SONY PSN (Refunds/Banned Account) and Damn KIDS! RANT.

Storm on 06/06/2017 - 14:26

So, my 9 year old boy was playing the free game 'Drawn to Death' (which he shouldn't have as it has swearing in it, but anyhoo) on the PS4. I was elsewhere around the house.

I get an email from PayPal saying $70 was just spent on some in-game content from Sony. WTF?!

Kid busted. Swears he was just looking and didn't actually buy anything (a 10-pack of cases for skins, weapons or whatever). Kid banned off PS4 FOREVER. He didn't use the cases (in-game content purchase).

Contacted PayPal, stating he'd done this really bad thing and it wasn't authorised.

Paypal refunded/reversed the charge.

A week later, Sony ban my account.

I talk to them. Absolutely nothing I can do except buy some PSN wallet cards from JB-HiFi or wherever, and email pics of them to Sony, to pay for the $70 in-game purchase.

"It's a Sony Interactive game… the in-game gear hasn't been used. Can't you just remove that content from my game/account on your servers"? NOPE.

"Can't you just remove the game entirely from my account"? NOPE. You could re-download it and the extra content would still be available.

So basically, because my boy stuffed up somehow (his first ever time of buying something online, accidentally or not), Sony are holding my account to ransom, and refuse to do anything about it until we pay up for content I didn't authorise and got in contact with PayPal about within minutes.

Before the haters start hating:

  • Yes, I know my boy was an idiot, and is probably lying about not buying the content (surely you'd have to see a confirmation button or two to buy stuff for that game)
  • Yes, I know Sony have a get-out clause in their terms/conditions, basically saying 'Too Bad!' for any chance of refunds on in-game content purchased, even if it's due to some hacked accounts. They have some policies for games purchased (14 days limit as long as you don't play it).

My point is that surely this happens sometimes, and that Sony could be much friendlier to their customers. The add-on wasn't used. It is a Sony produced game (so they could remove the add-on from my account if they really wanted to). If it had been a refund to the PSN wallet then fine… I've spent hundreds on PSN.

But no. They are not reasonable at all, and have a 'Stuff you' attitude.

Poll Options

  • 272
    Too bad! So sad! Pay up!
  • 102
    Sony are money-hungry bastards!
  • 13
    I really don't care, I always buy pre-paid wallet cards for PSN to avoid this issue, fool.
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Comments

    • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 14:56
      +14

      I'm not so sure there is a specific clause in consumer rights about this, he purchased something and he's changed his mind. His son basically had full authorisation unless he wants to say his PS4/Card was stolen.

      • tomsco on 06/06/2017 - 14:58
        +16

        Agreed. Apart from your comment below, there's also the point that if you're gonna let your kids play on something like this, don't let it store your payment details.

        • Storm on 06/06/2017 - 16:49
          +6

          Exactly. Lesson learned.

        • Scrooge McDuck on 07/06/2017 - 15:09
          +9

          @Storm:

          Did you think of contacting Sony about the unauthorised transaction before PayPal?

      • muzzakus on 06/06/2017 - 15:02
        +1

        Perhaps, but giving it a try is worth while, especially to draw attention to the fact that they haven't simply blocked the payed for content, but the entire account which can potentially have exponentially more purchases than this particular incident.

        Sort of like the milk man taking position of your house because you didn't leave out the empty milk bottles at your doorstep one time. I'm sure there are better analogies.

        • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 15:05

          I get your point and I agree with you but Sony, Steam and other digital stores work differently.

          When you buy a game you are buying a license that they can revoke at any time.

          I don't believe that is against consumer law, I don't believe anyone has taken them to court over it either.

  • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 14:55
    -8

    This is why you avoid Sony and their digital purchases.

    • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 16:15
      +7

      Sony did nothing wrong in this case, OP was at fault here.

      • Storm on 06/06/2017 - 16:52
        +2

        Yes, but samfisher has a point.

        When Sony ban your account (for whatever reason, it could be someone bought stuff after hacking your Sony or Gmail account, which I have heard happens often), you also lose ALL the online access for games purchased on the PSN Store, Netflix, YouTube etc. So buying discs instead on online content is obviously much safer.

        • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 17:48
          +11

          If you can prove it is hacking Sony would have restored everything back in place. My PSN was hacked before and purchases were made, but I was made whole after a couple days of discussion. But unfortunately you have admitted that this is bought by your son and you have not placed security measures to protect purchases. This is the first mistake. Second mistake is to do a reverse charge back instead of discussion with Sony first.

