Scammed by Landscaper - What Are My Options?

lordroy on 30/04/2021 - 08:01

G’day fellow Oz bargainers

About six months ago I engaged a landscaper for some minor excavations, removal of concrete debris, leveling of the yard and paving. The deal sounded too good to be true and although he was super non responsive and late for meetings etc. I engaged him since he had good reviews on ServiceSeeking and fb.

Four weeks into the job he turned our yard upside down, removed perfectly fine retaining walls, and in the process hit water mains four times with his bob cat. Never discussed/gave quote for ‘additional’ works (rebuilding the retaining wall, which btw is dodgy and needs to be rebuilt, also damaged our water hot water system - still works) and has sent us an invoice four times the original agreed amount. A $6k project turned into a $25k project with works being only 50 % complete. We will have to engage a professional landscaper to undo (and redo what he has done and cost another $20k). I refused to pay the inflated quote and he has lodged a case with the local administrative tribunal.

I’m lost for words on how audacious some tradies can be - over commit and under deliver and scam the hell out of a single income family. Any advice will be useful.

Home & Garden

Comments

  • Xistn on 30/04/2021 - 08:10
    +23

    Please take a ticket and take a seat to the left until your number is called, an Ozbargain advisor will be with you shortly.

    Xistn on 30/04/2021 - 08:10 (Collapsed - Offtopic. Show)
    • mini2 on 30/04/2021 - 08:26
      +4

      If OP can't wait, there's always Whirlpool.

  • John Kimble on 30/04/2021 - 08:13
    +13

    The deal sounded too good to be true

    Any advice will be useful.

    Don't do it again.

    • HeWhoKnows on 01/05/2021 - 16:03

      Good advise JK.

      And here is some more advise for everyone:

      Whilst we have heard OPs views we haven't heard from the landscape gardener
      Hence we are not in a position to judge or make recommendations

      First and foremost, I wouldn't side with OP based on their views only.
      There is obviously much more to this than OP leads us to believe.

      • capslock janitor on 03/05/2021 - 11:17

        scam the hell out of a single income family.

        scammers gonna scam regardless

  • Hithere on 30/04/2021 - 08:32
    +8

    he had good reviews on ServiceSeeking and fb

    Did you ask them for names of previous clients and check out his previous jobs?

    Reviews can be bought for a small amount each.

    It might pay to engage a Lawyer, or at least get some advice from one.

    • lordroy on 30/04/2021 - 17:18
      +3

      Might get a lawyer to look into it. Thanks mate

    • ATTS on 02/05/2021 - 07:58
      +1

      Just wondering, if you cant relies on reviews, how do you pick a good tradie?

      • Ken1977 on 02/05/2021 - 13:09
        +2

        By asking friends who have has similar works done. A lot of my work comes from word of mouth from clients.

        • capslock janitor on 03/05/2021 - 11:17

          Word of Mouth can be quite limiting though, need more 1-2 more to compare

  • boomramada on 30/04/2021 - 08:34
    +2

    I engaged him since he had good reviews on ServiceSeeking and fb.

    Guess what OP, now you get to put a FB review in flying colours :)

    good luck with the case in local administrative tribunal.

  • onlyletters on 30/04/2021 - 08:38
    +15

    damn this sucks man, keep all your records like photos and calls, and your time log of everything that happened and let him take you to court, ive been to court a few times and the court will do what is fair so don't stress..

    • HeWhoKnows on 01/05/2021 - 16:01
      -1

      Correction

      The court will do what it VIEWS to be fair based on the evidence presented.

      So depends on what material is submitted, witnesses etc

      Whilst we have heard OPs views we haven't heard from the landscape gardener
      Hence we are not in a position to judge or make recommendations

      First and foremost, I wouldn't side with OP based on their views only.
      There is obviously much more to this than OP leads us to believe

      • onlyletters on 04/05/2021 - 23:31

        no witness required, you take the stand and give your statement under oath, clearly you haven't been to court.

        sometimes a witness isn't always beneficial, they will ask you questions to make you talk more and possibly find holes in your statement that can give them reasonable doubt to find you guilty or the opposite.

  • FocusRider on 30/04/2021 - 08:40
    +6

    Name and shame please

  • AndyC1 on 30/04/2021 - 09:01
    +8

    Make a cross claim for costs to repair damage done and finish the job he started and did not finish as per the quoted price.

    Make sure you have everything documented so that when you get to the tribunal you will win.

  • SF3 on 30/04/2021 - 09:05
    -7

    About six months ago

    ok…

    I refused to pay the inflated quote

    good idea.

    <<Validation ✔️, Confirmation bias ✔️ >>

  • bobbified on 30/04/2021 - 09:05
    +11

    The deal sounded too good to be true

    Then why did you even go there?

    …and he has lodged a case with the local administrative tribunal.

