Yes! Its free. But is it moral?

BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 21:35
Last edited 09/05/2018 - 22:00

Hello OzBarginers,

So…there has been much discussion around the office today about the morality of…whether it is right or wrong to take something that is given for free.

Let me expand on that. We constantly see offers for free stuff…mostly for food…all over OzBargain. Burgers, chips, coffee, cupcakes, rolls, noodle bowls, pizza…it is all there and it is all wonderful. I take advantage of these offers sporadically, but I know people that will go out of their way to try and get all offers. So…just for a bit of fun and thinking…

  1. Is it morally wrong to take a free offer when you had absolutely no intention of patronizing a store prior to the offer…and have no intention of ever patronizing the store after the offer….but will likely go to the store again if there was another free offer?

  2. Is it morally wrong to find a "loophole" in a system or rules and to exploit that loophole to your advantage, on the assumption that doing so isn't breaking the law?

  3. Is it morally wrong to wait for an item to be discounted before you purchase the item when you may not ever purchase the item had it not been discounted?

  4. You find a wallet/purse/phone/valuable item. Is it morally wrong to keep the item if
    (a) you can identify without any doubt who the item belongs to?
    (b) there is absolutely no way of identifying to whom the item belongs.

  5. Is it morally wrong to download/stream a movie if…
    (a) You were really keen to watch it?
    (b) You were never ever intending to watch it?

  6. You find an item…say a laptop…in hard rubbish. You take the laptop.
    (a) To whom does the laptop belong?
    (b) You discover the laptop is broken…but still under warranty. Is it OK to make a claim under that warranty?
    (c) You discover the laptop is broken and is not under warranty. It can be fixed if you buy a spare part. Is it OK for you to call the company…ask for support… purchase the spare part and fix the laptop?
    (d) You discover the laptop is broken and is not under warranty. It can be fixed if you buy a spare part. You call the company for support and they say they dont make spare parts…instead they offer you a new laptop as a gesture of goodwill. Is that morally OK?

  7. Referring to point 6, would your responses change had you not found the laptop, but you were given it?

  8. Again on point 6, would your responses change had you purchased the laptop as a second-hand item?

  9. Are any of the questions above actually questions of morality??

Thank you all. Just all a bit of fun and discussion. Id love to hear what you all think.

Brant

General Discussion

Comments

  • Hybroid on 09/05/2018 - 21:38

    1. No unless there are restrictions on the offer to being a paying customer. If there aren't then it's fair play.

    2. Grey area, depends on the context.

    3. No, that's the purpose of discounting items.

    4. Yes, it's morally wrong to keep it under any circumstance imo.

    5. Yes, it's morally wrong but we all do it anyway.

    6. a) Unknown, could be stolen and dumped.
      b) Yes, unless the warranty is non-transferable in which case they would decline service.
      c) Yes, if they are happy to serve you then fair game.
      d) Great question, not sure.

    7. Nope.

    8. Nope.

    9. I think so, they're pretty good questions.

  • RiseAndRuin on 09/05/2018 - 22:07
    +4

    just wondering if you realized that n.3 is essentially the reason why ozbargain even exists? :)

    • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 22:13

      Of course I realise…but I have heard it said that its all about intent.

      If I never intended to buy something but now only do so because it is discounted…the morality of that is questionable.

      I wanted to explore the point.

      • dbui8743 on 09/05/2018 - 22:25
        +4

        The point of something being discounted is mostly to draw the attention of people who wouldn't usually pay any attention to the stuff or people who are on the fence.

        People who really need or even want the items will just buy them sooner or later.

      • Presence on 09/05/2018 - 22:25
        +2

        The only reason things are discounted is so people who wouldn't pay full price purchase it.

      • bobbified on 09/05/2018 - 23:07
        +5

        If I never intended to buy something but now only do so because it is discounted…the morality of that is questionable.

        You either haven't worded the above correctly or your logic just sucks!

        What does morality have to do with buying something that's on sale?

        • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 23:12
          -3

          How does my logic suck? I'm simply asking a question. I'm not saying morality has a single thing to do with it. I'm asking YOU what YOU think.

        • bobbified on 09/05/2018 - 23:19
          +3

          @BrantRaven:

          I mean, how do you even come up with such a strange suggestion that buying an item on discount is morally questionable?

        • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 23:41
          -5

          @bobbified:

          Do you even understand that I am asking your opinion? The question is still valid even if you think the suggestion within it is not sensible. FFS. For the Nth time…I am not saying that I believe it is morally questionable. I am posing the question as a hypothetical belief and asking what your thoughts are.

          At this point I haven't decided if you just don't understand or if you are trolling!

        • phocus on 10/05/2018 - 13:19
          +2

          @BrantRaven: why are you taking this so personally?

        • SlickMick on 10/05/2018 - 14:30
          +2

          @BrantRaven:
          You're getting upset, but not listening. Some of your questions don't make sense. It doesn't make sense to question the morality of buying things on discount. It makes less sense than questioning the morality of eating toast. (At least maybe some idiot could suggest the wheat got injured!!??)

