Victoria’s Best Performing Schools (Herald Sun)

Hi all,

The Herald Sun released the “top 100” performing schools,

Unfortunately it’s behind a paywall, so happy if anyone can share the list.

The headline suggests that private schooling dominates the list.

For all the OzB parents, will you be stretching yourselves (I.e using home equity, taking a loan etc) to send your kids to a private school?

Obviously there will also be parents in OzB where private schooling isn’t a stretch. To those parents, are you still shooting private schooling if the local public school is ok?

Comments

  • +2
  • +1

    Private schools dominate the list.

    Don't forget school fees + additional cost of tuition. I hardly think paying annual school fees would get you 99.9 automatically. If that is the case then we'll have very competent politicians.

  • +4

    For all the OzB parents, will you be stretching yourselves (I.e using home equity, taking a loan etc) to send your kids to a private school?

    Nope.

  • For all the OzB parents, will you be stretching yourselves (I.e using home equity, taking a loan etc) to send your kids to a private school?

    In my wider-team in the office (where everyone is on six-figure salaries), I've noticed that every time they announce "restructures" (happens once or twice each year), the ones that seem to stress the most about losing their jobs are not the ones who have mortgages, but actually those who have got their kids in private schools.

    • Yep I can see why. Having to move schools etc would be pretty impactful to a teenager, maybe even more so than moving houses

      • There is a percentage of the student population that will always change schools at the end of Year 6 (moving from primary to secondary).
        There is another percentage of the student population that change secondary schools, usually around Year 9.

        Surely it is just a life skill to be able to cope.

        • +2

          Yes, but I imagine having to move a yr11 from a private school (where friendship have been established etc) to a local public school because of a lack of funds may be quite impactful.

          It’s certainly a first world problem and not something that can’t be overcome,

          • @popcornready: Impactful, sure.
            But that Yr11 student will leave that school in the next year or so anyway.
            Leaving a school does not equate to losing a friendship.

    • Probably because they're not only having mortgages but also having to pay private school fees

  • +12

    Firm believer that its not the school that dictates the success of a student. It's the student's attitude and willingness to learn which can be influenced by any number of things in life. Perhaps being around snobby rich kids helps with that, but it's certainly not the only way to a successful life.

    • +3

      Agree, and the $35k per child you save gives a lot of extra cash for activities to enriching their lives in other ways.

      Very happy with the education my children are receiving in public school

    • It may even be counter-productive to send a kid to a high-performing school if they don't have the right attitude or intelligence level. They could become withdrawn and rebel because they feel like they're not as good as everyone else and can never catch up, etc.

      • -3

        Some people complete their education at high priced private schools only to end up as concreters and brick layers. They probably end up better of financialy than if they continued onto university. Their parents must be so proud.

        • +14

          Their parents must be so proud.

          You implying that parents shouldn't be proud if their kids end up becoming concreters or brick layers? Not everyone wants a white collar job. Why shame them?

          Back when I worked at a cafe years ago, I met a local business owner. She told me she went to private school and a top uni for law. Graduated and decided that she didn't want to become a lawyer. She wanted to do nails instead, so she got a job at a nail salon, worked her way up and eventually opened her own nail salon (provided other health and beauty services too). Drove around in a bright yellow Porsche. I'd be quite proud of her.

          • @buckethat: Being a tradie is the best in this country. Why? Because it isn't on the list of skills in demand. Look at accountants. Most of the ones that migrate end up on less than average salaries.

            You can be a labourer that doesn't speak that much english and making $400 a day. I can assure you an accountant that doesn't speak that much english won't be making $400 a day unless they drive Uber / Taxis.

    • +6

      It's student selection that largely determines the ranking of the school. The top two schools are state schools that have selective entry policies.

      Private schools give scholarships to high performing students to bring their averages up. Having parents who value education is another factor in academic success so the fees do influence student selection.

      • Good point.

    • The education doesn't really differ much in public compared to private. Apparently the greater chances of networking and having connections with people 'of wealth" or "higher ups" in society are some of the bigger reasons why parents send their kids to private schooling.

