Australian Taxpayers' Alliance Launch, $30 off (Normally $90), NSW Only

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taxpayers.org.au

• 

  _Bruce_ on 11/04/2012 - 12:38

  +1

  Political rubbish only.

• 

  laser on 11/04/2012 - 12:39

  I thought this was Ozbargain, not Ozpolitics! I vote against freeloading publicity seekers such as the OP!

• 

  _Bruce_ on 11/04/2012 - 12:42

  +1

  Just looked up some of the people behind this. Almost all of them have very strong ties to the federal oposition. Anyone surprised?

• 

  Aap Ke Papa on 11/04/2012 - 12:43

  what is this???? And I hate politics

• 

  rjblakel on 11/04/2012 - 12:43

  -1

  Wow, should I have marked "I know this won't be for everyone" in bold?

  • 

    _Bruce_ on 11/04/2012 - 12:47

    +1

    Well $60 to have someone tell me how hard I'm doing, and it's all the governments fault, and if I vote them out everything will be unicorns and rainbows is not required. I can tell you that right now and save the money.

    Thus - not a bargain.

    • 

      salem on 11/04/2012 - 13:39

      you should at least charge $10. cover your costs, you know… ;)

  • 

    Postulative on 11/04/2012 - 15:55

    No, you shouldn't have posted at all.

• 

  Spinner on 11/04/2012 - 12:47

  +3

  How can this be political rubbish? They support 'freedom fighters'.

  Freedom! Families! No nanny state! No Taxes! Ignore climate change science because then it can't be real!

  Seriously, this seems like a lame attempt to replicate the Tea Party in the US, which alone is reason enough to vote it down.

  To keep my point politically neutral, I would vote down anyone posting for Get Up as well, since quasi party fronts are dangerous. They inevitably end up with an expanded agenda that only reflects the people at the head of the organisation, not the people they profess to represent. Admittedly, full political parties share many of the same issues, but are at least accountable in some way through both internal and public elections. For the record, I am a swing voter, I am pretty sure I haven't voted the same way at consecutive federal elections.

  This post is a waste of time, and of $30. I feel deeply sorry for anyone who pays $90.

• 

  chingy213 on 11/04/2012 - 12:47

  Platorian!!!!!!

  Viva Viktory!!!

• 

  scampy on 11/04/2012 - 12:50

  -1

  Go away hippy

  • 

    _Bruce_ on 11/04/2012 - 12:52

    I don't think hippy is the term you are looking for…

    • 

      retiredfeline on 11/04/2012 - 13:19

      Actually some of those old fossils may have been hippies in paleolithic times, until they discovered money. :P

• 

  k on 11/04/2012 - 12:53

  -2

  wtf is this shit? these idiots are trying to reduce the tax we pay but are probably using taxpayers money to run this bullshit.

  • 

    _Bruce_ on 11/04/2012 - 12:56

    +1

    Not yet, they are still in opposition. For now they are spending their own money, so that they can have access to yours after you vote for them. See also: investment.

• 

  massari on 11/04/2012 - 12:57

  -1

  spam…

• 

  Spinner on 11/04/2012 - 12:57

  A note to Mods, please under no circumstance interfere with this post by unpublishing it (I don't know if it breaks any rules and I am not accusing it of doing so) or moving it to the forum.

  The response to this will say quite a bit about the OzBargain community…

  • 

    neil on 11/04/2012 - 13:15

    +3

    Yes sir! Anything else I can do for you?

    • 

      medium_tight on 11/04/2012 - 13:32

      Ozbargain gathering!!!

    • 

      salem on 11/04/2012 - 13:41

      waffles!

      • 

        neil on 11/04/2012 - 13:44

        +2

        Free Coffee?

        But back to the deal, I think the bigger question we need to ask this organisation is will this event be catered?

      • 

        whichtyler on 11/04/2012 - 14:53

        I Was Told There Would Be Punch And Pie

  • 

    AntMan76 on 11/04/2012 - 13:19

    +1

    So many ozbargain community reps these days.

    I am finding it hard to keep track of who my rep is.

• 

  dzhay on 11/04/2012 - 13:01

  I love how the platform is articulated - in flowery, inarticulate prose.

  Join my party, we stand against vapid slogans, far rights politics branded as free speech and the suggestion that Australia (or America) has been "taken over". Tom Switzer will not be attending.

