OzBargainers, Which Degrees Can You Recommend and Which Can You Advise against for Studying in 2016?

LAFC 23 on 06/10/2015 - 09:42
Last edited 06/10/2015 - 15:24

As the title suggests. What expertise/advice can you share with those looking to commence study.

I already have a path that I am keen on taking. But numerous friends and soon to be school leavers could do with some direction/ general advice - we could have asked for this on other forums, but really value the voice of the OzBargainer.

We've all heard "follow your passion" and "do what makes you happy" before, and while this might be sound advice for some, lets put this aside when considering:

What do you see a future for?

Do you have any experiences with a course that you regret? E.g. Changed courses half way through or required to go back to study after graduating.

And for those with no intention on studying at all, what advice can you give?

Cheers.

Edit: I finished my VCE studies in 2014, and have since spent this year working in a variety of fields. Many people around me jumped straight into a generic uni degree. I know that VTAC preferences are due in soon, hence many people could do with some guidance.

Education & Work

Comments

        • Tarnos on 10/10/2015 - 11:56

          @mandok: I think reaching for the best is admirable. However, this is a question about what to study. To clarify Elon Musk and Larry Page did not study Engineering. They studied Computer Science. Satya Nadella studied engineering but on Wikipidea you can see that he only chose Engineering because his uni did not offer Computer Science. Based on your choice of people your answer of study is Computer Science. There is already many contradicting replies here on Computer Science field.

          The other thing these people have in common is that they are at business owner/director level. I would argue that Richard Branson and Steve Jobs did not need much of a degree to get where they are in a similar status. Perhaps starting a business as soon as possible is the more likely way to riches. I hardly hear about engineers earning "millions" but I do hear about medical specialists, music artists, movie stars and business magnates being super rich.

  • rgr on 08/10/2015 - 23:35
    +1

    A lot of people have mentioned IT/Software/Computer Science - I agree. We're entering the 'digital industrial revolution' era where everything is gonna be driven by software and technology. If you want something that has an insanely high potential ceiling for making money then this is it. But it's hard to stick with if you are only after it for the money, you need to be interested in looking forward to learning about new technology.

    • SupeNintendoChalmers on 09/10/2015 - 17:00

      Considering the the speed of which ICT jobs are moving offshore I seriously would not recommend IT for anyone starting up, unless you're a programming freak of nature.

      Accounting\Auditing is another field I'd avoid. Some of the biggest professional services firms are farming heaps of auditing work to low cost markets like China, Indian and Philippines

  • RinaW on 09/10/2015 - 13:10

    Hi AFC23,

    Great that you've put this question out there, and the feedback has been quite constructive. Glad to know you've already decided on your path.

    What led me to my decision to study a Master of Exercise Physiology was:

    1. A personal interest - I wanted a healthy lifestyle, and to understand how exercise affects the body in the healthy condition as well as during chronic illness and acute injury. This personal interest has truly kept me motivated through exams and assignments. I know that even if I didn't get a job, I have a strong understanding of health that I can apply in my own life, so the education would not have gone to waste. My degree has changed my life at a personal level, not just my career.

    2. Values, view of role in society - Money, status or flexibility may be priorities for your career. These may conflict so write them down and find out what truly drives you. I thought money was important, but I was unhappy in my previous career as I worked too many hours, even though I had a great salary. I now know that helping others makes me leap out of bed in the morning. I love getting hugs from clients who now can walk to the bus stop after their hip replacement, or can dress themselves without pain. However, flexibility is also important to me, so I didn't want to go down the path of medicine and end up working so many hours again.

    3. Opportunity - Think of society's emerging issues. I remember noticing how people around me were getting back pain, being diagnosed with diabetes, cancer etc and hearing about this more and more in the news. However, there were lots of personal trainers and physiotherapists out there, so it seemed quite competitive. I volunteered at a few clinics I thought I'd like to work at, and the advice from physios, hospital registrars and people in the field led me to discover exercise physiology. It is a growing profession and I wouldn't have found out about it if I didn't seek advice. There are many fields outside of healthcare like this. I also like that this role does not tie me to the CBD, there is demand in the suburbs as well as regional/rural areas.