      Don't know if it's true but it's what I've been told by someone whose family is "old money".

      • TBH, that probably only applies to two or three schools, and is more likely to be the case where the parent(s) have attended the same or a similar school.

        On the other hand, "networking" is just that; it is not limited to any particular socio-economic group and could just as easily be a group of people that did apprenticeships together.

      • +1

        Apparently the greater chances of networking and having connections with people 'of wealth" or "higher ups" in society are some of the bigger reasons why parents send their kids to private schooling.

        To be bullied by rich kids. Way more prestigious.

    • I believe a school can have an influence on a student's ATAR. The parents who send their kids to a prestigious private school, generally are from a higher socioeconomic background, and generally place a higher emphasis on education, hence are generally smarter, therefore their kids generally have a willingness to learn to fulfil their parent's high standards. A lot of the influence towards education starts at home from parents.

      However, once you hit uni, its a whole different ballgame. Socio-economics don't matter.

      • +2

        Everything you just said started and ended with the parent, and not the school.

        • The school pretty much tailors their teaching to obtain a high ATAR. Lots of practice exams starting from year 9s, strong student cohort makes it easier to focus on teaching instead of behavioural control. Arguably better teachers, as what teacher would want to teach at a low socioeconomic school?

  • +1

    chool State overall score
    Melbourne High School 100
    Mac. Robertson Girls' High School 100
    Nossal High School, Berwick 100
    Suzanne Cory High School, Werribee 100
    Ballarat Clarendon College, Ballarat 100
    Presbyterian Ladies' College Burwood 100
    Haileybury College 100
    Fintona Girls' School, Balwyn 99
    Korowa Anglican Girls' School, Glen Iris 99
    Huntingtower School, Mount Waverley 99
    Camberwell Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Scotch College, Hawthorn 99
    Camberwell Girls Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Lauriston Girls' School, Armadale 99
    Yesodei Hatorah College, Elwood 99
    Trinity Grammar School, Kew 99
    Melbourne Grammar School 99
    Ruyton Girls' School Kew 99
    Penleigh and Essendon Grammar School 99
    St Leonard's College, Brighton East

