Houseshare and Roomshare Difficulty for Males

nightqueen on 13/10/2020 - 19:36
Last edited 13/10/2020 - 19:36

As a renting young male that has been housesharing/roomsharing for many years. I'm quiet, friendly, clean and no history of sexual assault. I've found it difficulty to get new accommodation as many listings on gumtree or Facebook often say 'females only or females preferred',.

From my observation, female households, mixed households and male households prefer new female roommates rather than males.

Has anyone noticed this and struggled to find accommodation due to being a male?

Is this a form of gender preference or a form of gender discrimination?

Poll Options

  • 276
    Fair gender preference
  • 106
    Unfair gender discrimination
Home & Garden

Comments

  • brendanm on 13/10/2020 - 19:38
    +45

    Rent your own place? It's also just preference, you can't force people to live with people they don't want to live with.

    • nightqueen on 13/10/2020 - 20:46
      +4

      I would prefer to rent my own place, can't afford it

      • brendanm on 13/10/2020 - 21:20
        +25

        Rent one, then choose the roommates you want.

        • nightqueen on 13/10/2020 - 21:27
          +45

          Yes good idea and if I'm the tenant on the lease, I can put males preferred or males only to help out the underdogs.

        • kaleidoscope on 15/10/2020 - 08:43
          +3

          isn’t subletting against rental terms usually?

          • brendanm on 15/10/2020 - 09:25
            -2

            @kaleidoscope: No idea, I've never been in a houseshare or tried to sublet.

            • kaleidoscope on 15/10/2020 - 11:11

              @brendanm: yeah better check with the contract terms before doing it as it can become a liability disaster if someone you sublet cause damages and it falls on you.

          • trapper on 15/10/2020 - 11:12
            +4

            @kaleidoscope: Most landlord's would want to add all adults living in the house to the lease, so is not subletting then anyway.

          • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 12:00
            -5

            @kaleidoscope: Subletting is totally legal, and a protected right.

            The right that landlords have is to get details of the subletters, and a chance to veto any applicants they do not prefer. So they could abuse the system if they like. But everything comes to a civil matter between the landlord and the tenant.

            • DonWilson on 16/10/2020 - 18:46
              +2

              @Kangal: this isn't how it works in WA. https://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/sites/default/files/atoms/fil…

              Subletting (or ‘assigning’) the rental property is where a tenant rents out all or a part of the premises to another person. The prescribed tenancy agreement enables the lessor/property manager to choose whether to:

              •permit you to sublet;
              •prohibit you from subletting; or
              •permit you to sublet but only with their written consent.

              If the lessor agrees to allow you to sublet but only with their written consent, then the lessor must not withhold consent unreasonably.

              If the agreement does not make any reference to your ability to sublet, then the agreement is deemed to include the provision that subletting can occur with the lessor/property manager’s written consent.

              In my experience the boilerplate rental agreements prohibit it.

              • dizzle on 17/10/2020 - 18:24

                @DonWilson: Same for QLD
                "If a tenant would like to sub-let a room in a rental property, they must get written permission from the property manager/owner. Approved occupants should also be listed in the special terms of the tenancy agreement."

                If they require written permission, then the owner/LL can say no.

        • AlanHB on 15/10/2020 - 16:51

          Yeah this is what I did when I was in sharehoise land.

      • ozbjunkie on 14/10/2020 - 09:01
        +41

        Much better being the lease holder and subletting to people you know, trust, or like (hopefully all three).

        TLDR: the words you use, tone of voice, body language, all of these are opportunities to show you're relaxed, friendly, dependable, and considerate. Thats all anyone really wants in a flatmate.

        Otherwise, the bias you've experienced against men is partially an age thing,and part gender issue. People are worried about boofheads, whether it's drinking, aggression, untrustworthy mates, and maybe some of those are a bit unfair (a female can have untrustworthy mates of course). Young people are more likely to drink and just generally not be as settled and considerate.

        So it's your job to simply not present that way. If female preferred, give them a call, let them hear your voice, be gentle and we'll spoken. Show you are considerate "is there a time that might suit you, I could meet you in the area and shout a quick coffee? See if we feel like going ahead with an inspection?"

        Notice you aren't even asking for their address, just 5 or 10 minutes, and you're shouting coffee as a small friendly gesture. You're also asking when they're free, and being clear you'll come to them. You're taking them into account, just like a good flatmate will.

