I found $150 on exiting the toilets, and handed it to the receptionist. She sent out an email to the whole office, and the owner was found.
From where I come from, if you lose something, and someone else finds it, and returns it, you owe him 10% of the value.
Well, this guy did not even thank me.
Although I know it's illegal and partly immoral, next time I find money in the office, I'm even more tempted to keep it.
^^^^^^^
This is what the OP is referring to and I tend to agree after having found a wallet with $1500 in and receiving nothing.
We all say time is money and it takes less time to keep (which I couldn’t morally do) than to contact the owner.
From a third person view easy to judge but having been there, yeah was a bit miffed. Would I have accepted it? well it depends on the owners behaviour.
What goes around comes around though. If you had, or ever have lost a wallet before, it’s at least a day of running around just to replace all the cards, not to mention stress, etc.
I’d return a wallet with a bit of my time in the hopes that, should the same happen to me, the person who found it would do a similar thing for me.
You could have just left it where you found it wouldn't have wasted any of your time or effort…
But because you picked it knowingly going to return it because you are a good person. I reckon you wouldn't have accepted a reward instead accepted a coffee or beer wherever you were.
Leaving a misplaced item feels like I'm doing it "knowing" someone else might steal it.
Any form of gratitude/happiness/relief is how they justify your efforts and prove to you that they didn't deserve to have their stuff stolen for being a jerk.
I returned this lady's wallet one time. I missed my half hourly bus for it too, I didn't want anything for it really but what I got was a dirty look and a snatch before she walked away abruptly. I regretted not opening the change compartment and shaking the coins all over the floor in front of her.
Recently I found a card wallet at the station. Had an work ID, credit card, medicare card, transport pass and drivers license all neatly jammed into the little plastic wallet. I was tempted to play hero but instead scribbled a smiley face with the text "hope this made it back to you!" on a bit of paper and slipped it in before handing it into the security staff on duty. I don't know if they ever got it back, and had run to make the train, but I was much much happier.
lol finders fee.
That's not a thing - except at public events where parents want to upset their kids
Interestingly it is where OP is from - Switzerland. The law obliges owners of lost items to reward those who hand them in. The requirement to give a reward is set out in article 722 the Swiss civil code. It says the finder is entitled to just reward, and reimbursement of related expenses. The code does not specify the amount of the reward, although 10% of the item’s value is often used as a rule of thumb. A generous finder can decline to accept the reward.
I wonder if people in Switzerland "find" a lot of "lost" cars…
I found a purse with $250 in it. Returned to the owner and she offered me $100. I didn't accept but it felt great knowing that she offered it. The owner should have you something as it is a nice gesture. You did the right thing as it did not belong to you, they could have done better…
I wouldn't have accepted it either. Its nice that the owner offered, but I would have returned anything I found just because its the right thing to do, not to try and benefit from it.
I've returned heaps of crap over the years to people; wallets, phones, keys, card etc. To expect a reward is just "ugh", I've enough stuff.
And then there's you. Why make the world a better place when you can get what's "yours"?
He's not interested in being Aussified…
Maybe we can restrict any hopes of him wanting to be an Aussie citizen like the Swiss do as well…(people get a vote)
Do you work in lost and found? :)
@foxmulder: Surprising I get off the internet occasionally and venture outdoors, and well, you come across stuff. Especially at places like train or bus stations, people put stuff next down next to them and forget it when their bus finally shows up.
Lots of phones.
Stuff like phones & wallets are easy to return. Wait for the call or check for an address. Years ago I found a blokes wallet out the scrub while surveying, miles from nowhere. Maybe a kangaroo pinched it. 4 hours drive to where he lived as well. As it happened I planned to be going past his place; wasn't home so I left it in his mailbox. There's a "WTF" moment for him.
If the wallet has a bank card drop it into a branch, they'll sort it out. Done that a few times (I work for banks, and no, I don't have access to customer data).
Take dead phones to whoever issued the SIM.
For keys put a little note with your number where you found them, you'll get a call a couple of days later.
Returning stuff really doesn't take a lot of effort, but it makes people very happy when they get it back. I've really no use for it anyway.
Stuff like cheap umbrellas I keep, I know I'll only leave it on a bus like I did the other day. It's the umbrella circle of life.
If you don’t want to be an Aussie, then maybe I can ring your home planet, claim that I found you and return you for a finders fee?
That is a good tip about the phone SIM. I found a Samsung Galaxy something once and it was a pain to find the owner. I eventually did, but it was mostly through the luck of someone ringing it.