  • +3

    School State overall score
    Melbourne High School 100
    Mac. Robertson Girls' High School 100
    Nossal High School, Berwick 100
    Suzanne Cory High School, Werribee 100
    Ballarat Clarendon College, Ballarat 100
    Presbyterian Ladies' College Burwood 100
    Haileybury College 100
    Fintona Girls' School, Balwyn 99
    Korowa Anglican Girls' School, Glen Iris 99
    Huntingtower School, Mount Waverley 99
    Camberwell Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Scotch College, Hawthorn 99
    Camberwell Girls Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Lauriston Girls' School, Armadale 99
    Yesodei Hatorah College, Elwood 99
    Trinity Grammar School, Kew 99
    Melbourne Grammar School 99
    Ruyton Girls' School Kew 99
    Penleigh and Essendon Grammar School 99
    St Leonard's College, Brighton East 99
    St Kevin's College, Toorak 99
    Waverley Christian College, Wantirna South 99
    Kilvington Grammar School, Ormond 98
    St Andrews Christian College, Wantirna South 98
    St Margaret's School, Berwick 98
    Box Hill High School 98
    Glen Waverley Secondary College 98
    Shelford Girls' Grammar, Caulfield 98
    Lighthouse Christian College, Cranbourne 98
    Methodist Ladies' College, Kew 98
    Tintern Grammar, Ringwood East 98
    University High School 98
    Mentone Girls' Grammar School 98
    The Kilmore International School 98
    St Catherine's School, Toorak 98
    Bialik College, Hawthorn 98
    Strathcona Baptist Girls' Grammar School, Canterbury 98
    Heathdale Christian College, Werribee 97
    Sacre Coeur, Glen Iris 97
    Ivanhoe Girls' Grammar School, Ivanhoe 97
    Balwyn High School 97
    Yarra Valley Grammar School, Ringwood 97
    The King David School, Armadale 97
    Caulfield Grammar School, St Kilda East 97
    Westbourne Grammar School, Truganina 97
    Melbourne Girls Grammar School, South Yarra 97
    Carey Baptist Grammar School, Kew 97
    Lowther Hall Anglican Grammar School, Essendon 97
    Donvale Christian College, Donvale 97
    Genazzano FCJ College, Kew 97
    Mount Scopus Memorial College, Burwood 97
    Wesley College, Elsternwick 97
    Wesley College, Glen Waverley 97
    Wesley College, Melbourne 97
    Toorak College, Mount Eliza 96
    The Knox School, Wantirna South 96
    Kardinia International College, Bell Post Hill 96
    Victorian College of The Arts Secondary School 96
    Loreto Mandeville Hall, Toorak 96
    Xavier College, kew 96
    Goulburn Valley Grammar School, Shepparton 96
    Brighton Grammar School, Brighton 96
    McKinnon Secondary College 96
    Firbank Grammar School, Brighton 96
    East Doncaster Secondary College 96
    Auburn High School, Hawthorn East 96
    Melbourne Girls' College 96
    Kingswood College, Box Hill 95
    Yeshivah College, St Kilda East 95
    Mentone Grammar School 95
    Vermont Secondary College 95
    Lighthouse Christian College, Keysborough 95
    Canterbury Girls Secondary College 95
    Ivanhoe Grammar School, Ivanhoe 95
    Mount Waverley Secondary College 95
    Peninsula Grammar, Mount Eliza 95
    Sacred Heart Girls' College, Oakleigh 95
    Mazenod College, Mulgrave 95
    Leibler Yavneh College, Elsternwick 95
    Southern Cross Grammar, Caroline Springs 95
    Brighton Secondary College 95
    The Geelong College, Newtown 95
    Oxley College, Chirnside Park 94
    Northcote High School 94
    Gippsland Grammar, Sale 94
    Geelong Grammar School, Corio 94
    Girton Grammar School, Bendigo 94
    Bacchus Marsh Grammar 94
    Alphington Grammar School 94
    Nunawading Christian College, Nunawading 94
    Highvale Secondary College 94
    St Paul's Anglican Grammar School 94
    Beth Rivkah Ladies College, St Kilda East 94
    Ballarat Grammar, Wendouree 94
    Glenvale School, Yarrambat 94
    Eltham College of Education Research 94
    Luther College, Croydon 94
    Brentwood College, Woodend 93
    Braemar College, Woodend 93
    Albert Park College 93

