Combined Income $360k Yearly. Property $1.75million, Savings $400k

Dear ozbargain,

My Wife and my family are pushing me to purchase a property worth $1.75 (pre-approval in place)which is ofcourse very nice and will serve us for many decades. They insisit we can easily pay it off given our combined incomes. We have 2 dependents under 8 going to public school for now.

Alternatively, I have my eye on a property around $1.3m which is a bit safer, no LMI.

With changes to foreign buying lockdown, I am apprehensive to take out such a large loan.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

*** EDIT***

I am pleased to advise that we have picked up our new house today at Auction
Thanks all for your valuable opinions.

All the best!!

closed Comments

  • +1
    • Will another "dream" property come up in the future?
    • are the schools, public transport and roads good?
    • how far from the beaches and parks?
    • will the dream house be a dream house for other people in 15 years time when kids move out?
    • what is the rental yield on the dream house if you were to rent it out for a year or so to help reduce the burden that you feel? The negative getting may help reduce the burden that you feel initially and compensate for any price drop in the immediate future.

    Need to assess it without emotion first.

    Then factor in the emotion as the dollar value you'd pay. Is it worth the 300-400k above the property you have your eye for?

    Would you sacrifice 1-2 years of living elsewhere to get that comfort you seek by paying off as much of the principal?

    Get analysing and creative to meet in the middle with the boss . Happy wife+ security = happy life

    Good luck

    • Thanks you for your views.
      Hopefully, I would not have to rent this out so looking for the best suburb/schooling/lifestyle etc.

      Not looking at rental growth/yield etc at this stage…

  • +1

    if it's your forever house then I would say pick the one you like the most and that fits best with the type of lifestyle you want to enjoy.

    If you are planning to move to a "dream house" then make it a business decision. Understand what your dream house looks like, what it would cost and plan out to how you will get it.

    Compare the houses by looking at historical data so that you can make a decision based on what will give you the best ROI over the period you will have it.

    You may find that the median growth of the 1.7mil house will give you better capital gain that makes up for the additional interest payments but if you want my personal opinion, I would say that with $400k in savings, you should limit your budget to around $1.2m on your combined salary to avoid digging yourself into a debt that compromises the type of lifestyle to which you are accustomed.

    Remember that interest rates are historically at their lowest and although economic factors currently show that it will continue to decline to meet the global cash rate average - even small increases on a loan of the size you are getting can create cash flow issues.

    • +1

      Good advise and this is something I am leaning towards.
      I dont want to compromise my lifestyle one bit.

      In fact I want to increase spending…

      I think a house around $1.2-1.4 might be the way to go..

      Now where is my Wife :)

      • Well a 1.3mil mortgage on a 1.7mil house leaves you with no savings and a loan repayment of around $8k per month so no doubt you will have to make lifestyle compromises to do that.

        unless you're expecting your salary to significantly outgrow cpi increases, the 1.7 is pretty much a forever house for you unless your dream house is a downsize

  • I really Dont know if this Forum is Suitable for this discussion
    Get a right accountant to discuss this one on One.

    • -8

      Agree. If OP is earning that much, should OP even be on OzBargain? Sounds like he's just plainly boasting wealth and income here.

      • +18

        You think I am the only one making good money here?
        You think millionaires become millionaires but living lavishly?

        I love my deals as much as the next person.
        I have worked hard to get where I am and I want to maximise my opportunities.

        • -8

          Again, good on ya man, pretty sure you got your 'team' or rather 'soldiers who you sent to Omaha beach' - worked hard too. Ever watched how Kevin Spacey acted in horrible bosses movie? Better not mess with this guy, just saying, I certainly will not. Respect!

        • +2

          @uknowthatbitch:

          Not sure what you are on about mate.
          However, thanks for taking the time out and giving your views.

          Appreciate it!

          Peace!

    • +3

      Yes and No.

      IMO people such as on this and other forums provide more valuable information than an accountant who will tell you what you want to hear..

  • +5

    Don't borrow as though you will forever be earning 360k, that's what I will say!

    • No definitely not.
      I can and want to earn more than $360k otherwise it will not be progression…

      • +7

        Think about this.. I bought a property much smaller than what I can afford, very little mortgage stress and I could actually cut-down on work so I could actually spend more time at home..

        What's the point of that big mansion of our means you have to work 6 days 10 hours to pay it off.. I'd rather buy for less and enjoy more time.

        • Words of wisdom here!