  • WatchNerd on 09/05/2018 - 22:15
    +11

    It must have been a slow day in the office today?

    • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 22:17

      LOL. To be fair it was a discussion at lunch and after work.

  • Empharand on 09/05/2018 - 22:31

    As you seem to be on a guilt trip, I will throw another one out there..
    Is it morally wrong to take free food, when there are homeless people that could use that food more then you, and obviously are not aware of said free food offers due to no connection to the internet?

    I'm also guilty of the above, I think we all do it. The best thing I ever did homeless wise was provide food and water to about 12+ people in Las Vegas last year, most were very thankful, others were only interested in money. I had a homeless person approach me in New York wanting money, I didn't have any on me (plastic was my primary form of payment) so I offered him a large fries from Maccas that I had already bought and he walked off. I also had a homeless person approach me in LA wanting a dollar, I happened to have 40c in my pocket and offered that to him, he gave me a foul look and said 'have a nice day'

    Yep

    • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 22:37

      Hang a sec…

      Why on earth would you think I'm on a guilt trip? LOL! This is just a set of questions devised by me after having a work discussion today. I was curious to know what this community genuinely thought. Nothing more!

      I have no guilt…nor am I trying guilt anyone!

    • FeRGan on 10/05/2018 - 03:29

      Drugs.

  • Diji1 on 09/05/2018 - 22:45

    What?

    • bobbified on 09/05/2018 - 22:57
      +2

      The answer is Yes. But what's the question again?

  • [Deactivated] on 09/05/2018 - 22:57
    +1

    Nietzsche was the man. Morals are just slave conditioning.

  • Ughhh on 09/05/2018 - 23:13
    +2

    Many silly questions here imo.

    You discover the laptop is broken and is not under warranty. It can be fixed if you buy a spare part. You call the company for support and they say they dont make spare parts…instead they offer you a new laptop as a gesture of goodwill. Is that morally OK

    Why would a company give you a new free laptop, when the original laptop is out of warranty?? It's hard enough getting a new replacement when it is under warranty.

    Back to reality.

    • BrantRaven on 09/05/2018 - 23:16
      -2

      FFS!

      Firstly it does happen. Has happened to me…but not with a lappy.

      Secondly, even if you think if wouldnt happen…imagine (u know that thing before the internet existed) that it did happen. The question still stands. Im asking for your opinion on the morality of it.

      • Cave Fire on 10/05/2018 - 00:43

        imagine, sounds like a cool mmorpg made by john lennon.

      • Ughhh on 10/05/2018 - 18:21

        What's your opinion on the morality of a kitten attacking a suspicious looking leprechaun?

    • Cave Fire on 10/05/2018 - 00:45

      depends on your social setting, sometimes they'll just make things happen to keep the wheels rolling imo.

  • Detective Pikachu on 10/05/2018 - 01:12

    … these offers sporadically, but I know people that will go out of their way to try and get all offers.

    Are you suggesting there's a moral difference between someone who uses these offers sporadically over someone that uses all offers?

    At the end of the day, morality is a very subjective topic, particularly in a "liberal" society. One person may find a moral standard to be universal, while another person doesn't.

    To vaguely answer some of your leading questions, yes, most definitely, they would all not be moral in any "anti-capitalist" or "anti-liberal" society.

    • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 10:23

      I am not suggesting anything at all. I am asking a series of questions and asking…What do YOU think! I am not asserting anything.

  • Savas on 10/05/2018 - 02:17
    +5

    Are you like Ned Flanders or something?

    • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 10:24

      Thank you for adding to the discussion. Yes…Im Ned Flanders.

  • lbsyc on 10/05/2018 - 03:08
    +3

    TLDR, it depends

  • Godric on 10/05/2018 - 06:10

    Yes

    • Euphemistic on 14/05/2018 - 16:31

      Yes, Yes, No, Yes, Yes, No, no, no yes no maybe no no maybe maybe no……

  • GourmetFoodie on 10/05/2018 - 06:58
    +1

    Generally speaking when stores run freebie promotions they know there will be a certain percentage of ozbargain types who take advantage of it purely for the sake of the freebie. The reason they continue to run these promos is that there is also a percentage who become introduced to the brand and re purchase or existing customers who become more loyal and purchase more because of the promo. Any smart business will run ROIs on these things…

    So in short if the company loses out because of the promo its their own fault for not implementing it properly.

    • SlickMick on 10/05/2018 - 14:39
      +1

      I'm just a bargain hunter, but I've been influenced by countless freebies. We are part of the target market even if we think we're immune to their marketing.

      I got done big time once: I entered a mother's day competition for one of those burners that diffuse oils into the air. I didn't win it, but had already made up my mind that's what I wanted to give mum, so I bought one from them.
      No prizes for guessing who won that round.

  • myusername on 10/05/2018 - 08:03
    +2

    life is all about finding loopholes

  • Ryanek on 10/05/2018 - 08:05
    +1

    Companies offering free stuff just comes out of the advertising budget.

