Hi OzBargain!
I have been working for many years as a chemist in the personal care / pharma field. I won't be able to discuss specific brands, companies or anybody's medical conditions. General discussions are welcome.
[AMA] I Am a Chemist, Working in The Personal Care/Pharma Industry (Skin & Sun)
Duckie2hh on 15/01/2020 - 09:25
Last edited 15/01/2020 - 12:33
Last edited 15/01/2020 - 12:33
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I would classify myself as having an oily skin. Based on this, I start the day with a good and simple soap gel (Biore from Japan) to strip the excess oils, followed by a simple hydrating gel that forms a film to keep my skin hydrated for the rest of the day. Step is repeated before I go to sleep. I work indoors so I don't put on any SPF products.
Any recs for a waterbased hydrating gel?
Neutrogena hydro boost range is quiet nice. Originally developed for the Asian region and are popular due to their light feel. I would also recommend products that contain Saccharide Isomerate as an ingredient. This ingredient is extremely moisturising and when used at the correct levels, should feel as if there is a slight film (non-peel) on the skin.
More a general chemist question really, but have you ever had to deal with or report anybody for trying to obtain excessive quantities of pseudoephedrine?
Yeh more of a pharmacist question, so I am not sure sorry ^__^"
What the hell are Parabens?
They are a common name for a group of preservatives. Typically they are made up of methyl hydroxybenzoates and propyl hydroxybenzoates (can also contain butyl, ethyl, isobutyl, etc). One of the oldest and widely used preservatives in the world. In the last 10 years or so, there were studies that came out that showed potential impacts to affect children as these parabens can behave/look like certain hormones. Therefore certain parabens are banned/not recommended for babies and children. Generally though, they are very safe and a huge amount of usage history. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them to anyone (except for kids).
Thanks
Whats the best kind/brand of sunscreen? Outdoors sports &/or swimming
Depends on the skin and what you are after. Most parents go for Zinc based sunscreens because they are thick and white (so you can see where you have or haven't applied it). I would recommend those types of sunscreens or those products that use high efficiency UV filters (i.e. ethyl triazone). For longevity in outdoors, sports and swimming, go for a W/O sunscreens. These have oil on the external phase of the emulsion and usually feel heavier and more oily. The upside is that they last a lot longer and are more resistant against wash off.
All sunscreens have to comply to the same TGA regulations. Therefore feel free to pick based on feel and price. The important factor is re-application rate and the amount you use.
someone at work was telling me most sunscreens are bad for the ocean? I haven’t had the chance to read into it yet … but is this now a thing?
Almost everything we do is bad for the ocean
If you take the chemicals that make up the sunscreens and dump them in the ocean, yes it will kill off the corals and be disastrous for the environment.
When people put on sunscreens and then go for a swim at a beach, naturally some residual product will come away from your body and enter the ocean. This is where the concern and focus by the media is at.
We are making this sunscreen the W/O by using the ingredients as safe as much for corals and reefs. But still having problem to really homogenized them well. It's easily separate between oil and water when we store them in cold weather.
Hmm, it might sound like there is insufficient wax or emulsifier to hold your system together?
Fragrance components are in many skincare products and perfumes. Are these fragrance/perfume compounds as nasty as some suggest?
Everything is eventually harmful. It just depends on dosage. Generally fragrance and perfume components have to comply to IFRA standards. This standard states that certain chemicals within the perfume, should be limited to certain dosages depending on the product's intended use. Most brands will declare the components that are known to be allergens (important for consumers who are aware of what they are allergic against).
Generally, I would only recommend fragrance free for people who are known to have sensitive skin.
How do you deal with the professional conflict between evidence based protocols and the fact the vast majority of skin products sold are not much more than fragrant placebo?
Ultimately it comes down to local laws and regulations. Cosmetic guidelines in Australia are very relaxed, when compared to Europe. I understand based on this, some products that are sold here, do have a lot of 'marketing fluff'. Conflict wise, I work to ensure that all laws and regulations are met and any claims can be substantiated and are not misleading (more important). Fortunately for me, I can ignore all the marketing claims on the front of pack and focus on what's actually inside the product.
Therapeutic products (including sun care) are treated differently however. In Australia, we have one of the most strict and robust regulatory systems.
I'm not necessarily talking about simply following the law.
I'm talking about the ethical implications of being involved in creating, marketing and selling products which offer no meaningful utility.
The market of skin care products is very competitive. Brands are often forced to continually innovate and push marketing claims in order to appear more desirable over the competing product on the shelf.