        • Same, I always wonder what goes on in people heads that they feel they need to borrow the max or buy the biggest.
          Are their lives really that empty that they feel the need to impress, like some bizarre form of dick measuring?

        • Champ! Totally agree…

    • +1

      I've just heard two men in their 50s say that today!

      Mid-life career burnout is extremely common. Marriage meltdown is another issue.

      If OP and his partner sustain their incomes for 6 more years then they'll be fine financially.

      One can only wish the best of luck.

  • +2

    I am an oldie , and have plenty of realestate experience . Your home is your kingdom. If your wife loves that sort of house of 1.70 million, and you are quite confident , and I am of the opinion you are ( from what you spell out here),please go ahead to proceed the purchase .I strongly feel for you that you would have not much problem to meet the mortgage repayments in future. Both you and your wife appear hard working couple.By the way even so you won't have to suffer at the expense of having a good enjoyable life. I had the same experience and I encourage my children taking the same approach. So far my advice to myself and my kids is right. In fact the loan will initial and stimulate you work harder to make more moneys . Years later your home will be very much appreciated many folds, trust me. By "then and now“ don't forget to remember me and appreciate my this advice ; a free one . From once upon -a time a professional accountant cum real -estate manager.

    • Great advic and thanks for the motivation.
      I will not forget this.

    • While, I totally like your advice, knowing that where the prices already are, it seems absolutely impossible for prices to increase by say 15 times (or even 25 times in some cases) like they did in the past, over 3-4 decades or less. What are your thoughts about it? "Smaller the base, higher the scope of appreciating multi-folds and vice versa" is the theory I base my thoughts on.

  • +2

    I don't understand how you the OP only has 400k saved up. Do you have shares or some other investment where your savings are going?

    I see you have property in a SMSF, but I guess that's been limited to ~30k/year contributions per person for the past few years … still doesn't explain where else the money has been going.

    If you don't have any other investments, I would seriously look at diversifying away from property. Maybe sell the properties in the SMSF and buy shares in SMSF - when you buy a house to live in.

    • The massive pay bump has happened in the last 12 months

      • Which technology/skills do you work on if you don't mind?

  • +2

    Whilst the focus these days seems to be on investment properties we did about 5 years ago what your family are proposing.

    We borrowed the 80% based on our savings and bought a house we love ( whilst far much more of a house than we need).

    5 years down the line the mortgage has got easy and when we get to retirement plus a bit we'll sell to move to something more practical for us having the memories of enjoying every year of our wonderful home plus the investment gains it's made by the nature of owning it so long.

    • Good work!
      Thanks for your experience

  • +4

    It's probably just me, but something doesn't add up with the OP. There are a lot of numbers numbers being thrown around and some very personal information disclosed to a bunch of random's (us).

    I expect both partner's to be intelligent enough to know their situation and wishes in life. How wise is it to base what is a large decision on the opinion of others that don't know your situation.

    File this thread as fiction, IT sales and PM asking for this kinda advice, yeah right!

    • +1

      some very personal information disclosed to a bunch of random's

      Gotta love the anonymity of the internet. Probably easier to bounce ideas off randoms than off friends/family.

      File this thread as fiction, IT sales and PM asking for this kinda advice, yeah right!

      It sounds believable to me. I just don't understand the small savings. Either they're big spenders or just got big pay raises or had a few years out of work.

      • Right on both fronts.
        We spend lots of money and also received massive pay bumps

        • We spend lots of money and also received massive pay bumps

          There's your answer. It took you 16 years to save 400k. At that rate it'll take 48 years to save another 1.2m … no chance of ever paying off a 1.3m mortgage.

          I would suggest living extremely frugally for 2 years, see how much you can save, before getting tied down to a mortgage.

          With regards to the massive pay bumps - take a look at your colleagues/superiors. My guess is there aren't too many people over 50 working in your companies, so I wouldn't bank on being able to make the money you're making for the rest of your working lives. IT project management/sales jobs are especially vulnerable to this.

          If you have a solid client base, why not start your own firm? That should give you a little more job security later on in your career.

        • @sp00ker:
          First 4 years was education.

          My first decent job back in 2004 was $28k annually.

          Yes you do have points that I take onboard.

          I can't service my clients elsewhere due to the nature of the work.

    • Yup, you could call it all fiction.
      That is your opinion

  • Thank you all for taking the time out and giving us your perspective.
    I truly appreciate it.

    All the very best!

