Purchased off The Plan Property, Builder Changed Floor Number on Settlement

ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 09:05
Last edited 25/11/2018 - 09:19

Long story short:

I bought an off the plan unit in a high rise building quite a while ago on 9th floor, which is due to settle in 2 weeks time. I received the strata plan of the building last week and shocked to find that my property address is 8th floor. I reconfirmed my draft plan several times and it's evident that contract was signed for 9th floor unit. Number of floors in the building remains same in both strata plan and contract exchanged. Builder is now insisting for registration as is, as per them the lot number is matching and as long as lot number is correct and floor plan is same, floor number doesn't matter (I don't buy this argument).

Discussed with solicitor and he is doing his bit to sort this problem, however he said that there are no such clause in the contract specifically mentioned about it and most of the clauses in the contract is not in favour of buyers. I am very particular about the floor I chose while booking. I also have a loan approval and everything is lined up, however change of floor is not acceptable to me.

I am being stressed for past few days and running out of options to sort it out. I thought of firing up a question here if anyone had similar experience dealing with builder in such situation. What options do I have in this situation?

Home & Garden

Comments

  • whooah1979 on 25/11/2018 - 09:12
    +42

    8th

    Buy it and sell to an Asian buyer.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8#As_a_lucky_number

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 09:15

      If he buys the whole floor :) unit number isn't 8 though

      • whooah1979 on 25/11/2018 - 09:16
        +8

        Please don't say that you purchased unit 4.

        • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 09:23

          It's 1

          • Scrooge McDuck on 25/11/2018 - 12:00
            +9

            @ash79: Are you being directed to a different unit at a different physical location, or has the floor name just been changed?

  • oscargamer on 25/11/2018 - 09:12
    +59

    Be guided by your solicitor.

    • orly on 26/11/2018 - 22:52

      Now where's the fun in that? :)

  • [Deactivated] on 25/11/2018 - 09:18
    +4

    Of course floor number matters, particularly with the number of apartments being bought by superstitious Chinese buyers. I would get the builder to provide a full written explanation of the reason.

  • Rizzler on 25/11/2018 - 09:33
    +15

    land titles office does not care for bullshit sales techniques to Chinese that avoid using the 4th floor and number 4 in apartment numbers - they wont accept a strata plan with a missing level 4, which your building clearly contains a 4th Level of Apartments, nor will they create strata lots that dont contain the number 4.

    very low probability - but maybe you have an angle if there is no special condition dealing with the variance between sales plan missing level 4 and the strata plan including a level 4, but don't piss around with a small time backyard conveyancer to fight this. Just be aware the sales plan doesnt count for much. Its the Strata Plan that is the important document here.

    Chances are you overpaid for your apartment and might want to get out of the deal, in this instance, consider engaging a top tier firm to review, will set you back 2k for them to take a look and fire off a letter. You may get a discount/incentive or even have an avenue to terminate.

    good luck.

    p.s I work for a residential developer.

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 10:03
      +3

      Hi mrjizzler,

      Good insights.

      There is no variance in floor plan of the unit, strata plan and draft plan both contains level 4.
      Getting out of deal is one option, but searching a new property is tiresome job and don't want to do that again. Bank valuation has got no issue with this property and I already received conditional loan.

      In the contract exchanged when it's clearly mentioned the floor level without any **marks, it's not acceptable to me. It's a big effort to setup a mind for an off the plan property for which I waited for more than a year.

      Thanks for the information.

      • RockyRaccoon on 25/11/2018 - 10:25
        +1

        Also talk with your loan company. It might make a world of difference to them. They may even drop out.

        BTW make it clear here.

        Are you talking about a name change or a physical change.

        Is the unit the same number of floors from the top and bottom

        Or has it changed as in this example:

        9 floors from the bottom, and 3 from the top (12 floors) and now 8 floors from bottom and 4 floors from top (12 floors) ?

        • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:26
          +2

          It's a physical change, when I looked at apartment under construction from the street, the one shown up to me as 9th floor is still 9th floor but what I am getting now is 8th floor. I am not sure what happened there, still discovering by discussing it with sales agent.

          • Kangal on 25/11/2018 - 15:19
            +8

            @ash79: You should contact a solicitor.
            But I will give you an advice that they will not even THINK about.