• 

  kusama on 11/04/2012 - 13:12

  Why would anyone pay for this

• 

  Nezuji on 11/04/2012 - 13:17

  I didn't realise that political party launches were such hot events that they commanded ticket prices like these! In fact, I was rather under the impression that grass-roots political movements tended to be characterised by free rallies, at which fundraising activities such as sausage sizzles are presented…

• 

  c64 on 11/04/2012 - 13:47

  +1

  spam

• 

  andy19363 on 11/04/2012 - 14:59

  -1

  Whilst I'm usually uncomfortable with the "What's in it for me?" notion…….

  What's in it for me?

  • 

    Postulative on 11/04/2012 - 15:57

    +1

    A chance to pay money to support "freedom fighters" from the Liberal Party.

• 

  Postulative on 11/04/2012 - 15:54

  +2

  Sounds like the coalition of politicians who support large businesses at the expense of businesses.

  You're labelling Nick Minchin a "freedom fighter"? That's just hilarious.

  Now take the politics off Ozbargain.

• 

  Postulative on 11/04/2012 - 16:04

  While I'm here, getting annoyed by this post, I am curious: can Nick Minchin and Eric Abetz please explain how they have been supportive of free speech? Can they explain their position on ACTA, and whether its discussion should be open to public debate? Can they explain why Bob Brown was not permitted to exercise his rights as a parliamentary representative when George W came to town (and why half of Canberra was closed down for an occupying force of US personnel)?

  If they're opposing the nanny state, do they oppose Abbott's plan to subsidise nannies?

  And what did they do to stop the Howard government from blowing money in the biggest boom the Australian economy has seen, simply to prevent the opposition from being able to make any election promises?

  On the subject of a free economy, do the people in this group support the Australia-United States trade agreement, and the resulting pressure on Medicare and the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme? Do they promote Australia's decisions over many years to align its trademark and copyright laws with those of the US, so that a work doesn't escape from copyright until 70 years after the creator has died?

  If the topic on which I'm posting is going to be so blatantly political, without any action by mods, then I am perfectly within my rights to respond accordingly.

• 

  chuq on 11/04/2012 - 16:40

  I created an account solely to vote this down. Sadly, I then found I couldn't until my account is 30 days old. So instead I will say this…

  • Who pays the carbon tax? Companies who pollute more than a certain amount of carbon dioxide into the air. Odds are, no-one reading this.
  • Who pays the mining tax? Companies who make more than a certain amount (many, many millions) of profit from the resources in the ground. Odds are, no-one reading this.
  • Who pays income tax? Almost every single person reading this post does - and income tax will be cut as of next financial year (July 1, the same time the carbon tax comes in. The income tax cuts are being funded by the carbon tax. Is the coalition going to roll back the income tax cuts when they roll back the carbon tax, and how are they going to cover the shortfall?)

  Makes this rant about being "for the taxpayers" quite pathetic, it is the complete opposite.

  • 

    Spinner on 11/04/2012 - 18:30

    +2

    Welcome to OzBargain

    I have to agree with the detail of your points, although I generally agree with the theme:
    * People will pay the carbon tax when the companies pass it on. Households will get compensated in a variety of ways, but basically the cost stuff will go up, albeit by a pretty small amount.
    * Unlike the carbon tax, the mining tax won't cost consumers a cent, since mineral and ore prices are a commodity. So you are partly right that people won't pay for it as a tax. What it does men is reduced returns for shareholders. Almost everyone has shares of some form, generally through superannuation, although some people hold them directly. A big chunk of this money will end up going into superanuation and small business tax costs.
    * Any savings in income tax will be lost to the carbon tax. For most people, there will be little or no net gain or loss from the amount. Some low income earners might be slightly better off, some high income earners might be worse off. Your milage may vary.

    Voters should be aware of the following:
    * Abbott plans to add 1.5% to the tax rate of large companies to pay for his super-sized middle class welfare maternity leave scheme.
    * Mining companies don't contribute as many jobs as people will believe, only around 1-2%. The sector is wildly profitable, due to doubling of almost all commodity prices in the last 10 years. They also trade by selling non-renewable resources.

    In my opinion both parties have demonstrated that they are thoroughly incompetent, or alternatively deceptive (it is hard to tell which side is doing which more) over the last few years. The preceding statements were not intended as an endorsement or criticism, rather a reflection on how most people don't fully grasp the economics or detail behind these issues. If I have got something wrong, corrections are welcome.

