Please help with my renting problem

tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 07:48
Last edited 25/01/2016 - 07:51

I have moved in this new renting property 2 months ago and have signed for 1 year contract. At the time that I moved in, the agent gave me a blank condition report to fill in. She said it is a brand new property. However, there were some damages in the toilet which the landlord didn't agree that their fault. They told us that it is our fault when we moved it. That's the reason why they delay the condition report and I haven't received It yet after 2 months. They already take my bond money.

During that 2 months, the landlord keeps annoying us. They told us when we need to cut the grasses (I think this is council's responsibility, not the landlord. However, the grasses are fine). They told us can't leave furnitures and too many shoes infront of the house! (even during the moving time). They even told us need to clean the kitchen everyday! (however he just talk to me face by face so I don't have this record). They keep watching us and telling us what to do. I feel like no privacy.

I have warned them that I will report this to Fair Trading and Tribunal if they keep disturbing me. However, they just did again yesterday. They asked the agent to inspect our house.

I want to stop the contract and move out. This is too much for me. However, I still got 10 months of the contract. Is there anyway for me to move out quickly without paying anything?

Thank you for everyone's help.

Home & Garden

Comments

  • Mr BoMBAStiG on 25/01/2016 - 08:04
    +7

    Document everything. Times, dates, names, photos etc. Make all correspondence through email or letters, don't talk on the phone or in person.
    You'll figure out what you do to solve it, it's just much easier when you have evidence coming out of your ears.

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 09:50

      Thank you for your answer, cymon

  • try2bhelpful on 25/01/2016 - 08:06
    +3

    I would go to the agent and get them to talk to the Landlord. I would also tell the Landlord you are going to record every conversation you have with them from now on. They certainly can't tell you to clean the kitchen everyday, that is just nuts. The things the landlord is obsessed about are insane, as they are temporary issues that will not affect the house when you move out. I would certainly look at sites like the tenants union; this is the Victorian one.

    https://www.tuv.org.au/

    It is always important to do a thorough inspection when you first move in and include everything you can in the condition report. I can't see how you are responsible for repairing the toilet unless they think you damaged it; but it has been a long time since I rented and the tenants union will be able to help you.

    I would get this nipped in the bud before it spirals out of control. Moving house again will add to your costs so, if you like the place, I would learn your rights and ensure the agent and landlord understand them as well.

    Best of luck.

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 10:12

      Hi Try2bhelful, thank you for your help. I like the place but I didn't released the landlord living next door! I understand that moving house is cost me a lot of money but living in this house makes me feel stress. I am going to call Fair Trading today and asked for their help. Thank you very much again. You are very helpful.

      • try2bhelpful on 25/01/2016 - 12:37
        +1

        I hope you also go to the Tenancy Union; they should be able to help you. The landlord being next door does not, necessarily, mean you will have issues. I've lived in 1/2 houses twice where the owners lived in the other half. They were, generally, helpful and didn't interfere with our quiet enjoyment of the property. My suggestion is you should look around and see what is in your area before breaking the lease; you may not find anything more suitable. However, if you do find something, it sounds like the landlord is not going to have any problems letting you out of the lease; he will probably look for someone "more suitable". Best of Luck.

  • airzone on 25/01/2016 - 08:14
    +10

    You do have responsibility for keeping the grass neat, even if it is the council strip on the street.

    They can inspect twice a year if I recall correctly.

    Search up the rules on quiet enjoyment, the landlord is not to be unreasonable and should really leave you alone… and provided you can build enough evidence that they are not, it will probably be cause to terminate the lease.

    I respect to the toilet, I hope you have some evidence.. If not, you will probably pay for it.

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 09:30

      Hi Airzone, thank you very much for your help.

      1. I did keep the grass neat and tidy. However, they asked us to cut it every 3 weeks and I cut it yesterday. I have done halfway and my lawn mover has broken. I have to stop to go to buy another one. And straight away, I got a message in my inbox that night saying that I have to cut the grasses properly. It makes me like someone pushing me.