          If you think buying physical just for the sake of preventing loss of content due to banning of accounts, I think you are approaching this whole issue with the wrong mentality. It is not Sony's fault here. Eventually all games will go digital like what Steam is doing, it is only a matter of time.

        • no not me on 07/06/2017 - 16:20
          +1

          Yeah, and Sony are generally scummy – they will try to push as much proprietary nonsense as Apple (albeit, not as successfully). They seem to only really budget for securing their hardware, and couldn't give a damn about people's privacy, personal information, etc., after that huge data breach.

        • lgacb08 on 07/06/2017 - 16:41
          +1

          @no not me: Sony used to be nowadays Apple in the industry but Apple has outsmarted them.

      • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 17:44
        +15

        Are you serious?

        So if you spend $5000 at Sony's store, you think you should lose $5000 with of games/movies/tv shows because you refunded $2?

        You are why consumers have no rights because you think things like this are the right thing to do.

        • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 17:50
          +19

          OP could have refunded through Sony but he chose to do a charge back instead which in this case was deemed as stealing digital content. Once the software is downloaded on the HDD, there is no way Sony can retrieve it back.

        • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 18:30

          @KaTst3R:

          "If you change your mind about a purchase made from the PlayStation®Store, you can request a refund to your PSN wallet within 14 days from the date of transaction, provided that you have not started downloading or streaming your purchase."

          So no.. OP couldn't have.

        • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 20:04
          +16

          @samfisher5986:

          And you think doing a charge back is the right way?

          Do you expect to go into JB Hifi, make a purchase for a PS4 disc, initiate a charge back and things are all good? It is stealing. If you want to refund, always go through the proper channel. If OP makes his case to Sony and they are unwilling to budge then too bad, take it as a loss. Right now, a mistake is made by the customer and Sony is under no obligation to make whole of the situation. If they do, it is good will on their part.

        • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 21:38
          -5

          @KaTst3R:

          There's nothing wrong with a charge back.

          A real digital library system will only remove the item in question, not thousands of dollars worth of content that has nothing to do with the transaction.

          Just because a transaction is reversed it doesn't mean its stealing, in fact because its a digital item you can just remove it without any disadvantage.

        • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 23:34
          +11

          @samfisher5986:

          There is everything wrong with a charge back. The customer cannot make a transaction, receive a good and then reverse it unless fraud is involved (which there isnt in this case).

          Sony's current refund policy will remove your permission to download a product but there is no control once the application is already in your hard drive or else Sony would already have disabled the millions of PT game that is already in the hard drives of the OG PS4. This will be the case until Sony decides to implement a Denuvo like DRM which constantly checks your permission thousands of times per minute which has shown to be more disadvantageous than a benefit.

          Sony is probably one of the strictest one when it comes to implementing its policies but it is the consumer who agreed to the EULA when you first sign up for the service, unless of course you didnt read. Who does.

        • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 23:42
          -4

          @KaTst3R:

          What on earth are you talking about?

          Sony can and does revoke games or content.

          PT was removed, not revoked.

          I can't believe you are happy being able to easily lose $5000 of content.

        • KaTst3R on 07/06/2017 - 00:00
          +5

          @samfisher5986:

          PT was removed from the store but you can still run it on people's hard disk till this date. Sony cant force a remote delete or take away your ability to use a software once it is in your hard disk. That is the point im making.

          If you have an account that is $5000 in value, a normal person will go through the proper refund process and do it the right way. If im OP, $70 vs $5000, it is a no brainer which you value more.

        • samfisher5986 on 07/06/2017 - 13:21
          -1

          @KaTst3R:

          They can stop you from playing things, especially ingame content.

          Also there are plenty of other situations where your $5000 account becomes an issue and you can lose it, just google it.

        • no not me on 07/06/2017 - 16:23

          @KaTst3R: Yeah, except, if a merchant supports PayPal, they should at least do what they're supposed to and partake in mediation. A lot of companies use PayPal, allow automatic chargebacks, ban the user then revoke the digital content. It's just really slack.

        • MrFunSocks on 07/06/2017 - 18:58
          +2

          @KaTst3R: MS are stricter than Sony since Sony at least let you pay back the charge back amount to regain your account. With MS if you do a charge back they nuke your account permanently and there is literally nothing you can do to get it back.

