In today's time, which is better?
Assuming it's the same area, same academic result, etc.
In what way would private be worth the fees?
More than just mere academic result, would the kids have good creativity, social skill, street smart, etc?
Primary Public Vs Private School: Which Is Better?
[Deactivated] on 18/06/2020 - 17:57
Last edited 19/06/2020 - 15:15 by 1 other user
Last edited 19/06/2020 - 15:15 by 1 other user
Poll Options
- 143Private of course. You pay what you get.
- 59Public. Because it's near free.
- 392All the same (public anyway, because it's free(
Comments
I did my first years of high school in public and final 2 year in academic private school. My private school was academic so there were no sports and activities and I lost contact with all my friends. In university and job, if you are from public or private school, it does not matter. If I could do it again I would go public. To get into a good public you have to be living in that area.
I went private but sent mine public, not for reasons of money. Private primary gave me opportunities I wouldn't have had in public at the time. Better sports, an introduction to music and other extra curricular. I engaged with a level of priveledge that I haven't experienced since. However my parents gave up a lot to make it happen. We rarely travelled until later and knew funds were tight. I don't think the teaching was any better and if it was it was luck. My daughters' experience at public primary was good. One poor teacher, but some great ones. They mixed with a broader group of the community and had all the organised activities of private, just not the grounds to go with it. I don't think private primary delivers much in this day and age. They will have different friends by the time they leave school when it really matters, so the social argument is a waste. Looking at results doesn't mean one school or another will deliver for your child. My tip if you want to spend the money- go public and donate 50% of the fees to school building fund. You will have the ear of the people that matter and will make a bigger difference.
I tutor a variety of primary and highschool kids.
Will put it plainly;
Well educated, nurturing and caring parents with a kid in public school = kids turn out relatively intelligent and do their work, of course this isn't always the case because bad influences do exist.
Uneducated, caring, but also unaware of the schooling system parents with kids in public schools, esp ones in low-ses areas = spells disaster, your kid misses out on a lot.
Shitty private school = slightly better environment than a low-ses public school, academically the kid will suffer.
Well ranked private school - will do wonders for your child regardless of their 'intelligence', they will almost always have more opportunities, teacher to student ratio is much higher so more time with the teacher. Teaching quality doesn't necessarily change, but private schools don't have teachers managing 30kids in one class.
Overall, the teaching system is flawed. Yes people and particularly teachers will get offended by this, a lot of the primary school teachers get these jobs because of the work-life balance and because the requirement to become a teacher is low. This is why tutoring is such a blooming business in especially Sydney since us tutors are basically cleaning up and filling in the gaps that the students have because someone isn't able to do their job properly. I am saying this because 9/10 of my students are capable but have not been taught properly. This is from the worst public schools up there with expensive private schools.
To OP: make sure you discuss school stuff with your child and take them serious, don't need to go all Karen at the school if your child says the teacher was being too mean on them but you gotta get them to trust you. This way, they want to go to school and learn, flourish and develop their soft skills more.
The biggest problem with public schools is how much of the lesson time is wasted due to the 'bad kids' behavior.
I have little experience with private schools, but I imagine a call home to say "your kid, the one you pay $xxxx for, is sitting out of the classroom because they are interrupting everyone else". My guess is that the parent will actually intervene. Either sort the kids out or save their money and move their kid to a public school to wreck everyone else's learning.
At a public school, those parents don't pick up the phone and you can't kick the kids out of the class.
Private school was useful to meet parents who were real estate agents, lawyers, accountants, I don't know who I would have met in public school.
I'd recommend private school. Some public school teachers care little for the job, and while that can be an issue in private schools too, my experience was that private school teachers were more able or more motivated.
But it has to be the "right" kind of private school. Not the "elitist" rich kid, snobby kind. I went to a private school with a good mix of socioeconomic backgrounds, cultural backgrounds, and it was an enriching experience. Co-ed is also important to me. I want my kids interacting with all genders (I was going to write both genders, but didn't want to get slapped in 2020).
“Private school was useful to meet parents who were real estate agents, lawyers, accountants, I don't know who I would have met in public school.”
