Introducing Payk - Group Payments // A Free App for Collecting Cash. Perfect for Gifts, Sharehouses, Sports, or Anything Else

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PayK

• 

  quirki on 11/09/2019 - 11:59

  +3

  Already a crowded space with the likes of beem it and finch, what's different?

  • 

    Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 12:17

    Definitely is. I have a great amount of respect for those products and they're run by some great people.

    I'd say they primarily focus on solving something the banks have been doing for years (really well in Australia), person to person. I know they have features for groups or splitting, but I'd say we go all in on that. PayK is a more ideal product for particularly large groups, like PTA, sports teams, office gifts, where you hate the idea of checking you got the money through pages of statements and a shonky spreadsheet, and when the owner withdraws, it's a full amount in a single transaction. It's fun as a group member to see everyone's name and if they've paid or not, and we'll send automated follow ups so you're not perpetually annoying people with weird messages about 'hey where's my $12'

    You can think of PayK groups like mini purpose based accounts. They can be used continually if you want, or keep it simple like 10 people, $10, withdraw it, buy the gift. You also get a perma-url so it can be a fun way to get a whole office in on an end of year party fund, or be creative and start a collection online for something.

    Does that help?

    • 

      HighAndDry on 11/09/2019 - 12:20

      You can think of PayK groups like mini purpose based accounts.

      You might want to rethink using that analogy in marketing or public statements unless I'm mistaken and PayK is an actual ADI.

      Not to be a downer, but you're a low(nil?) physical asset digital start-up in, as others have said, a crowded market and working with other people's money. That would naturally invite - and justify - a relatively higher level of scrutiny.

      • 

        Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 12:26

        Yep. It's not something we would use in mass marketing, but can help with comprehension in a discussion like this.

        I answered another comment below about our partner bank, detailing how we do not hold the funds, but facilitate the process.

• 

  HighAndDry on 11/09/2019 - 12:03

  Watch as they contribute funds instantly using any Australian Visa or Mastercard…

  When everyone’s chipped in, simply withdraw the full amount to your Australian bank account

  Quick question - where is the money held between people depositing it and when it's withdrawn, and what kind of security/protection do you have for these funds in the event of, say, liquidation or administration? Would contributors be secured or unsecured creditors in that situation?

  • 

    Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 12:22

    Great question. Funds are secured by our partner acquiring bank (one of the big ones). The nature of our license requires us to do this. All users will always have full rights to the funds deposited or collected.

    • 

      HighAndDry on 11/09/2019 - 12:28

      With respect, from your own TOS from the website:

      https://www.payk.com.au/wp-content/uploads/terms/terms-of-se…

      We are not a bank or other depository institution. Funds held by us or our service providers (including any service providers who are banks) in connection with the processing of transactions are not deposit obligations and are not insured for the benefit of the user by any governmental agency. Funds held in balance are an ancillary function of enabling money transmission and not for other benefit.

      In any case, follow on questions:

      1. Who is the partnering bank; and
      2. Is the partnering bank any different from a business holding an account with a bank? Because
      3. If not, again, what secures the funds?
      • 

        Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 12:47

        I can confirm we partner with one of Australia's big 4 banks for fund handling, this is indeed quite different to a business holding an account, and in a liquidation or administration situation, your funds would be returned to you, as we are not 'holding' them.

        To have more technical questions answered however, I would submit a ticket to [email protected] and a member of our payments team will surely be able to offer a level of insight beyond mine.

        Appreciate the hard line of questioning! Are you in the industry?

        • 

          HighAndDry on 11/09/2019 - 12:58

          @getpayk: That's good to hear. Not in finance itself but a related industry - just extra sensitive to these kinds of risks. I'll definitely give the app a shot if I have a situation where I can use it (I think I have a group trip coming up). Good luck and all the best with it!

          • 

            Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 13:00

            +1

            @HighAndDry: Thanks mate good luck!

            Let us know how you go! And hit up support if you need anything, they're super handy if you need any help.

        • 

          serpserpserp on 11/09/2019 - 13:18

          @getpayk:

          and in a liquidation or administration situation, your funds would be returned to you, as we are not 'holding' them.

          Well this would be an interesting scenario because essentially you might be in liquidation because of some internal company fraud scenario where all in one day funds have been funneled out to a random bank account and it is then gone. When PayK/Bank goes to reconcile at the end of the day, that is when everyone realizes all the money is gone and then the next day you go into administration without any funds to pay your customers back with. Then the bank you are facilitating this through is in a very awkward reputational situation.