        • noshopping on 08/06/2017 - 13:14
          +4

          @samfisher5986: "There's nothing wrong with a charge back." I had to laugh real hard at that. Do you know why businesses HATE chargebacks? Because it doesn't matter if you are a tiny small fry or a huge company processing billions of dollars per year, if your merchant account has a 1%+ greater chargeback theshold, the bank CLOSES it, e.g. NO MORE merchant processor. Therefore, when you proceed todo chargebacks, most businesses treat it very seriously because it hurts their banking relationship, plus in most instances it cost them $20-$50 in chargeback fees.

        • MrTweek on 08/06/2017 - 14:09

          @KaTst3R:
          JB-Hifi might demand the item back (which Sony can probably do in this case with a mouse click).
          JB-Hifi will not demand you to return every single item you ever bought from them without compensation.

        • KaTst3R on 08/06/2017 - 14:30

          @MrTweek:

          I dont think JB is gonna storm into your home with the SWAT team just to retrieve a game disc which you decided to charge back.

        • MrTweek on 08/06/2017 - 14:49

          @KaTst3R:

          Until PSN decides to implement a structure similar to Steam, there is no way Sony can retrieve the downloaded software.

          I'd say, until they implemented this, they should take the risk instead of pissing off long term customers over rather small disputes.

          It's very clear that they are punishing him for the mistakes of his son and don't care about losing a happy customer that would most likely spend more than $70 in the future, if they were nice to him.

          Sony would not lose anything in giving him his account back.
          They are literally trying to sell off a happy long term customer for $70.
          Text book example of corporate greed.

          They may or may not be right from a legal point of view, but in any case, this behaviour makes me never want to become a Sony customer.

          Some companies grow big by being so nice to customers that they love to come back.
          Some companies grow big by trying to squeeze every single cent they can out of their customers, no matter what.

        • KaTst3R on 08/06/2017 - 14:54
          +1

          @MrTweek:

          Just for clarity, I just edited my comment because codeman (below) reminded me of occasional licence checks which does happen.

          I dont agree with Sony's way of doing things (and also alot of the big companies). They need to change to treat customers better. Steam is one that gets the thumbs up. After years of poking people in the arse, they finally come up with a solution (albeit it gave them much more headaches) that benefits the consumer.

    • [Deactivated] on 08/06/2017 - 12:50
      +2

      For the record, I avoid all console manufacturers with digital purchases: as someone who has lived in four countries, the fact that they don't permit region changes annoys me. Steam and Battle.net however: no problems, those accounts travelled the globe with me.

      However in this case, despite my bias against digital purchases on consoles, I say Sony is not in the wrong.

      OP, Keep your eye on your kids.

      • KaTst3R on 08/06/2017 - 14:31

        Xbox allows region change. I think it is like once every 6 months and you will lose all digital currency left in the account.

        • [Deactivated] on 08/06/2017 - 17:58

          Really? Well that's good to know, will take that into consideration next time I buy a console Shakes fist at Sony

  • tomsco on 06/06/2017 - 14:56
    +7

    Look, not justifying - I think that is very poor customer service, and as you said, it's easy for them to reverse, but is there a chance they were a bit annoyed about the Paypal chargeback?

    This is where if companies want digital stores to succeed (and to be honest, I doubt Sony have a concern about the success), they need to improve on their refund policies - I think Steam is one that has a great policy.

    • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 14:57
      +2

      Steam has had many bad policies in the past, the difference is they listen to customers.

      Yes if you reverse a credit card transaction you will only lose the game you purchased, but you could get your whole account locked for this in the past just like Sony.

      • [Deactivated] on 06/06/2017 - 20:22
        +2

        I bought Orange Box HL2 physical. Opened genuine Y-fold cellophane and steam said already registered. Steam helpdesk treated me like a criminal. Pretty stupid as their code system must have been hacked/guessed as the box was genuinely sealed.

        • samfisher5986 on 06/06/2017 - 21:37

          Their support has changed since then though.

    • jm2014 on 06/06/2017 - 15:29
      +13

      Yes:

      "Chargebacks
      If a top up to your wallet is reversed by your payment service provider (e.g. your bank, credit card provider or PayPal), known as a "chargeback", and there are insufficient funds in your wallet such that your balance is negative after the reversal, you will owe us a debt of the balance. We will suspend access to the PSN by your Account or console until that debt is repaid."

      http://legaldoc.dl.playstation.net/ps3-eula/psn/e/aunz_tosua…

  • Team Ziggy on 06/06/2017 - 15:06
    +7

    I'd try to start the conversation via social media to reason with Sony.. you may have the upper hand that way.

