I'm a dryland crop and livestock farmer in NW Victoria.
Approx 5,000 hectares growing wheat/barley/chickpeas/field peas/vetch/export hay and with a predominately merino sheep flock.
Regards, Ant
[AMA] I'm a Dryland Crop/Livestock Farmer
LlamaOfDoom on 02/05/2019 - 00:40
closed Comments
Probably just being at Mercy of the weather.
Want to bale hay? Hay is to dry, wait half the night for the dew/humidity. 2 hours later it's too hot/dry, wait for the cool change, etc.
Want to spray? Temp to high. Wind too strong. Inversion setting in. Delta T to high. Etc.
Want your crop to grow? Wait for rain!
What's the most profitable crop/livestock?
Just the legal ones?
Last year?
Barley, wheat, field peas.
All legumes performed very poorly last year, but the price of field peas was through the roof, as well as wheat and barley pricing bring especially good.Highly variable to be honest and definitely not one that is always top.
I hear it can get pretty harsh in a drought, does the government or anyone else lend you a hand?
There is definitely government assistance available but in most cases you have to be a long way into debt to greet significant help.
We have taken advantage of a Vic government grant to build stick containment areas for feeding sheep while there is no paddock feed available. This was worth $5k (the maximum available) for our business.
Why did the 80s have farming fad breeds like herefords and border leicesters? They were everywhere back then. We kids used to play spot the Angus.
Herefords definitely not a fad breed.
I would say the biggest thing driving fad breeds is the proliferation of "lifestyle" blocks (think belted Galloway's and alpacas) and consumer demand (in the case of Wagyu.
Angus is generally considered great genetics for grain finished cattle.
(I'm not a cattle expert!)
What does farmland sell for in your area (per hectare/acre)?
In the area I farm, around $200-400/acre.
This area has highly variable soil types which explains the large variation.
How do you like your steak cooked?
Medium rare.
I'm about to buy 3 acres. Will be using most of it as a hobby farm. I will be getting only a few goats for maintaining grass & meat,veggie & fruit also.
Any advice for my hobby? I've never dealt with livestock before.
Get sheep instead of goats. Goats eat everything ans smell like ass. You can get people in to shear the sheep once a year for free (they get the fleece). Unless you have a thing for goats? I hear they are more acceptable sacrifice to lord Satan.
You're correct sheep is a better option. I put the wrong animal haha. Their is also a type of sheep that doesn't require shearing, or less often,i can't remember the name of it.
Shaun?
Dorper
I would recommend sheep you have to shear.
Since you won't be relying on the wool for income, go for something a little hardy like Dorset or white Suffolk. Bit coarser wool, but with good meat production and good to contain.
Merino are quite sooky and die, but incredibly easy to contain and great wool.
Don't touch the shedding varieties (dorpers aka dorpedoes, Aussie whites, etc) as if your fence can't hold water it can't hold the bastards in.
Goats same as shedding regarding fences!
What does it cost for someone to mutilate the lamb's arses? Is it done at the same time they chop the balls off the boys?
$1 every time a animal welfare activist forces so called knowledge on me.
Another $2 for when I don't give a damn and they shed a tear.
I don't think you understand what "forces" means.
the force is strong in this one
Have you seen what a flyblown sheep looks like?
Yes I have. It is the product of human interference:
Have you considered that merinos (and in fact all sheep) are not native to Australia, do not live well in this environment, and for their own welfare would be better left in their natural (or at least longer lived) habitats where they are not at risk of such afflictions?
Have you considered that merinos (and all sheep and all domesticated animals) have been selectively bred and otherwise manipulated for maximum utility, and that it is these manipulations which cause them most suffering and the need for ongoing human intervention?
Do you really think a sheep would, through natural adaptation, become so overwhelmed with wool that it would require another species to look after it? To the point it requires bodily mutilation? A sheep with excessive wool is like a pig with excessive fat, a dog that's exceedingly long, a chicken with exceedingly quick growth, a cow with udders that practically drag along the ground - all human inventions, designed for maximum profit with no regard for the animals' own welfare.
Wanna stop flystrike? Stop buying Australian merino wool.
So New Zealand then.
