Building a New PC after a Broken Motherboard

LHenSim on 19/06/2017 - 12:03
Last edited 19/06/2017 - 13:08

So my old PC, which was working fantastically for gaming, decided to break down. Turned off while just using Word, and wouldn't turn back on. I initially thought it was the power supply, but after buying a new one and getting the same problem, I think the motherboard is out. Maybe the power supply went, shorting the motherboard?

Either way, I think it's time to properly upgrade. My experience is pretty limited here, so I was hoping for some guidance of what to buy/where from for Sydney. Stuff that I already have:

  • GTX 1060 6GB
  • 550W Power Supply
  • 16GB RAM, not sure of type, and also unsure if it broke at the same time.
  • CD drive, other peripherals are all good.
  • My old version of Windows 10 should work.

Stuff that I want to replace:

  • Case: not too fond of it, and for all I know it's part of the problem.
  • Motherboard: not sure if it's best to go for ATX or mATX, frankly know very little about motherboards.
  • Probably a new processor, I had an older i7 (I believe 2600), but if I'm starting basically from scratch I'm happy to go for a newer one.
  • Probably new solid state/hard drive. I had 256GB and 1TB, but if I'm replacing so much, I understand that new hard drives are good for longevity.
  • Anything else that I'm missing?

Thanks for any help! Long time lurker, first time poster here.

Computing

Comments

  • Axelstrife on 19/06/2017 - 12:12
    +1

    https://www.mwave.com.au/
    http://www.msy.com.au/home.php
    http://www.umart.com.au/newsite/

    These are the biggest and best in sydney, there are others but ive never known them to be cheaper.
    https://staticice.com.au/
    ^ Use this to search for the cheapest parts it tells you what state the store is in.

    Your ram might be the old DDR3 which if you buy a new Intel or AMD Ryzen CPU will use DDR4.

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 12:26

      Thanks! Assignments just finished so I think today will be a fair bit of PC part research. Any particular suggestions/common mistakes to avoid?

  • garetz on 19/06/2017 - 12:27
    +1

    If you do not know how to find faults in a self build, you should take it to a professional to get it checked, it may not be the motherboard, and a simple fix.

    You may pay a premium, but goto a shop that will help you build it for additional cost.

    if you want to make a pc yourself, then https://au.pcpartpicker.com/ is a good resource.

    Just add the parts you want, and the site will tell you if anything is not compatible.

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 12:37

      May attempt this, but I did basically take the PC apart while talking with my more tech-savvy friends. This was my father's old work PC that I took and updated, so I'm honestly a little bit OK with starting from scratch and actually knowing what the parts in my PC are.

      Thanks for reminding me about PCpartpicker though!

      • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 13:47
        +1

        I'd say starting a build on pcpartpicker is a good start. First by entering in the stuff you currently have and want to keep. Then you can experiment with adding new stuff and the compatibility filter will most likely pick up any problems. Having a look at completed builds by other people with the same/similar components is a good thing to do too. You can do this by browsing for individual parts, scrolling down to reviews, and clicking on a reviewers completed build.

        Not sure how tight your budget is, but if you're after an awesome case people rave about these Phantek Cases

        That being said, with budget constraints, money is probably better spent towards performance than looks.

        Your current CPU should be fine for a GTX 1060 (try searching "i7-'insert your model here' 1060 bottleneck") to double check. There's also this 1060/cpu bottleneck chart to refer to, which shows that older i7s should be fine (i7-2600 is fine - potentially a small bottleneck in CPU intensive games). However, in terms of future-proofing, older i7s start to bottleneck GTX 1070s & up (potentially next-gen GPUs too) as seen on this 1070/cpu bottleneck chart.

        Make sure whatever new motherboard you get will fit into whatever case you decide to get (or the old case if you're keeping it), and support whatever CPU you decide to run with. If you upgrade the CPU you will need DDR4 RAM. The rest should all plug in fine and you can then decide what to upgrade/what to keep. Also you could consider getting a motherboard & CPU that will support overclocking, so that in a couple years when the 1060 starts to struggle you can perhaps upgrade the cooling solutions and overclock :)

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 14:55

          Thank you!

