Parcel Content Stolen from Front Door, What to Do Next?

JKF on 02/04/2019 - 17:31
Last edited 02/04/2019 - 17:37

We ordered some children clothes and they were delivered earlier today. Wife came home to find the box and bag ripped open lying on the footpath with all content gone. Neighbours saw the delivery wedged between the flyscreen and front door earlier in the day. So the theft had picked up the box, ripped everything open between the front door and footpath and escaped with the contents.

What to do next?

It's obvious the content is missing but we can't claim the parcel itself is missing. Was it the delivery drivers fault for leaving the delivery in plain sight behind the flyscreen? Should we file a police report? Contact the vendors?

Some of the contents were paid by credit card, others by debit card. Not sure if can make a charge back on the card.

And in hindsight that's what the AusPost delivery locker is for, so don't need to mention that…

General Discussion

Comments

  • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2019 - 17:33
    +3

    Opening someone else's mail is a (criminal?) offence.

    Stealing is a criminal offence.

    Of course report it.

    Claim against delivery insurance if you have it, otherwise it wouldn't be worth your while to claim against contents insurance.

    Unless you bought a closet full of designer children's clothes.

  • MeesusEff on 02/04/2019 - 17:37
    +6

    Postie did their job, imagine if they carded everyone's cheapie parcels (not that yours is) then people would get pissed at having to go to the PO to pick up a 50c parcel. Unless you paid for registered signed post. If you paid by a CC that has merchandise protection you should be able to claim.

  • dcep on 02/04/2019 - 17:38
    +6

    normal post without signature on delivery ? or you've allowed authority to leave.

    Was it the delivery drivers fault for leaving the delivery in plain sight behind the front door?
    Should we file a police report?
    Contact the vendors?
    Some of them content were paid by credit card, others by debit card. Not sure if can make a charge back on the card.

    No.
    Probably.
    No.
    No.

    • JKF on 02/04/2019 - 17:46

      There was no option for signature on delivery. Didn't provide authority to leave.
      They are decent A3 size box. I'd expect them to leave a card when nobody's home.

        • photonbuddy on 04/04/2019 - 14:21
          +1

          What a load of rubbish.

          It's up to the seller to make sure you get your items. If they choose not to give the buyer any postal options, they wear the risk. If they offer signature on delivery, and the buyer opts out, then the buyer takes the risk.

          I had a business send me my order of a new phone. When I hadn't received it after a week or so, I contacted them, and they told me I should look for it around the property. They described to me the phone box, with no packaging, and an address label stuck on. A $400 item without any security whatsoever!

          Needless to say, they ended up wearing the cost, and issued a full refund.

          Some businesses have no common sense.

          • Quantumcat on 04/04/2019 - 15:18
            +6

            @photonbuddy: The seller did get the item to the buyer though. It is unfair to blame the seller.

            • photonbuddy on 04/04/2019 - 20:45
              +1

              @Quantumcat: No … The buyer does not have the item, and the blame can be reasonably laid at the feet of the seller for choosing a method which leaves a parcel unattended on a recipients front door step.

              As I said, if OP had chosen to be a tightarse and not choose signature on delivery, then it would be on them. If a seller is to silly to offer such a service, then they take responsibility, as they have chosen the method of shipping.

              • Quantumcat on 05/04/2019 - 02:35

                @photonbuddy: The item was delivered to the buyers house. Not sure how you can dispute that.

                So are you saying that if a seller pays for regular postage in a satchel they are now liable when the buyer loses it, even if it gets delivered successfully? Have you tried putting yourself in the sellers shoes? He has done exactly what was asked of him and the postal service has managed to fulfil their end of the bargain too (so the seller cannot claim anything from them). So they should have to pay out of their pocket because of something that happened AFTER the successful delivery? That's being a little entitled don't you think?

                • photonbuddy on 05/04/2019 - 12:05

                  @Quantumcat:

                  The item was delivered to the buyers house. Not sure how you can dispute that.

