Fine from Italian Police

oaks101 on 05/08/2018 - 23:28
Last edited 07/08/2018 - 00:59

So last year I was traveling around Europe and while in Italy I hired a motorbike for a day. I apparently inccured a fine for driving in a bus zone, although I had no idea at the time as most of the signs are in italian. I just received the fine in the mail, but it isn't very clear on how much the fine is or how to even pay it.

My question is what's the worst that can happen if I don't pay it? I have no intention of ever going back to Italy either. The fine is about €90 I think.

EDIT: As per the vote, I have decided not to pay it.

Poll Options

  • 80
    Pay it
  • 178
    Don't pay it
Travel

Comments

  • [Deactivated] on 05/08/2018 - 23:33

    Pay it.
    Get the Google Translator app on your phone, it will translate it for you.

    • macklington on 05/08/2018 - 23:41
      +25

      Pay it.
      You might not want to go back to Italy, but you might want to go somewhere else in the EU, and you never know what the cross-border debt recovery policies will be then. 90 Euro is about 140 bucks at the moment which is better than some fines here, and if it was me it would be worth it to avoid the possible headache.

      • bluesky on 06/08/2018 - 00:30
        +5

        Pay it.
        If your future career happens to require you to travel to Italy, or EU, you won't have to wonder if problems will arise, causing you headache and embarrassment.

        • Zedsdeadbabyzedsdead on 06/08/2018 - 00:49
          -1

          Pay it with no questions. Number one reason we're in trouble. Fear.

  • [Deactivated] on 05/08/2018 - 23:47
    +1

    You're actually a bit lucky that the rental administration fees aren't extortionate.

    • oaks101 on 05/08/2018 - 23:56
      +1

      I should have added, I already payed $85 in admin fees to the rental pricks, straight off the credit card

      • rbrb on 06/08/2018 - 19:31
        +3

        I’d do a charge back on that as well.

      • cheapo123 on 07/08/2018 - 12:09
        +1

        Was this for the rental or for the fine?

        Usually what happens is if it you dont pay it, the fine double and it usually goes to the rental which uses your info to pay the fine. If the rental is nice enough they pay before it double if not they doubled amount.

        It wont affect anything else. So if the rental took money out alrady for the fine, then dont pay it. the rental company already has paid for you. Usually it written in the contract

      • nikey2k27 on 07/08/2018 - 16:01
        -1

        Do you want to go back to EU at any point I think you find more Italy? if enter EU you flag at border and go before court

    • Zedsdeadbabyzedsdead on 06/08/2018 - 00:50

      Luck doesn't exist. everything is predetermined.

  • bobbified on 05/08/2018 - 23:54
    +27

    If I was going to be completely honest, I wouldn't pay it. A normal traffic fine isn't serious enough to cause you any issues later.

    If it was a hit and run or something like that, then I'd definitely want it addressed immediately.

      • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 00:46
        +2

        It escalates

        Are you pulling this out of your arse or do you actually know? If you do know, then please let us know.

        • Tech5 on 06/08/2018 - 00:48

          Regarding australia?

          " If you don't pay your fine or enter into a pay arrangement there are serious consequences. Here are some of the things that could happen to you if you don't pay your fines:

          Suspension or cancellation of your driver's licence or car registration
Court enforcement action
Publication of your name on a website determined by the Fines Enforcement and Recovery Officer
Civil enforcement where your possessions can be taken and sold
Having some of your wages taken
Have a charge registered over your land "

          This is off a government website. It can be reasonable to assume other countries are the same. Just weigh up risk reward. A fine less than $100, or possible problems further on down the track

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 01:10
          +6

          @Tech5:

          Australian fines can obviously be escalated amongst Australian residents.

          But what can Australian authorities do to foreign visitors after they've returned to their own country? The answer is nothing - they have no jurisdiction outside the country. State fines won't even appear on the immigration records, so it won't stop anyone at the border.

        • Tech5 on 06/08/2018 - 01:15
          +6

          @bobbified:
          I used the australian government website to give a basis of what a country can do to people inside their own country.