    I think it's time to end thread :)

  • Your income can afford maxim 2.2m property and hence 1.75m is pretty safe for you. I would recommend you buy a 2m+ if it is obviously better than the 1.75m one. 1.75m really can't buy a decent one in Sydney.

    • Lemme guess - you're a real-estate again/mortgage broker/banker. Don't have 20% deposit? No worries - let's get the OP a low doc loan.

    • Are we listening to ourselves… The medium household income in less than $100K and 1.75M can't buy you a decent house?

  • +1

    it depends how old you are, what other investments and assets you own. if you don't own any other significant assets or more importantly income producing assets, I would state, especially if young, that you save your money and buy a variety of assets that will set you up for life. I don't know if you're asking from an east coast pov, but from a west coast pov you could easily buy a few 400-600k properties and set these up for a decent passive income stream. Instead you'd be locking up 1.7m of leverage for a house you'll live in i.e. you can't rent out 1.7m worth of property. If instead you bit the bullet and lived a more modest lifestyle, even if it was a nice 800k standard house, you'd have 800k that could be used for productive, passive income producing assets.

    At the end of the day with a large income like yours, i would be funnelling as much into shares, multiple invesmtent properties in a mroe affordable bandwith i.e. not just 1 x IP at $`1.7m, but say 3 or 4 totalling 1.7m.

    Set yourself up now and look at the long term end goal, not the short term flashy house and suburb IMO.

    • +4

      Just saw your income post above OP. IF you just got the income boost then I would avoid buying this $1.7m house. If you want to be wealth and freedom (not just financially, but the time to do what you love and enjoy life later down the track) then say no to short term 'this will make the wife/family happy' things and do something that will really make you guys happy in the long run. They may not realise it now, but sock your new income away into an affordable home. Go for a mid ranged suburb, i don't know where you are but in WA this woul dbe a $500-700k house. that's still a decent <15km inner ring suburb. With 300k a year income you'll pay that off fast.

      With the rest start socking it into decent shares and another investment property or two around circa the median price in the city.

      This is a simplistic view - you still need to work out what properties and equities to invest in… but that's part of the educational side. If your earning 300k im sure you can learn it. if not invest wisely in a good adviser, or even ETFs and a decent property buyers agent (well researched) to select properties.

      WIth that sort of income you can easily save $100k a year, if not i would challenge you to $150k or more. I dont' see any reason why you can't. If you can't your expenses are merely catching up to your income proportionately, and you are spending to meet your income level. i.e. if your income dropped to 80k, im sure you'd get by at 40k, so why suddenly does 300k mean you need to spend $150k a year?

      Each 100k you save will add to your passive income and asets in the future. $100,000 of shares every year, for 10 years, and you're up 1 mill. at 5-10% yield depending how aggressively your invested, evena conservative 5% is a good $50,000 pa passive income stream.

      You may not work and earn this much money for long. accidents happen, money disapperas and you find yourself on the cusp of retirement with nothing to show for your spendthrift ways. So do yourself a favour now and avoid proportionately increasing your spending to match your new income. Bite that pride bullet and set yourself up for a better future - not many of us get a chance to earn that much. Don't waste it!

  • I am nowhere near the position that you are, but if you find the 1.3m property just as good as the 1.75m one, then I would probably take that. Personally, having 450k off the loan would relieve a lot more stress and make it more worth it. I think your family should have no say in this if they aren't contributing to to the mortgage and living in the house. You and your partner should make the choice.

  • +1

    Unrelated question, but how are you on 360k income with only 400k in savings? Is the 400k excluding non-bank account investments or have you been living a very lavish lifestyle for the past few years?

  • +4

    The classic humblebrag haha. Good work though

  • +2

    Sorry if I sounded bitter with full of sour grapes but…

    You are educated enough to know the answer or are earning high enough to pay 10 accountants and 10 financial planners to answer your question.

    Three things highlighted itself in your post. $360K combined income, 1.75M house and 400K savings.

  • in regards to your original question, should you buy at 1.75 mil, i say go for it, hell you only live once, in regards to foreign buyer lockout, look at it this way, the chinese already pulled out of the market 6 months ago, that has not effected the price as much as you think and as much as the media makes it out, the market is still recovering with steady annual raise of around %10 in a so called downed market. and they will keep going up.

  • I guess the question is do you really need to live in $1.7mio house.

    Or keep living debt-free in a modest or 'good enough' house :)

    It all depends on your perspective on being in debt and 'working for the bank'.