                  There's a big difference between being delivered to a house, and being delivered to the recipient. It's attitudes like yours that have allowed Aust Post and other couriers to become so lax.

                  So are you saying that if a seller pays for regular postage in a satchel they are now liable when the buyer loses it, even if it gets delivered successfully?

                  No, I'm saying you have very bad analogy skills!! Clearly the buyer has received their item for them to have lost it.

                  So they should have to pay out of their pocket because of something that happened AFTER the successful delivery?

                  The seller has chosen, for whatever reason, to not offer a method of shipping that has a reasonable level of shipping. By doing this, they are the ones who have taken the chance that something like this might happen.

                  OP only knew the parcel had been delivered because the mongrel thieves left the packaging. Would your responses be different if they took the lot?

                  • Quantumcat on 05/04/2019 - 14:13

                    @photonbuddy:

                    There's a big difference between being delivered to a house, and being delivered to the recipient. It's attitudes like yours that have allowed Aust Post and other couriers to become so lax.

                    If the seller has to make sure the buyer gets it in their hands - how do you propose they do that? Only offer door to door courier service so that postage always costs ten times as much as the item? Are sellers now not allowed to use Auspost satchels? What if someone does have a parcel collect bin at their house so it will be safe, but they have to pay for the special courier because the seller has to take into consideration the lowest common denominator?

                    At some point in your life you have to take responsibility for your own actions. You're probably the sort of person who would walk into a wall because they're looking at their phone and not where they're going, and will sue the construction company that built it in your way.

              • Never Pay RRP on 05/04/2019 - 12:00

                @photonbuddy: For most of my purchases involving delivery, the deliverer just leaves it at my door.
                I don't even recall being able to purchase a higher level of secure delivery.

                • photonbuddy on 05/04/2019 - 12:07

                  @Never Pay RRP:

                  For most of my purchases involving delivery, the deliverer just leaves it at my door.
                  I don't even recall being able to purchase a higher level of secure delivery.

                  If it's not offered, then the seller is taking responsibility for the package. If it's offered and rejected, you take the responsibility.

                  I think this is probably the reason some E-Bay sellers will have free delivery, but offer tracked/signature deliveries at ridiculous cost.

                  • Ughhh on 05/04/2019 - 12:52

                    @photonbuddy:

                    If it's not offered, then the seller is taking responsibility for the package. If it's offered and rejected, you take the responsibility.

                    Is this based your opinion, what the PayPal/ebay policy is, Austpost policy or law?

                    • photonbuddy on 05/04/2019 - 16:49

                      @Ughhh:

                      Is this based your opinion, what the PayPal/ebay policy is, Austpost policy or law?

                      It is based on law. I had a similar thing happen, as mentioned above, and despite everyone telling me 'tough titties!!', a lot of research found this little bit of gold:

                      Sale of Goods act (NSW), and the following from section 35 (http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/soga192312…):

                      "Unless otherwise authorised by the buyer, the seller must make such contract with the carrier on behalf of the buyer as may be reasonable, having regard to the nature of the goods and the other circumstances of the case. If the seller omit so to do, and the goods are lost or damaged in course of transit, the buyer may decline to treat the delivery to the carrier as a delivery to the buyer, or may hold the seller responsible in damages."

                      This was a few years ago, so it may have changed …

                      • Ughhh on 05/04/2019 - 20:04

                        @photonbuddy:

                        If the seller omit so to do, and the goods are lost or damaged in course of transit

                        Is product still in "course of transit" though when it has arrived at the final destination? Item was not damaged or lost while in the carriers possession.

                        • photonbuddy on 05/04/2019 - 21:16
                          +1

                          @Ughhh:

                          Is product still in "course of transit" though when it has arrived at the final destination?

                          The final destination is the buyer, not their front door.

                          If the item gets nicked, does it not stand to reason the seller has not made such a contract with the carrier that is reasonable?

                • singingwolf on 10/04/2019 - 00:11

                  @Never Pay RRP: Signature on delivery or registered post.