          I.e. what can happen if OP ever returns to Italy, or even the EU

          If the rental company/police have details of OP's australian address, I'm sure that they have his passport too. I doubt the police would be able to do much initially, but if it does escalate, what are the chances that OP will be put on some sort of system that will ping when he re-enters the EU?

          You speak with a lot of certainty, saying that state fines do not appear on ones immigration records. If you have proof of that, as well as proof that the problem will not escalate further than a state fine, as well as proof he will never be pulled over by police for a routine traffic check, post it. If you do, I will withdraw my concerns.

          As I have stated already, it is risk vs reward. $100 fine vs potential problems in the future. I don't even know why the rest of what I or you wrote even matters. It is simple as, what are the chances of him going back there in the future and having issues? More than 0% thats for sure. If you don't think that risk matters, that is your prerogative. But please don't give other people shit advice, saying, "Yea, nah, you'll be right"

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 01:26
          +5

          @Tech5:

          what a country can do to people inside their own country.

          OP is not an Italian resident. The Italian government cannot enforce their laws in Australia.

          I.e. what can happen if OP ever returns to Italy, or even the EU

          You said earlier that it'll escalate - and I was asking you what it could escalate to? Or were you just making an assumption?

          There would be a huge number of people who get these fines in the mail months after they come back from holidays. OP has mentioned that it's not even clear how much the fine is or how to pay it. I suspect a huge number of recipients would simply bin the letter instead of going around trying to figure out exactly what it is. I somehow doubt every one of those people would be in serious trouble if they returned to Italy.

        • Tech5 on 06/08/2018 - 01:31

          @bobbified:

          I feel like you are being purposefully obtuse. If you read the whole post, you should be able to gather that I am talking about if OP goes back to italy/EU, and what can happen to him if he is there. I.e. what the government can do to people in their own country, like I said.

          You asked what it can escalate too. I dont know specifically, hence I pulled an aus gov website about what can happen to aus residents. I.e. what is within the realms of possibility of what can happen to OP if he goes back to Italy.

          I feel like the goes back to Italy thing does not have to be specifically stated, yet you keep basing your arguements on the fact that they cannot reach him in Aus. So I guess I should have stated that for you.

          Finally, you say you "doubt every one of those people would be in serious trouble."

          I doubt it too mate. But can you guarantee not even one of those people will be in serious trouble? Or trouble at all? Hence my point of risk vs. reward. As I said, if you do not think the risk matters, that is fine. Don't tell OP that it won't happen. Because it may.

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 02:19
          +2

          @Tech5:

          You speak with a lot of certainty, saying that state fines do not appear on ones immigration records.

          State fines are just that and are at the state level only. Immigration and federal authorities are only interested more serious charges where a person has been convicted by a court. Hence when a person applies for a visa, the question about criminal convictions is asked (and nothing about fines).

          In addition, regular traffic fines don't appear in the national police checks because the feds are simply not interested.

          Read the bit about Convictions:
          https://www.homeaffairs.gov.au/trav/citi/appl/what-documents…

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 02:23

          @Tech5:

          I doubt it too mate. But can you guarantee not even one of those people will be in serious trouble?

          Dude, OP has one ticket. You make it sound like he's left a whole trail of destruction or something. Of course there's a small possibility that it could get escalated, but the question is, what's the worst that can happen with one outstanding ticket? I'd say "barely anything". At worst, if he ever does return, there's a tiny tiny chance that they could make him pay it at the border.

        • Tech5 on 06/08/2018 - 02:27
          +5

          @bobbified:

          I think I should just state my opinions for you, clearly and in numbered points so you stop going in circles

          1. OP has received a traffic fine. This in itself is likely not serious, and if it stays where it is, will be unlikely to cause him problems if he returns to Italy or the EU

          2. I believe that like in Australia, traffic fines in Italy escalate, whether OP is still in the country or not.

          3. The Italian government can do nothing to OP if OP is in Australia, even if the fine escalates.

          4. We cannot be certain whether OP will ever go back to Italy or the EU

          5. Finally, we don't know how far the fine will escalate nor do we know what kind of problems it may cause OP if he is to return to Italy or the EU. What we do know is the fine is cheap. The risk is unknown. It may be serious (to use your words, not mine), or it may not be. Also, what is serious to one person may be different to what is serious to another. My recommendation? Pay the fine. Get rid of ALL possible trouble in the future.'