@D C:
I have often seen packed lunches on the bus stop bench or left on the train. My heart cries every time but I can only leave it there.
he opt for 'first 10 minutes of the creation of the kid' instead
I didn't take it cause it's not my money. I don't have a problem with others accepting money for returning lost wallets etc if it's offered.
The $150 wasn't lost though.
It was a payment and the guy was sitting in a toilet stall waiting for someone to accept the $150 and provide a service.
You screwed (not in the intended way) the whole thing up when you took the money to the receptionist and handed it in.
Haha, nice plot twist
doing something voluntary and have the expectation of getting something in return… I cant stop laughing
Yet you still had the expectation and went to the extend of raising your concern on a public forum.
Give him a break, there's only one way you learn differences in culture and that's experience. He was upset because someone broke expectations of what he would consider ordibarily appropriate. He's literally just learnt that isn't the case here which I'm sure has changed his viewpoint.
Ordibarily I’d agree with you…
Different places, different
habits.morals.
fixed…
Were you being paid by your employer at the time you handed it in? If so, is the reward not rightfully theirs?
Unfortunately some people just have very bad manners. While I wouldn't expect a finders fee, a simple thank you should have been offered.
meh people just don't think, its not bad manners.
I've returned things and they're greatful its returned… and closed the door, other times I've been offered money.
Its not something we think of or experience every day.
We don't have a "law" and process in place.
I felt embarrassed after a situation on holidays where the staff let me back into my hotel room after locking myself out, I didn't realise till later I should have tipped them for the assistance
I've found a wallet, with CC and other cards only, and when I've called the person who lost it, I got abused and accused of having stolen it.
You're not supposed to take the 10% finder fee out before returning it.
I've found $150 on exiting the toilets
Sounds like there is a bit more to this story, was this payment for services?
one wonders where you came from…
Switzerland apparently
yes they kept that Nazi gold too
Yep, no need to dig in the dirt, like in Australia. One has gold, the other coal.
We kept Nazi AND Jews gold. Double dipping, you would call that.
Lol, A1 trolling
He's a camel, from down under.
"in" downunder, not "from". Otherwise I would not ask such questions.
Bactrian or dromedary?
The logic behind paying a finder (in those countries where that is common practice) is not just to share the spoils. It is to compensate for the finder's efforts.
If you find something outdoors, where do you drop it off? Perhaps the nearest police station - that could be a fair detour and take up lots of time. If you don't want to keep the item (immoral and illegal), but also don't want to put in the effort you would be morally justified (as suggested above) to just leave it where you found it. In an outdoors setting that would often lead to the destruction or permanent loss of the item.
Law makers in some countries have realised that issue and stipulated a finders compensation to overcome it. By the way, it specifically applies to animals too, children are not mentioned, to get the fee you have to keep them well fed until the owner is found ;-)
yeah lot of effort for those swiss banks to keep that Nazi loot…. so the logic is the swiss are hypocrites?
Not really. Basically they just had to destroy their side of the documentation. The other documentation went down in either allied bombing, or in the German incinerators.
I recently had to get an Uber driver to return a phone to me (SO's, not mine) and Uber charge a $15 item return fee which goes to the driver to compensate them for having to return the item. I like that system.
Side note: the driver didn't even know that was a thing until I told her to make sure uber gave it to her, so she returned it out of goodwill.
Is this in Australia? Didn't know that Uber has introduced this fee to aussie riders.
It was in the US. I assume that the fee would be everywhere, but I haven't checked.
Those are really good points, I'd never thought about it this way although I still don't think it should be a part of the law. But thanks for sharing :)
The $150 was planted as an employee honesty test.
He failed. Too honest to be in business
From where I come from, if you lose something, and someone else finds it, and returns it, you owe him 10% of the value.
Unfortunately, you are now not where you come from. you are now in Australia.
there is a well known proverb.
"Wherever ground is stood on, the sky is hold high"
Yes, noticed that, just trying to understand the customs over here.
So … an Aussie in Switzerland should behave and have expectations as an Aussie or as a Swiss?
Should expect friendliness and warmth? Or the Swiss way?
Should expect excitement and adventure? Or the Swiss way?
Should expect and open minded, generous, kind society? Or the Swiss way?
Each country has its own "peculiarities" that make them special and unique. For good or for bad. People are unique, that is why they form countries.
About Switzerland (which I have never visited but it is one of the very few countries I DO WANT to visit and to absorb and to feel and to immerse) I recall a (Swiss) actress stating: Switzerland is so perfect, so clean, so precise … but it is so incredibly boring!
So a rigid, monetized, insular society has its benefits. If you are rigid, monetized and insular. It is personal.