                  If you are not home, drivers should card it. PITA I know, but stolen packages is the worst.

                  I recommend you now buy one of these: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoxhDk-hwuo

                  • Zachary on 11/04/2019 - 21:21

                    @singingwolf: Hey that's pretty smart!

                    unfortunately only engineers would be able to come up with something like that, us dumb folks wouldn't have a clue as to where to start……

      • Quantumcat on 05/04/2019 - 02:36

        Also if you there's no signature on delivery there's automatically authority to leave.

    • zealmax on 04/04/2019 - 16:29

      Most platinum credit cards come with complimentary insurance for damage and theft.

  • nocure on 02/04/2019 - 17:43

    What to Do Next?

    Upload the footage?

    • JKF on 02/04/2019 - 17:46

      Will be installing camera…

      • JIMB0 on 02/04/2019 - 19:54
        +19

        Better not get that delivered in the same way.

        • theHMASfriendship on 02/04/2019 - 20:16
          +9

          Well OP should get a camera delivered to watch their camera delivery.

      • athk on 04/04/2019 - 14:33
        +1

        Place a fake parcel to catch the thief, please… Catch this piece of work and hopefully they'll be arrested..

        • AlienC on 08/04/2019 - 21:35

          Haha I wonder if anybody has done this on youtube or something.

          Leave some cheap gps tracker and camera in a box and wait for results.

  • Sage on 02/04/2019 - 17:58
    -4

    Must live in a dodgey area.
    Hopefully the goods weren't worth too much.
    Maybe someone is selling them on Facebook Marketplace.

    • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2019 - 19:34
      +2

      It happens anywhere.

      There are thugs operating in Toorak. Richer suburb = nicer things.

      At least that's what they think.

  • 87percent on 02/04/2019 - 18:12
    +1

    Contact Australia Post, and see if they'll do a one of reimbursement. Think from memory it's up to $75

  • whooah1979 on 02/04/2019 - 18:14

    box and bag ripped open lying on the footpath with all content gone.

    Did your partner take photos?

  • Randxyz123 on 02/04/2019 - 18:45
    +1

    Unfortunately, you are unlikely to get any of it back or any compensation. Contact the seller first. They can take it up with Aus Post.

    The default for Aus Post is unless it says "signature required" then they'll just leave it.

    Do you live in a rough area?

    Check facebook market place and buy/swap/sell pages for your area. If there is a community page join it and see if they have a classifieds. Unless they were expensive then I would walk along your street look in the bushes etc, the thief probably ditched the contents when they realised it was children's clothes and nothing they could sell.

    If there is a community facebook page, post on there asking if anyone did something stupid then put the items back "no questions asked".

    Unlikely you'll get anything from your credit card. In the future post it to your workplace or a parcel locker

    • TheOtherLeft on 03/04/2019 - 07:56
      +8

      I've had parcels marked "signature required" and they still left it at the front door.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2019 - 18:45
    +1

    Step 1 install video camera
    Step 2 big obvious parcel
    Step 3 ACA profits

  • Quantumcat on 02/04/2019 - 19:21
    -6

    You're at fault for not getting it delivered to a safe location. If you leave your stuff out in public it is easy to foresee it being stolen. Neither the seller nor the postie did anything wrong and shouldn't lose money because of your choice.

    • [Deactivated] on 02/04/2019 - 20:28
      +1

      One complication to that is Australia Post requires the sender to make a claim. In this case, the sender did the least wrong.

    • Zachary on 03/04/2019 - 13:44
      +1

      So we should all have a dedicated lock box just outside the front door(which is of course either cemented down or built into the wall of the house so the only way to get the contents out is to physically break in and go to the location of where the other end of the lock box is at, find the key that fits that lock and open the lockbox out) labeled: "If you knock/ring door bell and no one comes out, please insert any mail or parcels into this dropbox please" and they would gladly comply?

