Installing My Own Roller Blinds - Advice and Help Needed

SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 16:52
Last edited 03/02/2017 - 16:56

Hi all!

Greenie when it comes to DIY handman. Have moved out to my own house and I have ordered two roller blinds custom made from halfpriceblinds.com.au as a test run. Much cheaper than measure and quote and install custom blindsmen it seems, where it might cost upward of $2-3k+ for basic roller blinds. Hoping to do the whole house for 1-1.5k myself.

They have videos on roller blinds installation, measure etc. there but I am still abit nervous being a first timer with the drill, let alone blinds.

The installation instructions advise what they roughly recommend Phillips head wise depending on the material your fixing to.

Just some questions:

1) I am WA based, so my new house is typical double brick walls (externally) with white set plaster finish and so forth. The windows have steel lintels at the top inside edge of window sill.

I plan to fix to the facewall (i.e. where your architrave would normally go). Therefore is my relevant 'instructions' fixing to brick, ignoring the plaster finish the underneath would be brick?

Which leads to my question: if you drilled into steel lintel, once you pierce through you'd be into brick? So would you affix using screws/sized screws and materials that matches steel, or brick?

2) Instructions for brick recommend a green plug and 38 mm 8 gauge self tapper. Can anyone explain the step by step process of drilling pilot holes/eventually getting the plug and self tapper in?

So I work out my bracket screw holes positions, then what size drill bit do I use to drill a pilot hole? Would it be a 38mm drill bit to match the 38mm 8 gauge self tapper prescribed by the instructions? Then just push the green plug in (must it be real tight?) to the pilot hole I assume? Then do I just use another drill bit to drill-screw the 38mm 8 guage self tapper into the plug?

I assume by doing the self tapper 38mm 8 gauge bit it expands into the green plug which then clings/expands into the brick to hold in place? Can I therefore not remove it once installed, as it isn't a typical screw that can be screwed in/out of a hole more than once?

3) I was gifted a drill set - Makita - from Bunnings. Comes with two cordless drills: Hammer drill and I believe impact driver drill?

Is this the correct drills I need to be using? I am abit confused when you use each drill, on what materials and what types of projects?

I have been googling the above to try and get a clear picture, but could just use some upfront advice/affirmation from those more seasoned with a drill. Abit worried as old fashioned folks and those around me want me to outsource it out , but I have been told and believe this is one of those 'should know' things as a DIY'er, that you can easily save money on? Surely I just drill slowly and I should get a straight, nice sized hole? HOw hard could it be? Being a first timer just want to make sure I get the drill, drill bit sizes and process/technique right.

Any advice on roller blinds too would be great. Obviously the end brackets have to be exactly placed to meet the length of the roller blind roll once put up - so just curious how others go about making sure the drilled in brackets meet the exact length. Too short and your roller can't fit? Too long by a cm and wouldn't your roller not touch from one end bracket to the other, so again it wouldn't hold up? Venetians etc have brackets that you hang , but aren't from end to end hence it can be 'approximate'.

Thanks in advance for any tips!

Home & Garden

Comments

  • rompastompa on 03/02/2017 - 16:58
    +1

    Some general points (not specific to your questions)

    I'd suggest putting up some shelving or picture frames to get you used to drilling clean straight holes in brick/masonry first.

    Also, put some electrical tape around the drill bit to the depth you want to use, that way you know how far to drill.

    • SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 17:24

      Not sure what electrical tape is but thanks for the tip, will need to check it out.

      If I predrill too short I assume the plug won't go in? If I predrill too long is it also an issue??

      Or do I need to drill the exact length of the green plug, and the self tapping screw?

      Just abit confused as a greenie as to what sizes. being recommended a 38mm 8 gauge self tapping screw, do I get a green plug 38mm, and I just drill to the same depth as the self tapping screw assumedly? Being around windows, and with no powerpoints I should be safe that there isn't wiring or other utility piping/cabling that would typically run near wnidows?

      Edit: not planning on putting up picture frames or shelving unfortunately, as it isn't currently needed. Can I buy some blocks of wood or pinch some spare crappy old bricks that are broken off other building houses and just drill into that?

      Let alone what drill type should I be using for this sort of job?

      • altomic on 03/02/2017 - 19:01

        electrical tape - put electrical tape (coloured tape - you can use a band aid) on the drill bit to the depth you want to . like this site suggests

        • SaberX on 06/02/2017 - 16:02

          No probs - thanks for the advice. I saw green plugs come in 3.5mm and 5mm styles so if I get a 3.5mm or 5mm as stupid as the question sounds, I assume I would drill to the same depth i.e. electrical tape starts 5mm down from the drill bit/tip.