          Budget is not necessarily set, and it depends on what I'm aiming for (more of the same vs. actual upgrade) but I'd be disappointed if I can't keep it under $1000 either way. I'm likely to go more for practicality than looks for a case, but I'm still tossing up between ATX and mATX.

          One annoying thing is that I'm not certain about the exact specifications of all of the parts, but I'll have my best shot with pcpartpicker.

        • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 16:44
          +1

          @HenSim: No worries! :)

          Actually, scratch everything I said. I got bored and made a build for you - https://au.pcpartpicker.com/list/FhNmZ8

          ~$762 with these sort of parts is what you'd be looking at for a future proof upgrade. It's basically from scratch - upgrading the motherboard, cpu, ram, and case. Keeping your 1060 GPU of course. Also, keeping your existing SSD & HDD should be fine with a reformat and clean install of windows 10 on the SSD. In the future you would upgrade to a 500GB+ NVMe m.2 SSD in the available slot on the motherboard. In a nutshell, it's all feature packed and new, over-clockable, with balanced price vs quality vs performance, and should only need to upgrade the GPU in a few years time to keep up with AAA games - the rest should be fine for many years.

          It lacks WiFi/Bluetooth - but you can easily add a WiFi card if you need. Also no Thunderbolt 3, not super important for a desktop PC but if you wanted this IMO you'd be better off upgrading to a motherboard that supports it as opposed to an add-in Thunderbolt 3 card. But it has all the other goodies :D

          Disclaimer: triple-check that everything will 100% fit (check dimensions/reviews/etc.). Postage costs not included.

          Option 2 - double check motherboard is the problem, replace the motherboard and only the motherboard (given everything else is still fine), can't really "upgrade" the motherboard without upgrading other components too, and with their upgrades will require corresponding upgrades (e.g. CPU upgrade will require RAM upgrade, etc. - may as well just go a little further and upgrade a couple other things). Can also change the case along with the motherboard if you so desire!

          This motherboard is the only one I could find from a quick search that would support your current CPU ~$159 (will need to have look around, even on gumtree/eBay, for a cheaper option - and check their CPU support list like this)

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 17:03

          Thank you very much! I will likely go for something very similar to this. Only thing is that I might go a bit up on the CPU, to possibly a 7700 I was tempted to go for just the motherboard, but the limited options available that were compatible made that less appealing.

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 17:13

          Oh, also, is there an ATX version of that motherboard, or is it just better to go for the mATX? Reviewing a few different options there.

        • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 17:26
          +1

          @HenSim:

          For gaming, I'd say the i7-7700k is probably a tad overkill. But if you need/want the extra CPU power go for it! That eBay deal for $397 atm is pretty decent :) IMO I feel the i5-7600k does present better value though - and more than enough for gaming.

          And if you're referring to this ASRock Z270M - then yep there is an ATX version of it :)

          Difference being just size, meaning you lose a couple slots, etc. All the same features. You probably don't/won't need those extra slots anyway :P

          As for the one for your old CPU - no idea. This particular one was the only one I could find xD

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 17:48
          +1

          Cool. I'm probably going to go for something the same, or very similar to what you've suggested.

  • RiseAndRuin on 19/06/2017 - 13:13
    +2

    as a true ozbargainer, if you were happy with the the performance why not just replace the motherboard? you can get a used or possibly even a new one for a few $$

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 13:35

      Haha, maybe I should get my membership revoked?

      I guess if I'm going to go to that effort, I think that I should try to future-proof it. Replacing a motherboard is pretty close to doing a fresh install of a PC isn't it? Either way, I'm pretty happy about the idea of building a PC, never had the proper opportunity, and this is well-timed with the end of prac/semester.

      It is tempting though. If I just bought a new motherboard and case, should everything else just work? The DDR3 RAM, and i7-2600 with a stock cooler will just plug in and work? Probably more importantly, I should be able to easily replace them with no issue?