I wouldn't say that most products offer no meaningful utility. The products I make, have every claim substantiated. This could be in the form of ensuring that the correct dosages of active ingredients are in there, or have the support of a scientific journal.
Sure there are those who are out to game the system. Unfortunately the cosmetic market in Australia does not have anyone to regulate/police the market.
I would say making your products safe by following best practices, guidelines, regulations and your own morality on making sure you don't actually harm anyone satisfies the ethics of the situation. Whether or not the product has any utility is not an ethical consideration. Whether a product has any utility or not is in the eye of the buyer. If there's someone willing to buy a product there will be someone willing to sell it, it's just basic economics.
Any plans for cannabinoid products? (PS Went to conference on industrial side of that market here, huge venture capital investment, despite hostile legislation atm)
What are if any, new "in" active ingredients in your field?
What instrumentation do you guys have, how big is the QC lab?
1) Yes. Currently the TGA is looking at research and safety data on cannabinoid uses. In Australia, you can only access them through a special scheme and is heavily regulated (speak to your doctor).
2) There is a lot of focus on the carbon footprint of water (it will surprise most people on how the impact (on carbon footprint) of water in personal care products) and ingredients that promote your skin's microbiome levels.
3) We have a good amount of space. A lot of mixers, hot plates & dishwashers. Think of a commercial kitchen. Most products we make read of a recipe, just like baking a cake (minus the baking).Thanks for that, I had to google "carbon footprint of water", really did not know that was a thing.
Sorry just to clarify, can you answer questions relating to medicine or just skin care specialist questions? I.e i've got a couple questions about Asthma (Breo Ellipta) in particular, and how/why it's so successful.
If it's just skin care questions, I'm gonna forward this thread to my partner and she'll bombard you with questions lol haha
I can answers cosmetic skin care or pharma skin care questions :)
Are you a Chemist or a Pharmacist?
Chemist
In relation to your comment about the cosmetic guidelines in Australia is more relaxed, compare to Europe above.
What is your opinion about Korean and Japanese cosmetic products, they are everywhere in the Melbourne City lately?Korean and Japanese products are generally known for the quality of their formulations as well as the types of ingredients that they use. I hate to say it, but their products are just better overall. Products in the Japanese markets are notorious for their quality control checks.
The prevalence and entry of Japanese and Korean skin care products into Melbourne is great. However it is important to note that most importers are just bringing the products in and on-selling it without consideration of:
A) correct labelling (so that consumers with skin allergies can be fully informed)
B) by-passing Australian regulations on certain ingredients that are 'banned' or 'restricted'
C) contain claims that are therapeutic in nature and therefore do not comply to the regulations of a 'cosmetic'The increased presence of these products will put pressure on the local markets to 'up' their game.
The only thing I would add, is to be cautious of those japanese-esque inspired products that are not produced in Japan or exist in the Japanese market.
The Cancer Council promotes the use of sunscreen when the UV index is 3 or above, even if not spending a long period of time in direct sunlight. I have tried countless sunscreens (physical - zinc oxide etc. and chemical - avobenzone etc.) and all have the problem of leaving a greasy shine. Even bloody expensive "anti-shine" ones like from La Roche Posay have this problem. What is it about sunscreen formulation that means a nice looking finish can't be achieved? Or, if you know of one, can you recommend a truly non-greasy SPF 15 or greater product?
Sunscreen formulations require a a layer of film to be created in order to achieve a good SPF value. If these shiny products are not to your taste, I would recommend going to a more colour cosmetic approach (i.e., BB cream), where the powdered pigments should be able to produce a matt finish. The only downside is that there will be some colour.
How did you get in the industry?
I was pretty lost during year 12 as to what I wanted to do after high school. A course councillor then showed me some brochures for a new university course with a focus on pharmaceuticals and formulation. I liked the thought of being active with my hands in the lab (instead of a desk job in a financial building) and decided to go for it.
Eventually after graduating, I was desperate to find a job (did not care what industry after 4 years at University). Accidentally landed a job in a company that produces cosmetic product and found that I liked it. Been in the industry ever since.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge OP.
You mentioned a daily facial routine for oily skin, and recommendations for a person with dry skin?
No problem. I would recommend picking a cream based cleanser so that it doesn't strip as much oils away. Then just remember to keep hydrating your skin with a light moisturiser. I would only recommend heavier based moisturisers for body application as most people find them un-appealing on the face.
What's your skincare routine? What ingredents should people avoid in their skincare products?