Roughly 2 years ago my mother purchased a car for my brother and his partner. I'm not 100% sure if they put the car in their name but neither even attempted to pay my mum back. It was $3500.
They had the car for roughly 6 months when my brother had it towed to my house. It is now sitting in my garage and has been for over a year. It's been out of rego this whole time and we no longer associate with them as their both addicts. My mum wants to recoup her money and I'm sick of it sitting in my garage.
Do we have a right to sell the car if it is in their name ?
Thanks
Selling a car not in my name?
Noragrets on 24/05/2019 - 12:36
Comments
If you don't have it, try your State's online Registration portal.
I don't think you do.
Not even sure how you transfer ownership of an unregistered vehicle. I think you will need the Proof of Ownership paperwork that comes with the most recent Registration renewal.
If you have that, (guessing that you dont cause then you'd know who was the registered owner) I guess you can just forge the signature to transfer ownership and hope you never get caught?What I'm unsure of is if they even transferred it into their name from the previous owner. My mum purchased the car and gave it to them the same day with the rego papers signed. But they didnt want to pay a transfer fee, so they (I think) waited until it was due for rego to change ownership. Before that happened they towed it to my house and it's been here ever since. Is there any way of finding out who it was last registered to?
Go online.
If registration hasn't transferred, then you/your mum should have all the information required to make any changes you wish.
Your best bet would be to contact RMS and ask them directly as they would have all the necessary information to assist.
I made a query the other week via phone and found them to be very helpful and they answered my concern quickly, far quicker than trying to find the answer on their website lol
Try contacting over the phone or in person.
In qld it is fraud to sell a car not in your name (only the owner can sign the transfer papers).
I'd assume nsw is the same.
…only the owner can sign the transfer papers…
Only the person who's name is on the registration can sign/approve the transfer - that name doesn’t have to be the owner.
It's a technicality as 99% of the time they would be one and the same but an important distinction to make for OP's case.
Registration doesn't prove ownership, paying for the vehicle does. Your mum payed for it, it's hers, unless she has gifted it to him in writing.
Just because she can make a reasonable argument about being the beneficial owner of the car does not give her the right to sign the registration papers on behalf of the registered owner.
There are no papers to sign, it's unregistered.
When I have sold unregistered cars you (ie. the registered owner/operator) still sign the (old) registration papers to show transfer of ownership.
Might vary from state to state though I guess.
@djkelly69: You don't have to do anything with any rego papers. The car isn't registered. What if you buy an unregistered car, then sell it again unregistered? You would be signing something that's already been signed, and isn't in your name. It's simply not necessary.
The owner of the vehicle and the registered operator of the vehicle can be two different entities.
Registration doesn’t mean ownership but the onus would be 100% on you/your mum to prove that you did own it if it's not registered to you. You having possession of it for 12 months is pretty good proof (but maybe your brother would say so is having registration in his name)
A lot of your answer will depend on what your brother would do if he was contacted and made aware of the sale. If he feels he owns it then he retains the default right to sign the registration/transfer papers – again doesn’t mean it’s his but could be fun times ahead to resolve.
If you’re looking to sell unregistered then there would be no legal issue selling it but buyers might simply not be interested as you cant supply the old registration papers to sign as the standard way of showing you’re the owner.
If you were looking to register it and then sell it I’m sure it would involve at least meeting with RMS, then a stat declaring why you’re the owner and the registered party is no longer contactable
So what happened was they came to my house in a smashed up car with the kids in it. Their previous car was t-boned and the whole side was caved in. My mum bought a car that day and gave it to them with the intention of being paid back. The rego papers were signed by the previous owner, but I dont believe my brother and his partner transferred it into their name. It lapsed rego, was towed to my house and has been left here. I have now got custody of their children so giving the car back is not an option as they then have a way to get to my house which I dont want.. but I dont want the car sitting here either. We could always sell it to the wreckers if worst came to worst but it's a decent car so that's a last option. I'll get my mum to call up the RMS and see where she stands. Such a frustrating situation. She does have bank statements etc to prove it and potentially messages but no paperwork unfortunately.
As long as a another party doesn’t jump in and muddy the waters RMS should ultimately accept a stat dec as ownership I think – there are lot’s of cases in life where it’s impossible to cough up the right documentation and that’s what you have to fall back on.
On a side note, good luck with the whole situation – it’s so hard watching someone’s life fall apart in slow motion right in front of your eyes. You feel so powerless, there’s any number of government agencies that theoretically offer support but if the person involved wont work with them and accept help there’s not much you can do but try and mitigate the damage to themselves, their kids and your own family on the way down.
It's unregistered, it's not stolen. Sell it as is where is, you don't need anything else.
Find the receipts for when your mum purchased it. If it is her name on the documents, it belongs to her.
proof of registration is not proof of ownership. Main roads (in qld will tell you that)
If your mum never filled out a change of registered user form with them then it will be in her name. She should have rego reminder letters with a change of registered user form on it - use that.