    Then go and plead your case. If things are the way you tell us, I can't see why they'd decide against you. You might be able to put in a cross claim for some compensation to put towards the $20K cost of the second landscaper. Pictures of before and after and the testimony of the the second landscaper will definitely help.

    • JimmyF on 30/04/2021 - 09:33
      +4

      Agreed, if the OP never agreed to these extra works, but if the original quote work was completed as requested/agreed, then this quote/invoice for ~$6k is valid and should be paid. Regardless of the mess made in other areas, you can't withhold payment as such for that from another job.

  • onetwothreefour on 30/04/2021 - 09:12
    +2

    Name and shame.

  • Darayus on 30/04/2021 - 10:23
    +8

    i never trust FB review and Service Seeking reference and HI Page also.

    I had experience from Hi page twice one for pest control guy who quoted almost best but since he was able to visit my home on Saturday, i accept his quote. he arrived almost 4 hours late by afternoon and after constant reminder about when he will be at my place once he missed his schedule appointment time. Moment he steps in he started grumbling that price quoted does not includes outside wall spray and room size are huge then standard ( don't know what standard size he means) and asked for another $ 40 to start. I accepted his quote since i want to get my job done and move on rather then wait for another week to complete and keep my missus quite for not getting pest guys in. He sprayed rooms in 20 minutes and collected CASH and walked away. After two weeks i can still see pest crawling around the house and when i called him again he said, what do you expect me to spray for small amount, you need another spray as this crawling insects are not covered under my services.

    Another experience, I called AC service guy for annual split AC maintenance and knocking noise from main unit, he attended open grill of inside unit and clean the mesh with air blower close the grill for inside unit and charged me $ 80 for call out fees, when i mentioned can you look into knocking noise coming from outside unit when AC is running, he mentioned that he has to charge again for another call out fees for inspecting outside unit as quote is for only one job at a time.

    I have experience myself never use tradies online without someone's recommendation as they try to leech you for your ignorance and try to maximized thier income without doing any good jobs.

    • godofpizza on 30/04/2021 - 10:28
      +1

      same, i was having issues with my evpa cooler. one plumper replied ( via high pages) said without looking at the unit that it needed replacing. And that he wouldn't come onsite unless i was prepared to spend a grand to fix it.

    • TheBilly on 30/04/2021 - 13:34

      It’s kind of your fault though $40 to come out and do a pest control job or $80 to service the AC. It’s not an online or reference thing it just comes down to how much you are willing to spend and the caliber of person you are going to get in your budget.

      • kiitos on 01/05/2021 - 08:57

        No guarantee that paying more avoids these problems though

        • TheBilly on 03/05/2021 - 10:38
          +1

          That's right but if you carry out the additional checks such as is the guy a licenced tradesman, does he have insurances the chances things will go wrong become slimmer and slimmer.

          • ATTS on 03/05/2021 - 16:29

            @TheBilly: how do you find out if they are licensed and if they have insurance?

            • TheBilly on 03/05/2021 - 20:03

              @ATTS: Ask them for their licence number. Then search it up on the NSW fair trading website or equivalent state search function. All licences are publicly available to check. Then you ask them for their insurance certificate of currency (workers compensation and public liability usually 2 insurance policies). Also make sure the names and ABN matches on all the searches and insurances. For example, If the guy you are dealing with is named Darryl Johnson and he is operating under the company name Green Landscape, when you search up the company name in the licence search it also lists the directors name attached to that company and licence. On top of that you can do an ASIC search which costs $15 to get the name and address of the directors of a particular company.

  • netjock on 30/04/2021 - 10:24
    +2

    $6k was probably too good to be true. I always ask for the quote how many days is it going to take, if they are not getting at least $800 per day then they are going to be dodgy.

    Hope you had the $6k quote including details of what was to be done. If he did stuff he didn't quote for and cannot show approval for doing it then they are just trying it on. You'll have to go down the legal avenue because some of these tradies don't see reason.

  • godofpizza on 30/04/2021 - 10:26
    +7

    i would have shown the door or gate after the first time the contractor hit the water mains.

  • Jugganautx on 30/04/2021 - 10:41
    +3

    DIAL BEFORE YOU DIG.

    • Euphemistic on 30/04/2021 - 10:53
      +7

      Important, but typically doesn’t show any ‘household’ services, just where they connect to the mains in the street.

  • pharkurnell on 30/04/2021 - 10:43
    +2

    Online reviews arent worth a pinch of shit.

    The deal sounded too good to be true
    First warning flag

    Four weeks into the job he turned our yard upside down, removed perfectly fine retaining walls
    Why didnt you stop him there?

    A $6k project turned
    He was there 4 weeks and you thought it would only be $6k? Was his business called the Smith Family?

    • lordroy on 30/04/2021 - 17:19
      +1

      Sorry, I was not clear in the description. He probably worked for about a day and a half during that four week period at our site.