  • try2bhelpful on 06/06/2017 - 15:13

    Yeah, it is very annoying with those sort of things. At least it wasn't worse than the $70. I have the app purchases turned off in my iPad to avoid me accidently purchasing something. If I want it, I then have to turn it back on again. Sounds like you will just have to cough up the dough and make the kid work it off in chores around the house. You need to change the password on your account. Cut the kid a little slack, these damn games are designed to make it easy to purchase stuff which is why I hate in-app purchases. Let me buy the damned thing up front and leave it at that.

    BTW - I agree with your view. Sony are just being dicks. They could easily put in something that allows the back out of these things, and the disabling of the associated game, but then their profits will go down.

    • Storm on 06/06/2017 - 16:56
      +4

      he had his birthday recently. He is paying the $70 out of money he got for his birthday. Plus being banned for the foreseeable future from the PS4. Plus doing a lot more crappy jobs for me. Plus chopping his fingers off.

      • Scrooge McDuck on 07/06/2017 - 15:08
        +14

        Luxury. We used to have to get out of the lake at three o'clock in the morning, clean the lake, eat a handful of hot gravel, go to work at the mill every day for tuppence a month, come home, and Dad would beat us around the head and neck with a broken bottle, if we were LUCKY!

        • johnno07 on 08/06/2017 - 07:43
          +5

          Well we had it tough. We used to have to get up out of the shoebox at twelve o'clock at night, and LICK the road clean with our tongues. We had half a handful of freezing cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at the mill for fourpence every six years, and when we got home, our Dad would slice us in two with a bread knife.

        • abb on 08/06/2017 - 08:38
          +4

          Right. I had to get up in the morning at ten o'clock at night, half an hour before I went to bed, drink a cup of sulphuric acid, work twenty-nine hours a day down mill, and pay mill owner for permission to come to work, and when we got home, our Dad and our mother would kill us, and dance about on our graves singing 'Hallelujah.'

        • Franc-T on 08/06/2017 - 09:49
          +3

          You had hot gravel? Soft! We had cold rocks we had to chew to make our own gravel.

        • Scrooge McDuck on 08/06/2017 - 10:25
          +3

          @abb:

          But you try and tell the young people of today that… and they won't believe ya'.

      • no not me on 07/06/2017 - 16:24
        +4

        Why don't you just setup the parental controls? Then you can avoid this ever happening and also avoid buying prepaid cards.

  • Marrk on 06/06/2017 - 15:14
    +11

    Shitty situation, though can understand Sony banning your account over a chargeback for a 'product' provided. Would treat it as a learning experience.

  • [Deactivated] on 06/06/2017 - 16:00
    +1

    Does your son have your Payal password? If so, it's an authorised purchase by you, IMHO.

    • Storm on 06/06/2017 - 16:54
      -1

      No. Paypal is automatically logged in via PS4. I'm not sure if there is a setting to enter a password or not. Will check when my account is back.

      • [Deactivated] on 06/06/2017 - 17:49
        -3

        When ever I buy something on psn (PayPal) linked. It asks for my psn password. There is no option for automatic. You have always had to enter your psn password when purchasing something. Ever since they where hacked years ago. Your son knows your psn password

        • PVA on 06/06/2017 - 19:20
          +1

          No, not true. I don't have to enter my password.
          There maybe a tick box or similar saying Rember password … maybe

    • jno on 08/06/2017 - 11:47
      +1

      There is an option for every purchase to require your psn password, not sure if its defaulted on or not but its there on mine and always always have a guest account for other users besides you

  • Mac40 on 06/06/2017 - 16:02
    +3

    Sorry you are having to deal with this Storm. Sony are not good in these situations - they auto ban accounts that retract payments from Paypal or credit cards, and I think that is evil. Some of us have spent thousands of dollars with them but they won't budge over even a dollar of DLC without several phone calls - speaking to managers and even then it needs to have been their fault somehow. It took them over a month, after about 4 phone calls and few emails to eventually refund for a product that would not allow me to download it even though I purchased it - I could go on and on explaining this and other issues but it just comes down to them not being 'good' in these situations. If I were you, I'd pay the amount straight away so that you can free your mind of this stress - it goes knowhere and probably isn't worth your time fighting.

    If you can, try not to let their attitude about this soil your opinion of the company as a whole. I know it's hard but there are good people working there who are trying to bring the whole company more in line with Australian Laws and customer expectations. I feel your pain, but just pay it so you can get back enjoying a game of Rocket League with your kids.