      • Quantumcat on 03/04/2019 - 14:10

        Yeah my parents have something similar but lower tech than that, a pink toy bin bolted to the gate so posties don't have to contend with the dogs. A thief COULD just lift the lid and take whats in there but there's no indication when there's a parcel so they'd have to look every day and risk raising suspicions —— whereas a visible parcel on the front step is a lot easier to identify and only grab when there's something to get. If that makes sense. I think parents decided the risk of losing a parcel was low enough that the pain of having to engineer a solution that the posties could drop something in and thieves couldn't get things out, while also being able to get things out themselves, wasn't worthwhile.

      • abb on 04/04/2019 - 13:25

        next time:

        Well, your drop-box was made of concrete, so it was obviously foreseeable that a thief with a petrol-powered demolition saw could chop it open and steal your package. Next time take some personal responsibility and install a box made from alternating layers of diamond fibre and titanium carbide and get a back-to-base alarm monitored by Blackwater with a 15-second Apache gunship response guarantee.

        • Zachary on 05/04/2019 - 15:16

          …oh, didn't know there was a way to cut through concrete, thought concrete was as solid as it could get in terms of thief deterrent, I guess not…..I suppose one way to go through the concrete wall may be smashing it with a sledge hammer(Which I guess a thief could easily carry on hand) or one of those demolition cranes thingy with the giant ball(unlikely unless the thief works in a construction area and has access to one or manages to steal one), which would also damage the house too assuming the box is integrated into the house walls….

  • bazzato on 02/04/2019 - 19:47
    +5

    You should make a police report, if only so they are aware of what is going on in the area and what to look out for (probably won't end up helping you though)

    As for blame, it is the fault of the thief. People need to stop blaming victims.

    • Quantumcat on 02/04/2019 - 20:58
      -5

      Even if you catch that thief there's hundreds more lining up to take their place. Punishing the thief doesn't stop it happening, so it is useless to place the blame there rather than on a place that will actually change things. Insisting on signature on delivery or getting it delivered to a post office, parcel locker or your work (if signature on delivery not available) will change the outcome. Better for your mental health to have an internal locus of control.

      • bazzato on 03/04/2019 - 08:34
        +6

        Victims placing blame on themselves has a long history of making their mental health worse not better.

        Blame the perpetrator and if possible/practicable take precautions to stop it happening again.

        I don't think the victim needs to blame themselves to actually change things.

        • Quantumcat on 03/04/2019 - 09:09
          -4

          a) The receiver takes steps to make sure they get their parcel - result, happy receiver with all their parcels
          b) The receiver always has things delivered to their door with no signature, parcels regularly get stolen, but the receiver just gets angry at the thieves and doesn't do anything to stop it happening to them - result, angry receiver who feels like the world is against them and things always go wrong for them and they're the unluckiest person in the world

          Which receiver is in a better mental state do you think?

          https://www.verywellmind.com/what-is-locus-of-control-279543…

          • bazzato on 03/04/2019 - 13:42
            +4

            @Quantumcat: I'm not arguing that option (a) isn't the better way to live your life than (b)

            But that's not about blame, that's about taking possible/practicable precautions to stop bad things happening.

            The perpetrator is always to blame. If a crime has been done against you it is not your fault.

            If a thief was caught in your house stealing stuff, would you say to the police, don't worry about charging them, it's my fault for not having a more secure house? You wouldn't be to blame for the break in, but you may improve security to try an prevent it happening again.

            Many sexual and violent assault victims blame themselves and I don't think it helps their mental state. They shouldn't feel shame or blame, only the perpetrator should.

            • Quantumcat on 04/04/2019 - 15:23
              -6

              @bazzato:

              If a thief was caught in your house stealing stuff, would you say to the police, don't worry about charging them, it's my fault for not having a more secure house? You wouldn't be to blame for the break in, but you may improve security to try an prevent it happening again.

              If you left the door open and an expensive computer and TV visible from the window: yes you are to blame

              If you locked your house and had nothing tasty visible from the window: no you are not to blame.