  • School State overall score
    Melbourne High School 100
    Mac. Robertson Girls' High School 100
    Nossal High School, Berwick 100
    Suzanne Cory High School, Werribee 100
    Ballarat Clarendon College, Ballarat 100
    Presbyterian Ladies' College Burwood 100
    Haileybury College 100
    Fintona Girls' School, Balwyn 99
    Korowa Anglican Girls' School, Glen Iris 99
    Huntingtower School, Mount Waverley 99
    Camberwell Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Scotch College, Hawthorn 99
    Camberwell Girls Grammar School, Canterbury 99
    Lauriston Girls' School, Armadale 99
    Yesodei Hatorah College, Elwood 99
    Trinity Grammar School, Kew 99
    Melbourne Grammar School 99
    Ruyton Girls' School Kew 99
    Penleigh and Essendon Grammar School 99
    St Leonard's College, Brighton East 99
    St Kevin's College, Toorak 99
    Waverley Christian College, Wantirna South 99
    Kilvington Grammar School, Ormond 98
    St Andrews Christian College, Wantirna South 98
    St Margaret's School, Berwick 98
    Box Hill High School 98
    Glen Waverley Secondary College 98
    Shelford Girls' Grammar, Caulfield 98
    Lighthouse Christian College, Cranbourne 98
    Methodist Ladies' College, Kew 98
    Tintern Grammar, Ringwood East 98
    University High School 98
    Mentone Girls' Grammar School 98
    The Kilmore International School 98
    St Catherine's School, Toorak 98
    Bialik College, Hawthorn 98
    Strathcona Baptist Girls' Grammar School, Canterbury 98
    Heathdale Christian College, Werribee 97
    Sacre Coeur, Glen Iris 97
    Ivanhoe Girls' Grammar School, Ivanhoe 97
    Balwyn High School 97
    Yarra Valley Grammar School, Ringwood 97
    The King David School, Armadale 97
    Caulfield Grammar School, St Kilda East 97
    Westbourne Grammar School, Truganina 97
    Melbourne Girls Grammar School, South Yarra 97
    Carey Baptist Grammar School, Kew 97
    Lowther Hall Anglican Grammar School, Essendon 97
    Donvale Christian College, Donvale 97
    Genazzano FCJ College, Kew 97
    Mount Scopus Memorial College, Burwood 97
    Wesley College, Elsternwick 97
    Wesley College, Glen Waverley 97
    Wesley College, Melbourne 97
    Toorak College, Mount Eliza 96
    The Knox School, Wantirna South 96
    Kardinia International College, Bell Post Hill 96
    Victorian College of The Arts Secondary School 96
    Loreto Mandeville Hall, Toorak 96
    Xavier College, kew 96
    Goulburn Valley Grammar School, Shepparton 96
    Brighton Grammar School, Brighton 96
    McKinnon Secondary College 96
    Firbank Grammar School, Brighton 96
    East Doncaster Secondary College 96
    Auburn High School, Hawthorn East 96
    Melbourne Girls' College 96
    Kingswood College, Box Hill 95
    Yeshivah College, St Kilda East 95
    Mentone Grammar School 95
    Vermont Secondary College 95
    Lighthouse Christian College, Keysborough 95
    Canterbury Girls Secondary College 95
    Ivanhoe Grammar School, Ivanhoe 95
    Mount Waverley Secondary College 95
    Peninsula Grammar, Mount Eliza 95
    Sacred Heart Girls' College, Oakleigh 95
    Mazenod College, Mulgrave 95
    Leibler Yavneh College, Elsternwick 95
    Southern Cross Grammar, Caroline Springs 95
    Brighton Secondary College 95
    The Geelong College, Newtown 95
    Oxley College, Chirnside Park 94
    Northcote High School 94
    Gippsland Grammar, Sale 94
    Geelong Grammar School, Corio 94
    Girton Grammar School, Bendigo 94
    Bacchus Marsh Grammar 94
    Alphington Grammar School 94
    Nunawading Christian College, Nunawading 94
    Highvale Secondary College 94
    St Paul's Anglican Grammar School 94
    Beth Rivkah Ladies College, St Kilda East 94
    Ballarat Grammar, Wendouree 94
    Glenvale School, Yarrambat 94
    Eltham College of Education Research 94
    Luther College, Croydon 94
    Brentwood College, Woodend 93
    Braemar College, Woodend 93
    Albert Park College 93

  • +9

    A rather pointless list I imagine, unless you also look at how the data was determined.
    And then look at the student enrolment practices at each school, and then look at the other strengths / weaknesses at each school, and probably the geographical distance to the school from your home, and if there is any expected religious affiliations, or out of hours participation……..the list goes on and on.
    Maybe also consider your own child's strengths and weaknesses, interests and dislikes, etc., as well.

  • -4

    Given how competitive jobs are now, it's really important your kid gets ahead and has the right connections.

    Earning 5 figures is not enough for a dignified lifestyle — think nice cars, pedigree dogs, good homes in leafy suburbs, eating out, wine, European tours etc.

  • +2

    Schools with children from higher socio economic backgrounds tend to do better. Have a look at https://www.myschool.edu.au/ as it shows where a school is performing relative to other schools with the same socio economic mix of students, so a fairer comparison.

  • +5

    These rankings are bs.