  • KaTst3R on 06/06/2017 - 16:15
    +8

    Never ever reverse charge on PSN or Steam because they take it like you are stealing from them. Once you have downloaded the content in your hard drive, Sony has no control over it and cant do a remote delete. So that is why they ban the account. It is also rare that Sony will reverse the ban. Your only choice is to pay up and take it as a lesson learnt.

    And also set up a pin requirement when purchases are required to avoid a similar situation.

  • Baebs on 06/06/2017 - 16:30
    +7

    Same thing happened with a Dad on Overwatch, except his degenerate Hanzo-maining 12 y/o son spent $8000. Reversing a payment always leads to an account ban so only option is to explain the situation.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/660ub3/ive_got_a…

    Luckily Blizzard unlike Sony sides with the consumer.

    • Storm on 06/06/2017 - 16:49

      Yikes! My issue is nothing compared to this guys.

      Hey Guys, My name is Allan or Kadbury.
      I said my son could play Overwatch while I was out at work for the regular 9-5 day. I left him by himself and I came back home to relax & get dinner underway. After I had finished dinner and done everything I needed too I then decided to get on Overwatch and perhaps play some competitive.
      I had 5304 Loot Boxes I call my son down to explain this and he had said that he had bought around 10,000 Loot Boxes and couldn't even finish them all by the time I had got home (He started buying at about 10:00).
      I do not want to chargeback because I know if I do I will be loosing my skins & credits which I am pretty sure Blizzard wouldn't like.
      What should I do
      Update 1: I am currently talking to Blizzard about this but it isn't looking too good. I have not received any money back as of yet but the Loot Boxes have been removed.
      Update 2: I checked my SPAM Emails to find one from Visa saying that a lot of money was being spent. However since I had bought about 600 Loot Boxes over the last 10 months then they thought that it was normal.
      Update 3: Blizzard has refunded the Loot Boxes that where not opened. Nothing has happened about the 4696 Loot Boxes that where opened as of yet. I do not want to go to the length of getting my Bank to chargeback. Stay Tuned
      Update 4: Blizzard isn't going to refund the other 5000 or so Loot Boxes. I am extremely confused and I am honestly slightly scared to go to my bank about this. Reddit what should I do here.

      • robbo600 on 08/06/2017 - 13:02
        +1

        Did he spend almost $12,000 on loot boxes?!

      • FW190 on 09/06/2017 - 03:23
        +2

        holy crap!

        I am glad that I never:

        1 - store any payment details on my console/PC/phone
        2 - do in-game micro-transaction
        3 - have kids :)

  • tassieeagle on 06/06/2017 - 17:05
    +1

    I think it was mentioned before but I would make sure you no longer have PayPal or any credit cards linked to psn. I'd take it a step further and do it for everything your kids might touch like Google play or Apple store.

    Prepaid credit is the way to go, kids or not.

    • merill on 07/06/2017 - 22:11
      +2

      I have had this happen to me. I now only use Pre purchased gift cards on Apple, Xbox and play store. Plus you can buy and stock these cards when they are on discount. Never pay full price.

    • Dpkmax on 07/06/2017 - 23:04

      @tassieagle , so true "Prepaid credit is the way to go, kids or not"

  • pikapika on 06/06/2017 - 18:55

    Not good…But if you've got children playing on your PS4 then they should have their own account and make it so your account is password protected. This way he can have an account but he won't have any options to 'accidentally' buy anything.

    OR

    If you still want him using your account (say if you get it unbanned) then make sure EVERY purchase you need to put a password in..Then if he has no clue of the password all his purchases would fail.

    I have the 2nd option on my account and it works perfectly..Annoying that you have to enter your password in every time but it stops accidental purchases.

  • trustnoone on 06/06/2017 - 18:59
    +2

    You are definitely not getting that money in my opinion, I've seen stories of people who legitimately have accounts legit stolen and claimed money back from paypal and Sony will tell them tough luck, either buy some cards to give the money back or enjoy your ban.
    As far as I know, any charge back is an instant ban by Sony, I think technically you're supposed to contact Sony first, not charge back first although if I thought someone knew my Paypal or credit card number I know what I'd do.
    Don't get me wrong, I love my PS4, I play it way more then any device I have, but I shudder to hope I never have to deal with Sony customer service.

  • burningrage on 06/06/2017 - 19:36
    +3

    If there is a lesson learnt here it is that Sony has always been a difficult business to deal with. I learnt it with my PS2/3 experience.