Absolutely. Mate, you did your good Samaritan deed for the day. Hopefully one day someone will do the same for you and there's your thanks in return. Pity you weren't thanked in person, but hey that happens.
Well this one surprises me, based on finder having an expectation of a reward, yes it would be nice to have the offer, but an expectation - no way!. Part of being a human should be to engender kindness in society, and returning the money was the ONLY right thing to do!.
I recently found a girls purse with all her CC and cash in a shopping centre trolly, just returned it to the onsite security and went home … that was the right thing to do. As for your co-worker thats another thing!.
Seems like lots of negative responses towards OP for expecting a finders fee, but why bash on a case of cultural differences and expectations?
Out of curiosity I researched Googled for the Swiss civil code and Google translated part of it (Article 722) - "When returned to the owner, the person who found it is entitled to reimbursement of all his expenses and to a fair reward."
A Swiss news article also mentioned this: "In addition, the law obliges owners of lost items to reward those who hand them in. The requirement to give a reward is set out in article 722 the Swiss civil code. It says the finder is entitled to just reward, and reimbursement of related expenses. The code does not specify the amount of the reward, although 10% of the item’s value is often used as a rule of thumb. A generous finder can decline to accept the reward."
But since this is Australia, it's up for OP to do as Australians do and expected to do =)
HUH????????
Quoting sph-
"Switzerland. The law obliges owners of lost items to reward those who hand them in. The requirement to give a reward is set out in article 722 the Swiss civil code"
I'd suggest you look up the definition of precis before making spurious allegations.
It appears to mean a concise summary. Not sure how it is relevant - he/she copy and pasted a paragraph from a news article without putting it in quotation marks, using the quote function, and/or stating a source.
In the original post…"set out in article 722 the Swiss civil code"?
It really is a precis IMHO…missing the "of" after 722 is a bit of a giveaway that it was not a cut and paste…or should be :)
@havebeerbelywillsumo: Try looking at the article Blackfyre has linked. The 'of' is missing in the news article, which is why it is missing in both sph's and Blackfyre's posts.
It is a copy and paste.
Like I said, "…or should be :)", I don't have your energy to search, kudos to you. Still the main point holds, source was acknowledged….OK, original source.
"In the original post…"set out in article 722 the Swiss civil code"?"
@havebeerbelywillsumo: sph didn't copy and paste from the Swiss civil code, he copy and pasted the summary of the code directly from a news article. How is that acknowledging the source in any way?
@havebeerbelywillsumo: Thank you. You may now revoke your spurious allegation that I made a spurious allegation.
yeah lot of effort for those swiss banks to keep that Nazi loot….and since the thefts involved war crimes the swiss code was worth jack shit to the swiss banks who just kept it all.
Clearly not handing in war crime loot was just good business and entirely morally acceptable to the swiss. Why is swiss hypocrisy of interest to anyone anytime after that crap?
negative because its more a case of not finding out what the Australian culture is, but stating they won't do future good deeds because of cultural expectation of their prior home country
Although I know it's illegal and partly immoral, next time I find money in the office, I'm even more tempted to keep
No its 100% immoral
Thank, that summarized the behaviour in Switzerland well. Did not know it was in the Swiss Civil Code.
Take back a wallet, request $250 in fuel/time/effort etc, compensation fee, no reward required
I luv Swiss laws!
i'm curious as to where you come from?
is it the land of entitlement?
you should be happy with yourself that you performed and honest good deed.
say i dropped a $20 on the ground near you if you pick it up and hand it to me does that mean i owe you $2?
so a thank you isn't good enough?
It would seem you are in the land of entitlement - fully expecting your $20 back. ;-)
How far would you go if you find a $1 coin, how much trouble would you go through to identify it's rightful owner?
Just pointing out that nothing is black or white. Different countries have drawn the line in different places.
This thread is an opportunity to broaden your horizon and learn something new, or to sneer at people for asking questions. Your choice. I will make my moral judgement of you based on what choice you make ;-)
if you dropped $20 on the ground infront of me i would give you the $20 back not stand there like an a%%hole and demand $2 for giving it back for you
You are good with red herrings. Of course your example is at the extreme end of the scale.
The situation the OP described is a little less simple already. And there are plenty of other scenarios.
If you judge OP based on him asking a question it reflects a lot more on you than on OP.
@team teri: you seem to lack honesty with your opinion sorry.
please dont respond as i already feel you are just a troll
a response will prove that
This is classic 'what's in it for me' behaviour
yeah very swiss
Quick in judging.