    1. Pay to win, yes paying for an elite private school does unlock stuff.
    2. Poorer schools have poorer kids, poorer kids have shitter lives, shitter lives = worse education.
    3. STOP FUNDING PRIVATE SCHOOLS FROM PUBLIC MONEY
    4. Your HSC marks mean jack shit.
    5. Go for early entry into uni.
    • -3

      Agree with:

      Pay to win, yes paying for an elite private school does unlock stuff.
      Poorer schools have poorer kids, poorer kids have shitter lives, shitter lives = worse education.
      STOP FUNDING PRIVATE SCHOOLS FROM PUBLIC MONEY

      Not this:

      Your HSC marks mean jack shit.

      • +6

        Your HSC marks mean jack shit.

        This is true. I a had friend who got atar in the 60s, started uni with a degree that required low 60s to get in.

        After one semester of mediocre grades, transferred into a Commerce degree at Monash which wouldve required high 80s ATAR to get in.

        I also have another friend who did something similar except with Melbourne Uni. Met several people throughout uni with similar stories.

        edit: just also want to add.. once you get your first 'real' job, your degree becomes worthless anyway as your industry experience now trumps your degree and which school it came from. As long as you have it, it doesn't really matter whether you went to Melbourne Uni or La Trobe. Plenty of senior level management and executives I've worked with have degrees from very small unis.

        May not be the case for everyone but has certainly been the truth for me and for plenty of people I know.

        • I agree with all of ^
          But I wouldn't say the HSC means jack shit. It can enable you to go directly into the course you want, saving time and money vs the transfer route.

  • +3

    Correlation is not causation.

  • +6

    There are good private schools, there are crap private schools. Same with public. The problems really happen at schools in lower socio-economic areas, where you have a higher likelihood of having patents who are dropkicks and don't value education. They pass this down to their kids, these kids then proceed to constantly disrupt the class, taking learning time away from the kids who want to learn. This then give the kids who do want to learn a worse outcome, even if they have the right attitudes.

    • +2

      That’s my high school experience in a nutshell.

  • I think this really depends on your local public school, and how easily you can afford a private school. As spending 35k/year on a private school isn't a big deal for us, and our local school is ranked around 330, we will definitely send our child to a private school.

    • +1

      Hopefully your child has the same expectations.

  • +1

    Some interesting insights above, great to read all the perspectives

    • Are you considering taking out a loan or something to send your child to a private school?

      • Not at all, just curious the thought process of what parents face when it comes time to decide

        For example, what if you own/live in an area where the public school is terrible?

        • +1

          You focus on sending your children to a selective government school, or alternatively send to a well regarded private school. Number 1 priority is trying to gain a government selective school entry.

          • @voo123: I would prefer to send my kids to a private high school than a selective high school simply due to distance. Many private high schools are close to me and the selective high schools are further away, hence there will be a need to get up earlier to get to school. I value time and convenience, even if it will cost me money.

            • @MissKitten1: Depends on your circumstances. If you have multiple kids, it would be advantageous to pay more for a house zoned to a good public school. Essentially you would pay more upfront for the property, but save more overall in school fees.

              If you have 1 kid, buying in a cheaper nearby suburb and sending them to a private school is a better option.

            • @MissKitten1: By the time kids attend a high school they make their own way there and do not like to be taken to school.

        • That's pretty much the situation where we are. Our kids aren't quite at the age to start school yet but close enough that we've been looking into it.

          I went to a state school and would prefer to send my kids to one too. But there are a ton of private schools in our area, almost all of which are religious schools - many with fees of under 10k a year. Given that it's not too difficult for even middle class families to scrape together 3-10k (or at least, a darn sight easier than 35k+), that generally leaves only the poor families in the area still going to the state schools.
          On the results from my research, the public schools all sat below the 30th percentile compared to other schools in Victoria for educational results. That's just too low for us to take a punt and hope. But on the other hand, we are a non religious household so I have no desire to send my child to a religious school either.

        • The published school fees (for private or religious schools) usually exclude quite a lot of other expenses:
          - Uniforms
          - Excursions / camps / overseas trips
          - Sports uniforms and equipment
          - A 'loan' for school infrastructure or resource development (this may be refundable)

          In relation to time / distance, most of the private or religious schools will have mandatory Saturday sport programmes, and not always at the school but at other school locations. Write off your Sat mornings for most of the year.