  • manatama on 06/06/2017 - 21:07

    When you have kids, create a separate PSN account for them with a limited access to certain games on your console.
    Or create sub accounts.
    https://www.playstation.com/en-au/get-help/help-library/my-a…

    I know this doesn't solve your issue, but for others' reference.

  • meep on 07/06/2017 - 06:03
    +2

    Side note: When you put in your PayPal details for the first time on the PSN, it asks if you wish to save your password for future uses. Regardless of what you select (I selected 'No') the PS4 will save your details so that the next transaction you make will go through automatically.

    Learn't that the hard way when my account was hacked end of last year and I had to deal with Sony's incompetence.

    Contacted Sony via web chat once I had my account back, hack advised to them, incorrect charges advised, Sony acknowledged the issues, reference obtained.

    Lodged the problem with PayPal, PayPal advised they would investigate and contact Sony.

    No contact from Sony, PayPal refund money, Ps4 locked, account banned.

    Contact Sony via phone, operative can locate the web chat, says nothing was lodged with it, no action has been taken thus the Ps4 has been locked, advises they will log the fault and it should be resolved in less then a week.

    Week a half later, no contact from Sony. Call again, new operative says they can locate the web chat but the reference I was given was internal and I shouldn't have received it, that nothing was logged for it and that no previous call exists. Says his logged a new fault, it will take 2 weeks to be addressed. Also advised he didn't know of any contact from PayPal but that "any refund of money before they approve the refund will result in the PS4 being locked and the account being banned".

    All in all over a month wasted because Sony's support is less then desirable and their own system design defeats the purpose of the most simple security: a password (as mentioned previously by @PVA, the Ps4 will remember your PayPal password, regardless of what you tell it to do).

    I'd recommend going to the ACCC and make a complaint. Might as well try. Its Sony's own design that a password does not need to be re-entered for purchases unless two factor authentication is set up. Their design allowed the transactions to go through without approval.

  • Odin on 07/06/2017 - 10:16
    +1

    Yeah this is a case of "too bad". Sorry.

    Sony's system is archaic and well known for this. They simply can't upgrade their system without causing an even bigger (profanity), so this is one of the side effects of it. You just have to learn to live with it. Just don't leave a CC on your account and it's nothing to worry about. Or don't leave your kids unattended.

  • furys12 on 07/06/2017 - 11:22
    +23

    wow i can't believe the amount of "against Sony" in here, OP let his kid play a game he shouldn't be playing, whilst signed into a service/account he shouldn't have access to, with passwords and payment details open and saved, it doesn't matter that it was all setup and saved because op is the usual user of the console, its on OP to make sure that the appropriate checks are in place if he's going to allow anyone else to use the console.

    The "other user" made a purchase that due to the facts above Sony has absolutely no way to know it was not being made legitimately by OP and then the purchased contents were used, followed by a chargeback, which is basically scam 101 and the incorrect way to handle the situation.

    Op should have called Sony first, he likely would have been told "sorry live and learn" which is absolutely the correct response in every way but maybe they would have been nice enough to let him off there have been many a documented case of it happening so who knows, instead by doing the chargeback he triggered all sorts of scam and unreliable customer warnings, which will get you banned from near every service.

    Honestly at this point i don't think OP has any leg to stand on calling Sony the bad guys in this situation because it was handled wrong by OP before Sony even had a chance to be the good or bad guys, the amount of scams and dodgy people that pull this exact stunt must be astronomical these days you can't fault Sony for having the hardline approach theres just no way to know and they certainly wont be the only ones.

    Before anyone says it, i'n not saying sony are perfect and maybe they've handled similar situations (where the person did the right thing) in just as shitty way but 'in this case' they dont deserve the hate.

  • sghetti on 07/06/2017 - 11:23
    +2

    This is where I've had better service from Microsoft re Xbox One. There was a special on the Fallout 4 Season Pass at some point, I jumped on it purchased the pass.

    I go and check my account history and realise I purchased the Season Pass 6 or so months ago when I bought and installed the game. Sleep deprived with 2 young kids, memory is horrible right now.

    Anyway, called Microsoft and they check the account and confirm that I had purchased it in the past and refunded the new purchase amount in total.

    A bit of a different scenario but they could've said too bad for not checking first. Although you could argue that being logged into the microsoft account with the item already purchased should stop you from purchasing it on the same account.

    • tomsco on 07/06/2017 - 11:37

      Good result there, and good show of CS.