          Am just abit confused but all green plugs require 6.5mm holes drilled with 6.5mm masonry drill bits, correct?

          Just not sure how this translates to the suggestion of 8gauge, 35mm screw for securing, as 8 gauge appears to be smaller than 6.5mm hole??

        • altomic on 06/02/2017 - 16:08

          @SaberX: with the green plugs you drill a hole the same size as the plug. the screw then forces them open.

          if you get some 7mm green plug stuff like this stuff from bunnings then drill the hole with a 7mm masonry bit

          drill the 7mm wide hole as deep as the length of the screw.

        • SaberX on 06/02/2017 - 17:03

          @altomic:

          thanks - the description on the bunnings site mentions suitable for 10 and 12 gauge screws? Should I be getting the 6.5mm wall plugs instead (Which would suit the 8 gauge, 38mm self tappers recommended by the manufacture)?

          Funnily enough they've disappeared off the bunnings website since last night, so I can't even link them! they were 25mm or 50mm though. I assume being a 38mm self tapper the recommendation is get a 50mm wall plug so the screw can go part way, as opposed to a 25mm which would be too short a plug.

          A workmate suggested getting a masonry drill bit 6mm as your unstead hand or hole will end up bigger than 6mm, whereas if I were to get a 6.5mm masonry drill bit, the 6.5mm green plug would be loose? WHat is your thoughts?

          I am also confused why brick has self tapper screws recommended for installation:

          https://www.halfpriceblinds.com.au/instructions-manual/rolle…

          My googling and others seem to agree that self tappers are for metal or something aren't they? Where you have a plug I've been told just to use a normal screw??

  • geek001 on 03/02/2017 - 17:19
    +1

    Wait, is this outdoor blinds or indoor blinds? Unless your inside wall is brick, inside plasterboard walls generally has wooden studs behind it, so your screws would have to be quite long before you hit brick.

    • SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 17:22

      Indoor blinds.

      WA House remember, no plasterboard if it is that apartment like hollow material?

      It is just double bricks with mortar - grey set on top and finished with the white float, or whatever they call it. Seems to be a WA thing.

      • geek001 on 03/02/2017 - 17:28

        Ok, not familiar with WA houses. Then I have only one advice for you, being a novice myself. Go and have look at how other blinds are installed. :)

        • SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 22:35

          I have seen other blinds installed, the problem is they're already installed so I don't see the process of installation.. :(

  • Youfah Mizzum on 03/02/2017 - 18:08

    These are not specific to blinds per se, but generic to drilling into masonry (bricks, concrete etc).

    1. You need a masonry drill bit. It is different to other drill bits.

    2. No need for a smaller pilot hole. Just use the appropriate sized drill bit you need & go for it. If you're unsure about what happens when you drill, grab a few bricks from somewhere and drill away. Most suburbs have a house going up somewhere nearby & there will discarded bricks all over the joint.

    3. Electrical tape is a bright coloured tape roughly 12mm wide which sparkies use. But you can use any tape - the idea is to wrap tape around the drill bit so you just drill into the material without worrying how deep because you have already wrapped the tape around the bit to the correct depth.

    4. With regards to the green plug, drill using the recommended size bit. Pretty sure the green plugs are sized for a 6.5mm masonry bit. I am 99% sure the 38mm refers to the length of the plug, so drill the hole 38mm deep - this is where the tape comes handy. UNLESS the screw supplied with the blind is longer, then drill to the length of the screw. Tap the green plug gently into the drilled hole with a hammer - gently.
      You just screw directly into the plug - no need for further drilling after the plug has been tapped into the hole.

    5. Yes if you predrill too short the plug wont go all the way in. If you predrill too far, it is only an issue if the screw is SHORTER than the plug and the plug has gone too far into the hole for the screw to grab. Else if the screw is plenty long enough it will grab the plug even if the plug is no longer flush with the masonry.

    6. Cabling & other utilities hidden in the walls are rare around windows. Don't worry about it.

    7. You seem to be a tad nervous. As mentioned in point 2 above, just find some scrap to test stuff out on.

    8. Your post has a mention about permanency. You 'd be able to undo the screw, but removing the plug - forget it.

    Hope that helps.

    • SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 22:45

      Hi! Firstly thanks for the step by step advice and patience. With all the 'google'/youtube suggestions sometimes it's hard just to get a step by step hand holding advice from the internet these days. Keeping in mind I did watch the installation videos on all the blinds websites, while they show the drilling into the wall bit, few talk specifically about sizes of plugs, drill bits, drill types etc, much of which totally green handymen like myself haven't a clue.

      Bear with me - just had some questions, in identical number order to yours.