            Say that you are willing to exchange from floor 9 to floor 8, but doing so will incur a (example) $60,000 fee on their behalf. Then be happy with the OzDiscount you got. Or they will realise you are no-pushover and will stick to the original contract. Or if worse comes to worse, the ball is in their court and they will have to respond to it. Be careful they might respond with a Counter-offer and say how about $20,000 instead. So you have to start at a high-enough cost that their Counter-offer looks unreasonable, and if matters ever go forward legally they will look bad.

            Really, there's not much for you to concerned with since you have hard-proof and judges/courts do NOT look favourably with builders, especially those that try and weasel their way out of a signed and agreed to contract. You can even get them to pay for your (thousands $) legal fees.

            Good luck

          • poohduck on 27/11/2018 - 20:39

            @ash79: It's been sold to someone else who wanted it. You were already in the bag.

    • whooah1979 on 25/11/2018 - 10:44

      land titles office does not care for bullshit sales techniques to Chinese that avoid using the 4th floor and number 4 in apartment numbers - they wont accept a strata plan with a missing level 4

      https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3481168/New-Sydney-…

      New apartment building in Sydney has left out levels four and 14

      The new Sofitel Sydney Harbour Hotel currently under construction has also taken precautions as to not deter foreign buyers, and have simply skipped out on building levels 13 and 14 (pictured)

      Furthermore Sydney’s tallest residential tower has a level 82, however there are only be 66 physical floors.

      The developer of Greenland Centre, China’s state-owned Greenland Group has avoided level four, 14, 24 and 34.

      The 10 floors between level 39 and 50 don’t exist, and there is no level 54, 64 or 74.

      • Rizzler on 25/11/2018 - 10:56
        +2

        yeh the lift buttons might not be there. but take a look at the strata plan.

        so the muppets that live on level 5X of the greenland centre, actually live on level 4X…..

        maybe you could stand on the street, next to the greenland buyer on "level 55" and ask them to count the levels from the ground to their balcony……

      • Scrooge McDuck on 25/11/2018 - 11:54
        +2

        Can't they just sell/lease/book the 4-numbered units to white people?

  • HardQuiz on 25/11/2018 - 10:05
    +1

    If number of floors didn’t change, what happened exactly?

    Did they name a floor “M” and changed it to something else or did they add a parking floor.

    I don’t understand how did the variation occur?

    So your apartment is supposed to be 901 and now it’s 801 ?

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 10:08
      +3

      When I bought it it was just a lot number and floor number. Now lot number remains same in the strata plan but the floor number is changed. Not sure what went wrong, builder is insisting that as long as the lot number and floor plan is same, floor number doesn't matter, which I completely disagree with.

      • Seedy seed on 25/11/2018 - 10:14
        +21

        Tell em you get 8/9 of the floor level you were promised you will pay 8/9.

        • bobbified on 25/11/2018 - 18:01
          +6

          Arsehole builder might then move OP to level 20! :p haha

      • moneyhungry on 25/11/2018 - 17:59
        +1

        Unless there is an extra floor above you from the original plan then what is the problem?

        • futureminime on 26/11/2018 - 13:02
          +2

          There is an extra floor above them. They got moved down 1 level so there is now 1 extra above. The position in regard to other buildings will effect views etc, and thus property value.

        • abb on 26/11/2018 - 13:57
          +1

          Value of units often increases the higher you get. Less traffic noise, better views.

    • kingmw on 26/11/2018 - 12:07

      All apartments are sold (as per their Contract of Sale) as Lot No….. for Strata Plan …..

      Floor and unit numbers are not listed on the contracts.

      • Rizzler on 26/11/2018 - 12:53
        +2

        But strata Plans which are a contract document illustrate a strata lot number against a level.

        • HighAndDry on 28/11/2018 - 13:19

          Yes - so OP needs to see if the property they're being given is the same one as marked on the Strata Plan, and not as "the one that was pointed out to them when they were buying".

  • Blue Suby on 25/11/2018 - 10:10
    +21

    Is the ground floor Level 1 or G?

    • jjjaar on 25/11/2018 - 10:43
      +2

      This. Which is the same question as rocky raccoon.

      Are you still the same distance from the top floor, of have they pushed you down a level?

      • HighAndDry on 25/11/2018 - 12:08
        -6

        OP is - they just like the number 9 and not 8 for some reason. That's not something the law will care about though.

  • elgrande on 25/11/2018 - 10:54
    +3

    Look on the bright side - 8 flights of stairs are less in a fire than 9.

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:40
      +3

      That's another point added in my list to convince myself if builder doesn't push me back to 9th floor.

