Advice Needed Someone bought a car returned to seller

L[Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 20:26
Last edited 17/07/2021 - 12:40 by 1 other user

Hello Ozbargain, I needed some advice from you guys,
One of me closeby friend had bought a car recently,
He trusted seller's words, who said car is mechanically very good, and great a to b car,
He literally only just started the car, (DID NOT TEST DRIVE OR INSPECT)
The seller seemed like a mechanic guy.
Seller had dropped the car at his house,

When he drove the car, he found big problems in the car, As soon as he found out problems in the car, he contacted seller asking to cancel the deal, ofcourse being such a private nature of buy and sell second hand vehicles, seller just simply did not reply. So my friend reversed the payment of the car which was done by bank transfer ( transaction reversal was successful). And straight away after transaction reversal, he returned the car to seller and said him to take the car back. Seller resisted to accept the car back ofcourse. started to threaten to call police for nuisance (he did not go inside his property, only stood on street). Eventually he left the car there away for the seller, leaving car and some CASH money there for seller's inconvenience (one of the parties from seller's side seemed okay with giving seller some money for cancelling the transaction). Seller of course did not get the car payment due to bank transaction reversal.

All the above was done within same day, and then a day later seller messages him back saying him to pick the car up, or he will contact police (threatening of police) on the basis of the fact that seller has rego papers stating the usual buying and selling of car/vehicle (the usual form thats filled out by both buyers and sellers in any Australian state for dealing with selling/buying a car). Friend did not transfer the car into his name. He only drove it couple times, firstly to test it after seller dropped the car, and then later to return the car to seller.

I totally understand its my friend's problem that he did not even check the car before buying it. AND I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT THIS WEBSITE IS NOT FOR LEGAL ADVICE, and personal opinions only.

Buy do you guys have any opinion on what seller can do, or is there major law breach or police will take some hard action against the friend?? the payment was reversed, so technically seller only got CASH payment that he left in car at seller's place.

Now he messaged saying that seller's reported this to police

Automotive

closed Comments

  • djones145 on 14/07/2021 - 20:28
    +1

    bikies

    • SF3 on 14/07/2021 - 20:51
      +1

      send to the buyer.

  • thatonethere on 14/07/2021 - 20:33
    +2

    How much money are we talking about? A $500 shitbox isn't going to interest the police.

    Was there a signed bill of sale? Did both parties sign the transfer orders?

    Probably the aggrieved party would have to go to xCAT in your state or territory to get their money as usually a private sale is "as is" and final.

    Amazed the bank agreed to take the money back. Normally that required the destination account owner to agree.

    • apsilon on 14/07/2021 - 20:38
      +2

      Amazed the bank agreed to take the money back. Normally that required the destination account owner to agree.

      So am I.

      Private car sales have no guarantee, it's up to the buyer to take all precautions. I think legally your "friend" could be in trouble.

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:06

      It was like around $ a grand and a half ish
      And both parties signed the standard paperwork of selling/buying a vehicle in their state/territory.

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:10

      Yes bank agreed because it was like a false statement to my friend on that car being mechanically good, so that why bank agreed to this, as like a false statement

      • brendanm on 14/07/2021 - 21:28
        +7

        Lol, that isn't a judgement for a bank to make.

        • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 22:55
          +3

          Well, they did. So too bad for the seller. Should have taken cash.

          So there are two lessons here, one for each side.

          • brendanm on 14/07/2021 - 23:00
            +1

            @[Deactivated]: I would question whether what they did was a valid thing to do, not sure they are even allowed to, or if the buyer lied about etc.

            As far as I'm aware, once a transfer has been made, it can't be cancelled. Once it has gone through, it can be disputed, and I doubt a private sale of a vehicle would satisfy the dispute process. I therefore doubt ops version of events. Happy for you to post information to the contrary.

            • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 23:03
              +2

              @brendanm: Yeah all valid things, but its too late for the seller though.

              I'm pretty sure that this entire post is made up trolling BS.

              • brendanm on 14/07/2021 - 23:03
                +4

                @[Deactivated]:

                I'm pretty sure that this entire post is made up trolling BS.

                The most logical conclusion I think.