          Let me know specifically which of my above opinions do you disagree with. To be honest, I don't think that you even know. You are arguing for the sake of it.

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 02:30
          -6

          @Tech5:
          I know exactly what you're trying to say.

          I'll simplify what I'm saying in one point:

          1. The risk of anything bad happening with one single ticket is so small, I wouldn't even bother.
        • Tech5 on 06/08/2018 - 02:31
          +4

          @bobbified:

          Unfortunely, this has clearly been a waste of time. Because I have already addressed your issue in a post probably 4-5 above this one:

          "It is simple as, what are the chances of him going back there in the future and having issues? More than 0% thats for sure. If you don't think that risk matters, that is your prerogative. But please don't give other people shit advice, saying, "Yea, nah, you'll be right"

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 02:33
          -2

          @Tech5:

          Nice chatting to you too :)

        • AustriaBargain on 06/08/2018 - 04:54

          You told him it was nice chatting to him with a smile face too, but he just told you that talking to you was a waste of time.

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 07:01

          @AustriaBargain:

          but he just told you that talking to you was a waste of time.

          Someone has to be the bigger man. OzB would be chaos if everyone threw tantrums! lol.

        • terrys on 06/08/2018 - 08:16
          +2

          @bobbified:

          The risk of anything bad happening >> 0. The cost of ensuring it falls to ~0 is about $140.

        • bobbified on 06/08/2018 - 08:41
          -2

          @terrys:

          You're right about that risk being greater than 0. In my opinion, that risk is very very small. Guess it really all comes down to how risk-adverse OP is. Is it worth paying ~$140 to eliminate that tiny risk?

          OP needs to make an informed decision himself after taking all the available information and opinions into consideration and understand what can, can't or possibly happen after he makes that decision.

        • chillin222 on 06/08/2018 - 21:50
          +1

          @Tech5:

          it is risk vs reward. $100 fine vs potential problems in the future

          I'd definitely take the $100. The chances of the Italy traffic infringement system being hooked up to EU immigration records is incredibly unlikely.

        • ronorboris on 07/08/2018 - 10:12

          Couldn't be arsed to spend 2 minutes paying a speeding fine while in uni. After multiple reminders/warnings the fine increased by ~$50.

        • [Deactivated] on 09/08/2018 - 20:50

          @Tech5:

          I had this exact scenario where a visitor from the USA got a parking ticket in my car. I wrote to the local council and told them her full name, I didn't have her address. I never heard about it again and neither did she.

          The biggest issue with putting stuff against peoples names would be mismatch. My friend has a very common name and if they searched immigration records for people who had entered/exited the country about that time I have no doubt they would come up with multiple records.

        • MITM on 06/08/2018 - 21:38

          SPER and the debt is plain BS. Simple answer: when drivers license expires, renewal fee includes outstanding fines. No admin fees, lates fees or interest. Just pay the original fine/s along with the licence renewal fee. Debt would hit 0 within 5 years - guaranteed.

        • EightImmortals on 07/08/2018 - 06:30

          @MITM: Politicians aren't that clever.

  • Zedsdeadbabyzedsdead on 06/08/2018 - 00:17
    -7

    The Italian police are the mafia, thankfully the new government will get rid of these corrupt lot.

    • HighAndDry on 06/08/2018 - 14:50

      thankfully the new government will get rid of these corrupt lot.

      As the saying goes, because the government doesn't like competition?

    • HangryCakeStore on 07/08/2018 - 12:31

      Alot of negs but I think there some truth of exponential growing number of mafia/drug syndicates (italian descents) that going under-radar around certain places in Aus(NSW)?

      This something only locals(Flemington) know most about.. (finished my comment here https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/6233835/redir as its mostly repeated)

  • Zedsdeadbabyzedsdead on 06/08/2018 - 00:46

    The G20 have an agreement. Check it out. it's called sharing of information.

  • hawkeye on 06/08/2018 - 01:10
    +34

    probably if I was you wouldn't order any pizza's for a while or atleast not home delivered and lie low until this pasta's

  • dylo on 06/08/2018 - 04:54
    +84

    most of the signs are in italian

    Well you were in Italy.