      • elgrande on 25/11/2018 - 13:47
        +1

        I have been on level 1 for about 2 weeks. During this time we have already had one fire evacuation. Not to mention if there is a lift power outage.

        But more seriously, 8th floor or 9th floor there is not a great deal of difference from a view point, an extra couple of metres. After a few hours of living there you probably wont notice much difference.

        The other question - did everyone drop or just you?

        • stumo on 25/11/2018 - 17:53
          +3

          Until an 8 story building gets built next door.

          • elgrande on 25/11/2018 - 19:41
            +1

            @stumo: Haha yes true. But who knows, the plan might be altered and it ends up 7.

    • Ulysses31 on 25/11/2018 - 15:41
      +2

      I think it's always less.

    • oO0Dam0Oo on 26/11/2018 - 15:55
      +2

      But better to be on 9th rather than 8th if resorting to an SOS parachute

  • HighAndDry on 25/11/2018 - 12:08
    -7

    This is common. Your floor is set, but the floor number or even apartment number is completely changeable. If it was important to you, should've had this in the contract. Because no one else cares about it enough.

    • djkelly69 on 25/11/2018 - 12:20
      +1

      I don't think it is clear from the OP whether just the actual floor number has changed, or whether his unit is now a level lower than it was supposed to be.

      • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:39
        +8

        It's actually 1 level lower physically from the one I was shown as 9th floor from the street when it was under construction.

        • djkelly69 on 25/11/2018 - 12:47
          +1

          What you were shown from the street doesn't really matter. Does the contract say what floor you were to be on?

          • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:50
            +1

            @djkelly69: Contract and floor plan I received while booking the property clearly says 9th floor and Lot#XXXX.

            • djkelly69 on 25/11/2018 - 12:51

              @ash79: So the contract you signed and exchanged says it is on the 9th floor?

  • Purple on 25/11/2018 - 12:17

    This happened to a friend of mine. She brought an unit on level 15, the developer said all purchasers in the same building will drop a level, so her unit dropped a level to level 14. She took it with no choice because she had sold her house and she need a place to move in. She asked the developer for some compensation, but the developer said is their right to drop a floor level.

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:38
      +6

      Good point.
      I will ask my solicitor to check if all purchaser are dropped by a level or it's just me. If at all I am in mood of buying another property I am never going to go for Off the plan property. I have uncomfortable feeling with this deal.

      • abb on 26/11/2018 - 13:59

        I am never going to go for Off the plan property

        This was a valuable lesson you learned (the hard way, unfortunately).

  • PAOK11 on 25/11/2018 - 12:31
    +1

    Your contract will be littered with special conditions that try to exempt you from your rights under Section 9AC Sale of Land Act 1962. The special conditions in the contract provide the vendor the power to change and alter the plans. Regardless, it will be this case all over again Mirvac (Docklands) Pty Ltd V La Roccaas but this time you can rely on the provisions in the Competition and Consumer Act 2010 sch 2 (ACL).

    I'm not really sure on the physical specifics of the situation but it sounds to me you are one floor lower than you paid for.

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:34

      Exactly, I am one floor lower than the one shown to me from street when it was under construction.

      • PAOK11 on 25/11/2018 - 12:40
        +2

        You have two options and neither are what you want to hear.

        1) Pony up for the legal battle of your life
        Also I would not bank on receiving any monies for damages, you will be seeking to rescind the contract and your deposit monies returned.

        2) Accept it and move on.

        • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:44

          If at all I am buying another property in future, I would never gonna consider off the plan as an option, So many clauses for the seller to get out of it even is a floor level is changed physically

  • Love a bargain on 25/11/2018 - 12:34
    +1

    Same as a lot of others have asked/ said. It's unclear from your description as to whether the unit is still in the same physical location (but just that the labelling of the floor has changed). If that's the case, then you haven't really missed out on much.

    • ash79 on 25/11/2018 - 12:36
      +5

      I am physically one floor lower than the one I was shown when it was under construction

      • Love a bargain on 25/11/2018 - 13:25
        +3

        then I think you do have a valid claim… although it's mind-baffling as to how that could have happened… did someone mis-counted the lot numbers in the beginning? (It might be easier to argue if you can work out where it'd gone wrong.)

        e.g. whether the ground floor is counted as level 1 in the original plan and could that be the reason

        • abb on 26/11/2018 - 14:00

          Someone else probably paid a premium to get their lot moved up a level.

          • Antikythera on 27/11/2018 - 01:13

            @abb: or they sold the penthouse again and are moving everyone down a level.