                • mskeggs on 14/07/2021 - 23:09
                  +2

                  @brendanm: If you were thinking about doing some crooked stuff, you might ask in a few forums to see how your plan might work out.

            • Chandler on 15/07/2021 - 14:44

              @brendanm:

              As far as I'm aware, once a transfer has been made, it can't be cancelled.

              Depends. If it was something like an OSKO payment, then likely it wouldn't have been able to be cancelled. If it was a standard bank transfer, then that would be reconciled overnight (from my understanding) and so the bank may be willing to cancel the payment, since they hadn't actually made the transfer.

  • SBOB on 14/07/2021 - 20:36

    grabs popcorn

    dont parent teach kids basic life skills these days?

    • USER DC on 14/07/2021 - 22:15

      I wish they did

  • jackary on 14/07/2021 - 20:37
    +5

    Who’s to say your friend didn’t trash the car between getting it, and returning it to the seller?

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:06
      -3

      Who's to say that the seller did not trash the car before dropping the car and after friend inspecting it.

      • timthetoolman on 14/07/2021 - 21:15
        +4

        That would be your friend's fault for not driving it away after test driving

        • jackary on 14/07/2021 - 21:39

          See above

      • whitelie on 14/07/2021 - 22:10

        This essentially happened on a car I purchased a long time ago.
        Unbeknown to me, it was on consignment from the mechanic working in the workshop attached to the dealership.
        Test drove the car, was happy with it so placed a deposit and arranged finance. Came back a couple of days later, pick the car up and gearbox wasn't right the minute it went out the door. Obviously knew the car was sold, so took it out for one last thrash before they had to say goodbye.
        Because it was thru a dealer the box was replaced under warranty. If it was a private sale, essentially would have been up the creek but I would have driven it again before signing the papers.

        Signing the papers is agreeing to purchase the car. If a roadworthy isn't required for the sale, then it's as is. The lemon is now your friend's property and the seller can demand payment.

  • ozhunter on 14/07/2021 - 20:48
    +3

    Looks like you friend agreed to buy it and actually paid for it.

    that seller has rego papers stating the usual buying and selling of car/vehicle (the usual form thats filled out by both buyers and sellers in any Australian state for dealing with selling/buying a car).

    Tell your friend to pick up his car, and give the seller his money back

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:08
      -4

      My friend did not agree to a non mechincally good car

      • ozhunter on 14/07/2021 - 21:25
        +8

        Why did he sign the papers?

      • brendanm on 14/07/2021 - 21:56
        +3

        Then he should have had it inspected before purchase. Private sale is "as is".

      • mskeggs on 14/07/2021 - 23:07

        The sale says he agreed to buy.

  • CheapskateQueen on 14/07/2021 - 20:51
    +1

    I mean I don't know the answer to this "legally"

    seller complains to the cops that your mate entered into a transaction but never completed it. took thy car and claims it's a shit box so returned the car. buyer says I got scammed. I bought car, realised it's a shitbox, and took it back. even threw some money at the guy for nothing.

    yes seller could claim the buyer damaged it, but he can't prove it. what's the police going to charge the buyer with? theft? no. damage? based on what proof?

    yes the seller could take buyer to local court for breach of contract, and buyer will claim breach of implied warranty that the car works. magistrate cbb for this crap.

    your mates a dumb fudge though for buying a car without driving it

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:08
      -3

      Car was not damaged by my friend at all, have some minor dashcam footage of car being at the seller's place.

      And yes definitely agree on my friend being so dump to buy car without even driving it

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 22:58
      +1

      seller complains to the cops

      Cops tell the seller that it is a civil matter.

  • 87percent on 14/07/2021 - 20:58
    +3

    If I was the friend, I would be moving house too

    • mskeggs on 14/07/2021 - 23:07

      Agreed. Some people get cranky when they sell a car and the buyer defrauds them.

  • ozhunter on 14/07/2021 - 21:02

    Do you think the bank returning your friend the money absolves him of the contract?

    I guess you can wait until the seller posts those rego forms.

  • yellowfever on 14/07/2021 - 21:03

    Buyer is in breach of offer and acceptance.
    Buyer failed to make the transaction
    Buyer decided to breach the sale by not proceeding with a payment transaction and rescinding the acceptance of the offer.