              It is the same here really. If the buyer asked for signature of delivery and the seller didn't give it to them, or if they had it delivered to a parcel locker and it disappeared enroute or a car drove into the parcel lockers to open them and stole what was inside, then no.

              It is about what is reasonable to foresee. If you don't take steps to mitigate the likely risks then you're to blame when you get what you deserve.

              • bazzato on 04/04/2019 - 16:03
                +3

                @Quantumcat: Wow. The OP deserved to have his stuff stolen. I’m sure that’s the thief’s view as well.

                • Quantumcat on 05/04/2019 - 02:38

                  @bazzato: I should have said that the obvious thing that could happen, will happen.

              • lonewolf on 05/04/2019 - 10:29

                @Quantumcat: Saying its your own fault is a bit rich, I would say that it can be stated, in the current society we live in, we need to be more careful and smart about things, but saying its our own fault for being robbed regardless of circumstances is nonsensical.

                • Quantumcat on 05/04/2019 - 10:58

                  @lonewolf: If there's nothing reasonable you could do to prevent it then you are blameless. What's reasonable is subjective but there's probably a few things we can agree on.

                  Sending cash in an envelope is not reasonable because of the easily foreseeable outcome of it being stolen enroute or the seller just taking it and not sending anything. Agree? Would you say the buyer is blameless if they never receive anything? Probably not. What if you leave a laptop on a park bench for a few hours. Is the person blameless if it goes missing before they come back for it?

                  Now I can see here there are a few steps and people might get lost mentally and not be able to make the connection between each.

                  If you live in a place where the general public can see your front door and it isn't far from the footpath, you probably wouldn't leave valuables there, now would you? If you put your home address as the address for your parcel, it isn't unlikely the parcel is going to be delivered to your home, if it isn't something huge like a fridge where they might make you come and get it from the post office. If the parcel is something too big to fit in your letter box, it will be left on your doorstep unless you got signature on delivery, or the postie was the sort of contractor who only takes half the parcels with him and cards the test.

                  So by having a parcel delivered to your home, with no signature on delivery, you KNOW it is going to be left on your doorstep. So it is basically the same as leaving it there yourself. Even if it isn't anything valuable a passerby won't know that and it will be a target nonetheless.

                  I can see what the OP did. They knew they shouldn't get it delivered without signature required, since they tried to get it but the seller would not offer it. They then couldn't be bothered to take any further action and just thought, oh well, I'm sure it will work out". That apathy then cost them, and they have the gall to try and make the seller responsible when they did nothing wrong - they got it delivered to the address the OP asked them to. Is it their responsibility to check that the OP has a parcel collection box at the front of their house? Should they refuse to sell to the OP in the way the OP asked them to, just in case the OP is being neglectful?

                  As far as I can see it is the same as the following scenario. You're down to your last $200 but you need more money. You could go to work to definitely earn more but you can't be bothered. Instead you bet it on a horse race but the horse loses. Instead of taking responsibility for your actions (it is very foreseeable that the horse could lose, so it is a risky thing to do) and accepting that you decided to take the risk and it went badly, you blame the bookie for taking your money and say it is his fault the horse most and he should pay you back.

                  OP knew he lived in a place where his front door was visible and easily accessible, he knew that by getting a regular parcel delivered there it could be left by the front door, and he chose to take that risk. The risk went bad. Now he wants to blame his decision on someone else that did nothing more than do exactly what he asked of them.

                  • lonewolf on 05/04/2019 - 11:04
                    +1

                    @Quantumcat: You are missing the point, this is all still saying exactly what i said, in the current society we live in, we need to be more careful or cautious as there are idiots out there. But to say one is at fault for another person being an idiot is what i am saying doesnt add up for me. We should be cautious and careful but the idiots (crims) are always at fault.

                    I would be careful to walk down a dangerous street middle of the night or be careful for putting myself in a dangerous situation and yes internally i would also thing i made a mistake for not being more cautious. But in terms of whose at fault to completely say its my fault there is some maniac out there who wanted to stab a random person….We are basically taking all blame away from the crims and placing it on the victims. I think victims should try to be more careful or cautious in certain scenarios but in terms of blame i still blame the crim more than the victim.