    • yk300 on 06/08/2018 - 17:20
      +2

      Wish I could upvote more than once.

  • chumlee on 06/08/2018 - 06:35

    I believe Australia only has an agreement with NZ and no other country so nothing will happen.

    When you want to go to Italy again just give them a note and you will be fine (€200 note will do it)

  • thatonethere on 06/08/2018 - 06:48

    90 euro isnt too bad. I reckon just pay. My in laws got lost in an italian town and went round thru a resricted to locals only zone 3 times in a rental. 200 euro each loop.

    Risk of not paying might be if the rental agency is a multi national they can debt collect you here for the amount with a big mark up. Or the police might end up charging the rental company if you dont pay and they have your credit card on file with a signed agreement you pay fine.

  • jason101 on 06/08/2018 - 07:14

    Is there also a chance that if an escalation occurs due to the OP ignoring the fine, the rental company will be contacted again (and again) leading to them continually charging admin fees?

    • buderim11 on 06/08/2018 - 07:43
      +4

      The rental company will not be contacted again, the fine is with the driver not the car ,same as here. The rental company have passed on the drivers details and charged him for their time.

  • Donaldhump on 06/08/2018 - 07:21
    +9

    Did it come in registered post! If not how can they prove you every received it

    Let’s just hope the police inspectors aren’t on ozbargain

  • jaclarkaus on 06/08/2018 - 08:00

    I got pinged 3 times while I was in Italy, I discovered that I had gone through about 30 speed cameras before I figured out why SOME drivers were slowing down there (most didn't!)

    I got 3 separate notices from Avis for €60 each where they passed on my details (thanks for that…) I figured they were for speeding. When they finally arrived (all 3 in same registered and signed for envelope) they were form Turin Council/Police for driving against restricted traffic signs that the GPS said to. There were 3 amounts on the fine, one if paid straight away, and one if not, and one about double if it goes to court. I paid the lowest one €100 approx each the only pain being you couldn't pay it by credit card, and had to screw around with Internet Banking to do a SWIFT payment to their bank account

    • shutuptakemymoney101 on 07/08/2018 - 20:08

      Should have 'accidentally' paid 101 Euro, then ask them for the refund.

  • Geoff-bargain on 06/08/2018 - 08:03

    There was an article a while ago that Australia forgives overseas fines regularly because it's too hard to enforce them.

  • Godric on 06/08/2018 - 08:13
    +13

    Send them a packet of pasta

    • CocaKoala on 06/08/2018 - 10:48
      +5

      Wait before the San Remo pasta goes on half price though.

      • shaiguy on 08/08/2018 - 10:34

        Sending them San Remo pasta would be like sending them pizza with pineapple on it

  • JUSTINO on 06/08/2018 - 08:44
    -1

    Lol

  • Pootie Tang on 06/08/2018 - 08:52

    No way I would be paying this. Just like the backpackers that come here and overinflate their tax returns and leave with a solid return before the ATO can audit it, they are gone and it is written off.

    Surprised they posted it, is there an option to dispute it, then they might put it in the too hard basket upon receiving that.

  • [Deactivated] on 06/08/2018 - 09:06

    dont pay and then change your name?

  • [Deactivated] on 06/08/2018 - 09:17
    +3

    About 15/16 year ago, I got done doing 180kmh in a 90kmh zone in France. I ignored the fine and nothing ever came of it. I’ve been back to France many times with no issue (but to be fair, I’ve never landed in or left from a French airport in that time).

  • Gelato on 06/08/2018 - 09:23

    a friend visited Melbourne from overseas and got a fine from driving on bus lane with their rental car.
    they disputed the ticket saying they did not know the rule and the bus sign was not clear, end result they were able to get away with the fine

    not sure how things is done in Italy, but just sharing

  • Masher84 on 06/08/2018 - 09:28

    When I was young, about a hundred years ago, I got a two dollar parking ticket on a trip to Perth. I ignored it. About a month later I got a reminder to pay the now $4 parking ticket. I ignored it. A month later it was eight bucks. I paid it. I think then that even my underdeveloped brain could see where this was going. If I were you, I would pay the fine.