You like your Vegemite, I like Nutella.
Swiss are very honest, and all are fine with leaving 10% to the finder, the system works.
It seems here in Australia things are different.
That's why my post. To find out how things are here.
We're generally honest too, we just don't expect a reward for our honesty.
"Here's your stuff I found."
"Ah geez, thanks mate!"
"No worries."
"Oh here, have a beer!"
"Nah, all good cobber. Thanks anyway, see ya."
You very happy double dipping on war crime gold and then you assert the swiss bankers are honest.
Your swiss through and through - what you do and what you say have nothing in common.
If that was your intent… you've worded it terribly.
No where does it come across as a learning experience.
Your last sentence you know it wrong to keep.
The entire 4 lines you wrote just spits of selfishness.
I found someones phone once and returned it to the local supermarket (I found it in front of it). The guy who lost it asked if I saw a phone and I told him I gave it to that supermarket. He was so happy, he offered me cash and I kindly refused. It just feels good to know that someone was happy by the actions made by me (not very often).
You're a good man!
I've found phones on 3 separate occasions, not kidding. And managed to return all of them back to their owners(well at least that's what I was told). Never even received a thank you from anyone (not even from cops, instead they gave me a look, for increasing their work load) It just felt good to do the right thing.
That might fly in Switzerland, but over here you'll most likely get called an entitled twat for expecting to be rewarded.
your comment needs more upvotes!!!!
Personally I feel a thankyou should be thanks enough in most cases or perhaps a small token gesture of a gift in some cases where the finder has really gone out of their way.
I've found things and gone to reasonable lengths to try to get them back to the owner without any expectation of reward, I've also had people give me a lottery ticket which was nice, but a thankyou would suffice.
I once lost something quite large and reasonably valuable near a boat ramp, I knew exactly where I left it and returned early next morning to find someone had taken it. I thought I'd try my luck to see if the item had been handed in at the local caravan park shop and upon asking the young guy at the desk found that he had no knowledge of it, bummer I thought. Luckily the owner of the shop overheard the conversation and asked me to follow him to a campsite where we found the item. The finder had been kind enough to mention the find to the shop but were not willing to leave them there (the shop owner even made a remark that the item must have been a good one as they hadn't actually handed it in). I thanked the finders but in the back of my mind felt like there was a strong element of luck in me getting the item back and the finders were probably hoping I wouldn't return. I would have been hesitant to give a reward other than a thankyou in this situation.
Another time I left a pair of practically new and fairly expensive sandals at a beach shower and drove off in my car without picking them up. I quickly turned the car around and was back at the shower within 2 minutes and they were gone. "Luckily" someone nearby asked me if I had lost something and then directed me to the back of their car where they had put them. They would have likely seen me leaving in my car as they were at the shower when I left the sandals.
So in some cases I feel a finder can be quite opportunistic and often its just better to leave a found item where it is for a day or two before taking it with you unless you are really going out of your way to find the owner. In the case of items that can be easily damaged by weather or found in a place where thieves operate it might be better to take it with you and try to find the owner.
It would be interesting to know who you work for, as hiring a 12 year old is illegal. Sorry if I'm mistaken, but from your rant and sense of entitlement I just assumed that's your age.
Probably thought the same thing until I read the comment about the civil code in Switzerland. So if someone is unaware of how things work in Australia and this is the first time s/he has come across the situation then I can understand the confusion.
Wouldn't a 12 year old do the opposite based on the "finders keepers, losers weepers" kid's law?
Maybe the guy who lost his $150 fully intended to give whoever found it a "finders fee"…. until he found out who had found the cash.
I don’t understand why everyone is so against the OP - he found cash, turned it in and didn’t get so much as a thank you. The real knob in this story is his colleague that couldn’t even be bothered to say thanks.
The finders fee operates in other parts of the world like Japan too. It’s just a cultural norm he’s pointing out is very different to his experience here.
I can't imagine people would mind too much if he was pointing out a cultural diferrence.
He was actually complaining about it not happening the same as in Switzerland, then on discovery that it's the norm here, said he wouldn't bother helping again if he's not going to get a financial benefit out of it…
Yep enjoy the Karma mate, shame he didn't give you even a thank you though.
I recently found a wallet containing $100, credit cards and worse of all, the dude's internet banking username and password written down on a piece of paper. If that had fallen into the wrong hands he would have been absolutely screwed.
I contacting him on Facebook and he came and picked it up, he was gobsmacked the cash was still in there an duly handed me $50.
Good Karma AND $50, that was a good day.
Now to search OzBargain for something to spend the $50 on ;)