    4. Growth/career path - Reach out and spend time with people who are in the role you want, and ask them about their experience, their career journey and their future plans. Nobody has ever turned me down when I have asked them for advice or to be my mentor. Public service pay rates/awards are publicly available online, so get an idea of how your salary can grow at each level. Exercise physiology is a specific professional/technical degree, however I found out that are opportunities to move into management in public/private practice, research, academia, corporate health or diversification with another expertise e.g. dietetics. You will want to grow and evolve in your career, so think of how your degree can facilitate this too.

    5. Graduate programs, careers expos, university help - I went to a career expo which got me thinking about health. These expos take place each year in major cities. The university careers office websites are also really helpful, whether you study there or not. Find out about when graduate program intakes take place each year, many graduate programs will consider generic degrees.

    All the best during this exciting time,
    Rina

  • boomramada on 09/10/2015 - 14:20

    Degree = HESC + Time = $$$ + $$$$
    just like any other investment, go for a degree that best suite you for best outcome based on current market. its not about others.
    Pick something you enjoy doing for rest of your life.
    I know lots of people here recommend you to get a IT degree, there are so many IT degrees out there and only do that you are passionate to become a developer not just a computer fixer :)

  • systema on 09/10/2015 - 14:21
    +1

    I would strongly recommend against anyone who is thinking about starting with Physiotherapy, Occupational Therapy or Speech Pathology. There had been a huge increase in universities providing these courses (from one uni per state previously to 6 in some states) along with increase number of intakes (from 20-30 per cohort to over 100) and introduction of graduate entry master. These placed substantial strain to the clinical placement system with not enough workplaces to take on students - imagine what it will be like when you are out looking for a job. It will only get worse with NDIS and age care reform which push some of the sectors into forced privatization, i.e. less funding for new positions. If you are considering any of the above, I would strongly suggest you to steer clear of these courses.

    Declaration of interests: I work in the allied health field and lecture at uni on some of the subjects.

    • AFC 23 on 09/10/2015 - 23:22

      For the people considering the courses you've mentioned above, Do you have a recommendation for alternatives to these courses (providing they want to stay in a health related field)? Cheers.

    • battosai on 15/10/2015 - 10:08

      I would also like to know any alternatives to these courses that want to stay in a health related field.

      • AFC 23 on 19/10/2015 - 17:15

        c'mon systema, give us something! haha

  • SupeNintendoChalmers on 09/10/2015 - 16:57

    Coroner\Moritician

  • CheapCoffee on 09/10/2015 - 17:11
    +1

    NOT Veterinary Medicine.

    Over supply of graduates and low pay throughout the career. Expected to study like a human doctor throughout the course and just as hard to get into vet school. Many young graduates with some experience working as a clinician are looking for alternative career pathways due to terrible work-life balance. Also, veterinarians have the highest suicide rates among all professions.

    In regards to pay; just to throw out some numbers: Experienced vets with 15+ years experience often struggle to earn over 80,000. New graduates are expected to earn around 40,000 or below (award rates). Clinic owners can vary a lot, but I heard some just do locum for other clinics because you can earn more through that rather than putting your time into your own clinic. Despite this, the general public's perception is that veterinarians earn a lot of money, and overcharge a lot.

    • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2015 - 09:36

      I find this hard to believe considering what Vets charge.

      • CheapCoffee on 10/10/2015 - 13:10

        http://www.payscale.com/research/AU/Job=Veterinarian/Salary

        Numbers may be slightly right skewed due to number of specialists (which requires 3-5 years of extra training)

        http://www.theage.com.au/it-pro/pampered-pets-putting-a-pric…

        "The truth is, vets don't earn that much compared to the wages of other professionals. For example a graduate veterinarian can expect to earn about $19.38 an hour ($38,690 a year). That climbs to $24.70 an hour ($48,807) for experienced vets.

        But a first-year registered nurse can expect to earn $24.93 ($49,439 annually), a nurse with eight years or more experience can earn $35.02 an hour ($69,429 a year) and this climbs to $140,032 for a grade nine nurse. A graduate doctor earns about $50,000 a year (not award wages). Vets also get less than teachers ($50,522 first-year), firefighters ($28.83 an hour) and dentists (first-year, not award, $75,000) to name a few. (All are NSW award wages unless stated otherwise)."

        • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2015 - 13:29

          Payscale.com is a load of bullshit, it says plastic surgeons earn $250k a year.

        • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2015 - 14:44

          @CheapCoffee:

          The only real source is to actually know people in industry, internet pay scales are bullshit.

        • CheapCoffee on 10/10/2015 - 23:07

          @thorton82:

          Not sure if you read the links, but AVA report is the professional body so that is the most accurate official information you will be able to get within Australia. ABS data comes from a federal government funded survey, so it should be a solid source of information as well.

          Personally, I can tell you from anecdotal evidence from that it tends to be slightly worse than what the industry wants the public to know as many veterinarians are not a part of AVA.

          Also, plastic and reconstructive surgeons do earn around $200k+ according to ABS. http://joboutlook.gov.au/occupation.aspx?search=keyword&tab=…

        • [Deactivated] on 11/10/2015 - 00:56

          @CheapCoffee: Mate there wouldn't be a plastic surgeon in the country in private practice who makes under a million a year. As i said, those figures are complete bullshit.

        • CheapCoffee on 11/10/2015 - 01:03

          @thorton82: Haha :) You are probably right about plastic surgeons, but I don't really know any of them to comment on their occupation.

          However, what I do know is how veterinarians work in real life, and the numbers really aren't far off. As someone who is close to the industry, I wish the numbers were wrong like you have suggested though.

  • shaiguy on 09/10/2015 - 17:30

    Do Arts (languages) (plus some other degree) and go on exchange overseas. You will not regret it. Otherwise become a pilot and get a scholarship/cadetship with an airline. You get paid to travel, ok pay and your stress levels are less once you have completed a flight.

  • WillKillfor5Cents on 09/10/2015 - 20:16
    +3

    Only do a degree if you really have a burning passion about something, otherwise it is a waste of time and money.

    In hindsight, I didn't really know with what I wanted to do in life and did a double degree in IT/Commerce because I liked computers and wanted a second degree as a backup plan.

    Wrong idea mate. I should've worked in the mine, do the hard yard and by now (although the mining industry is in a deep hole now) I would have a house paid off with some savings to potentially start my own business. They were earning insane amount of money.

    Instead, I am still living with my parents now, wasted 5 years to study and now in an okayish job and about to get a mortgage in the next few years.

    Anyway, if you have a burning passion in something, it does not matter what degree (cliche?). But seriously, most people who seems to know what they wanted, they had planned to get that job from the first year. However, people like me, we only panicked on our penultimate year, which is a little too late mind you! You need to get that intership, paid or unpaid, just get your foot wet from the get go! It is a competitive market now, you have to offer something which others are not capable of offering.

    Good luck! Good on you for thinking this early in life!

  • lenlynn on 09/10/2015 - 20:43

    How about engineering in mechatronics? I met someone today whose grandson is a recent graduate and he's earning 100k+ first year out. But his granddad said he's a genius, working for Telstra and flies to HK and other countries frequently for work and was the only first class honours in his graduating year. Assuming granddad doesn't have dementia or is shitting me.

  • Make it so on 09/10/2015 - 20:50
    +9

    Don't pick a degree. Pick a profession and work your way backwards to see which qualifications you need. Too many people pick a degree because the degree sounds interesting only to realise later that there are no jobs that connect with it, or that they don't like the jobs that do. Choose a job you like, because you'll be doing it your whole life, whereas your degree is just a few years.

    • AFC 23 on 09/10/2015 - 23:27
      +1

      100% agreed.

    • booboo on 10/10/2015 - 12:44
      +1

      Couldn't agree more. People go with their 'passion' having no idea what job is at the end, if any.

  • Bludgeman on 10/10/2015 - 07:40
    +1

    To be successful, you need to be able to communicate. If you're socially awkward and cant hold your own, doing every degree won't help you. High level execs I work with have generic degrees but extremely good communicators. On the flipside, I have friends who are much more qualified than most people and working entry level jobs(accounts payable, sales support etc).

    • kiitos on 10/10/2015 - 08:52
      +2

      This is my weakness - not very social, get nervous about speaking up in groups.

      How can one learn to communicate better?