  • genuine question and not trying to be smart, but when people quote their income, is this pre-tax or after, as i know for me, there is quite a bit of difference. i recently moved into a new role, and got excited by the salary offered, but after i calculated the take home amount, most of it went to tax\hecs etc

    • find a good accountant to help minimise your taxes

    • pre tax mate

  • Reading your post making me depresssed OP…seriously in the wrong field, or IT just plain rip off industry lol

    • Well its a niche field mate, just like plumber, Sparky.
      But you also need to be good at what you do.

    • IT is a white collar job which requires a very high skill set and intensive education.

      Business owners have been stung by using low skilled and cheap international workforces and because demand is high in Australia, the price for a highly skilled IT professional is quite high now.

  • +1
    1. One of my former staff in his early 30s bought a $2+m home at the end of last year. It's a basic house, but in a reasonably expensive location. He's young and keen to get ahead. Do some stress testing of your situation. Interest rates won't be this low forever so factor in interest rates of 7-9%. Also what if your business fails?

    2. Something else to consider: what about buying a more modest home and taking a career break or couple of years off to pursue your own interests (non-money making). Or even early retirement.

    Obviously there is a spectrum between what you're considering and the second point above, which includes all of the possibilities in between.

  • +1

    Ilsan, my advice to you is to pump up your savings rate. My wife and me immigrated 8 years ago as students, but only started working 5.5 years ago and have higher savings than you on a combined income of around 200k. Luckily I married a modest lady from a humble background who knows what value for money means.

    • Does that personality trait come in pill form?

      • It's not a personality trait, it is a habit. Everyone can change their habits. For example, if they are too keen on shopping they could transfer that desire to some other activity that could replace it and be more wholesome. Depending on a person that could be a hobby, exercise, time in nature… Personally in my spare time I love reading through which I learn new things and it does not cost me anything since nowadays you can find anything online…

  • +1

    Just remember money isn't an end goal, the purpose of life is not to amass wealth or to spend so much that you waste your life working to pay it back. Personally a 2mil home would not me make me happier than a 300k one, and I'd rather retire early.

  • +4

    I am pleased to advise that we have picked up our new house today at Auction for Mod: Removed Personal Information
    Thanks all for your valuable opinions.

    All the best!!

    • Congratulations! Our of interest, is it the dream house? Or close to?

      • yes, it is very close to the dream house.
        about 80%

        • Awesome. Glad to hear your success.

          I also agree with you that it is just as valuable to have opinions from the community as well as paid professionals.

          Get a good diverse selection of views that can help see a problem in different ways.

          All the best with the move.

    • May I ask where did you buy?

    • Congratulations!.All the best mate.I hope your wife is happy now!!!

    • Congratulations, may you make many happy memories in your new home.

      Also you may want to be less specific with the price as auction results and the address is available to public.

      Very nice house though ;)

    • Just FYI - It took me about 1 minute to find out your new address based on the info you've provided.

  • yet another person who wants to replace professional advice from a financial planner for cheap advice on a bargain forum!

    • +3

      Yes another person.
      However for this person an advice of a every day average Joe is more valuable than a planner who wants to tell you what you hear.

      • i would suggest OP takes everyone's opinions, but considers professional advice and second opinions from an FP, lawyer and an accountant when putting hard earned capital in motion.

        • -3

          Your suggestion is welcome, however Incorrect.

        • -7

          @ilsan: Mate, being a professional, I'm not going to bother with your amateur opinions. In the words of Mark Twain, Greg King, KJV Bible Proverbs 26:4, George Carlin, "Never argue with…"

          You can google what it means.

      • Or sell you something like those CWB bunch 😠

  • +2

    So much tall poppy syndrome!

    • waiting for the next post that will one-up this one, because that's what the internet forums are for

  • -2

    It seems like this thread was posted as a way to "one up" a thread started a few days ago - "$130k Annual Income (~$375 savings per week) - what NON REAL ESTATE to invest in?"… Seems like the initial post and a lot of OP's responses are to do with showing off his wealth and have an arrogant tone to them.

    • +2

      No it doesn't! He's kept it respectful and polite. I'm certainly not making the same level of money as he is, but I don't find it arrogant in any way. So many sour grapes in this discussion…

  • +1

    people talk like 1.7mill is a lot for a house these days. a 1 bedder in Sydney's inner west goes for $700k.

  • It might be bit of safe side to invest in:
    - big land + good area about 1.3m to live in.
    - once you found dream house, start looking for investment properties about 600k+ with huge size of land - bit outer suburb but close to transportation/shopping mall.
    - redevelop that property next year (after 1 year to have CGT 50% concession) and build unit + sell it as new units.