                    In this scenario, I would blame Australia Post as well as my postie would rather take the parcel back to the post office than leave it in a very unsafe area. And from my own experience, the seller can also be help somewhat responsible if they dont offer other options of delivery / safer options of delivery. Because shouldnt a seller always take the signature option so they can prove it has been delivered? otherwise there isnt as much proof? At least thats what happened when i have had parcels missing, the seller ended up trying to locate it with australia post and i was told i am not responsible for it because there was no proof it had made it to me and no signature etc. Is it only larger companies / sellers that may opt to not use the signature option and just wear the occasional lost parcel? While i thought smaller / one man shops would usually only have request signature or some form of signature so they dont get into these scenarios.

        • Ughhh on 04/04/2019 - 13:34
          -2

          Victims placing blame on themselves has a long history of making their mental health worse not better.

          For your own health, always believe that it's always someone else's fault. If you rear end someone, it was their fault.

  • rxjb on 02/04/2019 - 19:47
    +1

    if it was safe drop by default, I would go back to the merchant and explain the situation. they may be happy to send you another parcel?

  • Sinful on 02/04/2019 - 20:46
    +1

    I have a sunroom next to the front door.

    I left a note on the door to put parcels in and lock the door.

    You might want to get a deposit box of some type.

  • mreddie on 02/04/2019 - 22:00
    +1

    Look up the Wyze Cam V2 (usually on eBay for pretty cheap)……and run a camera at your front door. We've done this and it certainly keeps the delivery people/visitors honest. The Cam does unlimited send of footage to the cloud, send you updates/notifications and has a slot for a micro SD for card recording too…

    • Bubble Tea on 02/04/2019 - 23:41

      They strangely look like Xiaomi Xiaofang cameras

      • adr8 on 03/04/2019 - 11:05

        That's what I have at my front door, had to make use of the few I got cheap on OzB.

  • whooah1979 on 03/04/2019 - 05:14

    Auspost is to blame here with their unreasonable KPI.

  • o53djz7qTPY4der on 03/04/2019 - 05:54
    -8

    Just leave it a day or two. Then tell company you haven't got it yet.

    • Never Pay RRP on 03/04/2019 - 10:29
      +1

      Not only is this completely dishonest, it won't work, since the company will contact Australia Post who will report that they successfully delivered the package to the door, leaving the OP in the same position as before.
      It's just that it's extra (pointless) work for the company and Australia Post.

      Even if they were to receive compensation of some sort from the company, it would be the same as stealing from them

    • MeesusEff on 03/04/2019 - 10:44

      You know that for parcels, the postie will take a photo of where they have delivered it and there's GPS tracking. It is not their fault that OP's neighbourhood has low lifes.

      • [Deactivated] on 03/04/2019 - 13:09
        +1

        Not my postie who just drops a missed delivery card without trying. :p

  • LPV569 on 03/04/2019 - 07:44
    +3

    That’s just as dishonest as the person who stole the parcel in the first place.

    • o53djz7qTPY4der on 03/04/2019 - 08:47
      -6

      No it isn't. They have not received the items they ordered. This is not a lie.

      • Quantumcat on 03/04/2019 - 09:11
        -1

        The items were delivered to their house, after which OP is responsible for them. If OP lost them it isn't the sender's fault.

      • Never Pay RRP on 03/04/2019 - 10:33

        This is not a lie.

        Umm, it is absolutely a textbook definition of a lie

        noun: lie; plural noun: lies
        1. an intentionally false statement.

        You are advising them to state that the goods had not been delivered, when they had clearly been delivered.

        • o53djz7qTPY4der on 03/04/2019 - 14:51
          -3

          The items, by my definition, were not delivered. They were left on the doorstep. I do not pay for delivery in the hope that the courier brings it to the closest point of my address. I want to items to reach me.