    Buyer should purchase a kevlar vest to prevent bullets damaging the vital organs required to operate the intelligent brain.

  • epkh on 14/07/2021 - 21:10

    that seller has rego papers stating the usual buying and selling of car/vehicle (the usual form thats filled out by both buyers and sellers in any Australian state for dealing with selling/buying a car). Friend did not transfer the car into his name.

    I'm not entirely sure but can the seller also submit the registration paper instead of the buyer? If so, and it has been submitted by him, then the car would legally be your friend's, right? Not sure though what the police would do in that instance.

    If not, I guess there's no legal proof that the car is your friend's as transfer did not officially occur but come on; completing a sale of a car without even checking it is ridiculous. The 'hush-money' placed in the car as well proves that your friend also feels guilty of being a nuisance…

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:16

      Those papers only really state that the car was sold to friend from seller.

      Car had not been transferred into friend's name because he did not agree to take ownership of the car after receiving the car

      • epkh on 14/07/2021 - 21:17

        That's some super weird arrangement your friend had with the buyer but I think he should be fine then.

        • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:20

          Buyer always need to pay the VicRoad/ServiceSA/RTA/ etc something like that body to get vehicle into his name, (aka pay them some money) until then the car's rego remains under seller's name

      • [Deactivated] on 15/07/2021 - 11:08
        +1

        Seller can submit notice of disposal, It has your friends name on it and his license details, address, etc.
        If they do this then your friend is legally required to pay transfer fees and take ownership.

  • AndyC1 on 14/07/2021 - 21:10
    +1

    Get the car back and make sure you get the money. Then wait for the seller to turn up and ask for the car back.

    The police will not get involved as it's a civil mater and if he hands the paperwork in to the RTA or the equivalent in the state he is in then you will own the car and have the money. keep the car paperwork and make sure you get something that he signs to get the car back as he may put the paperwork into the motor registry and then you will get all of the fines and red light camera fines……

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:14

      All the paper work was left in the car when friend left the car at seller's place.

      Friend went to police and discussed about the situation, police said friend can dispute that he was not in the possesion of the car at the time of those driving offences if he decides to do that

      • AndyC1 on 14/07/2021 - 21:23

        Sounds like a recipe for disaster as courts and infringement department's love proof, not police verbal's or he said she said……

      • apsilon on 14/07/2021 - 21:35
        +1

        So the seller can submit all the signed paperwork, dump the car at/near your friends place and then say the car was basically stolen, that they'd sold it but got scammed. Even if the car were then later returned the seller could then come after them for damage to the vehicle.

        I think your friend is in a really bad position.

    • brendanm on 14/07/2021 - 21:59

      Registration is not ownership.

  • pegaxs on 14/07/2021 - 21:15
    +11

    Yeah, call me sceptical, but I don’t think that is how bank transfers work… An EFT is not the same as a credit card, you can’t just do a chargeback and take the car back later. Something about this story sounds like bullshit.

    • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 21:16
      -3

      It was all done within a couple hours, so it was not a big deal

      • Hardlyworkin on 14/07/2021 - 22:51
        +5

        Yeah nah

        • CheapskateQueen on 15/07/2021 - 07:40

          you can cancel an EFT if the bank hasn't actually transferred the money yet.

          I did it once. actually an OzB deal. the seller said she gave me the wrong bank details so I called to see if the transfer could be reversed. once a transfer has been put through it can't be reversed but if it hasn't actually been processed yet, it can be stopped.

          • pegaxs on 15/07/2021 - 10:46
            -1

            @CheapskateQueen: Not saying it can't be done, but under the circumstances and time frame OP is asking us to believe, it's bullshit.

  • PissLUR on 14/07/2021 - 21:29
    +3

    Wow the bank shouldn't have stopped/reversed the payment.

  • adam on 14/07/2021 - 21:38
    +8

    The bank should never had done a chargeback, there was no fraudulent transaction (lying about something when selling it privately isn't fraud), it was just a change of mind on behalf of your friend. I think the seller could take your friend to court for doing that transaction reversal, it would be equivalent to theft.