  • +1

    well done my virtual friend ….for buying your family home for 1.5m opps sorry it was 1.51m….

    Man what did you actually get from all these advice?

    I was just reading this and All I could see is your financial profile listed on a public website for people to know that you are rich and successful man with a happy family but dont mind a wife swap…for a joke.

    This is a typical example of people with crazy ego. I am pretty sure a smart man like you, have already consulted top financial advisors before you came here with you Versailles Palace dream

    I hope your virtual self confidence has been increased tremendously. Wish you good luck and dont forget to get some golden taps to be installed in your Bathroom (incase you forget that you are a rich man when you are having shower like all of us)

    • +3

      Well put! I couldn't have worded it any better.

      Also notice how a fellow Ozbargainer had posted a very similar post a few days before this guy, but with a combined $130k income. Seems like ilsan posted this with the sole objective of showing off, and to indirectly say that he is better than the other Ozbargainer.

      • +1

        Isn't judging someone negatively more disgusting when you don't know what his real intentions were?

        • that is called, "calling out"

        • +2

          Exactly this. OP's put his situation and figures out in a forum for guidance/advice. When i ask for advice, i listen, filter. And ultimately make my own decisions.

          He didn't refer to any other posts.

          He didn't claim he was richer or better than anyone else.

          He's asked on an virtual forum which gives a degree of anonymity, so it is a great place to ask frankly without real world people knowing.

          However, other people have compared it to other posts, given opinion that they view it as showing off, calling it out etc.

          Rich or poor or anything inbetween… who gives a crap.

          OP has not said anything arrogant. But the responses by some folk are based on assumptions and conjecture just from the numbers, which people are not used to seeing.

          If the numbers were different, wouldn't the situation would be the same? E.g.Combined Income $120k Yearly. Property $600k, Savings $130k. Almost exactly the same situation. but perceptions would be different because the numbers are lower.

          People earn more, people earn less. But everyone has the same issues. And haters gonna hate.

    • +3

      There's nothing like 'top financial advisors' to be honest. Many of them are a rip-off. It's like investing in stocks basis the daily recommendations of analysts in morning TV shows on the biz channels. Not saying that they all know nothing, but their advice is often business-driven and customized for their business interest more than yours.

    • +3

      Scotty my friend…..Take it easy!
      You can see from all OP's post that he is a nice, humble family guy….

      It's always worth asking "layman's advice" on top of the "top financial advice", puts things in perspective sometimes.

      Well done OP.
      Don't judge Scotty!

  • +1

    Bro honestly, if I had your income, I would not spend 5mins (all respect to OZB) on OZB looking to save $50 on a HDD, or buying something on Amazon because it's $25 cheaper.

    Having a high income (maybe top 1-2% of the state) should give you the leverage to walk into OfficeWorks and buy a friggin HDD without looking at the price tag, or an iTunes card at full price, or a Samsung Galaxy from JB HiFi (not Kogan) and the list goes on.

    You don't become a naturally "better" person just because you still hunt for bargains whilst earning $3,850/week in pocket.

    Back to your original post, congratz if you really do have that sort of income and yes, going for 1.71m house (even tho you already purchased @ 1.5m) is a no brainer.

    • Bro honestly, if I had your income, I would not spend 5mins (all respect to OZB) on OZB looking to save $50 on a HDD, or buying something on Amazon because it's $25 cheaper.

      You don't get rich by spending money. Many people well off are in such a position because they are tight with money.

  • Nothing to add, just want to congratulate you on your purchase and I hope you enjoy your new home.

  • 1.51mil in Sydney? You must be living in the blue mountains to get something big enough for your family ;)

    Good for you though champ. If I had a combined income like that I'd be shooting for the stars too.

  • +2

    You and your wife are earning 360k combined? Go hire some servants to figure this out for you.

    • +1

      haha… cudnt stop laughing….. now you know how rich becomes richer… without hiring…. we all were here to give free advice….

  • Congratulations on your purchase.
    Enjoy your new home with the family.

  • Congrats on the purchase mate! Glad you got it below your max borrowing capacity. Auctions can be super nerve racking. Good luck for the future!

  • work it out yourself, you've got this far

  • Nothing else to say except congratulations on the purchase of your dream house =)

  • Here I am on under 32k a year.

    I actually kinda hate my life at the moment.

  • OP has bought property and thus problem solved. Great advice from all and we wish the OP good luck. Thread closed.

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