Networking with real estate agents. What a boon.
“ I'd recommend private school. Some public school teachers care little for the job”
Based on what?
“ I want my kids interacting with all genders”
Wow, very progressive.
If anyone really wants to know which school suits their kids, book an appointment with the principal, have a meeting and ask to walk around the schools.
Based on attending both private and public schools, tutoring school students, and having friends who are teachers.
Unless you're claiming that wanting your child to attend a unisex school is necessarily regressive (when actually there are some arguments in favour of that), I reject outright your thinly veiled barb that my preference for co-ed schools is necessarily progressive.
Networking with real estate agents has been useful when wanting to sell a property in the family.
Agreed that parents should book an appointment with the principal of prospective schools, and I'll add that it is useful to speak to students as well.
"Private school was useful to meet parents who were real estate agents, lawyers, accountants"
Is this meant to be a positive?
Haha, yes touche.
Well done making me smile before 9am on a Monday :)
I like public because I don't want to have an advantage. It just takes away my achievements and I'd much rather get a good grade (90+ atar) going to a shitty public school than think I had to pay for my education.
Ultimately money can't buy educational achievement, but I think you're right that it can help.
Regardless, I like your attitude. Sounds like a winner, determined, self-determining. You still in school or you well past all that?
I'm at university right now (mathematics major). I think money can buy educational achievement up to a point, I know people who achieved 95 atars but you wouldn't believe it talking to them and some of them actually struggle at university. They admit it themselves, I remember talking to a girl who went to a top private school and what she told me was jaw dropping. All they care about is propping up grades, they employ exam strategies, pre-written essays and basically only teach them how to nail VCE exams which is quite sad imo. She struggled very bad at university and felt she retained nothing from highschool. Similar to what international students tell me about China, they study 12 hours a day for exams but they learn nothing in the long run. On the plus side, some of the campuses are gorgeous, beyond ANYTHING I ever imagined a highschool could be.
People who scored well at my school were very few (some years the highest was only about 80) but they're some of the most intelligent people you'll ever meet, some of them doing PhD's in physics.
Good luck and best wishes, its a challenging degree.
I was one of those 95+ that struggled with uni. Not because I bought my education, actually we were pretty poor, but because as a relatively gifted young person I never learned how to try, how to fail and then try again, how to struggle, persevere, and triumph.
I have since learned these and many other things. I am not special. Or rather, nobody is special. Which means, in a way, we are all special. If that makes sense.
I have also learned that nothing takes the place of dedication, perseverance, and humility.
Well done champ, we're all cheering for you.
And… while I eventually dropped out of physics, a close friend with an atar around 60 or lower finished undergrad as a mature age student, completed his PhD, and is now approaching a decade's experience working in RnD with manufacturers of electron microscopes. He's a good man. I learned a lot from him.
@ozbjunkie: I completely agree, in a sense that at the other end of the spectrum, there are people who are intelligent and capable but because of that, they're afraid to fail or even try since they think they will lose their title of 'intelligent'. It's a trap really. Just like money can only take you so far, so does intelligence and the quicker one drops their pride and ego, the further they go. Unfortunately I feel gifted students can go under the radar and suffer just as much as weaker students due to the reasons above. Once things get hard in life they don't have the perserverance, feel their intelligence is challenged and/or just quit.
Thanks for your encouraging words :) and I'm glad to see you have found your footing as I'm yet to find mine.
@[Deactivated]: I'm still stumbling through this life in the dark, but from viewing the path behind me now lit, you never feel at the time that you are finding your footing, but hold on, and keep climbing, and before long you'll discover that either you have indeed progressed far along a secure path, or may have even made a path of your own.
It's not about where you are, it's about where you're going. A ship sailing fast at full sail resists waves that a ship adrift could never withstand.
Anyway, I have become poetic, so it must be time to put the whisky down and head to bed.
Oh this argument again.. funny I always find that the people who send their kids to public school seem to be the most opinionated and defensive….like angry atheists
Reminds me of the old joke - a liberal party member is someone who claims private schools are better, and then sends their child to a private school, a Labor party member is someone that claims there are no differences, and then also sends their child to a private school.