      2. Regarding the condition report, does it mean everything were in good condition by default? There are 4 bed rooms but in the condition report just mention 3 bed rooms. Does it mean the 4th bed rooms is in good condition? I didn't tick on my agreement about the toilet. If I am not agree and the landlord doesn't agree then what will happen?

      3. I will trying to find all the evidence to against them. Thank you for your help again.

      • QW3RTY on 25/01/2016 - 10:23
        +7

        A note on the toilet, the Agent didn't complete a condition report and didn't identify that the toilet was either undamaged or damaged prior to you moving in.

        Just stand your ground and say you didn't damage it — the Agent and Landlord don't have any evidence to the contrary.

        • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 10:52

          I will. Thank you very much for your help.

  • Gershom on 25/01/2016 - 08:24
    +8

    Why would you want to leave furniture and shoes in the front yard for God's sake? And what are you doing to the place that the owner has to tell you to do the cleaning and mowing? Get your sh1t together man!

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 09:40

      Hi Gershom, thank you for your help. We actually leave it in the porch, not front yard and it was during the moving house process. We need to leave some furnitures at the front and move them in slowly. We can't move everything in 1 week. It was Christmas time and we were busy with other stuff as well. With the shoes, I think it doesn't matter to leave it in the porch because I don't want people wear shoes into my house.

      I don't know how busy you are but could I ask you to cut your grasses every 2-3 weeks? That's what the landlord asked me to do. I think it is unreasonable. Everyone has different standard of cleaning and living and they have the right to live their own way. The landlord should live us alone and respect our privacy.

      • Deridas on 26/01/2016 - 09:22
        +2

        Tony,

        I think Gershom is being sarcastic. ;)

      • BartholemewH on 27/01/2016 - 08:13

        With regard to the grass 2 - 3 weeks is normal in Summer.

      • Tech5 on 27/01/2016 - 09:01

        Cutting grass every 2-3 weeks is normal though…

      • MementoMori on 27/01/2016 - 11:25

        Hi Tony. FWIW I agree it's not reasonable to store furniture out the front of your place for over a week.

        The average person moves the majority of everything in in a (very busy and stressful) weekend.

  • QW3RTY on 25/01/2016 - 09:07
    +6

    The agent gave me a blank condition report to fill in.

    Lazy agent. They'd be breaching their management agreement with the Lessor.

    During that 2 months, the landlord keeps annoying us. They told us when we need to cut the grasses.

    In your Lease, look at the definition of "Premises". If the grassy area is included in the definition of Premises, you will need to maintain it. This will be consistent with a standard clause of a Lease stating "The Lessee will maintain the Premises to a certain standard, blah blah." Check your Lease agreement to confirm the actual scale of care required.

    They told us can't leave furnitures and too many shoes infront of the house!

    Make note of it and move on. A reasonable request.

    They even told us need to clean the kitchen everyday!

    Do they tell you to clean it every day? As in, the Lessor/Agent calls in every day?! That's ridiculous. As a Lessee you are entitled to quiet enjoyment of the Premises, which means that you are entitled to occupy the Premises without constant interruption/intrusion by the agent or Lessor. Should be in every lease.

    I have warned them that I will report this to Fair Trading and Tribunal if they keep disturbing me.

    As above, write to the Agent that you're enforcing your right to Quiet Enjoyment. Quote the Lease section.

    I want to stop the contract and move out. This is too much for me.

    If the Agent/Lessor is breaching your right to quiet enjoyment, they are in breach of Lease. Make sure you include this in your letter to them. Notify them if they do not cease and desist immediately, you will engage solicitors to have the Lease terminated.

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 10:07

      Hi QW3RTY, thank you for your help. I know the agent is lazy. They has to prepare the condition report for us.

      • The agreement only say "The tenant agrees to keep the residential premises reasonably clean".
      • So we can't leave shoes in-frond of our porch? and furnitures during moving house process?

      Thank you for your help. Can Fair Trading help me in this case? I have spent a lot of money in moving house and I don't want to spend more money for solicitors.