      1. Masonry drill bit: so do you get a masonry drill bit for whatever drill type it is? As mentioned I have a drill set: hammer drill and I believe an impact driver drill? Do masonry drill bits fit both types of drills? My builder site supervisor casually mentioned a 'drill driver' when I tried to get some tips, which seemed like a different type of drill?

      2. Pilot hole wise: so basically one isn't needed as you drill just the one hole - exact size of the green plug - hammer that gently in, then screw the self tapping screw in with a normal screwdriver?? The self tapping screw then expands into the green plug or causes it to expand, thereby gripping the brick?

      I think I will definitely get those discarded bricks this weekend.. feel abit dodgy driving around looking for them though!

      1. Electrical tape - thanks! So basically whatever the depth of my end screw is - measure that onto drill bit and wrap the electricla tape (or any other tape) further along the drill bit. In other words when you reach the tape you know you're done? Smart, and honestly I never thought about it.

      2. The confusing part to me is you mentioned drill the green plug using the recommended size bit. But just what is the recommended size?? I mean as you can see from the half price blinds website, installation video and the pdf download for instructions for roller blinds installation:

      https://www.halfpriceblinds.com.au/how-to

      the recommended installation material for brick is green plug and 38mm (1.5") 8 gauge self tapper. So how then do I work out what drill bit is required (for either hammer or impact driver drill) that would suit the size hole I would need for the green plug?

      You mentioned green plugs are sized for 6.5mm masonry bits, however the halfprice blinds mention a 38mm (1.5" ) self tapper, so I would have thought the size of the actual nail is 38mm, and not the depth??

      I just have no knowledge when it comes to standards in the industry, so I am abit lost. If I have the right green plug size, self tapper, and drill bit then I figure I could slowly drill a hole, hammer the green plug in as you said, then just use a handheld screwdriver to screw the self tapper in?

      The issue is all the blinds installation videos and youtube videos seem to show them drilling pilot holes into the walls followed by using a drill to actually auto drill the screws into the bracket (and thereby pilot hole). Which was what was confusing me. I think the videos are somewhat generic?

      Unfortunately because they claim they don't know what material you will be fixing to, half price blinds does not provide the screws and materials to affix. Hence just their recommendations.

      1. Guess predrilling too short is better than longer then. Regarding the screw grabbing the plug even if not flush with masonry - if you drill too big of a width hole with too big of a drill bit your plug would be too loose and would not grip the brick even once the screw has been screwed in right?

      In other words your plug has to be tapped into the hole pretty firm? Enough to require abit of hammering gently to push it in? But not enough that it could just slip out if you inverted the wall upside down, correct?

      1. haha electrocution from first time drilling would be a sucky way to go. but thanks anyway. agreed there shouldn't be anything there.

      2. yeap nervous, as many have been vocally against my DIY and want me to 'pay' for a right job. Others seem to say it isn't 'hard' , I just don't know anyone who can demonstrate it to me in person so I can learn off.

      3. Yeap, just as I thought then - plug has to be removed, and becomes useless. But does removing the plug make your hole bigger, as what I was told is the screw expands into and pushes the plug out, so that it almost expands and grips onto the surrounding brick right? So by removing both I assume you widen your hole further??

      I was just asking mainly incase I drilled and found my brackets slightly too far apart and the roller blind roll not being able to click in nicely. Hopefully I measure right with their distance apart (the brackets) to avoid looking like an idiot after drilling the holes haha.

      Thanks for all your advice. Any chance you could point me to the right links/directions as to green plugs, masonry bits and the 38 mm 8 gauge self tapper? I tried bunnings but got lost amongst all the lingo, not sure if I have the right things?

      Hopefully one day I'll look back at how stupidly simple this was. :)

      • SaberX on 03/02/2017 - 22:46

        Hmm, not sure why ozbargain converts my numbered points into all that crappy formatting/bullet points above. Any suggestions?

        If you read down, it should be 1 ,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 and so forth, in direct response to your points.

    • SaberX on 06/02/2017 - 17:05

      Hi Youfah - I did some more reading and questioning throughout the last few days.

      Just wondering - but is a self tapper required for screwing in? It seems to be for metal steel lintels etc. whereas face fitting onto brick walls I've been told you don't need a self tapper screw as you have plugs anyway?

      Should I just follow the recommendations re: green plug and 38mm, 8 gauge self tapper screw? or would I be fine just following 38mm and 8 gauge but getting any normal screw??

      I can safely upgrade to a 10 gauge screw so long as it fits into the bracket screw hole, correct? As I assume the bigger the screw, the better the fit into the green plug and better bracket weight support?