          • +2

            @GG57: You forgot:

            • Technology fees, iPad, rent a MacBook etc
            • Cadetship or whatever those crap are
            • Musical instruments, additional out of school tuition for the instruments then band fees
            • Voluntary (read: they will guilt trip you into paying) building contributions
            • Incursions
  • Easy buy a 3 mil house in the zone and send yah kids to Melb High School .
    Rent if you don't have that chum change .

    • +2

      Melbourne High is a public selective school. Any student can gain admission if they're smart enough.

      • As of 2011 there are four selective schools: Melbourne High School, Mac. Robertson Girls' High School, Nossal High School and Suzanne Cory High School.

        Top 4 in above lists.

        Re: selective schools, if they only admit students with highest scores, you get highest scores in the school’s results.

        As for private schools, scholarships attract highest scores or achievers or top range selective entrance score to negotiate with the school… I think we can see a pattern here.

        • So what is the top list of public schools away from selective .
          I'm sure already they have had extra spice on the price of real estate for in the zone .

    • Melb High School and Macrob do not have a zone, A child can only gain entry based on an exam.

  • Private schools should be banned - it cements wealth inequality
    Religious teaching in schools should be banned - it engenders false equivalence (& lack of critical) thinking

    I went to a very high performing private school

  • +2

    Back in 2005 when I was looking for a high school for my oldest child I studied Naplan scores like they were sporting results. Since then, I've come to realize that the main reason private schools perform better at Naplan is they are getting mostly high socio-economic kids.

    This article:
    https://grattan.edu.au/news/here-is-the-expensive-truth-abou…

    says:
    "The past three Pisa reports (the OECD’s international problem-solving test for 15-year-olds, in 2015, 2012 and 2009) all found that once student and school-level socio-economic background are considered, there is little discernible difference between the achievement of private school students and government school students."

    This article says something similar.
    https://www.theage.com.au/education/fourth-study-this-year-c…

    Also, there is a something I like to call the private school industrial complex where schools spend big bucks on state-of-the-art facilities.
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-08-13/rich-school-poor-scho…

    Very impressive, but does it make your kids smarter?

    My niece was attending a private school until one year they said they didn't have a place for her anymore. Basically, she got kicked out for not performing well enough.

    Look, I get it, we all want the best for our kids. If you lucky enough to have the cash to send your kids private then more power to you. But if you can't or don't believe in this stuff then you aren't ruining their lives.

    • +1

      My niece was attending a private school until one year they said they didn't have a place for her anymore. Basically, she got kicked out for not performing well enough.

      I think there's more to it than that, the majority of them would've spoken to the parents about the kid's non-performance or advise them to look elsewhere before taking the drastic option to get rid of them. Places don't disappear in a jiffy either.

  • -1

    Got to love a world in which you can buy your children a superior education.

    People think this falls under the banner of capitalism. Sadly its the complete opposite. Its socialism. For those of you without that superior private educaiton I will explain. Capitalism is based on the individual having the freedom to perform acts that allow them to achieve power, wealth and whatever else drives them by giving them the freedom to do so.

    A private school educaiton is not something an individual can choose to do. Its decided by the wealth of us, namely the parents. So its a form of socialism to pay for another person to be educated. Just as the taxpayers funds public education as a socialist system, so to do taxpayers plus parents fund the private system as a form of socialism.

    Its also a great way to treat the young how schools are like sneakers and only the wealthy get the good stuff. You want the branded ones and are a second rate citizen whose parents don't care aout you enough if you don't get given it. Those toff schools are in essence a pair of Nikes. Put the lower class in their place early!

  • You neglect schools which cater to "special learning" and for some odd reason think conventional pedagogy is the begin and end all. Are you from a dysfunctional school?

  • +1

    The actual suburb of the school is probably more relevant than if its public or private.

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