        I moved in to a house at around 25, as a uni student, where 2 other tenants were full time workers over 35 and 1 other tenant was finishing up their med degree.

        I just explained I was done with partying, and just wanted a friendly and peaceful environment where I could settle down and get through my studies. Got the place.

        Finally, even if it's female applicants only, if you're having a tough time finding somewhere, you could still call "I realise the add said females applicants only, and I can guess a few reasons why that might be. Still, I'm reaching out in the hope that you might be willing to consider a male applicant that met your standards for a helpful and dependable flatmate… Then use the shouting them a coffee line.

        • Zephyrus on 15/10/2020 - 17:28
          +4

          It can also be for religious/practical reasons. e.g. Muslim women won't want to live with unrelated men, people won't want to share bedrooms cross gender.

          There can also be some rather questionable men who want female house mates because of the implication

          • ozbjunkie on 15/10/2020 - 20:37

            @Zephyrus: All valid points. And things you probably won't be able to talk your way through. Still, worth a shot if it's hard to find a house.

        • trapper on 17/10/2020 - 18:41

          I moved in to a house at around 25, as a uni student…

          I just explained I was done with partying

          lol, and they bought that? or were you serious?? wtf haha

          • ozbjunkie on 17/10/2020 - 20:32

            @trapper: Nah I hit it pretty hard for a few years there.

            Put it this way, when I was done I had to sleep for about 12 months.

            Just about ready for round 2 though.

          • tebbybabes on 17/10/2020 - 22:16

            @trapper: I was a post grad student at 25. I was also done partying by then.

      • Bren20 on 15/10/2020 - 09:44
        +12

        I've house shared for about 10 years

        Based on your description of yourself, I wouldn't give a room to you. Generally, people who would prefer to live alone don't add anything positive to the house, they only emerge for meals and keep to them-self. I don't like living with strangers, I want to socialise with my housemates.

        Having said that, there are many different share houses out there. There are plenty where people co-exist without having any connection to each other.

        With regards to preference, people are free to live with who they choose. This includes gender/race/sexual orientation. I personally wouldn't exclude people for these traits

          • Bren20 on 15/10/2020 - 16:50
            +7

            @xX69Obi1Kanobi69Xx: ?

            not really, I thought what I wrote was fairly well reasoned and free of emotion

        • AlanHB on 15/10/2020 - 16:53
          +1

          I found it really hard to know what people would act like until I moved in with them. That said, it was a bit of a facepalm if they turned out to be the roommate who lived exclusively in their bedroom.

          • Bren20 on 15/10/2020 - 17:45
            +1

            @AlanHB: yeah, it's really hard to get the measure of someone from the quick chat you have when you're showing them the place, we've certainly made mistakes in the past.

        • trapper on 16/10/2020 - 12:03

          In London it was great fun.

          Over a couple days we would queue up half a dozen applicants each evening. Then sit there in the lounge drinking a few beers with us asking all kinds of crazy questions to gauge their personality.

          You are basically picking a new person to join your circle of friends, so it paid to be thorough.

          I found it a bit different in Australia though, a lot of weirdos show up to random flatshares. I think because most normal Australia locals find a flat through existing contacts. Foreigners were much more likely to be normal easy going type people.

        • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 19:32
          +1

          The roomkeeper has spoken… ROOM DENIED!

  • Drakesy on 13/10/2020 - 19:48
    +17

    Female preference is a no brainer, they're generally cleaner, quieter and smell less.

    Not sure what the problem is.
    People are entitled to live with other females if they choose to.
    Just like you'd prefer to live with a group of females (i probably would).

    Now i'd usually say rent a house/apartment yourself but given you're in Sydney i can sympathize.
    maybe get a group of mates together/a girlfriend and rent a house? I know landlords will preference females any day

    • LFO on 13/10/2020 - 20:03
      +32

      smell less

      Cleaningless has no gender and excessive or very strong perfume (or talcum powder!) can be really overbearing.

      Females are notoriously untidy around bedrooms and bathrooms. Too many clothes, too little hanging space.

      But I agree with you, people are entitled to share with what they choose to, regardless of anything else.

      • SydStrand on 13/10/2020 - 20:15
        +24

        Females are notoriously untidy around bedrooms and bathrooms. Too many clothes, too little hanging space.