      Technology has a habit of having weird issues for me, so I'm a bit worried about the possibility of old parts carrying problems over meaning I have to do the whole process again.

  • Davo1111 on 19/06/2017 - 14:37
    +1

    How do you know the MB is broken?

    If it were me, i'd just replace the MB… maybe the CPU and leave it at that.

    Make sure it all fits within the power specs.

    Also, PSU is that a branded one?

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 15:11

      Best guess, with help from friends who know more than me. PC wouldn't turn on, although the ethernet light was on. People suggested that it was likely the power supply, and I bought a Corsair one (not listening to their advice to get a multimeter and check first), and the same problem occurred.

      I can't imagine what else it would be, that would both cause it to turn off randomly, and prevent it from turning on again. Maybe an issue with the case?

      I am looking at the minimum I can replace, but if I change the motherboard and CPU, that means I'll change the RAM as well.

    • Kangal on 19/06/2017 - 15:45
      +1

      Yeah, Sandy Bridge CPU's were/are great.
      Basically the 2500k and 2600k still perform great today if you OC to 4.5GHz.

      If you want to upgrade on the cheap:
      - Dust it out, and get decent fans/cooling
      - Clean install Windows 10 Pro
      - Get a decent 1TB SSD, the Samsung EVO 850 or Crucial MX300 (keep 4TB HDD for large media storage)
      - 16GB of DDR3-1600 is good, you can OC to 2133MHz and upsize to 32GB
      - Upgrade CPU to the 3770k (+5% performance increase)

      The only thing you have to keep in mind is that this is still the old platform.
      So you're missing out on some new features like:
      M.2 SSD's, DDR4 fast ram, Wifi ac, BT 5.0, USB 3.1, USB-C, ThunderBolt 3, UEFI updates, RGB Lighting etc etc

      It might be time to consider a fresh new build.
      Maybe you can grab a cheap mobo, and a cheap GPU (eg $100 GTX 960) and sell your old system as a "Gaming PC" for $700. And use that $700 cash, add a couple more hundred dollars, and build anew.
      In particularly Ryzen, the R5 1500X will be equivalent to your old 2600k, a R5 1600 will give you a nice boost, and the R7 1700 is pretty much the cheap high-end now (vs i7-7700k).
      The AM4 mobo standard is here to stay for a long time.
      And your GTX 1060 (6GB) is already pretty great.
      Just grab a fresh SSD and HDD, and a nice case for yourself.

      • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 15:54

        On that first build, what motherboard are you recommending? I'm a touch confused there. I follow PC specs stuff, until suddenly I don't. Knowing which motherboard to go for is probably one of the things that's giving me a harder time at the moment.

        I'm more inclined to go for the new build, although I'm more likely to just sell off individual parts than I am to build a separate PC for selling.

        • Kangal on 19/06/2017 - 16:07
          +1

          The first build is your current build… just need a few TLC.
          I think you'll be fine with most Z77 motherboards.
          As per what brands, go with Asus/ASRock or the Gigabyte brands… they're bulletproof and well supported with BIOS/UEFI updates.

          So there's the Asrock Z77 Extreme6, or the Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H-WB.

          The 3770k like I said is a nice 5% performance boost if you need it, but you should be concerned about the Dust, Heat, and Clean Windows installation first. After that make the leap to an SSD, in particular, the models I listed.

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 16:24

          I'll look into those. I know nothing about the classifications of motherboards (what the letters/numbers mean), so I'll be sure to use pcpartpicker etc. to check compatibility. I see myself either just replacing the motherboard and case, or doing the full thing.

          Got to also decide between ATX and mATX.