      • QW3RTY on 25/01/2016 - 10:20
        +4

        No worries Tony, hopefully it can get sorted out.

        •The agreement only say "The tenant agrees to keep the residential premises reasonably clean".

        The Agent can't draft a Lease to save their lives. That clause should say "The Tenant agrees to keep the Premises reasonably clean." "Tenant" and "Premises" are capitalised because they would be defined in the Agreement.

        Are there any definitions in the agreement? because "the residential premises" is pretty unspecific.

        •So we can't leave shoes in-frond of our porch? and furnitures during moving house process?

        This is more an arse covering exercise to protect the Landlord against claim for any items that go missing from the property. Especially popular in apartment complexes where a Lessee may try and claim that the Premises are not appropriately secured (normally by the Strata's managing agent) and that the Lessee is entitled to claim for goods lost. Rubbish clause in my opinion, as everybody should be responsible for themselves.

        A reasonable Lessor/Managing Agent should be working with you during the move-in phase — but move-in should only be a week maximum. If it's an apartment complex — it's not acceptable to have items blocking/occupying space in the common area, except for maybe a door mat. The Strata would have conditions of what is acceptable/unacceptable. What type of property is it?

        Can Fair Trading help me in this case? I have spent a lot of money in moving house and I don't want to spend more money for solicitors.

        For the moment in time, ensure you've written to the agent expressing your dissatisfaction for the way the rental is being administrated. Make sure you let them know you're feeling harassed and that you don't have quiet enjoyment of your Premises. I would also contact a Tenancy Advocacy Unit (http://www.tenants.org.au/) and get them to provide advice.

        • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 11:04

          Thank you for your reply. I will look deeply in the definitions of the agreement but I believed that there are none definition for "reasonably clean".
          It's a duplex house. We leaved stuff in-frond of our porch. Not blocking anything of anyone else's house

        • QW3RTY on 25/01/2016 - 11:09
          +1

          @tonytrinh206:

          "Reasonably clean" would probably be determined back to "what a reasonable person would deem clean". There's a legal "definition" of what a reasonable person is — but I'd be more concerned with what your Premises is defined as.

          If it's a separated duplex house, it'd be unreasonable for you to have nothing on your front porch. But working to extremes, it would be considered unreasonable if you just had loads of stuff stacked up on your porch 3 months after moving in.

          If your Agent continues to hassle you about leaving shoes outside on your porch, ask them to site the clause of your Lease that prevents you from doing so. (profanity).

    • inherentchoice on 25/01/2016 - 10:55
      +3

      The agent gave me a blank condition report to fill in.

      Lazy agent. They'd be breaching their management agreement with the Lessor.

      Actually it looks like they're also breaching section 29 of the NSW Residential Tenancies Act 2010:

      (1) A condition report relating to the condition of residential premises on a day specified in the report must be completed by or on behalf of a landlord before or when the residential tenancy agreement is given to the tenant for signing.

      (2) Two copies of the condition report must be given by the landlord or landlord’s agent to the tenant before or when the tenant signs the residential tenancy agreement.

      http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/rta2010207…

  • inherentchoice on 25/01/2016 - 09:45
    +2

    During that 2 months, the landlord keeps annoying us…

    They keep watching us and telling us what to do. I feel like no privacy…

    They asked the agent to inspect our house.

    The agent or landlord is NOT allowed to come in to the property unless they give proper notice. Click here to read the relevant law. The landlord/agent can only inspect the premises 4 times per 12 months and they must give you at least 7 days written notice each time.

    They already take my bond money.

    Did you get a receipt from the State Government rental bonds board? If the bond has not been lodged with the government then they are breaking the law.

    • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 09:57

      Hi there, thank you very much for your help.

      The oven wasn't work properly and I have reported to the agent. The agent was trying to make an appointment with me through email. However, the landlord just walked to premier and knocked the door and asked my friend to get access. My friend, he didn't know anything and let the landlord to get in. However, I am the person who signed the contract, not my friend. Will this consider as breaking the contract?