If you feel strongly about that issue, your chances of making a difference are greatly increased if you become an actual agricultural landowner. On top of the initial purchase price, I pay exorbitant land tax and council rates every year for the privilege of being a landowner and doing as I see fit. My main problem with vegans is the slacktivism aspect. They don't want to pay what it takes to make an actual difference. They just want to tell others what to do. If you feel strongly about it, invest your own hard earned money and run your own land according to your own personal philosophy.
They don't want to pay what it takes to make an actual difference
Imagine using this reasoning for other social issues:
Abolitionists should buy up all the slaves so plantation owners can't buy them.
Poor people should buy businesses so they aren't paid poorly by rich bosses.
Catholic girls should marry all the boys so there are none left for homosexual men.
@[Deactivated]: Nice. Only wealthy people can be committed to animal rights and most other social issues by your reasoning.
So would you buy merino wool if it wasn't mulesed?
Is your attack against mulesing or having sheep at all?
Why attack mulesing if you don't support non mulesed wool anyway?Why attack mulesing if you don't support non mulesed wool anyway
The same way I'd attack nuclear armament even though I don't support war in general.
Mulesing is one of the most obvious horrors of wool, even though the rest is horrible enough - it's the low hanging fruit I hope others see.
Every time I see vegan comments on ozbargain, I get the following error:
24-hours limit for voting negative on comments is currently capped at 5
Anyone else have this problem?
Perhaps a substantive response rather than a braindead reaction might clear that up for you?
I just got that same error again!
About $2 a head.
Most producers are moving away from mulesing. If it's done, it's now standard practice to use anaesthetic.
No, it's usually done later (not at marking time) once the ewes have been drafted (very rare you would keep them all, and if they're going to get cut from the mob, you wouldn't mules them).
Marking time is when the balls get ringed (Google "elastrator").
Do you answer questions?
OP made no mention about actually answering any questions!
true
Need another AMA for I answer questions :P
Yep. Busy time of year, been waiting to sit down. On tractor at moment. :)
Have you seen Narcos: Mexico. #ideas
No. Something like Sicario?
Hi, Do you and other farmer friends believe/fear the global concerns of today.
EG. Weather changes, NWO, Gov mind control, AI and science-induced global survival threat.Do most country people you know see it as fake news, or perhaps are concerned?
In order:
Definitely, not into Pro wrestling, no, no, no idea what that last one is.
Like any group of people, farmers have people in both camps. Definitely older farmers have lower uptake on accepting climate change. I would say as a group though that probably more deniers than the general population?
Thankfully most plant breeding programs and the scientific community supporting farmers are getting on with the job of breeding high temp tolerant plants, etc.If the question is are farmers skeptical? I'd say yes I think overall.
Is it organic farming?
Definitely not organic farming.
Definer not an option in this rainfall zone.
What do you think of the federal government's failure to have a climate change policy?
Disgrace.
Do you own your farm? If so, what kind of return can you expect from farming over the long term? Would you do it again if you had the chance?
I farm as part of a family farm. Dad and two sons.
Parts of the farm are owned by parents, bro+wife, all 4 of them, parents super fund, then all 6 of us (me+wife).
We have bank loan for my farm (6 way loan).
Long term, our aim is 8% ROI.
Definitely would do it again. I would probably try to stay in regular workforce longer before coming farming to build a larger savings bank.So the 8% ROI is to cover the interest on your loan and provide your wages?
How scalable is your farm - does it depend on the type of crop? E.g. if you farmed double the size land with double the people could you get an ROI of 10%? Is there a minimum, optimal size? How big are your competitors?
Yes to interest, no to wages (taken out before ROI calcs).
Farm is fairly scalable but we are at the upper end for scale without dishing out for a lot of larger or duplicate machines.
Increased size for us would result in increased efficiencies (time savings mostly) but require significant infrastructure spending on plant and equipment.
Minimum optimal size for this area (one man band with labour hire for shearing and sowing, with contact cartage for harvest) is around 4000 acres of say.
Our competitors vary significantly from single family unit operators with 3,600 acre blocks to large multi generational farms with 40,000 acres.Re-reading this is vague as hell, ask and I'll clarify anything required.
@LlamaOfDoom: what percentage would you say is the capital value of land vs infrastructure and machinery?
did you grow up on the same property? if so did you need to expand the size to keep three families from before when it was just your dad running the place? or perhaps diversified into more labour intensive uses of the land?
@Antikythera: Our farm is probably a little equipment according to industry groups at very close to 50:50, very slightly with land ahead last year.