        • RiseAndRuin on 23/06/2017 - 22:00

          @HenSim: manufacturers websites usually allow you to search mobos compatible with your cpu/socket. just go find one that meets your needs and is expandable enough, or google the reviews before you buy.

          personally I'd buy a new one when you actually need it, e.g. when the new one is noticeable faster than the old one, I'd say twice as fast as a rule of thumb.

          also an SSD for the OS and programs would be the best upgrade if you don't have one yet, as old HDs would be a bottleneck for any modern system.

          edit: should have read the rest of the thread first :D

  • supnigs super skids on 19/06/2017 - 15:55
    +1

    keep what you have and buy a new mumboard

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 15:59

      Any suggestions for which one? It would have to be an older model for compatibility, I believe?

      • supnigs super skids on 19/06/2017 - 16:05
        +1

        I'm not sure but that's what I would do. even buy second hand. don't know much about computer models but Google would help

  • Axelstrife on 19/06/2017 - 16:09
    +1

    https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/313803

    Mate time to buy your CPU.

    • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 16:25

      This may speed up decision making.

      • Axelstrife on 19/06/2017 - 16:27

        think fast as most stores have raised prices this store hasn't and these prices are the same as every other computer store.
        with 20% it's a bargain i suspect they could raise price aswell.

      • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 17:09

        Great price for that i5-7600k ;) same one i recommended earlier

        But yeah, keep in mind that all these would require upgrade to a newer motherboard and ram :)

        If you're not interested in over-clocking or future-proofing - the cheaper i5-7400 would be fine for your 1060.
        IMO it's worth the extra $56 for an over-clockable CPU that's more future proof. But a motherboard that supports over-clocking will also cost a bit extra.

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 17:21

          I'm pretty unfamiliar with overclocking. I'm somewhat considering going for i7-7700 and not bothering for a motherboard that can overclock. But I'm still undecided. If I end up missing out on this deal to spend some more thinking time, I'll live. May also just pick everything up in person from MSY, to cut down on shipping worries.

        • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 17:52
          +1

          @HenSim: That's like buying a shiny new top-end car with wooden wheels xD

        • HenSim on 19/06/2017 - 17:54

          Haha, point taken. I think that I'll end up doing the i5. Everything coming to $861 (including some slight changes, eg. going for the Corsair 200r as I quite like the look of it) if I go for the easy-option of buying from MSY and not dealing with postage.

        • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 18:13

          @HenSim: Sounds pretty good :) Ah yes that case seems decent. I'd probably prefer the Cosair case too, I picked the other in the build coz I thought you'd like something with flashy lights & windows or something xD …not a fan personally.

          You could always try this to boost performance ahaha

        • JimmyLmao on 19/06/2017 - 21:02

          @HenSim: Also, just an after thought I had. If getting it all through the one vendor, maybe you could ask for a bundle discount of some sort, even 5% would be good :D Could always persuade them by telling about how particular things are cheaper elsewhere and you just want to price match and give them your business ;)

          Also definitely do some more research before pulling the trigger!

          If your ultimate goal is to just get the PC up and running again, I'd probably go with just the motherboard replacement. It'd be much cheaper overall and there probably isn't much of a bottleneck in the current set up - so all good. But it does sound like you're keen for a bit of an upgrade xD

  • alvian on 20/06/2017 - 03:38
    +1

    Kind of a stupid question but did you test the power button on the case and did you try shorting the power switch pins on the MB?

    • HenSim on 20/06/2017 - 18:03

      Not entirely stupid, since I did not. I really don't know how to test individual parts. Since the setup doesn't work, maybe I should try just putting the old one into the new case!

  • Stevek1960 on 20/06/2017 - 09:58

    I find that Umart - http://www.umart.com.au/newsite/ is best for components

  • theweza on 20/06/2017 - 10:27

    @alvian - good question re- power button, but shorting the power switch pins on the MB, that doesn't sound like a good ideal?

    • alvian on 20/06/2017 - 20:25

      No, that is exactly what the power switch is doing every time you switch on a computer.

      Find the front header block on the MB and look for the 2 pins that is connected to the Power Switch plastic header. When you press the power switch on the front panel, these are the 2 pins that are "shorted", i.e. electrically connected.