      But agree about the last point - I would assume most (if not all) digital delivery services would prevent you purchasing something you already own. Oh well - resolved at least :)

    • El Grande on 07/06/2017 - 12:11

      That was Microsofts fault they shouldn't let you buy something you already own again.

      Sony had no fault here. If they do it for 1 person they would have to do it for everyone.

    • sghetti on 07/06/2017 - 12:25
      +1

      100% agree as I said, a different scenario. The big difference being was that I explained my case and there was no pushback what-so-ever. They immediately went into resolving the issue, I didn't need to escalate to a manager or anything.

      A based on their good Customer Service and the fact I was willing to spend the money on the Season Pass, I ended up purchasing another game of same value.

    • ilikeradiohead on 07/06/2017 - 18:35

      Odd, as normally the purchase page will say that you already own it. Still good that they resolved it no fuss.

    • Matslurpee on 07/06/2017 - 22:48
      +4

      I think the key difference here is how you spoke to the content provider and not the currency distributor.

      He reversed charges without talking to them, only tried interaction after they banned the account.

  • Cliche Guevara on 07/06/2017 - 12:24
    +20

    Not going to tell the OP how to deal with his own kid, but not sure why the Paypal charge back was even a consideration. When my boy did a similar thing ($80 worth of Forza Horizon DLC on xbox360) it was just an issue between me and him. He was banned from the xbox until he could pay back what he owed. Worked out to be about 3 months (he gets $5 week pocket money/allowance for doing some chores). In the end he learnt a valuable lesson - and also the value of the content he downloaded…

  • benny79 on 07/06/2017 - 13:25

    this has happened to me a couple of years back
    I took it as a lesson learned as digital purchases are covered in the t&c

  • centrelink on 07/06/2017 - 14:20
    +1

    Nice, I always ban my customers who want to return their item because they ordered by mistake as well. It makes me feel nice and gooey with pure satisfaction to make me waste my resources and effort to send the item in the first place.

    • Matslurpee on 07/06/2017 - 22:50

      The ban would have been a result of the unexpected charge reversal.

      If he had contacted Sony instead of PayPal he would likely be in a different situation right now.

    • MrFunSocks on 08/06/2017 - 00:30

      He was banned because he didn't try and "return" the item that was purchased, he went to PayPal and got them to reverse the payment while still keeping the item. It's theft plain and simple.

      The correct way to do it would have been to contact Sony and get them to refund it.

  • Nillionaire on 07/06/2017 - 14:35
    +1

    I agree Sony are money hungry bastards but I really don't care as I always buy pre-paid wallet cards to avoid the issue, fool. So, too bad, so sad, pay up!

  • messiah1095 on 07/06/2017 - 14:38

    Lesson learnt. Don't store any payment info on your consoles/devices and have 2FA enabled on your PayPal account.

    • based on 09/06/2017 - 15:50

      Didn't know paypal had 2FA, that's one account it should definitely be enabled on, cheers

  • luffyex2010 on 07/06/2017 - 16:55
    +1

    Hmmm I got a similar story when I first got my PSN account….its a bourgeoisie world.

    Was on PS Store with my PS3 with my crappy ADSL2+ internet with slow speeds, then the screen froze, click click click…..(itchy fingers)

    Next thing I got from the TV screen with the internet back " THank you for your purchase"
    Its was a purchase done for a PS vita game "Soul Sacrifice"….

    Called Sony told them the issue, they said they cannot reverse it and will not refund as its my problem (didn't set a password for purchases….. ). It was my first time using the PS Store and the sad thing is that I don't even own a PS Vita at that time.

    Feeling frustrated as its $60, i lodge a complaint with fair trading. Fair trading replies they cannot do anything.

    So much for fair trading.

    Today…..got used to PSN, put a secure checkout pin/password and will always have the mentality about SONY
    "its all about the money…..that should be their slogan not players."

    Note: About the vita…..I eventually bought vita s' in the later years and managed to download and play my first game ever bought on PSN. SOUL SACRIFICE

    • FatGPT on 08/06/2017 - 14:47
      +1

      What an apt name for your first purchase, too

      • luffyex2010 on 08/06/2017 - 16:09
        +2

        I was fated to buy the game lolz

  • Toons on 07/06/2017 - 17:09

    mistakes were made but why not look into the case with Apple they had to refund millions for the same thing underage kids purchasing DLC bait

    however you should have went to Sony first not paypal and withdraw payment.