        I've lived with girls who did treated their floor as a wardrobe, but blokes do it too. And I've lived with guys whose floors weren't just 'decorated' with clothes, but also tools, stubbies, pizza boxes, etc. There's a difference between untidy and unhygienic, and I've never lived with a girl who did the latter. I'd also rather share a bathroom with a girl 8 days a week. The choice between having some beauty product clutter on your vanity vs some dude who never cleans, is no choice at all.

        Even better, leave alone (having the right personality).

        No one chooses to house share with strangers if they could afford to live alone.

        • AdosHouse on 13/10/2020 - 20:35
          +10

          "I've lived with girls who did treated their floor as a wardrobe, but blokes do it too."

          The floordrobe is a perfectly acceptable clothing storage space.

          • Hangryuman on 15/10/2020 - 09:42
            +1

            @AdosHouse: the horizontal wardrobe - I remember that from uni college days

            the pile of clothing on the floor - oh the ones on top must be the freshest …

        • gorgrond on 14/10/2020 - 10:22
          +4

          No one chooses to house share with strangers if they could afford to live alone.

          Not true . I know well off bachelors that live with other people because they dislike living alone. Some people are just extroverted, I guess.

      • morse on 15/10/2020 - 03:37
        +1

        As you say strong fragrances/odours go both ways. I had a male flat mate with awful Lynx fragrance that wafted into my bedroom every morning. Also had a female flat mate with undesirable but less invasive BO.

      • Baghern on 15/10/2020 - 23:05
        +4

        I beg to differ overall there is a big difference

        In most societies boys aren't taught to be self conscious or domesticated

        I myself never did laundry until i moved out. My female cousin was taught to do the dishes when she was 8 and i was 5, I watched on and even then knew it was sexist.

        The fact is even in the 21st century we're still bought up differently.

        I have one friend who does all the cleaning because he has a higher cleanliness requirement that his girlfriend. That's like 1 in 20 I'd say.

    • Nugs on 13/10/2020 - 20:20
      +27

      "they're generally cleaner"
      Two daughters and a son say otherwise….
      Also my wife often comes out of public toilets with all sorts of discoveries
      .

    • dcep on 14/10/2020 - 01:33
      -1

      Guess you haven't encountered used pads/tampons in kitchen bin.

      • capslock janitor on 15/10/2020 - 10:05
        +5

        i dont mind, that's life

        • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 14:36
          -4

          Period blood in the kitchen bin is 'just life', got it.

          Brb, gotta take a piss in the sink.

          • capslock janitor on 17/10/2020 - 14:49

            @Skinnerr: You do you. Take a shit in your sink if you want to.

            • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 14:58
              -3

              @capslock janitor: Tampons in the kitchen bin is (profanity) disgusting. Do it in the bathroom, like normal hygienic people do. I can't believe this isn't obvious.

              • capslock janitor on 17/10/2020 - 15:03
                +3

                @Skinnerr: Do what in the bathroom? You make it sound they remove their pads in the kitchen.

                I live with 2 girls, so it's akin to seeing a blood nose for me. And they wrap it up good before disposing.

                • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 15:40

                  @capslock janitor: I thought it was normal to have a little bin in the bathroom for exactly this reason, rather than walk around the house with it.

      • froggym on 15/10/2020 - 11:00
        +5

        Would you prefer them left on the kitchen counter? Bins are for trash, if you don't like it get one with a lid so you don't have to see.

    • Kranbone on 15/10/2020 - 01:03
      +13

      I've seen a lot of messy female rooms in my times and a lot of organised male ones. I don't think cleanliness corresponds to gender.

      • capslock janitor on 15/10/2020 - 10:06
        -3

        those are sexes, reckon OP might be diff gender

        • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 12:03
          +4

          Username checks out

    • Brick Tamland on 15/10/2020 - 13:32
      +3

      Female preference is a no brainer, they're generally cleaner, quieter and smell less.

      Big mistake. The opposite has been proven true in my experiences.

    • syousef on 15/10/2020 - 15:42
      +6

      What a BS stereotype. There are stereotypes of hygienic neat freak women, and also of female hoarders who live in a tip filled with either cat pee or infested with rodents. I'm pretty sure neither archetype puts it on their application when they want to rent a place. But most are somewhere in between.

      • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 14:39

        This whole thread is a gender stereotype circle jerk.