      • MonocleMoose on 11/10/2015 - 18:08
        +2

        Join your local Toastmasters club

      • Bludgeman on 11/10/2015 - 20:44

        I was the same. Best advice i can give is to put yourself in tough situations. If you get a chance to speak up in front of groups, do it. Dont hide away from opportunities. Practice makes perfect, but its natural to be nervous.

  • Kevin07 on 10/10/2015 - 09:22

    a bachelor of arts = rewarding the mediocrity

    • [Deactivated] on 10/10/2015 - 09:34
      +1

      Ironically I think most people doing a Bachelor of Arts could probably construct a sentence that makes sense.

  • geosta on 10/10/2015 - 10:49

    I have a few contradictory thoughts on this so I'll just throw them up in bullet points:

    • Going to university to figure out what you want to do with your life is a really expensive way of doing it.
    • Going to university just to be there is a great idea for any young person. There is a great diversity of life on a uni campus that doesn't exist elsewhere and immersing yourself in that will help you find yourself.
    • Studying a degree in something that you're not already interested in is a really expensive way to make figure out that you really are not interested in it.
    • Turning something that you enjoy doing (a hobby/interest) into your vocation is a very quick way to make you hate what you used to enjoy.
    • Taking a year (or two) between high school and university is a great way to focus in your mind why you are at university (if you indeed go there).
    • The university lifestyle is definitely a young person's scene. You want to enjoy it while you are young.
    • If you have a genuine talent for something, you probably don't need any qualifications to do it and be paid for it.
    • Speaking strictly about IT, you normally don't need qualifications. Until you turn 40, and are competing against people who cost half what you do and who have those qualifications.

    Hope some of that helps.

  • GalaxyNexus on 10/10/2015 - 14:24

    Wow, a lot of controversy about IT here… :D

    Let's start with this: IT is a very wide area, ranges from hard core programming (mostly engineering/science) to project management to business analysis (less engineering/science), etc.

    From experience, especially the technical side (software engineer with many years experience here), you'll need a combination of computer science knowledge and engineering knowledge to do your job well. People often misunderstood computer science (vs engineering) by comparing it to other science (e.g. math or physics), however the key differentiation here is that in computing, if you've got the basics (the science), it's easily applied (the engineering part is easily learned and in fact have to be relearned constantly otherwise you're left behind).

    As far as I can tell, the demand has always been great (in the past many years) for very good technical IT people (if you're a strong programmer, it's never been hard finding a job). On the other hand the lower end of technical IT jobs have largely been outsourced to the lowest bidder. Don't go into this field if you're not passionate about it, since then the chance of you becoming good at it would not be great.

    On the other side of the spectrum (less technical), anecdotal evidence (friends' experiences) shows it's harder to find jobs, especially if you've got not much experience (as uni graduates are).

    It's my believe that if you're really good and passionate at something, then that would be the right degree for you and finding a job won't be hard. If you're just "swimming with the flow" taking whichever degree is in season, you most probably will have a hard time. I have a lot of classmates taking IT just because it was the trendy thing to do ten years ago, and I can say that most of them didn't do very well at the end (most of them now doing other things, but rarely IT).

  • azorax on 10/10/2015 - 15:05

    Not Law (random stat was that only 15% of law grads get in the big law firms) -> Lawyers are not big atm, influx of them due to it being a popular degree in the 2000s or so. It is now just a 'higher tiered' art degree

    Healthcare
    IT
    Accounting seems like a good enough bet
    Engineering (don't go for the 'mechanical engineering' since that has been in demand for several years and and the vacant spots will be filled way before you graduate)

    • grumpyboots on 10/10/2015 - 16:50

      I've heard people say Law is the new Arts degree, and in a way it's true - it is a generalist degree that prepares you for a range of job opportunities. You have to do a secondary undergraduate degree at the same time to round out your world experience and hopefully this balances and increases your options.

      A law degree teaches you how to think logically and creatively, how to communicate, how to construct a convincing and coherent argument - generic skills valuable to a lot of business roles.

      That said, a law degree is not for everyone. You need high marks to get in - so most of your peers will be driven, A-type individuals and used to being the best. Competition is fierce, especially at the sandstone unis where an emphasis on black letter law won't appeal to everyone. The more career skill focussed unis won't have the same prestigious reputations when it comes to securing your first job. Connections mean a lot and can have a huge effect on your future career prospects.