I grew up on a family farm, yes. This farm was around 1400ha. During the 90s and 00s, we relied on share farming to increase our available farming area.
Since adding additional family units, the business and partners individually have purchased 3 additional parcels adding ~3200ha.
We have added some contact work to the business and are possibly looking to expand this further or reduce utilisation of contractors ourselves.
We have also expanded the livestock portion of the business substantially which is proving a great way to burn up any free time we may have had!
@LlamaOfDoom: I'm glad wages are taken out before aiming for 8% ROI - otherwise it would be pretty low returns for so much effort. Are the wages you draw relative to some benchmark (e.g. AWE) but taking into the hours you work - e.g. 1.5 x AWE because you on average work 50% longer than the average person.
What is the variability of returns in a year (worse, likely, best) like and what's been the trend?
Do other farmers perform in a similar way over the long term (I realise in the short term a farm missing out on say critical rainfall might underperform) or are there some standout performers? If so, what do you think is their secret sauce? Do you try to benchmark against other farms/industries if relevant?
@ihbh: We draw a salary of $3k/mo, with good years drawing additional bonus twice a year.
Not relative to AWE.Returns are highly variable, it's possible to have profit up to couple of million or complete loss.
It's all about yield aligning with commodity prices. I definitely haven't seen the boom boom years yet, hope they are coming soon!I think the majority of farmers (in our district would be similar performing. Conventional croppers (using tillage for weed control instead of chemicals) definitely got smashed last year with very low rainfall.
That said, there are definitely higher performing farms out there and we do compare against benchmarks.
Mostly this shows that the guys generating the best profit margins are those with median variable inputs, not the above average inputs. They also generally had lower fixed costs (these figures generally exclude all finance costs).To address some of this:
We have increased our cropping area a further 13% to improve equipment utilisation and economy of scale.
We are improving our variable rate maps to have more confidence in reducing our input rates.
Always trying to reduce overhead/fixed costs.@LlamaOfDoom: Re the chemical usage, is Monsanto your sole supplier? Do you also need them for the chemical resistant seeds?
If they have a lot of bargaining power (e.g. no competition, conventional farmers join band wagon) is there the possibility of them raising prices for seeds and chemicals down the track so they capture the excess profits (relative to yield of conventional croppers)?
Are there any long term problems using the chemicals - e.g. affect quality of soil, requiring more and more fertilizers?
@ihbh: No, we use many suppliers for chemicals, mostly:
4 Farmers
Kenso Ag
NuFarm
AdamaUnless we are introducing a new variety (sometimes bought from other farmers or seed suppliers (AGT or PBA usually)), all our seed is grown on farm.
Most chemicals go off patent after (i think) 20 years and then you get lots of "generics" providing the same chemical for lower cost.
We generally try to avoid using chemicals with residual effects, as they limit the crop rotations available. This is the most important tool we have for managing our farm.@LlamaOfDoom: Good to hear generics can help farming consumers just like the pharma.
What crops are involved with 1 rotation cycle and how many years does it take?
Returns are highly variable, it's possible to have profit up to couple of million
How would profits up to a couple of million occur? Would you need a bummer crop in your district and floods/drought in other competing areas? Otherwise if other areas have bumper crops too then that would depress prices?
You're asking a farmer questions during the day - that's when they farm….. It's NOT a 9-5 job, more like daylight till dusk.
No doubt you'll get replies once it's dark.
Correct on the 9-5 job!
This is very busy time (sowing crops, sheep lambing and all sheep being fully fed due to grazing feed shortage) so not spending a lot of time with head on pillow currently.
Are you ok? Its been 12 hours, we are worried about you.
Going good mate. Just about to break out my 2nd last Easter egg!
Ask me anything - answers, different story.
Probably busy sewing seeds madly with the recent rainfall in NW VIC.
We are busy sowing but missed the rain mostly with 2.5 - 8.5mm across our farm.
I'm a Dryland Crop
I'm on irrigation but trying dry farming this season due to insane water prices.
Are irrigation farmers in your district also suffering from crazy water prices? What are some good techniques for dry farming other than praying to the rain gods?
Definitely.
Lots of almonds in our district last few years which with current record process are bidding the water through the roof.
Vine guys have just finished their season last few months and not sure what their future holds.