  • Gandalf the Thrifty on 10/05/2018 - 08:20

    Be interesting to know what industry your office is in.

  • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2018 - 08:52
    +1

    Filed under "Someone has too much time on their hands".

    • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 10:21
      -3

      Ok…so someone asking questions in your mind is that they have too much time on their hands. What a stupid position. Perhaps we can file your response under…"someone who doesnt like to think".

      • SlickMick on 10/05/2018 - 14:40
        +1

        dang I've wasted all my negative votes on you today, and I wasn't done yet :(

      • [Deactivated] on 12/05/2018 - 09:21
        +2

        Filed under, "Someone who asks for opinions but doesn't like those that don't agree with his own".

  • Speckled Jim on 10/05/2018 - 09:10

    1. Morally fine. Offer is made; an invitation with no conditions regarding future patronage.

    2. Morally fine. That's why they're called loopholes. Usually some effort required to partake which is why some choose not to exploit them.

    3. Morally fine. Offer is made based on vendor's short and long-term calculations. Product is old? Better to clear it. All prices for the product during its retail life would be calculated to arrive at an average gross-profit figure.

    4. Morally wrong on both counts.

    5. Morally wrong on both counts.

    6. Complicated. IMO, unless the laptop was contained within a clearly marked Council collection bin, it's up for grabs. Viewed another way; you're saving them the trouble of processing it. At that point it's yours in the same sense as a private sale without receipt. Claim away.

    7. Same as 6.

    8. As above.

    9. IMO, only questions 4 & 5 relate to morality. The others relate to a free-market system bound by regulations (where morality is irrelevant) and prevention of landfill or reclamation processing. If Councils feel dudded because collection items are pounced upon, they should have lockable cages along every verge so bulky items can be deposited. Should someone break in to it, then you have a moral and legal issue.

    Do we get a new smart phone for this survey?

    • Gandalf the Thrifty on 10/05/2018 - 10:06

      Do we get a new smart phone for this survey?

      Only if you find one in hard rubbish

  • the Unforgiven on 10/05/2018 - 09:38

    no, unless you abuse the situation

  • mhasan on 10/05/2018 - 11:19
    +1

    Looks like your colleagues got too much time on hand to discuss these less important issues at work. Im sure you can find time at the dinner table for this…

    • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 12:11
      -3

      Thanks for your intelligent comment. Why didnt I think about this before rolls eyes

      sarcasm

      • D C on 12/05/2018 - 18:41
        +2

        Well, add another question to your survey:

        10: Is it moral to talk crap at work when I'm supposed to be working?

  • outlander on 10/05/2018 - 12:21

    Here's a moral question for you: Is it wrong not to take every advantage you can, when you can use that money to help the countless people enslaved by circumstance?

  • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2018 - 12:54
    +2

    3 is stupid.

    "Is it morally wrong to wait for an item to be discounted before you purchase the item when you may not ever purchase the item had it not been discounted?"

    The whole idea of giving discounts is to get people to buy something they wouldn't have purchased otherwise.

    So think of if it like this.

    $1,000 item, you would never buy.
    Retailer keeps item at $1,000, and you don't buy it.
    Retailer discounts item to $800, and you buy it.
    Retailer make an $800 sale, otherwise they would have made no sale at all.
    Did they make as much profit than if they sold it at $1,000? No, but they would have made $0 by not selling it anyway.
    What if they made a loss and not a profit? The business chose to see it below cost, that is their decision to make not ours.

    • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 14:00
      -4

      I agree with your logic…but asking the question isnt stupid.

      Since posting these questions I have had to explain time and time again…asking the question isn't the same as believing what the question is asking.

      I could ask the question…Do you think the policies of Nazi Germany had a negative effect on Jewish People? Asking this question doesnt mean that I dont think there wasnt an effect. It is simply asking the question!!!

      • SlickMick on 10/05/2018 - 14:42
        +5

        I used to say no questions are stupid. I've changed my mind.

        • BrantRaven on 10/05/2018 - 15:20
          -5

          thanks for trolling!

        • SlickMick on 10/05/2018 - 17:22

          @BrantRaven:
          lucky you to still have negative votes. I guess you haven't come across many poster's like yourself.

  • Ozbargainite on 10/05/2018 - 16:00
    +3

    Is it reasonable to expect answers to 9 different questions in one post?

  • R-Man on 11/05/2018 - 22:24
    +1

    "Is it morally wrong to wait for an item to be discounted before you purchase the item when you may not ever purchase the item had it not been discounted?"

    Yes. Despicable. I never do this. I only buy items at the true, just, moral and righteous RRP set by the retailers most holy and virtuous.

    Those who do this ye shall be judged.

  • owli on 12/05/2018 - 10:16

    Just because you broden a deal it does not make you immoral.
    You might just be an arsehole.

    OP most of your questions have no moral content.

  • anastasiastarz on 13/05/2018 - 02:42

    Chidi is that you?

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