    • TilacVIP on 01/05/2021 - 09:21
      +2

      No, the OP didn't think it was going to be 6K, he expected it to be. The Tradie was the one who quoted that figure. Now somehow it's the OP's fault??

      We don't know exactly what work was involved & If all that the OP says is 100% true, doing work outside of what they were meant to do & then asking for more money is just a blatant ripoff scam. If I [tradie, techie] am going to need to do extra work or something outside the quote, then I bring this up with the owner immediately and explain in detail. How these grubs can get away with something like this is unbelievable, I quite a few do get away with it.

  • Big Lenny on 30/04/2021 - 10:44

    pay peanuts, get monke…

    you know the old adage

    • bloom on 30/04/2021 - 13:32

      Unless it’s a deal posted on OzB 👍

  • Gotchas on 30/04/2021 - 22:13

    Would your home and contents cover you for the damage he did to your property?

    • poboy on 30/04/2021 - 22:29

      Home and contents doesn't cover landscaping/garden.

  • HelpMeiCantSee on 01/05/2021 - 07:57

    Tradie 101.

  • Myone888 on 01/05/2021 - 08:28

    I had bad experience with home gas heater service. He came and charged $250 for 8 mins service! Didn’t do much. I have told them that fans needs to be cleaned, no not done. Tried to sell me Flame sensor $140, thermostat $140 etc, when they were not necessary. Are these people like this?

  • Geoff-bargain on 01/05/2021 - 08:55

    What city/ state are you in? I have some experience with NSW if that's where you are?

  • OzHunterNSW on 01/05/2021 - 12:03

    Take his bluff…. the Tribunal consists of a number of stages, one of which is conciliation, where both parties try to find an amicable conclusion. Failing this, you both go to Tribunal where it is YOU, as much as them, that have the opportunity to present their case.

    You will be viewed in a much better light than a scamming low down good for nothing - landscaper

    • Logical on 03/05/2021 - 00:27

      hold on for a second… For all we know the OP told the contractor the scope of work by waving their hand around the backyard saying something like: mate, I need "some minor excavations, removal of concrete debris, leveling of the yard and paving"….. which can be interpreted as 'remove the old retaining wall to level the yard'….

  • HeWhoKnows on 01/05/2021 - 15:56

    " he was super non responsive and late for meetings "

    Well what did OP expect after this early first hand experience?

  • kfcfatfat on 01/05/2021 - 23:09

    I have been trying to get someone to do a concrete slab for my garden shed. Got 4 quotes ranging from $1700 to $5000. Sometime is hard to pick who to go with. It is like drawing a straw from a hat.

    • Logical on 03/05/2021 - 00:23

      Have you got an agreed scope of work? A drawing showing the location and size of the slab? And noting the thickness of slab, concrete strength, any footings, thickenings, reinforcement details… Quotes always vary as everyone prices their own interpretation of what the owner told them….. and then it turns out that it was Not what was discussed.

      • kfcfatfat on 03/05/2021 - 09:01

        Well, average consumers are not engineers and they just want something that suits their needs. The tradies came to quote and did their measurement. I told them what the shed is use for. I asked about what thickness they are laying (which btw is the standard is 100mm). They are the expert to provide a suitable for the problem.

        • Logical on 03/05/2021 - 23:34

          Tradies are experts? Most tradies have no qualifications and perhaps at best a short TAFE course. They learned their skill as an apprentice from other tradies who also had little knowledge. Tradies should be following engineers designs. Please contact a local engineer who will provide you with some standard details and a sketch of what should be done. If you can't afford a few hundred for standard details from an engineer then you shouldn't be investing thousands into a shed.

  • Logical on 03/05/2021 - 00:20

    Hey OP. Was the quote based on a documented scope of works? or was it all just verbal? If there was no written contract then both of you are in a pickle and it will need to be determined by the Administrative Tribunal Member. Don't pay any more to the Contractor.

  • No ONE on 03/05/2021 - 06:08
    -2

    over commit and under deliver and scam the hell out of a single income family.

    Sounds like someone familiar. Oh wait, is it Scott Morrison?

  • popsiee on 03/05/2021 - 20:07

    Cool everyone in the thread is an expert on reviews after the situation .
    I've never run into a problem with reviews so far so its a small % if played right .

  • BreezyPalms on 03/05/2021 - 21:34

    I am fighting a builder through NSW fair trading and NCAT at present.

    Best thing you can probably do is write out a diary of events as best you can remember, so you can use this to jog your memory when speaking to the tribunal. Hopefully you have some form of paper trail (emails, sms, written quotes etc to support your claims). Print off any evidence you have.

    Summarise in writing how and when the contractor was appointed and build a case that shows the contractor is unorganised and dishonest. Set out a list of defective works including photographs.

    Send the contractor a letter (email), pointing out the defective works and request they rectify the works by a set date. Once they fail to rectify, lodge your own dispute/claim with fair trading.

    Good luck.

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