    • DernKala on 15/10/2020 - 18:20
      +9

      Female preference is a no brainer, they're generally cleaner, quieter and smell less.

      Not sure what the problem is.
      People are entitled to live with other females if they choose to.
      Just like you'd prefer to live with a group of females (i probably would).

      Let me play devil's advocate for a moment. Would your comment be acceptable if you replaced the word 'female' with another ethnicity, religion or sexuality? For example:

      White people preference is a no brainer, they're generally cleaner, quieter and smell less.

      Not sure what the problem is.
      People are entitled to live with other white people if they choose to.
      Just like you'd prefer to live with a group of white people (i probably would).

    • dogboy on 16/10/2020 - 11:09
      +7

      I rented for over 16 years before buying my own properties. I found women are a lot less clean than men and a lot more trouble.

      • Skinnerr on 17/10/2020 - 14:40

        How dare you say that, that's sexist!

    • jv on 16/10/2020 - 12:49

      Female preference is a no brainer, they're generally cleaner, quieter and smell less.

      Depends on the suburb…

    • nobro25 on 16/10/2020 - 17:02
      +2

      This comment is downright profiling, not to mention being sexist. Being identified as a certain sexual orientation doesn't automatically make you worst. It's the same as those companies discriminating against women and only hiring men because they are seen as more productive, less hassle, less distractions and are trouble makers or avid complainers in the workplace. You simply can't use these words.

    • RJK on 16/10/2020 - 22:17
      +1

      In my own experience after years of rent sharing, the messiest people I've lived with were girls while the least hygienic was a guy.

    • SelfMade on 16/10/2020 - 23:15

      Enjoy the mood swings!

    • cheng2008 on 17/10/2020 - 01:48
      +1

      Looks like this is the post that proves the OP was right in saying that he's being discriminated against, what with the erroneous stereotype that females are more clean and everything.

      • nightqueen on 17/10/2020 - 08:47

        It's been interesting to see people's thoughts if it's fair preference or unfair bias or pure discrimination.

      • Drakesy on 17/10/2020 - 10:42

        Poll would say otherwise

  • roastchook on 13/10/2020 - 19:56
    +14

    You might be quiet, friendly, clean and no history of sexual assault, but, they don't know you and they don't know that. Present yourself as best you can …..clothes, friendly, able to carry on a conversation etc . Try and find a connection. Example, if one of them is wearing a band tshirt..and you even have the smallest knowledge of that band..comment on it.

    • jv on 16/10/2020 - 12:51
      -5

      Try and find a connection.

      You'll need to ask for their wifi password…

  • LFO on 13/10/2020 - 19:57
    +19

    Males who offer to rent/share might have the fantasy that a female sharer will be "more interesting", bring more females giving the chance of socializing, more tidy, more organized and generally clean and keen to follow and accept house rules. As I said, a fantasy.

    Females who offer to rent will probably prefer females as well to avoid any "female role" to be played or expected to be played. May be disliking the possibility of male visitors as well. Nothing sinister here.

    So yes, males might find it slightly more difficult but perhaps you are looking at the wrong place to start with (Gumtree!!).

    I''m sure a Real Estate handling share accommodation will not have those petty issues.

    Look somewhere else.

    Even better, leave alone (having the right personality).
    Cheaper and simpler.
    Total freedom.

    • Ghost47 on 14/10/2020 - 00:52

      As I said, a fantasy.

      LOL so true. Females can be messy af.

    • Diji on 15/10/2020 - 16:57
      +2

      Even better, leave alone (having the right personality).
      Cheaper and simpler.
      Total freedom.

      Simpler, sure, but how is living alone cheaper?

      • LFO on 15/10/2020 - 18:55
        +1

        but how is living alone cheaper?

        You end up paying only for what you use.

        Broadband? Perhaps you are fine with 4G in your phone.
        Netflix? Perhaps you don't like it. Or are too busy to watch.
        Food expenses? Perhaps you get free meals at/from work.
        Electricity bills? Perhaps you are out all night working and use very little during the day.
        Water? Perhaps you shower at work or the gym. And girlfriend/mum/friend does all laundry.

        Not applicable to all but plausible.

        Sharing is, in my opinion, more of a lifestyle option, an alternative to mix and socialize rather than a way to save money.

        • Diji on 15/10/2020 - 20:20
          +5

          Sharing is, in my opinion, more of a lifestyle option, an alternative to mix and socialize rather than a way to save money.