I'm a lefty before the negs come flowing in.
But in pursuit of a few negs, gee whiz the cannibalizing element of the left makes it harder and harder to claim I'm simply a lefty these days.
At the end of the day, it's your child's willingness to learn in the classroom and outside of it.
If you pay 10s and thousands of dollars for your child to go to a private school, and they don't want to learn, what good does it do?
No good at all, I lost a few friends that way (but I still remain friends with some of the leavers), their parents (very understandably) couldn't justify the fees for year 11 and 12 after their child wasted years 7-10.
If the kid is talented it will be nurtured in public just as well as private IMO
The old days of the "school tie" are gone so no edge there
I think the mixture of all the comments is a pretty good sign of what both types of schools are like.
If there's any comment that looks too one-sided, you can easily tell. There are definitely some comments where you just know they've seen both sides of the schools and has commented on a pretty neutral tone - trust those ones imo.
Public. Independent schools actually brag how they are in no way accountable to the state education department. If they are not answerable to the state education department then do you really think they are going to be answerable to you if your kid gets abused? And what do you think will happen if you go to the police over it, they will set their lawyers against you to defend their own. I'd trust the average independent school principal about as far as I could throw them.
I wish I could disagree with you here, but after a scandal about a non-teaching member of my old high school, I must admit that sometimes private schools will release information in accord with their financial interests rather than the public interest.
I wonder if you have a view on this matter which is informed by direct experience or if it is a product of your thinking and observations. Of course I have no right to ask for an answer, and you no obligation to share, but I'd be interested in your thoughts if you're willing to share them.
This is a question with no logical answer. I long gave up debating this with people. You won't change their minds - it's like trying to convince someone to change their religion to yours.
Send your children to a school that you are happy with. Show parental interest in their social/academic/mental/physical health and well being, and stop worrying about whether you made a mistake, or what other people think.
Agree.
Private school is good if you can afford it. And if the private school actually has a nurturing culture (some do, some don't) and suits your values.
But absolutely do not think you can throw money at your child's education and take a back seat. The care, investment, attention, guidance, scholarly insight and scholarly values which a parent can offer to their child can make such an impact in a child's life that the difference between a private and public school fades into infinitesimal insignificance.
And yes I realise I am still basically saying private schools generally offer (and demand) a higher standard of education, and I may very well be wrong about that. I just wanted to agree with your statement that parents should "show interest… And not ever be sorry they made a mistake etc".
Just my 2c given we have been contemplating schools for our newborn.
We are going to send her to our local public school for primary, which is excellent, and one of the best in the state. The good primary schools in this area was part of the reason we bought our house.
For highschool we have already put her name down for a local private school. It is only slightly further away from our house compared to the local public high. We did contemplate living in a different area in order to be in the catchment for specific excellent public highschools, but ultimately with prices of housing, and what houses are like in those specific areas, we are happier living where we are, knowing that we will pay hefty school fees instead, but we can afford them.
I think something that gets overlooked is the extra curricular activities at some of these private schools. Things like band and sport can go far beyond what most public schools can offer. These are opportunities I didn't get at even my (albeit country) private school.
Also a small factor in our decision is that we will have friends and family also sending their kids to the same highschool.
Outcomes can of course be the same. There are shitty private schools and there are shitty public schools. It's all well and good pointing at the list of top schools in the state and saying see they're public/private/catholic/whatever but you have to live there so those top schools may be totally irrelevant to you. The quality of the schools that are actually convenient to you matters more.
Just for added info, I grew up in the country and went to my local public primary school, and to a local private high school on scholarship. My wife grew up in the city and also went to her local public primary school, and then to the same school we are looking to send out daughter.