      To test a power switch, remove the header and connect it to a multimeter on continuity check. Press the switch and check for continuity. If there isn't electrical continuity then the switch is dead and it becomes a problem of finding a compatible replacement switch.

      To test a MB, remove every accessories including video cards, HDDs, FDDs, CD/DVDs, keyboard, mouse, network cable and all expansion cards. Only connect 1 good RAM module, the speaker, the CPU (and chipset) fan(s), and power cables (20/24 pins & CPU auxiliary) from a good power supply. Now use a flat screwdriver (or a plastic jumper block) and momentarily connect the 2 power pins on the header block (i.e. "shorting" it). If the MB won't turn on (as indicated by a spinning CPU fan), try the RAM module in another slot. If it still won't turn on any RAM slot then remove the RAM and the speaker entirely and test for the last time. If that doen't work then the MB is quite dead and any further repair will most likely require a microscope and soldering.

      If the MB turns on minus all the accessories, then that is usually an indication that one of the other components is at fault.

      • theweza on 22/06/2017 - 11:29

        Its just a process of deduction.
        Well explained, thanks for sharing alvian :)

        • alvian on 22/06/2017 - 12:47

          Deductive reasoning what every competent repairman, technician, doctor, detective, scientist, plumber, electrician, etc, use in their work everyday. Only the knowledgebase differ between the professions. The process is nothing magical but it can be overwhelming to a novice. Futurists are predicting AI systems will perform better diagnoses than human because nothing will be missed during the deductive process, at least theoretically.

  • HenSim on 20/06/2017 - 17:56

    Aaaaaand after spending all day building the new PC…. It does not work. Will turn on, but won't doesn't beep like it's supposed to, and no video signal goes through.

    I have tried many troubleshoot things. Pretty bummed out.

    • alvian on 20/06/2017 - 20:22
      +1

      Which parts in the "new PC" is new and which ones you used from the "dead PC"? Also don't "build" a PC to test it. Take the PSU and MB out of the case and test them on a table/workbench, making sure that is at least a piece of cardboard underneath the MB to insulate the circuit.

      I have, long ago, encountered a MB that turned on, but wouldn't beep and gave no video signal. Believe it or not it turned out to be a bad RAM module. Of course I cannot guarantee this is your problem, but maybe try your luck with a tested and known to be good RAM module?

      • HenSim on 20/06/2017 - 21:36

        Yeah, I probably should have started with testing outside the board. The only old parts are the DVD drive, two hard drives, and the graphics card.

        Unfortunately, I don't have any compatible parts that I know work, instead, I think I'm going to go first thing tomorrow to a repair place, my self-efficacy of being able to do stuff with computers be damned. Hope it is the RAM, because that's easy to replace, easy to get a refund on, and also not my fault, which will make me feel better.

        • alvian on 20/06/2017 - 22:12
          +1

          You mentioned no video output, so a faulty video card is also possible.

          You want to remove all unnecessary components from the MB during testing. See my comment above for suggestion.

        • HenSim on 20/06/2017 - 22:24

          I confirmed it wasn't the video card with troubleshooting (it was also working fantastically before the old PC went out). If the repair place isn't convenient/is too expensive, I'll try removing everything. I'll definitely do that from the start the next time I try something like this.

        • alvian on 21/06/2017 - 02:55

          @HenSim: Wait a minute. Your "new PC" contains a new MB, and the new MB wouldn't beep and gave no video output when you power it up?

          Are you saying both your dead MB and your new MB have the same problem? If that is so then the fault is in one of the removable components. You need to find out which one is faulty by removing all of them and test them one at a time.

        • HenSim on 21/06/2017 - 18:36

          They were slightly different issues, one wouldn't turn on at all, one would turn on but not go to POST. But all fixed now! I may end up testing the old motherboard if another case comes along, just to see if I can salvage something out of it; maybe make something for my little brother.

  • HenSim on 21/06/2017 - 18:35

    And I have a working computer! The motherboard was weird with how the ram was inserted… and that was literally it.

    Thank you everyone for helping me out with this, I am happy with my new machine.

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