          • poohduck on 27/11/2018 - 20:44

            @abb: For sure this is what happened

      • HighAndDry on 25/11/2018 - 19:50
        +1

        What you were shown is unfortunately not determinative. There's a draft plan in your contract - has your property changed from that?

  • eqv on 25/11/2018 - 13:26
    +2

    Wouldn't it be considered as a misdescription of the property then? Could even be considered as misleading and deceptive conduct.

  • Charity on 25/11/2018 - 14:38
    +5

    OP why are you fighting so hard to give a dodgey person your money?

    Just tell them the contract is now void. Tell your LAZY solicitor to do their job too, and make it official. Fire them also if they are too lazy or incompetent.

    Then find someone else that wants your 6 or 7 figures of money.

  • jm48 on 25/11/2018 - 15:40
    +5

    9th floor is more valuable than 8th.
    Not fair.
    If the law doesn't agree it is an ass.

    • whooah1979 on 25/11/2018 - 16:47
      +1

      Is there a reason why 9 is worth more than 8?

      • bobbified on 25/11/2018 - 18:06
        +1

        I reckon 9th floor would be more valuable too, since it's higher. It's only one floor so the additional value won't be significant, but the difference is still there.

        Perhaps easier to see if two further-apart levels were used as an example. Like, level 20 and level 3. There'll definitely be a difference in value simply because of the floors.

      • DarkOz on 25/11/2018 - 18:08
        +2

        Higher floors have better views. In this case minimal better views because it's only 1 level.

        If OP is Chinese he would be paying to have level 8 instead ;)

      • jm48 on 25/11/2018 - 22:45
        +2

        Just because it's higher, better views and less street noise.

  • Plug on 25/11/2018 - 16:05

    What's their reason for dropping you a floor?

    • gimli on 27/11/2018 - 20:15

      weight

  • SuperMid on 25/11/2018 - 17:26
    +3

    in construction: "contract is king".

    if it specifically states the 9th floor, and both parties signed, then your pretty set

    unless like your solicitor stated that the contract is vague and is in the builders favor (surprise surprise) then your screwed.

  • ozb10 on 25/11/2018 - 19:44
    +3

    Higher is definitely better imo, less noise from the ground, better view.
    For those thinking this practice is okay, what if the developer decided to drop all levels from 1st-8th floor all together?
    Maybe we should have the distance above ground or physical floor numbers in the contract in the future.

  • ribze1 on 25/11/2018 - 19:53
    +2
    1. Developers are greedy scumbags who will always put profit before people. Funny that this is why the banks are in hot water, time for a RC into the developers.
    2. Never buy off the plan, see point one. When you are buying something you can see, touch and feel you know where you stand (for the most part)
    • OhNoUShiz on 27/11/2018 - 19:32

      Not all off the plan developer is shady. Do your research on the builder and developer. Never purchase off the plan when the builder is not yet decided.

  • konazz on 25/11/2018 - 20:23

    I thought it might be a ground vs level 1, but it doesn’t make sense going down

    If OP was shown an apartment physically 9 stories up (1-9) then adding in a ground level would take him up (ground, 1-9) to the tenth story.

    It all depends on whether OP physically visited the 9th story or the 9th level above ground level. I think OP is going to have a fight with the contract variations, but might snag a chance with the ACL or the realestate act due to having a physical showing (vs a brochure OTP)

    • Love a bargain on 26/11/2018 - 00:44
      +1

      It's purchased off the plan so my guess would be that the 9th story or the the 9th floor (or even the building itself) didn't exist when the contract was signed.

  • Donaldhump on 25/11/2018 - 20:35
    +2

    If your contract says 9th floor physically off the ground and you are now only 8 off the ground then you haven’t got what you paid for, your view is less, and the apartment you are getting is below the one you asked for.

    Given that is it the fact you are physically lower, or the number that bothers you. I couldn’t imagine what the major difference is, other than some reason you hate the number 8.

  • pongie on 25/11/2018 - 21:28
    +2

    Maybe the 9th floor has views of something that the 8th floor would not see? A hot neighbor who likes to walk around in the nude?

  • paloverde88 on 25/11/2018 - 21:28
    +1

    I would have thought Unit 1 on 8 Floor is such an easy sell to Chinese buyers!

    • Roman Sandstorm on 26/11/2018 - 09:53
      +5

      Tiresome, pointless, not-even-slightly-amusing, and completely unoriginal comment.

      Surely the moderators can apply a filter and remove this useless trope?