          If it was a lifestyle option I would definitely be living alone. I'm introverted and would be described by most in this thread as one of those undesirable housemates who lives entirely in the bedroom.

          Rent is cheaper on a 2 bedroom split between two people than a single bedroom alone, since rent doesn't necessarily double going from 1 to 2 bedrooms (and likewise for 3 or 4 bedrooms, etc).

          The internet point only stands if you're a very light user. Mobile internet plans where you pay as you go are terrible for moderate to high usage.

          With regards to electricity, you always pay the supply charge and unless you don't need a fridge at all then you're paying for that to run 24/7 regardless. Most other uses of electricity like washing machine, TV, lighting scale with how many residents there are. Unless someone is OCD and washing their clothes twice a day or something absurd like that, then people will more or less just pay for what they use.

          I've never lived in a shared house where people pay for other people's food so I can't speak on that front. Either people pitch in for communal stuff or they don't use it. Like no one in the house expects someone to pitch in for milk if they're vegan or something. Most other ingredients people just buy and cook for themselves. Not sure how standard my experience is in this regard, though.

          For living alone to be cheaper than your average shared housing situation I think you would have to get extraordinarily lucky with rent and also have a confluence of all the factors you mentioned - you don't use internet much, you get free or discounted meals somehow, and you use very little electricity or water (perhaps you don't even own a washing machine). I think that's far from standard, though.

        • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 21:05
          +3

          Doesn't quite pan out.
          The service cost for Rent, Water, Electricity, Internet, Netflix etc etc will far outweigh the savings. It is worth it to share, strictly from a monetary viewpoint. For instance;

          …Now, let's calculate the costs for an individual:
          1bd unit - $250 p/week
          Water - $220 p/quarter
          Electricity - $1,300 p/year
          NBN cheap - $50 p/month
          Netflix cheap - $10 p/month
          VPN cheap - $50 p/year
          Total for single person: (rounded down) ~$305 weekly ~$1,300 monthly ~$15,000 yearly

          …Now, let's say you're sharing house and expenses:
          4bd house - $500 p/week
          Water - $330 p/quarter
          Electricity - $2,000 p/year
          NBN pricey - $90 p/month
          Netflix family - $20 p/month
          VPN best - $10 p/month
          Total split between four persons: (rounded up) ~$150 weekly ~$650 monthly ~$8,000 yearly

          See what I mean?

          • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 21:12
            +5

            @Kangal: Okay, let's take this even further beyond!!

            …the costs for an individual:
            Total for single person: ~$305 weekly ~$1,300 monthly ~$15,000 yearly
            + Transport (expensive): ~$345 weekly ~$1,900 monthly ~$22,000 yearly
            & Food (expensive) = Total Spending: ~$650 weekly ~$3,200 monthly ~$37,000 yearly
            (This here is the worst case scenario)

            Or Food (cheap) = Total Spending: ~$450 weekly ~$2,300 monthly ~$27,000 yearly

            …the costs for a sharing person:
            Total split between four persons: ~$150 weekly ~$650 monthly ~$8,000 yearly
            + Transport (cheap): ~$230 weekly ~$1,000 monthly ~$12,000 yearly
            & Food (cheap) = Total Spending: ~$330 weekly ~$1,400 monthly ~$17,000 yearly
            (This here is the best case scenario)

            Or Food (expensive) = Total Spending: ~$530 weekly ~$2,300 monthly ~$27,000 yearly

            …that's when we think about other costs/savings for individuals and sharers such as with transportation and food. For instance, a couple days carpooling (fuel) can add up fast. Plus if you get to have some Pizza/Movie nights, or just cooking together. Transport costs (fuel, rego, insurance) for an adult can go anywhere from $80 weekly, and upto $140 weekly, for the average Australian according to AAA. Food costs are THE biggest fluctuation (even more than rent!) depending on appetite/thriftness. For one adult can go anywhere from $100-$300 weekly. Or that breaks down to $400-$1,300 monthly, or $5,000min to $15,000 yearly max.