      • inherentchoice on 25/01/2016 - 10:10
        +1

        The landlord/agent can enter at any time with the tenant's consent. If they need to assess non-urgent repairs they can enter without your consent if they give you at least two days notice. If they need to assess "urgent repairs" they can enter at any time without your consent. But there is a strict definition of "urgent repairs". Was there a dangerous electrical fault with the oven or was it unsafe?

        Is your friend also living at the property and considered a tenant too?

        To be honest I think you should try to improve your relationship with the landlord and see how things go. I believe it's not worth trying to get out of the contract at this time, at least give things a chance to settle down a bit. Who knows, if you move to another place it could be worse. Anyways I am not a lawyer…

        • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 10:19

          It's not an urgent repairs. Yes, my friend is living here. I have put his name in the application form but not under contract agreement.

        • inherentchoice on 25/01/2016 - 10:37
          +2

          @tonytrinh206: Okay they may argue that it was urgent or that your friend gave consent.

          Anyway, as others have said, document everything.

          For the time being I definitely agree with QW3RTY's advice that you should write to them and make sure you let them know you're feeling harassed and that you don't have quiet enjoyment.

          Then depending on their response and how things turn out, if you decide that you really do want to get out of the contract then you may be able to issue a termination notice under section 98 on one or more of the following grounds:

          • that you don't have quiet enjoyment
          • that they did not give you two days notice to assess repairs for the oven
          • that they did not give you two copies of the completed condition report under section 29 of the NSW RTA 2010 (see my comment above).

          Alternatively perhaps you can just ask the landlord if you can end the contract early since things don't seem to be working out.

          I'm assuming you're in NSW? And did they lodge the bond with the NSW government?

        • tony2023 on 25/01/2016 - 11:14

          @inherentchoice:
          I will document everything and send it to the agent. I have discussed this to the agent but they said I have to pay for the 12 months before I move out. This is incorrect, I think. I only need to pay for 6 weeks compensation if I break the contract.
          Yes, they have logged the bond to NSW Fair Trading.

          I like get stuck of everything. Just paid $300 for Internet connection and $400 for electric, gas relocated. It costs me a lot of money for renting a wrong property.

        • inherentchoice on 25/01/2016 - 11:19
          +1

          @tonytrinh206: Yeah that's why I think it's best if you can improve your relationship with the landlord/agent.

          But if you do issue a breach of agreement termination notice then you only need to give them 14 days and you shouldn't need to pay any more rent after that. Unless they dispute the notice by applying to the tribunal to get it revoked. But anyway like I said I am not a lawyer.

  • blitz on 25/01/2016 - 11:15
    +2

    They even told us need to clean the kitchen everyday!

    I clean my kitchen every day, just saying. Not necessarily the floors, but all surfaces, food prep areas and cooking areas. Else it would get festy.

    • airzone on 25/01/2016 - 14:23
      +1

      Heh, I have a relo who never cleans their kitchen.. You could get food poisoning just by looking at it.

      Cleaning after you use it isn't onerous, cleaning it once every 6 months is a mammoth chore.

    • James Nav on 26/01/2016 - 11:58
      +3

      @blitz, Mate, you can clean your own bloody kitchen once a hour or once every 10 minutes if you want, the point is the landlord has no business telling the tenant when and what to do. Got it?
      The landlord should not even talk to the tenant directly, all correspondence should be via the agent.

      • Davros on 27/01/2016 - 08:25

        Show me the legislation that says a LL must have an agent?

      • blitz on 29/01/2016 - 11:07

        Mate, you can clean your own bloody kitchen once a hour or once every 10 minutes if you want, the point is the landlord has no business telling the tenant when and what to do. Got it?

        Watch your tone, James. You're new here, so work out how to be polite to others. "Got it?"