    • [Deactivated] on 06/08/2018 - 09:57

      Last time I checked Perth is still part of Australia

      • buckster on 06/08/2018 - 13:13
        +9

        Only just though

    • macrocephalic on 06/08/2018 - 10:57
      +1

      OTOH, in 2008 I got a speeding fine in NSW for $85. The officer said to me "you'll get a notice in about two weeks, and you have 28 days to pay it". I moved house a week later and never received the notice.

      Fast forward 8 years and I get a notice from the NSW State Revenue Office asking for $135. So I paid it.

      I think only $50 of fees for paying a fine 8 years late was not too bad.

  • cuteseal on 06/08/2018 - 09:30
    +1

    Send them 90 Italian lira… (1 lira ~ 0.05 cents)

  • backpaqer on 06/08/2018 - 09:39

    In the UK if you get caught speeding you have the option of either paying the fine or attending some "education" to get the fine waived. So if I get a speeding fine in the mail I will write back to them opting for some education when I'm next back in the country by which time the system will probably have forgotten me.

  • WorstinAus on 06/08/2018 - 09:40
    +10

    Hey OP. My old man got a fine in Italy over a decade ago and never paid. No issues since then at all. They sent him 1 or 2 letters I believe then stopped as there is no point chasing up foreigners on low level fines like this.

    The fine was about the same amount… he got done for getting lost in Sienna and ended up somehow in this lane which drove out onto piazza del campo. The end result is kind of like driving on the middle of Federation square in Melbourne.

  • Pinball Wizard on 06/08/2018 - 10:21
    +3

    Mafia for sure. Same thing happened to me twice on one trip and im sure everyone else. Not going back. Was up for like 500 euros

  • [Deactivated] on 06/08/2018 - 10:30
    +1

    I wouldn't pay it. It's a minor traffic fine, they are not going to ban you from future entry over a minor fine.

  • spiff on 06/08/2018 - 10:49

    Which part of Italy were you riding?

    • oaks101 on 07/08/2018 - 00:57

      Florence

  • Yummy on 06/08/2018 - 11:42

    Don't pay it yet, dispute instead, ask for proof.

  • OzBestDeal on 06/08/2018 - 11:57
    +1

    Are you sure it's a legit fine or just a scam?

  • Munki on 06/08/2018 - 11:59
    +2

    Curious how it isn't clear how much the fine is but you came to the conclusion it's around 90 euros…

  • Wardaddy on 06/08/2018 - 12:45
    +1

    I got robbed at gunpoint by the Carabinieri once. Just pulled me over, took my wallet extracted the cash, returned the wallet, sent me away. Not much respect for Italian police after that.

  • points4life on 06/08/2018 - 13:05
    +2

    You can request the fine to be issued in English. It's a European requirement, if they can't do that; don't pay it.

  • TheBilly on 06/08/2018 - 13:28
    -1

    I dont pay fines here until I get the letters saying they will suspend my licence and that takes months. Chill out, dont pay it. After the 3rd or 4th letter just respind with a dispute. Then ignore that 2 to 3 times then dispute it again. After a few years somebody will let it go. Just change your credit card number for safe measure, but stating you lost the old one.

  • doncarajo on 06/08/2018 - 14:10
    +1

    I had a few fines from Italy when I was there in 2009. I just ignored them. I went back in 2012 and they arrested me at the airport. Nah. Nothing happened. Don't worry about it.

    • SnoozeAndLose on 06/08/2018 - 14:30

      Got arrested and nothing happened?

      did you end up paying a hefty fine?

      • jsediv on 06/08/2018 - 14:55
        +1

        He didn't get arrested. He was 'avin a giggle

  • SlickMick on 06/08/2018 - 16:21

    Was the fine addressed to the rental company and forwarded to you?

    I once noticed a dodgy credit card charge, and had it reversed. Months later I received an Italian traffic infringement explaining what it was. I binned it. That was a couple of years ago and haven't heard any more on the matter.