      • idonotknowwhy on 27/11/2018 - 12:28

        Or a bot to auto-reply with:
        Australia is a first world country, which is why we encounter first world problems.

  • Neptunesblood on 26/11/2018 - 07:47
    +3

    Contact A Current Affair. They love this stuff and taking dodgy developers on. A call cant hurt.

  • gth on 26/11/2018 - 09:26

    You keep mentioning 'the floor I was shown' as being the one that is physically one level different to the final outcome, but do any of your contacts and draft plans indicate that you agreed to level 9?

    • Roman Sandstorm on 26/11/2018 - 09:51
      +2

      Did you not read any of the OP's responses to this question earlier in the thread?

      ash79
      @djkelly69: Contract and floor plan I received while booking the property clearly says 9th floor and Lot#XXXX.

      It's not like the thread is 30 pages long.

      • HighAndDry on 26/11/2018 - 09:59
        -1

        The floor number on the contract and on the floor plan is rarely binding on these issues - it's always the draft plans that are determinative, so OP needs to check that. Or rather, OP's solicitors need to check that.

        • Roman Sandstorm on 26/11/2018 - 10:06
          +5

          Hmmm… if this is so, then what is binding?

          If the floor number can be… malleable, then what about the number of bedrooms? Or the direction facing?

          If the contract is not worth the paper it is written on, then what's to stop the OP being delivered a broom closet in the basement? "Oh, yeah mate. The contract and the floor plan are never binding."

          You are, however, unequivocally 100% correct about: "OP's solicitors need to check".

          • HighAndDry on 26/11/2018 - 10:07
            +1

            @Roman Sandstorm:

            what is binding?

            I just told you:

            it's always the draft plans that are determinative

            That's partly legalistic weasling, partly practical because floor numbers are basically "naming" issues, the draft plans should show the actual physical structure, location and aspect of the property.

            Some buildings have a Ground level, then 1, 2, 3… Others start at 1. Others (on say, sloping ground), might have a B1 that's actually above ground on one side, and so be B1, G, 1, 2, 3, etc.

            So for practicality - the actual plans the building is being constructed to are supposed to be the only binding one.

  • lovepub on 26/11/2018 - 10:25

    Following.

    Want to know your outcome.
    In my opinion, this should be a no lose situation . But again I am no legal background whatsoever, but interesting thing to follow up with than checking every 5 min on cyber monday deals

  • Dr No on 26/11/2018 - 11:53
    +1

    The apartment block I am in, the original sale prices went up by $20k-$40k per floor for the same apartments. i.e. An apartment on level 5 cost $950k. The same apartment directly above on level 6 cost $990k.
    OP said he is being moved to the floor below what his contract says. I would fight for the original floor or seek compensation.

  • Starlight8 on 26/11/2018 - 12:58

    poor you!
    i hope you get your 9th floor.

  • futureminime on 26/11/2018 - 13:16

    Arguments I'd put forward are:

    1. 'The floor level matters. By your logic of floor plan and lot number you could move a penthouse suite to the ground floor.'
    2. 'If it doesn't matter move me back and let the other poor sod deal with it.'

    Luckily in the current market you'll be able to find something else if you need to. I would also consider what this tells you about the builder and how they treat their clients. If they are willing to do this I'd be checking everything I could about the fit out of the apartment. I'd say they've tried to pull a swifty on you and hoped you signed without noticing. After signing you would have been stuffed.

  • KaTst3R on 26/11/2018 - 13:59
    +6

    I pity the asian buyers who bought level 8 for the lucky number and they are now pushed to 7.

    • Ghost47 on 27/11/2018 - 13:24

      That could just create demand for the OP if he/she decides not to go through with the sale. He/she could also increase the price?

  • reddead2067 on 26/11/2018 - 14:05

    The law follows legal contracts.

    Does your signed contract actually state that your property is on the 9th floor?

    edit: I'm on your side, and I dislike property developers for their bullying tactics and trickery. I just want to know what your contract says.

  • yadupinto on 26/11/2018 - 14:22

    when i bought unit off the plan, the unit number mentioned in contract was 206 but when i received physical possession it was unit 26…my unit or floor was not changed just the unit number.
    reason for change - no specific reason given…was told they are streamlining the numbering…and it was done for all units in apartment…
    my sale deed, mortgage paper says unit 206…but later received letter from land title department listing that as unit 26… haven't faced any problem till date..

    • Antikythera on 27/11/2018 - 01:16

      so you bought on the 20th floor and are now on the 2nd floor?

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