      There's a lot of reading involved - I think the recommendation is five hours of reading for every hour of face to face class time in law. You need to take the initiative to enter moots and negotiation or witness interviewing competitions to build your skills and connect with the big law firms that sponsor those competitions. Many law grads who want to practice as lawyers find themselves volunteering for experience and the first two years are very tough - but once you have a few years of PAE, unless you develop a bad reputation, you'll be golden.

      I loved studying law and I love being a lawyer, I've always known this was my ideal career. But if you don't love it, or you're only completing a law degree for the money you hope to earn, it really is not going to be worth it. There's an extraordinarily high level of depression in this industry and the money isn't always so good (especially for a lot of the new graduates, post GFC). Where the money is good, the job is usually consuming - not a problem if you enjoy the work, but there's generally not a lot of self care modelled in law, although this is slowly changing.

  • centrelink on 11/10/2015 - 00:09

    Just do medicine.. Can't go wrong with that.

    • CheapCoffee on 11/10/2015 - 01:04

      If you can get in.

      • centrelink on 11/10/2015 - 11:16

        Doesn't that apply for all courses as well?

        • Ughhh on 11/10/2015 - 12:44

          To get into medicine, you need at least a 99.0/100 to get into it…compared to 55 in some other degrees.

        • centrelink on 11/10/2015 - 19:31
          -1

          @Ughhh: oh i see, so why not just get 99.0/100? I think that would solve the problem

        • Ughhh on 11/10/2015 - 20:16
          +1

          @spn:

          Did you get at least 99.0/100 at school? In previous years, the min score to get into Medicine was actually 99.7, 99.0 just wasn't good enough. I appreciate your simplistic thinking though.

        • Cynicaloflife on 17/10/2015 - 10:19

          @Ughhh:

          I disagree, it all falls down to UMAT. I have seen people getting an average UMAT score (83) and getting into med with 98.5.

          On the other hand, if you don't have UMAT, only a 99.7 or more can save you. I got a 99+ ATAR but poor UMAT and did not get into any med schools.

        • Ughhh on 17/10/2015 - 11:10

          @mandok:

          average UMAT score (83) and getting into med with 98.5.

          The score can fluctuate as it depends on supply and demand of the course. If no one wanted to do medicine, the score could drop to the 70s. Of course you would still need to do well in the UMAT and the interview. One thing I'm confused about with your comment is that you said it falls down to Umat, but you only need to do "average"?

        • Garden gnome on 28/10/2015 - 21:27

          @Ughhh:
          I think also it would be good to mention that post graduate medicine is a good option for people. Doing a degree before attempting to get into medicine can enrich your knowledge and help you later on in your career in medicine. A lot of specialities look favourably upon post grad med students who have done research preceeding the application to become a specialist, and if you do a biomed or science course, even arts with prerequisites met it can help a lot down the track. Who knows, that other degree may end up being your passion?

          In saying that though, it can cost you a lot of time and money if you don't get good enough grades or do well in the GAMSAT, as a person doing a science degree or an arts degree needs to have a clear goal and all options considered, which may or may not include immediate employment. Prospects aren't looking good for scientists or arts graduates as a whole at the moment. The majority of people studying Biomed and science at Monash and I would imagine all other universities want to do medicine, and the sheer number of people wanting to get into med (and dentistry) is enormous when you look at all of the people who sit for the GAMSAT every year. And the career trajectory remains this competitive if you want a speciality in demand, as the government allows many more med students to study than provide places available for specialty training. You may end up being a general doctor in a hospital for a few extra years if you want to take time to study and get good referrals from senior doctors in the hospital.

  • PetPenguin on 11/10/2015 - 11:48

    Surveying and Spatial Sciences, good fun, it combines outdoor and indoor work, there is a lot of employment opportunities and it's well paid.
    You have to be reasonably good in maths and with computers.
    If the surveying part is not your favorite you can easily find a job with the spatial science part and work for a company that uses ArcMap and/or remote sensing software such as ENVI.