  • Donaldhump on 25/01/2016 - 11:19

    mental landlord, id break that lease

  • Cheeper on 25/01/2016 - 11:39

    Don't rush to get out of your lease so you can find somewhere else… The same conditions will apply.
    Anywhere you rent you will find that YOU are required to keep any yard area maintained, clean and tidy.
    If your mower breaks down then call a mowing service to do it.

    The same applies to kitchen area, keep it clean. The reason behind that is to reduce the infestation of vermin as well as reducing odours and stains.

    When moving into any property always take photos of everything you can… the same when moving out.

    If you don't like having to maintain a lawn or garden then best to rent an apartment next time.

    Rent paid to a LL is for the use of the property… it is NOT so they can clean up after you.

  • ykwon10 on 25/01/2016 - 12:55
    +1

    Op, refer to this link for information regarding breaking your lease early.

    I do agree with most comments above. Lawn during summer period do require mowing every 2-3 weeks. Items left out in front porch over a week is not reasonable in my opinion. Especially if something happens in the house and require emergency evacuation, these items will be an obstruction and potential hazard. Agents can inspect the property up to 4 times a year as mentioned above.

    Having said above, you are also entitled to quiet enjoyment of the house. Talk to your agent & landlord, remedy things before it gets worse. You have more to lose than them as they can potentially black list you and prevent you from future leasing. Good luck OP!

  • fantafox on 26/01/2016 - 01:07

    They are intruding in your life and observing you far beyond a reasonable amount that would be expected. Get a letter drafted from a solicitor claiming ongoung harrasment and send it to them. 2 weeks later write another letter informing them of your intentions to cancel the lease and move out. They will probably jump at it to see you gone.

  • Candour on 26/01/2016 - 14:15

    join tenants union always.
    2 ring fair trading and get their advice;
    landlord is exceeding his legal rights
    3 speak to agent and ask him to educate landlord or you will be forced to take it to tribunal.
    agents don't like wasting time there so they will work for you to educate the landlord.
    4 read the tenancy agreement and check notice period =6 weeks? if you break the lease?
    5 get orders from the landlord if he won't stop being a nuisance.
    fill out the report.
    this agent's breach will be held against them at tribunal.
    6 join tenancy union and get their advice.
    7 move out

  • Candour on 26/01/2016 - 14:16

    join tenants union always.
    2 ring fair trading and get their advice;
    landlord is exceeding his legal rights
    3 speak to agent and ask him to educate landlord or you will be forced to take it to tribunal.
    agents don't like wasting time there so they will work for you to educate the landlord.
    4 read the tenancy agreement and check notice period =6 weeks? if you break the lease?
    5 get orders from the landlord if he won't stop being a nuisance.
    fill out the report.
    this agent's breach will be held against them at tribunal.
    6 join tenancy union and get their advice.
    7 move out when you can break th lease without penalty.

  • [Deactivated] on 27/01/2016 - 08:12

    I had a similar kind of landlord, had to go to tribunal, in the end I got everything I wanted except I had to pay some towards gardening because the Agent made a ridiculous rule "No weedkiller products allowed" after we already signed, and the garden was just unmanageable without it. I put it in an email at the time to complain about this rule but at the tribunal they claimed that "They never read my email" so in-fact putting it in writing by email is not really sufficient evidence of anything, you HAVE to use registered mail and use the correct form "From Tenant to Landlord" from consumer affairs so that they legally have to respond to it. Just my experience.

    • Candour on 27/01/2016 - 09:50

      this is why you cannot rely on the legalistic fair trading dept in NSW; they will threaten you with cancellation of your appeal if you don't respond in 3 days even if they take their own time responding to your complaint; they will suggest mediation, warnings etc which sap your energy; not sure if other states are better; that is why you should join the tenants union always so you can have them on your side; the agent wil only do the least possible to cover himself legally against liability even when he has omitted to give you the report. ultimately it saps your life and energy; that is why I suggested you move as soon as you can. and post it on their facebook site after that; they understand bad publicity but until you get your rights be very formal and polite. never antagonize agent or landlord. as you then lose your high moral ground.

Login or Join to leave a comment
Login Join