            Even bigger discrepancy (the BIGGEST in fact) in money comes from someone's income!!!!
            Some figures from ABS (all before tax) puts Median (mixed) at $48k, Median (men) at $51k, Average (mixed) at $86k, Average (men) at $100k. So calculating after tax is Median for mixed is $40k (min), Median (men) is $43k, Average (mixed) is $68k, Average Men is $78k (max). So for the lowest earner in that figure $40k per year (sounds reasonable), and minus the highest expenditure from the figures $37k per year (sounds reasonable), and that individual is making a Minimum Yearly Savings of +$3k. And if you take the opposite scenario, where a Man is earning a great Average Amount $78k yearly (plausible), and they are living extremely frugal $17k yearly (plausible), in that scenario the individual is making a Maximum Yearly Savings of +$61k. All these figures lie within the medium-average spectrum, yet in these two extremes the difference is $58,000 per year, so the thing that changes really is the attitude plus thriftiness of the individual adult.

            Hmmm, interesting eh? (+1 for myself, this was a bit of an effort : )

            • Diji on 15/10/2020 - 23:01

              @Kangal: Interesting analysis. :)

              • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 23:08

                @Diji: Thanks mate.
                Does any of those figures look " off " ??

                • Diji on 15/10/2020 - 23:21
                  +2

                  @Kangal: Not really, close enough to what I've experienced.

          • bobbified on 16/10/2020 - 12:02

            @Kangal:

            1bd unit - $250 p/week

            What? Is that really what it costs in Brisbane?
            I was paying double that in Melbourne and even more in Sydney!

            • Diji on 16/10/2020 - 14:31

              @bobbified: Depends on where you're at. I'm in Melbourne and I've seen $250s in the outer western suburbs.

              • bobbified on 16/10/2020 - 15:01

                @Diji: Yes, you're probably right. I automatically think CBD when I think of apartments.
                I just did a quick check in Werribee - there's one for $300 that's fairly new so any not-so-new ones there or further would would be cheaper..

          • Fatbrad on 17/10/2020 - 11:04
            +2

            @Kangal: I love how the VPN gets a mention 👍

  • donga100 on 13/10/2020 - 20:02
    +40

    Have you considered identifying as female?

    • Ghost47 on 14/10/2020 - 00:53
      +6

      His username would check out if that was the case.

      • Hangryuman on 15/10/2020 - 09:44
        +4

        but who gets to be the queen tonight might lead to arguments …

    • Donaldhump on 15/10/2020 - 10:05
      +1

      I’d be one ugly woman

  • whooah1979 on 13/10/2020 - 20:10
    +14

    no history of sexual assault.

    What? Do they ask that the inverview?

    • bdl on 13/10/2020 - 20:12
      +33

      MOLESTER? Y/N

    • dasher86 on 13/10/2020 - 20:13
      +6

      Congratulations in order perhaps?

    • Hangryuman on 15/10/2020 - 09:44

      yes - he's only prospective on that

    • cashless on 15/10/2020 - 10:36

      That's a relief to us all then

  • iNeed2Pee on 13/10/2020 - 20:34

    "Choose not to specify"

  • resubaehtgnolhcs on 13/10/2020 - 20:34
    +31

    no history of sexual assault.

    Maybe don't proactively raise this unless asked - it's kind of weird that you are pointing it out (in a forum of all places, let alone to prospective flatmates). Maybe focus on stable aspects in your life (e.g. the number of years you've held employment), and other qualities that will make you a good flatmate in other people's eyes.

    • [Deactivated] on 13/10/2020 - 22:04
      +4

      Instead, maybe OP should volunteer that he pees sitting down, and has been tested and is negative for IBS

      • ozbjunkie on 14/10/2020 - 09:06
        +4

        Nothing wrong with a sit-down pee.

        We should all be so fortunate to have the time.

        I think it's a sign that work life balance is on point.

        • [Deactivated] on 14/10/2020 - 09:12
          +2

          The throne of true balance. I like it.

          • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 12:05
            +1

            @[Deactivated]: Nah, moreso the fear of phone wetting.

            • [Deactivated] on 15/10/2020 - 12:56
              +1

              @Kangal: I hate to ask but…. Huh?

              • Kangal on 15/10/2020 - 14:36
                +1

                @[Deactivated]: Standing up, taking a wizz, one handed, bowl area open, phones are now large+heavy+slippery = good chance of a drop to the wet.

                Sitting down, taking a wizz/dump, two handed, bowl area blocked = little chance of a drop to the wet.

                …so for those that are always checking OzBargain at any opportunity, they will opt for sitting down even if it's for a wizz!

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