• 

  zephram on 11/04/2012 - 18:46

  +1

  I really hoped for a moment that these were people who were really happy about paying taxes and all the cool roads, schools, hospitals, garbage collection and subsidised University education it buys them?

  • 

    retiredfeline on 11/04/2012 - 18:52

    +1

    I think the education bit hasn't worked on some people. :(

• 

  pmupsinep on 11/04/2012 - 19:43

  neg, because all of these anti-government-waste morons are on centrelink benefits, and they are wasting our oxygen.

• 

  [Deactivated] on 12/04/2012 - 01:42

  +2

  Please people.

  Just because this is still here doesnt mean that Ozbargain supports the political views expressed or this type of post, or any of those for or against the politics expressed.

  The mods are individually surprised at this posting, but does it breech our current guidelines on a post? and will/should we permit such posts in the future? that is something we will be discussing.

  So instead of just telling us its spam, politics, etc etc. Look at our current posting guidelines and tell us.

  1. Why under the current rules it shouldn't be here and/or
  2. How we can re write the rules to cover this so it's clear things like this cant be posted.

  This is not to declare my personal views which isnt the issue here under my moderators hat. And frankly many of the comments here should be deleted under the same argument that those who oppose this posting but only use political arguments to support their vote.

  To me the issue is centred around, the fact that this is for a launch, its not a discounted membership, this is a one off launch with a price that we cannot (and will never be able to) determine if this is a "fair" price or one inflated just to give an appearance of a discount.

  And like our parliamentary friends we need time to look at all the implications leaving/removing this rather than quickly reacting.

  • 

    _Bruce_ on 12/04/2012 - 10:53

    I agree this is tricky. I think that this particular case did not sell itself as a bargain, just a discount, but something in the future could be.

    For example:
    See Persons X and Y speak, fomous for A and B, tickets for other presentations have sold for $200, now for only $60…

    Another option is to allow the post and let people mod it down, as happened here. I'm not sold on this idea, but it avoids the need for rules that some people may object to, and keeps OzB mods at arms length.

  • 

    retiredfeline on 12/04/2012 - 11:20

    +1

    Just hold a poll asking: Should items of political or religious nature be allowed on OzBargain? I think the majority of respondents will say NO. Practically all items of these natures are impossible to evaluate for their bargain nature, are thinly disguised ads, and generate flames. Many other forums ban these two categories too so there is precedent. There are sufficient websites for the keen to find these items anyway.

    Or just impose the rule by fiat.

  • 

    Postulative on 12/04/2012 - 12:18

    Fine. Please open a discussion whether any "discount" that involves politics, religion, political discussion or other issues that are likely to inflame sentiment should be permitted on Ozbargain.

    I'm thinking not just of this, but of Hillsong, Scientology and other "discounts" that are only a bargain if one has already bought into a particular philosophy.

    My personal preference would also be to ban anything that suggests a health benefit but doesn't have scientific backing, but I don't think the steroid pushers are quite as dangerous as the politics/religion pushers.

  • 

    Spinner on 12/04/2012 - 13:14

    I am not sure banning stuff outright is the right solution. It seems the -10ish net vote sort of took care of it. In my opinion (I keep saying that to remind people that it is just that) one problem with Australian society is a complete reluctance to discuss politics/religion/sex in any sort of sensible rational fashion. Banning stuff can sometimes let stuff go unchallenged.

    I am not really a fan of hiding all votes with a - count either, especially since some of the best comments in these threads come in response to someone saying something stupid. A functional community should be able discuss points rationally, although that is at odds with 'the internet'.

    As for the OP, it was a bit preachy but not hugely so (he made it clear that it was a personal opinion too). My bigger concern was he didn't list himself as a rep, yet he kept using 'our'. If stuff is kept reasonably neutral it shouldn't be a huge problem. If stuff isn't neutral, people will comment and respond in pretty quick fashion.

    But if a political party was to discount membership, wouldn't this be a useful bargain to someone looking to join? Shouldn't a religious organisation be able to sell discounted tickets to an event? I suspect the votes and comments would cast more light on extremist politics or cults (looking at you Paradise/Hillsong Church).

    I get the ban on sex stuff, because we don't want hundreds of threads about free porn or cheep hookers. That, and it is good to keep it all PG.

    To just blanket ban stuff shows a lack of faith in the OzBargain community, which is generally pretty sensible. If we end up with hundreds of posts about religion/politics, I would agree with a rule, but for the for the moment, the status quo seems fine to me.