    Consumer affairs will weigh into this one deeply if they find it legitimate especially with it involving a minor.

    They also don't like publicity in the negative sense

  • Hirolol on 07/06/2017 - 18:06

    you wouldn't get that kind of service on steam, i think steam actually let you refund a game within 24 hours if you don't like it.
    not sure about in game items though.

  • ssyl9 on 07/06/2017 - 18:52

    What you did was not correct. Basically you asked paypal to charge back but did not give back the item to Sony.. Of course Sony is not gonna be happy about it.

    If you contacted Sony at the first instance to have the item refunded, it might be a whole different story.

    I don't think you can do anything in this case as chargebacks without contacting the company for refund in a digital sense is considered as theft (taking something without paying). Even if you stated you intend to return the item, you didn't ask for a return before you did the chargeback. All in all they can say you are only sorry you are caught.

    take it as a "not so expensive" lesson to only utilise chargebacks as last resort, not the first thing to do.

    • [Deactivated] on 07/06/2017 - 23:17

      I think this might be their reasoning, as unfortunate as it may be.

  • sunnyc on 07/06/2017 - 19:05

    Poor customer service. Sony should of just refunded the money directly.

    • Ughhh on 07/06/2017 - 22:04
      +3

      Sony should of just refunded the money directly.

      Did you even read? Op didn't even contact Sony first. Sony find out after the charge back.

  • msmhw on 07/06/2017 - 19:49

    Op, maybe you should try to find some discounted PSN gift cards and pay them back?

    I think customer service and customer always rightsomething in the past, most companies now don't really care that much as they care about money, and if you don't pay the chase you with all the legal rights they have in their T&C. I missed the old days were the companies do their best to keep the customers happy. Now to solve your problem you need the attention of social media otherwise you won't get anything without fight!

  • Burnz316 on 07/06/2017 - 19:53

    Sony and Microsoft don't like chargebacks.. If you make a mistake, ring them and talk to a person. They will often refund your first mistake, but won't if your asking for refunds all the time.

    You need to password protect all accounts with billing information, maybe look into making your kid a child account which is restricted.

    • ggkfc on 08/06/2017 - 09:13

      Pretty much this, you and your kid, on your account bought some stuff then did a charge back. They ban you and now you are sad.
      You think a big company like Sony cares about you and your account? Just make a new account and learn your lesson

  • [Deactivated] on 07/06/2017 - 20:04
    +1

    Sony (SEN) suck for customer service and this is one of the main reasons why I switched to PC and never looked back. I know that Steam have a bad history but they have eventually come around and there are a lot of sellers aside from Steam, I'm especially a huge fan of GOG.

    In my case, what lost me as a customer is that there was a pricing glitch where the price advertised was $2.49 but before they actually let me purchase it they forced me to top up the account (can't buy items directly, you can only pay from a prepaid balance so you are not really buying a "game" you are buying "credit", and minimum of $10 also.), and then after top up, the price went up to $14.95.

    $2.49 to $14.95 is a huge jump in price and I essentially topped up with credit based on a false promise.

    I was able to reproduce the glitch and documented it. Here's the proof: http://imgur.com/a/GXMo5

    I then asked to be refunded the amount - they refused - despite very clear proof of the issue.

    Can't charge back because I know I would get banned and lose EVERYTHING already purchased on the account.

    I said it's against Australian Consumer Law - they said that isn't proven unless I actually take them to court

    Who's going to take them to court over small amounts? Even though it is 99% probably illegal, that's how they get away with it - and they know it.

    • burningrage on 07/06/2017 - 22:00
      +1

      This is exactly the reason I said Sony is a difficult company to deal with.

      That superiority mentality attitude…..

    • ShadowStealer7 on 07/06/2017 - 22:57
      +1

      You were on the US site, then logged in to an Australian account to access the Australian site

      • [Deactivated] on 07/06/2017 - 23:01

        I figured that out after it was too late, it wasn't very obvious that I was suffering from a region issue - the website is very unclear about currency, the only potential giveaway was "en-us" which is a common language code to use even for other english speaking countries. For example, in Australia we predominantly use the US Keyboard layout despite not being in the US.

  • Ivan Krazy on 07/06/2017 - 20:05
    +1

    You do realise you can set up a password prompt every time you make a purchase? I got that and it's great and prevents things like this! I think it's in PlayStation network settings! setup

  • D Money on 07/06/2017 - 20:12
    +1

    Don't put a television and video game in charge of babysitting your kids. Simple

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