          The big issue here is the laziness / ineptitude of AusPost. The contractors can do what they like with little-to-no repercussions. The most effective way of stopping this is by making it unprofitable for Australia Post to operate as they currently do. To do this, businesses need to stop using them. If it becomes too expensive to use Australia Post through lost/stolen/damaged parcels businesses will stop using them. Thus, hopefully, encouraging Australia Post to be better.

          I am fully aware that the merchant is not responsible for the theft of an item. However, they are responsible for the engagement of the courier AND the "safe-to-leave" instruction. There are two ways around this: 1) engage a different courier, and/or 2) do not give the instruction that it is safe to leave. Australia Post can not be trusted to do their job properly, which in this case resulted in the item being left in a visible location and the theft of the item. It could have, conceivably, been taken to the Post Office for collection or left in a safe place.

          The OP did not lose the item. Australia Post did. The merchant engaged Australia Post. Therefore, the merchant is responsible for chasing Australia Post for any loses they incur. The fact it was on the OP's doorstep is no different to it being stolen from the back of the truck. Australia Post have failed to do what they were paid for and if they were paid to 'leave without signature/in a safe place' that is on the merchant - perhaps in the future they will pay for signature on delivery or engage a more reliable courier.

          • ssyl9 on 04/04/2019 - 13:42

            @o53djz7qTPY4der:

            The items, by my definition, were not delivered

            well too bad your definition is not the worlds definition is it?

            Like I also want to tell my boss, by my definition I am not getting paid for work, as I see anything under 10k a week just compensation for my wellbeing for being there but that will never work too.

            The big issue here is the laziness / ineptitude of AusPost

            not really, if the sender didn't put signature required nor a registered post, they can leave it out on the doorstep… if anything OP probably saved a few dollars not putting the post to be registered or expressed.

            If it becomes too expensive to use Australia Post through lost/stolen/damaged parcels businesses will stop using them

            Lets punish sellers for doing nothing wrong! And seriously, you think Aus post don't have insurances to these type of things? You think they cannot call out your lies? All they need to do is show the parcel is delivered and you are screwed as any further attempts will be deemed fraudulent

            However, they are responsible for the engagement of the courier AND the "safe-to-leave" instruction

            No one is gonna know what place they are delivering to or is there a safe to leave place or not. It is up to the buyer to mention this to Auspost (not that hard as I done it numerous times online for things I buy) or sender and request a registered post by paying a few dollars more.

            The OP did not lose the item. Australia Post did

            The OP did lose the item unfortunately as when an item is delivered to the door and the courier left, the courier is no longer responsible. Unless Op had given instructions on not to leave it at the door and they did.

            The fact it was on the OP's doorstep is no different to it being stolen from the back of the truck.

            It is way different.

  • Baysew on 03/04/2019 - 08:59

    What is the value of the clothes that were stolen?

  • Member 0230 on 03/04/2019 - 12:53
    +1

    While we're thinking of ways to catch / discourage future theft:

    Former NASA engineer exacts perfect revenge on package thieves with hilarious decoy device

  • uedamasaki on 03/04/2019 - 13:22

    you could try speaking to the seller (or ebay if this was through ebay, or paypal if you paid with paypal). I understand the package was delivered, but you could still also argue that you didn't receive the item you paid for. I guess it's a matter of interpretation so clarifying this would be important. Just because the package was dropped off at your property I don't think that necessarily qualifies for 'safe delivery', as you(or a proxy) have not personally receive an intact package.

    The seller usually has an obligation to make sure you receive the items you pay for. I think postage insurance is actually for the seller (although some sellers may try and make you think otherwise), so it's worth considering whether the seller shares some liability for not taking out insurance or requesting signature on delivery.

    If you paid partly with CC, also worth checking if you have insurance through this.

  • HeWhoKnows on 03/04/2019 - 16:53

    Sorry to say TOUGH COOOKIES on this one.