      For my hammer driver drill any hex shaped drill bit will work? For impact driver though do I need to attach the magnetic nut driver piece, then what shape piece so I insert into the magnetized part to then drill the screw in(rather than screwdriver)?

      • Youfah Mizzum on 08/02/2017 - 15:56

        Self tappers are often used for metal sheet, and sometimes softwoods (pine, cedar - they're probs the most common soft woods).
        Other surfaces you'd pre-drill a hole for the screw.

        A masonry drill bit is irrelevant to the kind of drill you have. The kind of drill bit depends on what you're drilling into. So in this case its bricks and/or concrete so you use a masonry bit.
        Any kind of bit will be fine for whatever drill you have. You just slip the bit into the drill chuck & tighten. (The chuck is the tip of the drill which you can turn to open/close the orifice where you pop in the required drill bit).

        "Pilot hole wise: so basically one isn't needed as you drill just the one hole - exact size of the green plug - hammer that gently in, then screw the self tapping screw in with a normal screwdriver?? The self tapping screw then expands into the green plug or causes it to expand, thereby gripping the brick?" Yep - you got it.

        "Electrical tape - thanks! So basically whatever the depth of my end screw is - measure that onto drill bit and wrap the electricla tape (or any other tape) further along the drill bit. In other words when you reach the tape you know you're done? Smart, and honestly I never thought about it." Yep - you got it.

        "The confusing part to me is you mentioned drill the green plug using the recommended size bit. But just what is the recommended size?? I mean as you can see from the half price blinds website, installation video and the pdf download for instructions for roller blinds installation:"
        So, (and others can correct me if I'm wrong) the plugs are standardised colours based on the plug diameter. You can get white plugs, red plugs, green plugs etc. So for green plugs, that uses a 6.5mm masonry bit (that is the recommended size - 6.5mm). Just lob down to your nearest Bunnings, or you may have a correct sized bit in you new kit.

        "the recommended installation material for brick is green plug and 38mm (1.5") 8 gauge self tapper. So how then do I work out what drill bit is required (for either hammer or impact driver drill) that would suit the size hole I would need for the green plug?

        "You mentioned green plugs are sized for 6.5mm masonry bits, however the halfprice blinds mention a 38mm (1.5" ) self tapper, so I would have thought the size of the actual nail is 38mm, and not the depth??"
        I think I've covered that. The size hole you need for a green plug will be created when you drill it using a 6.5mm masonry bit. Thats the diameter. 38mm is the depth. I'd actually forget about using the self tapper & just get any old screw which looks like a good size to make a good grab in the green plug & expand it out to grip the bricks. Just use your commonsense, i.e. don't get a screw that's obviously to skinny & don't get one that will be too fat to get into the plug.

        "Regarding the screw grabbing the plug even if not flush with masonry - if you drill too big of a width hole with too big of a drill bit your plug would be too loose and would not grip the brick even once the screw has been screwed in right?"
        Right.

        "In other words your plug has to be tapped into the hole pretty firm? Enough to require abit of hammering gently to push it in? But not enough that it could just slip out if you inverted the wall upside down, correct?"
        Correct. You're getting the hang of this DIY stuff!

        "Just wondering - but is a self tapper required for screwing in? It seems to be for metal steel lintels etc. whereas face fitting onto brick walls I've been told you don't need a self tapper screw as you have plugs anyway?

        Should I just follow the recommendations re: green plug and 38mm, 8 gauge self tapper screw? or would I be fine just following 38mm and 8 gauge but getting any normal screw??

        I can safely upgrade to a 10 gauge screw so long as it fits into the bracket screw hole, correct? As I assume the bigger the screw, the better the fit into the green plug and better bracket weight support?"
        Self tapper not required. Yes, get a normal screw. A bigger screw will just be harder, or even impossible, to screw into the plug.

        "For my hammer driver drill any hex shaped drill bit will work? For impact driver though do I need to attach the magnetic nut driver piece, then what shape piece so I insert into the magnetized part to then drill the screw in(rather than screwdriver)?"
        Drill bits are not hex shaped. They are circular.
        Anything hex will be a screwdriver bit - not a drill bit.
        For your specific job right now - I would use a good 'ol hand screwdriver, nothing electric. Except obviously to make the holes with the 6.5mm masonry bit, that ya gotta do with your power drill.

  • LayG on 17/03/2017 - 11:27

    Does anyone know how much it would cost for installing Roman blinds in a 4 bedroom house. Just the installation charges.

    Sorry for being very vague. I understand its to do with sizes and type of installation but I just wanted to get a rough idea.

  • rollerblindsmlb on 24/03/2017 - 20:57

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