On the same topic, this is what I have picked up in the last few years,
- Elite private school students have more access to drugs
- Not all private schools are the same in Victoria
- Elite private school club exists in Vic ( Geelong Grammer, St Kevins, Scotch college and four more )
- They have an elite inter-school sport comp among the elite 7
- Most of the students from these elite/ selective school end up to be premier's or CEO's or someone with power
- Not all grammar schools are the same ( Bacchus marsh/ Hume grammar is not the same as Caufield/ Knox grammar )
- There is no guarantee of your kid's success if you fork out private school fee on your kids
End of the day, thousands of kids are in private setup and forking out thousands of $. Personal opinion is there should be some benefits, so if you can afford private school fee then should work towards it and not all public school are going to change the course for your kids.
Personally, I like to send my kids to the public but do not live in a good public school zone. Hence sending my kids to private and still debating on upgrading our house to a better public school zone.
St Kevins is not really an elite Private school. It's in the APS, but it's just making up numbers. Also, elite private schools are not limited to just boys or co-ed schools. There are elite girl's schools too (they're just not in the APS).
Confirmation bias in assuming the students mostly end up as CEOs and whatnot? You probably just never hear about the many who don't.
No idea how many students are at each of those schools you mentioned, but you probably have somewhere between 1000 and 1500 students per calendar year across those schools. No way most become CEOs or politicians.
Been to both and categorically can say private is better
Public school is good enough for primary school and private school is better for high school (where academic performance really matters).
Public school for primary school. Don't underestimate the value of going to a slightly dodgy primary school where you learn how to handle difficult social situations, talk your way out of getting beat, and having a much higher understanding of street smarts than the private school equivalent.
Once they're in high school, put them into a private school.
Slightly out of topic, how do you identify good schools or bad schools? What do you need to do to get the information? Do you have to visit the each of the school personally? Word of mouth from neighbours or friends?
Especially if the academic performance is not your main concern, so the schools rankings based on the test results is not a good indicator.Word of mouth? Local parents' FB group? NAPLAN and ICSEA results are too one dimensional and doesn't quite tell the whole story.
Private if you can afford it, worked for us last kid in year 12 now. Any way this is a bargain site people are as tight as, poll tells it. Bet if they didn't have to pay the kids would be in private lol.
Parent involvement in their child’s education is more important than public or private school. In my opinion parents get involved in their kids education when they send them to private school as they pay loads of $$$$.
Depends on which state you are in, what suburb and school choices. My kid change from a private school to a public school 'cos of bullying. It's a NSW inner city school. Basically, private schools generally has more privileged kids, while most parents care for them, some just put them in private schools and don't care about teaching them the right stuff. They end up causing trouble and bully other students.
A group of private school kids just stabbed a man blind in the nearby area recently and people from online forum start to wonder which private school they come from. Not that public school don't have it, but some schools have ethics class and teach kids how to interact and what is acceptable behavior in school. My son is having ethics class weekly in his public school and I love it. Kids in public school don't usually compare where they spend the holiday, while private parents/kids like to tell others about it.
I just don't like the environment in private school, so I send my son to a public school in a good suburb. It isn't in the catchment, but they accept 'cos they have space for him. The school is just less than 10 mins drive and he already spent four years there. He loves the school. You need to understand there is no definite answer to private vs public school. For primary school, most people choose the nearby public and they don't need a huge football field or an indoor swimming in school. Save your money for sports, music or drama classes. They love them and it will make them a happy confident child. This is more important than teaching them English or Maths.
If they are going to high school, you can always put them in a catholic or a private school 'cos by then they need better facilities and you know what your child wants from the school. You should go to the school open day and check the online review of the school, 'cos you help you to decide if the school suit your kid. Don't send them to a private school thinking that they have good teachers. Actually, a lot of teachers in public schools are caring and willing to support students even they have learning difficulties. From my experience, public schools my kids went to handle bullying better than private school, 'cos once you enrolled in private school, they don't really care.
Get your kids into Melbourne HIgh or Macrob.
Best of both worlds.
Depends on how good your local public schools are.
Apart from private school fees, do most parents contribute additional funds to the school. I am deciding what is the right amount to give without being treated like a cash cow but still be treated respectably.
There are no world class universities in Australia. Just world class hype. You can send your kid to Geelong high and have a decent shot of getting into Melbourne uni. Do you think that's true of any actual 'world class university'?