    Nobody is really at fault.
    You are just a victim of a bad circumstance.
    Its staight out theft from your property.
    But by all means mention to police as it may be an issue in the area that warrants follow-up by the police.
    Dont expect to get the clothes back though.

  • Nebargains on 04/04/2019 - 14:09

    I'd contact the seller, they may help you out in the interest of good customer service.

    A friend of mine had a parcel opened and vandalised, contact the seller to ask about purchasing another and they just sent them a replacement for free.

  • realfancyman on 04/04/2019 - 14:55
    +1

    Aren't they supposed to safe drop the parcels i.e but them in a hidden area away from the elements?

  • lachhelix on 04/04/2019 - 15:07

    Sorry OP :(
    Reminds me of the time the delivery guys dropped off an Xbox in the middle of my driveway - you'd think they'd default to post office pickup unless otherwise authorised

  • Zondor on 04/04/2019 - 15:36

    Isn't the seller really obligated to have insurance on the value of the item when posting?

  • The Professional on 04/04/2019 - 15:59
    +1

    Directly off the AusPost Website.

    When is a parcel suitable to be left in a safe place?

    An address must first be considered accessible and safe by our drivers. If it is, then we’ll leave it in a safe place if:

    the parcel doesn’t require a signature, or

    the parcel does require a signature, but the sender has instructed us it can be left in a safe place, provided us with your contact details, and you’ve chosen for us to do so.

    Some examples of safe places are out of sight on your premises, at the front door, in your mailbox (if size allows), on the front porch, under carport / verandah or by the side gate.

  • big on 04/04/2019 - 16:15

    I noticed a number of posters mentioning security cameras. Here is my experience:

    • Living in a high rise with >150 CCTV cameras
    • Thief (same guy) regularly enters secure car park (tailgating)and steals bicycles (incl. mine).
    • Every time there is footage of him on at least 5 of the CCTV cameras.
    • Police have the footage, photo of thief is displayed in the building but the guy has not been caught and continues to come in from time to time.
      (even smiles in the camera)

    Summary: Don't have to much hope that the CCTV will actually help you. It may just make you even more angry, to look at the low life taking your goods.

    • Herbse on 04/04/2019 - 16:21

      This is my thoughts on security cameras. Some times they are just glorified picture takers. Only useful if the police already know the theif or if you get lucky on social media.

      However, their presence would deter less brazen theifs. Or kids just walking last and see an opportunity.

  • Herbse on 04/04/2019 - 16:18

    If you're a buyer, you need to:
    a) ensure the drop off zone is safe or not easily visible from the street
    b) chose or request signature on delivery so that it goes to the PO if undelivered, and pay the premium for it if the package is valuable
    c) monitor the tracking and be home or arrange for a neighbour to pick it up
    d) use the free parcel locker service or LPO parcel collect service, both available by signing up on their website

    From a seller's point of view, especially according to eBay and PayPal rules. If the tracking number says delivered, any cases would close in favour of the seller.
    If some sellers decide to reimburse a buyer in this situation, it's out of their own generosity. Not any contractual obligation.

    Many people have a letter sized mailbox that can only slip in small letters. This means anything else will be left at the door. People can buy mailboxes with wide openings so packages can be put in there.

    Something as simple as pot plants near the front door to put them behind can also obstruct packages from easy view on the street and won't tempt would be thieves

    Investing in door cameras or security cameras around the house, if they're obvious that would deter a thief or use the video to give to the police could also help.

    The main thing I don't understand is that we have a FREE parcel locker service and you can use your local post office as your address using the parcel collect service. But people want their items without delay as soon as they get home and not wait for the weekend, so they take the risk of having them dropped off at the door.
    Self entitlement makes some people (not directed ad OP) feel like if things to wrong, they can get compensation from companies that have done the right thing.

  • cloudy on 05/04/2019 - 21:09
    +1

    This is the typical risk of online commerce.

    Leaving valuables in plain sight is just asking for trouble, so if signature on delivery isn’t necessary the business would probably see the cost of replacement worthwhile if something happens, so I’d say contact the business.

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