    • oaks101 on 07/08/2018 - 00:57

      Yeah it was to the rental place, then got the actual fine from the italian police

  • elgrande on 06/08/2018 - 16:54
    +1

    Mumma mia

  • MessyG on 06/08/2018 - 17:02

    My first thought was to say just pay it, but then I thought, how do you know the letter is real? There's so many stupid scams around these days, anyone could have gotten your details and this could be a fishing expedition to extort you for more money. Someone above said to request the letter in English, you could do that. And why didn't the fine come through the bike rental company?

  • smuggler on 06/08/2018 - 18:57
    +1

    As someone who has received multiple fines in Europe and in the US, I say DO NOT pay it. I have like 10 speeding fines and a bunch of jaywalking fines.

    • MITM on 06/08/2018 - 21:50

      I say Homeland Security/Gitmo Bay - when’s your next visit to The Police States of America.

  • DiscoJango on 06/08/2018 - 19:07

    send them a picture of super mario with a love heart

  • doctordv8 on 06/08/2018 - 19:42
    +2

    Stand up and be a proud Aussie that has traveled and has respect for the countries you have visited by just doing the right and honorable thing….pay it.

    • oaks101 on 07/08/2018 - 00:56

      What does being proud have to do with paying a fine. For all i know i did not even do what i was fined for.

      • doctordv8 on 08/08/2018 - 19:28
        -1

        Seriously? Proud Aussie doing the right thing, perhaps you are not familiar with the concept. You think they found you by mistake? Coincidence a fine arrived after you traveled and drove in a foreign land?

        Ok, I will give you the benefit of the doubt. Now call them and ask for evidence, and then come back here and explain exactly what happened.

        Then stand up and be a proud Aussie that has traveled and has respect for the countries you have visited by just doing the right and honorable thing….pay it.

  • fozzie on 06/08/2018 - 19:45

    You are lucky rental didn’t recoup. Send me a photo in pm and I’ll translate for you if you like. Up to you if you wanna pay it.

  • lainey13 on 06/08/2018 - 22:07

    Knowing Italian bureaucracy…. you'll be right. Doubt they would get organised enough or care enough about sending your details to Interpol.

  • Ozpit on 06/08/2018 - 22:12
    +4

    You were a guest in another country, you broke the law, pay the fine. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. You accepted Italy's road laws when you rode a motorbike on their roads. Do you think it OK for an Italian to come to Australia, drive on our roads and then think it’s OK not to pay if caught breaking Australian road rules. Pay the fine.

    • oaks101 on 07/08/2018 - 00:54
      -1

      If it was groundbreaking law that i broke i would happily pay it. The police man who apparently witnessed me break the law didn't pull me over, instead just wrote a ticket and processed it. If he had just pulled me over and fined me on the spot, then i wouldn't be writing this post.

    • HangryCakeStore on 07/08/2018 - 12:40

      Not driving but I heard there are exponential growing number of mafia/drug syndicates (italian descents) that going under-radar alot in certain places in NSW

      This something only locals know most about, and I heard the police are not doing much - you would see why when one of the hotspots of this suppose illegal trades is happening alot at paddy's market Flemington. Its crazy if you been there, so much is going in & out un-monitored

      Before negging, what issue is more concerning to u? Just something to think about, that no-one wants u to know about

  • Geryatric on 07/08/2018 - 07:21

    Pay the fine. It will catch up to you!
    Had a friend ignore a speeding offence in NZ and he ended up having to pay around $5000 years later for a couple of hundred fine at the time.

    • belongsinforums on 07/08/2018 - 13:36
      +1

      Nz is basically Australia though

  • CryssieJade on 07/08/2018 - 13:52
    +1

    I'm still a fugitive of the United States for a $20 unpaid library fine.

  • ozzpete on 07/08/2018 - 14:36
    -4

    I had no idea at the time as most of the signs are in italian

    You were in Italy, OF COURSE THE SIGNS ARE ITALIAN .
    Maybe this is part of why some foreign drivers do the stupidest things on roads here. I don't think "I can't read the signs because they are in English, not hindi", would hold up as an excuse here, nor is it a valid excuse in another country.
    Maybe we should at least ensure that any1 here from India or wherever, can at least read the common road signs, before we allow them to drive on our roads with foreign license

Login or Join to leave a comment
Login Join