          So the important thing here is probably your internal controls which you can say is first in class but who would really know?

          PayK is a more ideal product for particularly large groups, like PTA, sports teams, office gifts, where you hate the idea of checking you got the money through pages of statements and a shonky spreadsheet

          I use to manage a couple of sports teams in terms of the financial side of things. The easiest way is to set up a free online account which takes a couple of minutes with whatever bank you are with for each sports team then all you have to do is monitor a bank account that has nothing but transactions coming in from the players. Really simple and free (and all government guaranteed if the bank goes out of business!)

          Perhaps a feature you should be looking to put into your app is setting up groups with periodical automated reminders for the people that haven't paid in the group. Then the app can push notifications to the group owner that it has followed up for payment and hopefully you can set up if you want to be notified when outstanding people have paid, who is left to pay, when the whole group has paid etc. That might be a point of difference. Ultimately the problem you should be trying to solve here is the admin side of chasing up people for payments. But even then, nothing will work as good as someone calling up Peter to say "Hey, pay your fees now!!!" ;)

          • 

            Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 14:00

            @serpserpserp: Yeah I would say that there are several contractual obligations between a number of parties and our own business license ensuring something like that doesn't happen. We have been very thorough with due dilligence and payment security. Not only is a major bank involved, but Australia post, and in the coming weeks you'll probably see a little more about us in the news.

            I'd say we make it a bit clearer and simpler than that bank account example. Not to say it's not a good way to do it. Especially accepting payments in visa/master - that means no payid, no bsbacn, just pay with a card, like you would to a shop. Then the group has a live balance with everyone's name next to how much they've actually contributed. If the fee is $20 and I've paid every week for a month, I'll even have $80 next to my name, or alternatively you could create a new group every week.

            We do have automated and manual follow up notifications. You may have the tough stuff to chase money on the phone, but in other examples it can get super awkward, like if you bought a going away gift in the office, and your boss hasn't paid yet. I personally would rather have an app do the pestering than sending uncomfortable follow up emails about that. In the UI you can notify everyone or just any individual via push OR SMS. Plus, every other member can see who has paid and who hasn't - and image is a hell of a motivator.

            • 

              serpserpserp on 11/09/2019 - 14:33

              @getpayk:

              Yeah I would say that there are several contractual obligations between a number of parties and our own business license ensuring something like that doesn't happen.

              I know that is what everyone works so hard to avoid. I guess my point is that it is a risk involved with using the service even though it might be a very tiny one.

              Especially accepting payments in visa/master - that means no payid, no bsbacn, just pay with a card, like you would to a shop.

              I doubt a lot of payee's will use this service for multiple scenario's. So putting in the credit card details (then I assume the address details to verify, I guess there will also be a sign-up process after downloading the app etc.) is much much more cumbersome than logging into your online banking and paying via PayID. I see how this service could help people for a organizing payment perspective, but for a payee that just wants to send money and be done with it, it is a PITA.

              I think that was the reason I never got on board with Beem. I think there was even a time where if you signed up and made a transaction you got free money. But to be honest there was something in the verification/sign up process that I couldn't actually do on the spot so in the end I didn't even care that I was turning down free money.

              • 

                Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 14:48

                @serpserpserp: I see where you're coming from, we've been in market internationally and seen fantastic uptake in groups that are frequently organising collections together. Stuff like parent teacher association, office groups, members clubs, sports teams. These make the most sense for a lot of people, and that's how they go on to become more frequent users in other scenarios. Our signup is significantly less cumbersome than the one for Beem It, but once done it's very easy to re use and find further examples where a group wallet would come in handy. I personally do house groceries, big group dinners, office delivery splitting, and holidays.

                • 

                  serpserpserp on 11/09/2019 - 16:40

                  +1

                  @getpayk: Sounds like you are heading in the right direction. Good luck!

                  • 

                    Employeegetpayk @ PayK on 11/09/2019 - 16:45

                    @serpserpserp: Thanks! Let us know if you give it a spin.

      • 

        serpserpserp on 11/09/2019 - 13:24

        @HighAndDry

        If not, again, what secures the funds?

        See my post below but I reckon cause this is a start up, the bank is probably holding cash collateral for the prepayment risk happening here, or you'd hope they'd be monitoring very closely if that $ amount ramped up quickly. The fraud scenario I outline isn't out of the question and the bank would certainly want full security for a setup like this because ultimately people will be saying "PayK went out of business but NAB (or whoever) are the ADI providing all the transactional/merchant platform to the group, they should give me my money back!"