLA
"I'm getting worried as this is my life savings"
bahahahahahaahahahahahahahahaha
Ever heard of 'diversification'
.
Diversification is protection against ignorance. It makes little sense if you know what you are doing. – W. B.
All that asset management, diversification, that’s for idiots. You can’t diversify enough to know what you’re doing. – M. C
username checks out….
Warren Buffets portfolio has over 20 different companies in it
he also has investments in property both residential and commercial
in addition to that he also has money in a few venture capitals
He clearly hasnt got rich YOLO'ing his money on Z1P
…………….92% actively managed funds are beaten by simply low-fee index funds - over the long term.
So based on 'facts' not BS quotes you can diversify yourself enough to 'not' know what you are doing by taking the boring simply path. - you will make money and do better then most people who 'think' they know what they are doing.
I pulled all my money out of spaceships - had only put a few hundred in there just to see how it goes - not because of the decline due to the share market, but because of their fee changes. The fee changes made it much much worse than before.
I've been watching people complain about this on the FB groups and there are a couple of things to consider here.
First, Spaceship is a very specific tech oriented fund and should only be a portion of your investments. Ideally Spaceships good times should balance out so when some of your other investments are down the Spaceship tech/future stuff is up.
Second, most people joined Spaceship in the good times and only saw their money go up but skipped over the notification that Spaceship is a suggested 7 year minimum investment.
The months and years where it goes up 40% will be balanced out by the years where it drops 10, 20, 30 percent? I think that people who stay the course will likely see a good average return over that time.
Perhaps unfortunately for most people they are only going to have the courage to buy when the unit price is high and panic sell when it drops so wont see the long term benefit, but totally understand if you want to take your profits and put it elsewhere.
The most worrying thing is the amount of people I've seen who use spaceship as their only "savings account" and are now losing their house deposits and life savings and things of that nature. That's not how the account should be used and maybe Spaceship need to do more to remind people of this in their marketing, but I can see how it would be very tempting to accumulate under educated customers while things are booming.
These fintech apps are working as designed. They rope in plebs for liquidity to get them rekt.
OP, you haven't "lost" anything.
The value may have dropped, but as you haven't sold and locked in any losses you haven't lost a cent.
The choice is whether you want to jump out (and if so, what are you going to do with your money anyway?), or just stick it out and let it sit there.Are they actually managing (selling, buying, reselling etc) or is it just stock holding.
If its the later and you don't need the cash for anything else, just chill and leave it there.If they are actively trading and you're losing, you need to determine whether you're prepared to keep doing that or getting out of the game for a bit.
$2k losses isn't a whole lot tbh. Don't stress, and look long term. There's no such thing as quick and easy money. It's either quick and hard, or long and easy… not both.
Dont worry, just leave the money in spaceship alone and put more in, in fact now is the time to put double in, as much as you can, the stock market will bounce back after the war.
Didnt see this! But highly reccommend it bdyor
Success Fee
0% – 1.61%¹/year
Only when your investment outperforms the market and hits an all-time high, we charge a 20% success fee. It is reasonably estimated to range from 0%-1.61% per year.What a ripoff.
not at all, performance fees only kick in if they are outperforming the market and then only on the delta. In short if you're paying this fee your investment is doing exceptionally well.
I prefer zero fees.
They're already charging 0.49% pa which is way above market. Then adding more fees on top of that because they achieved what you're already paying them for is definitely a rip off.
Have a look at unhedged, its algo trading. Ive had money in for about 5 months now. They lend to move assets out when the market isnt doing so well. As a consequence they usually make smaller losses when the market is down, but then move into equities on the early stages of a rally. Worth a look, the fees are success based as well.
its algo trading
Algo trading apps are a scam. It's packaged and promoted to rope in inexperienced investors to pay high fees in return for average performance.
If they really figured out an algorithm to consistently beat the market & make stacks of money, why would they share it with the common pleb?
https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/archive/374pprym
ATO does not care unless you claim wash out sell.