  • Mysterious on 12/10/2015 - 02:22
    +1

    Congrats on taking a gap year btw. I wish I had taken a gap year from the start too. It should really give you some extra time to decide what you really want to do.

    If you like computers and maths, definitely go for an IT/comp sci degree like a lot of other people here have suggested. You'll be exposed to a whole new world of programming, web design, systems management, etc. and obviously you can't specialise in everything, but you'll surely find something.

    Good luck.

  • Oliver on 12/10/2015 - 08:06
    +2

    Avoid pharmacy. Wages are going down. There is currently an oversupply perpetuated by the pharmacy guild, which is a union of owner/employers flooding the market with too many graduates so they can force wages down further.

  • JohnHowardsEyebrows on 12/10/2015 - 09:27

    Engineering will always have currency. Medicine is by far the best, but hardest to get into, and longest degrees. Public relations is also one career path that keeps getting bigger, in spite of its (lack of) utility.

  • syousef on 12/10/2015 - 11:05
    -3

    Do you want a crystal ball too?

    Honestly what you need to ask yourself is:
    1) What do I want to do for a crust?
    2) What qualifications are required?
    3) Would I be happy with the pay and conditions in this occupation?
    4) Is there likely to be enough demand for the job to allow me to compete? If not, pick a different job and goto step 2.

    You're mostly asking about 3 and 4. Research on the web on some job sites will get you better statistical information than asking random strangers on the net. They say you have to be prepared to pursue multiple careers in your life, so a more general degree may put you in better stead than something that specializes, but you still have to consider supply and demand.

    For example did you know that in NSW there are 40,000 excess primary school teachers (looking for work but not employed) and that teachers are now forced to do study, provide evidence of teaching and re-certify every 5 years?

    I dread advising my own children when they reach the end of highschool.

    • AFC 23 on 12/10/2015 - 11:58

      I asked the question here to get info that is unique to most other sources. If you seriously think that none of us have searched for statistical info on the web and would use a thread like this as a sole source of knowledge then that is laughable in itself.

      • syousef on 12/10/2015 - 19:31
        -1

        You will just get random ramblings here. Very few people who are going to respond have current information about what is a good way to go. I'm 17+ years out of my first degree and did my second one for fun. Do you think my life experience would be relevant to your situation?

        • AFC 23 on 12/10/2015 - 21:35

          Look, I think you've taken this thread in the wrong way. I appreciate your input.

        • syousef on 13/10/2015 - 04:20

          @AFC 23:

          Ok fair enough. We'll agree to disagree, and I wish you luck deciding what to do.

  • InfraRed on 12/10/2015 - 16:37

    Don't do engineering

    • caradpam on 12/10/2015 - 17:47

      Why?

      • InfraRed on 13/10/2015 - 10:47
        +1

        Anecdotal experiences for graduates who have dome mechanical, civil and chemical engineering. Either they took a job barley related to their field, are still unemployed or only found a job in their field after 2-3 years after graduation. There's an oversupply and the manufacturing and mining industries are slowing.

        Electrical engineering seems the most potentially lucrative after graduation I reckon. And personally I feel a location bias, I once got a call to come to some casual meet up assessment thing for a mining company in Canberra until they noticed I don't live in Canberra then rejected me.

        Note: These aren't bottom rung students there either HD [high distinction] or almost HD students who do things like volunteer and worked all through uni.

        • zxreth on 13/10/2015 - 22:46

          HD average and are still unemployed/took 2-3 years to find a job? I call BS.

        • InfraRed on 15/10/2015 - 08:56

          @zxreth:Like I said this is my experience based on what I have observed with the people I know.
          Obviously I know of the elite that got jobs with Telstra or Shell out of uni but they're all 90+ students and some invent things and there's a world of difference between that and an almost or barely HD student.
          So it doesn't seem like useful advice to say "if you're ridiculously smart or work really hard do engineering" because if you're ridiculously smart or have a strong work ethic I reckon there are better ways to use it then to gamble on an eng degree.

    • Cyb3rGlitch on 12/10/2015 - 22:12

      Computer Engineering is fine if you're willing to put the extra work in for a Comp Sci job.

      • InfraRed on 13/10/2015 - 10:37

        Sorry I was talking more about non IT engineering. I have no opinion on computer engineering.

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