Fresh fruit (table grapes) are ok to go again I would guess.
Citrus prices still generally good so they can probably afford to roll the dice again.
Very little irritated pasture or grain crops around here and I doubt anyone who actually runs numbers will be irrigating Lucerne up here this year.
Hit or miss?
I'm not a bad shot.
Burner account of thevofa coz it's been 3 days since they've told us they're vegan.
Definitely not a vegan!
I enjoy life too much to make it so miserable.I don't know how simple one has to be to consider replacing a few food and clothing items as constituting misery. But I sure can see tens of billions animals being born into and dying in misery every year within animal agriculture
Replacing a few good items = 90% change for most people to meet vegan standards.
Vegan options for clothing are also pretty amusing.
Can you recommend me some work boots and socks (thick socks, not bamboo because in my experience they're shit).
What's the use of pesticides/herbicides like on your farm, on Aussie farms in general? Do you have any concerns for your health?
What's a typical day like (rough timetable blocks if possible)? When, how do you do your chores? E.g. Do you buy your food frequently or have a veg garden, eat your lamb?
How do you have break? Short and longer term ones such as a holiday.
Relatively heavy. Probably around 80% of our district is now no til farming (no tillage) meaning we do not use mechanical cultivation to kill weeds. Weeds are killed with herbicide and having healthy crops to out compete incrop weeds where no viable selective herbicides exist.
Majority of low rainfall zone (Australia wideis this way now. This has seen huge benefits in low rainfall years especially where conventional croppers have very low yields due to lower soil moisture levels and soil carbon.
I'm bout knowledgeable enough to comment on Chem use in other rainfall zones.
Not really concerned about health effects of chemicals. Use PPE when using the anything nasty, charcoal filters on spray tractor cabs, and most chemical handling now is no physical pouring or handling, using sealed transfer system.Currently days are on average:
~0615 Get up, get ready for day (brekky, lunch, unpack/pack dishwasher). Feed orphan lambs.
~0730 Check 2 mobs sheep in containment pens and two mobs in paddocks (clean feed trays, sweep troughs, refill dry licks, feed hay every 2nd day, refill grain feeders about 6 days).
~1030 Head to farm we are seeding at (~40min away). Spray or seed (on tractor), refill truck, etc.
Get home around midnight or 1.That's pretty rough. Every day bit different. Today didn't get on tractor til ~630pm as had dramas feeding sheep (broke shear pin on feed wagon, flat battery on old tractor, flat tyre, moved to sheep back with their mob after medical treatments….. Everything takes time! Had an early tea and on seeder now.
Days typically don't start til half hour before sunrise unless job requires it (spraying and baking hay mostly).My wife is currently stay at home mum (1 and 3yo) so does groceries (online shop Tuesday night and Wednesday night for Thursday pickup in town hour away).
For other chores (chop wood etc) I have a great head torch (Led Lenser H14R).- Usually breaks just during quiet periods and have dad/brother/father in law check sheep. That said hadn't really been a great year for breaks as with feeding sheep all summer has been relatively busy.
how far in the future do you reckon fully automated tractors for seeding, cultivating, harvesting etc are away? something like seen at the start of Interstellar. modern ones already rely fairly heavily on GPS don't they?
just the fact you are posting online while sitting in the cab suggests to me its not taking 100% of your full attention.
Autosteer (GPS controlled steering) has been a massive change in broadacre cropping. Incredible reduction in fatigue (you get tired because you've been up a long time now, not because you're mentally fatigued) and increase in efficiency (less over/underlap).
We currently use GPS for steering around boundaries, straight lines, yield mapping and variable input application. Also provides coverage mapping for spray applications.
Our next step will be to add autoturn for end of run most likely.Fully automated machines (with no driver) are still a way off. Definitely ground undulations and obstacles (trees, power poles, rock piles, fallen branches, etc) wool present issues.
Definitely plenty of reading and listening time available in the cab once it's all setup right (we are about 60% there).
Can you give us a rough idea of how the value chain of your business works (e.g. one crop), and rough $ or % for each stage:
- What do suppliers provide (seeds, fertilizer, herbicides, etc) and rough cost > in a season/year you turn this into crop $X > do you sell to a cooperative or other party and what do they sell it for roughly for e.g. markup Y% > is this then mostly bought by food manufacturer?
whats the hardest thing about farming ?