    As for who the vehicle belongs to: it belongs to your friend as the transaction was completed. If a receipt was created this transfers ownership to your friend. As to who the vehicle is registered to: this is a different matter of who owns it & depends whether that paperwork gets filed or not. If it gets filed & the vehicle gets towed as an abandoned vehicle then your friend could be up for more costs.

    Your friend is entirely in the wrong & has no right to change their mind in the case of a private sale.

  • USER DC on 14/07/2021 - 21:59

    Wow quite a weird situation

  • MS Paint on 14/07/2021 - 22:32
    +4

    Troll post

  • [Deactivated] on 14/07/2021 - 22:55

    Civil matter, the police will tell the seller to go sit and rotate.

  • mskeggs on 14/07/2021 - 23:04
    +4

    Not to throw around accusations, but by the letter of the law, the buyer in this circumstance has defrauded the seller, by reversing payment after agreeing to the contract.

    Advice we give to somebody on how to defraud the seller isn’t a great situation.
    We can be sympathetic that the buyer was unhappy with the purchase after they agreed to it, but they made their bed, and are now breaking their agreement.

    As for the idea the seller was acting unfairly because the buyer disagreed with their assessment there were no issues, well, the buyer should not have agreed to buy if they were unhappy.

    That said, I can’t imagine anybody is going to court over $1500.

    • [Deactivated] on 15/07/2021 - 00:06

      Yes thats exactly what i am trying to explain to my friend who's extremely stressed by his acts.
      One thing for clear is that the car definitely was not mechanically good, if the seller is really pursuing this much like threatening police etc. i mean if seller's car wasn't lemon he probably would have had sold it by now, but yeah clearly by all these signs I think quite clear it was a lemon sh*ttbox.

  • oscargamer on 15/07/2021 - 09:24

    Only read OP.

    This is a civil dispute and police won't get involved.

    Original seller can try to enforce the sale, but they won't .

    Your friend has done the wrong thing, but the seller won't do anything other than make vague threats (unless he's a Bikie)

  • Traveller107 on 15/07/2021 - 09:42
    +2

    I can't get myself to believe the bank would/ could reverse the transaction. Even if it was after 5 minutes of the transfer request they can't reverse it without the permission of the recipient and without transaction being complete.

    There seems to be more to this story.
    Seems like buyer paid a deposit and drove away with the car promising to make remaining payment asap. Seller let them do it coz they were old school and trusting. Buyer didn't like the car and returned it but seller won't take it back and wants the sale complete as per agreement but buyer if refusing to comply with their contractual obligations.
    Or this is a troll post.

  • Jugganautx on 15/07/2021 - 10:43

    HAHAHAHAHA

    That is all.

  • Alexander420 on 15/07/2021 - 13:25

    Always asking for a “friend” eh?
    This is one side of story, let’s said your story is right

    Then I wouldn’t wish the seller to
    1. File a report to police for a chargeback transaction on a private car purchase
    2. Complaint to bank with police report and wanted to take this matter further and sue for the stress, mental drain, sick leave blah blah blah
    3. Bank will said that your “friend” telling a lie story (if that)
    4. Your “friend” could got a criminal record

    I am not saying the seller have the right morale, but it is on you to check the car before signing the paper and money. Live and learnt, it is only $1.500
    Get the car back and scraped it then your “friend” will probably only lose $1.000

    Good luck

    • [Deactivated] on 17/07/2021 - 10:33
      -4

      Seller never ever probably had right ethics and moral from the beginning of his life I think, he's been that bad. He's just really one of those kind of a**holes. Friend is not in wrong, Its simply put it this way they had a dealing, friend got something which was not what it was said to be, so friend cancelled deal. Friend is already going through so much hassel in his life and stress. I really wish the seller really goes to bloody hell or something, literally not a single moral in him, even offering that person higher compensation for his inconvenience, still stupid idiot keeps on insisting on taking money and not even giving the car.

      Time and truth will prevail at the end. Surely God will make seller suffer for all the mental and psychiatric harm that seller has caused.

  • Pluto88 on 17/07/2021 - 12:12

    Both idiots imo the seller for selling a dodgy car and accepting a bank transfer as a payment and your friend for not test driving and inspecting the car properly before agreeing to buy it

    They should put this as a text book example of what not to do when buying or selling a car

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