CashRewards and Dan Murphy's - Moral Dilemna

[Deactivated] on 20/10/2014 - 21:46

ok, so i just noticed you can get up to 10% cash back at dan murphy's via cashrewards.

i work in hospo and the owner generally gets spirits and stuff from dan murphys and we have just started a process whereby i add all the things i need to the online shopping basket and place an order for click and collect.

this happens once every fortnight or so and often equates to $2-3000 worth of alcohol.

is it fair gain for me to do this ordering via cash rewards and get the ~10% cash back to my personal account? $300 free money isn't to be sniffed at. Or do i tell the owner, and she might want to do it herself and keep the money, or we could work out a compromise?

Poll Options

  • 20
    Fair gain
  • 2
    Split
  • 11
    Owners money
General Discussion

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Dan Murphy's
Dan Murphy's

Comments

  • Cheeper on 20/10/2014 - 21:53
    +1

    May be considered fraud?
    Your employer is paying for the goods and therefore the one entitled to the discount, not you.
    Tell your employer that this saving exists for them.

  • codhopper on 20/10/2014 - 21:54

    Imagine it this way:
    You work out a way to save 1 cent per transaction (or a fraction of a cent). Lots of transactions happen. You shuffle that money off into a personal account. No-one will miss that small amount anyway.

    Tell the owner it is possible to save money on the transaction (don't steal that potential saving) and maybe they will throw you a bone and split the savings.

  • horseshoe on 20/10/2014 - 22:11
    +3

    It is possible fraud. Put it this way, employers always want to know what your skills and experience are, but your most important asset is your integrity. Tell your employer about the savings she can make. I doubt you will get a financial benefit out of it, but she will remember that you were honest and trying to help her business. That will help with possible promotion later on, flexibility with the job, or just a good referral when you move on.

    Here's a news story related to your dilemma if you're still on the fence:
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-09-29/chef-who-swindled-schn…

    • T_double_U on 26/10/2014 - 02:08

      Agreed, OP needs to be thinking big picture..

  • eatwell365 on 20/10/2014 - 22:22
    +2

    Always do the right thing.

    Put it aside.
    How many CEOs/politicians/public servants/executives fly for business and return the frequent flyer points collected to shareholders/taxpayers?

    • arcticmonkey on 25/10/2014 - 23:06

      Not many? These guys are knowing for avoiding tax.

  • GnarlyKnuckles on 20/10/2014 - 23:26
    +1

    It's in no way a grey area or even a moral dilemma; you're aware of a way that your boss/employer can in effect save 10% on the alcohol purchases, in the long-run. Quite simply, your job is to tell them about it; not pocket that 10% for yourself, and keep it a secret from them. Pocketing it as a 'secret kick-back' would also set up a conflict of interest, whereby you would be reluctant to switch to a different supplier, even if there was a way better deal out there via which you got no personal kick-back.

    Imagine these scenarios…

    You pocket the 10% for 6 months, then your employer calls you into the office one day and tells you to set up "cash-rewards" for the company alcohol purchases from DM, and accuses you of not being on top of the game, because as the alcohol purchaser, you should have been aware of it. OR, on learning of the 10% available from DM she calls them herself, and demands to know why they didn't offer it to the company, given you're such good customers (and they of course tell her you have been redeeming it). OR, she approaches you and tells you to switch to a different mob, because she can save 5% by utilising some deal they offer… (etc.).

    I hate to be a total 'negative Nancy' though… so I advise this:

    Ask for a meeting with the boss, to discuss a pay-rise. Ask for a pay-rise that would equate to roughly half the benefits the company would be reaping if they knew about the cash-back.
    They will quite likely mournfully state that 'Unfortunately, the company is just not in a financial position to increase your pay by that much…' (or something like that).
    At THAT POINT is when you reveal the whole cash-back thing. So they will be getting the same benefit you have just asked for, and what you have asked for will also be 'covered' by the information/strategy you have just clued them up to… it would be pretty hard for them to actually deny you the pay-rise then, IMHO.

    Of course if you don't value the job at all, or like them/whatever, then you could see how long you can get away with pocketing the 10% for… but I wouldn't even advise it under those circumstances, due to the fact that 'word gets around' (your next employer may end up contacting them at some point, or hear about it on the grape-vine), and there's even an outside chance that they could mount legal action against you to recoup all the money you received, if they assume that their pockets are deeper than yours when it comes to ability to afford powerful legal representation. Imagine if as well as the actual money you got from the cash-back, you were also ordered by a court to pay their legal costs? That could be pretty tragic for your financial situation.

    Anyhoo, just a couple of hypothetical scenarios to consider…

    • mmd on 22/10/2014 - 00:58

      At THAT POINT is when you reveal the whole cash-back thing. So they will be getting the same benefit you have just asked for, and what you have asked for will also be 'covered' by the information/strategy you have just clued them up to… it would be pretty hard for them to actually deny you the pay-rise then, IMHO.

      Totally agree with Gnarly in the ideal world. However it all depends on your boss. If your owner is anything like my ex-boss, he would have gladly take the cash rewards idea, then turn around and still say he doesn't have enough money! What can you do then?
      If you can get it in writing or get the pay rise first, then by all means go ahead. But just think of the worst case scenario cos there some real Scrooge's out there.

      Edit: If it was my ex-boss, I would keep it. He would not have known anyways, since cashrewards operate as a third party. The DM invoices would still be charged to your boss with the correct amount that he paid.

  • [Deactivated] on 20/10/2014 - 23:57

    i should add that we also regularly buy stuff from coles and she has no problems with staff using their flybuys card when buying stuff for the business.

    • GnarlyKnuckles on 21/10/2014 - 00:07
      +1

      That's completely different hombre… I'm guessing the company does not have a FlyBuys account? Is it even possible for a company to have one? So in that case it is either no one gets anything, or the employee gets a (very small) perk.
      The situation you describe above involves between $200 and $300 a fortnight, that the company would be able to recoup themselves, if they knew about it. To put the difference in perspective, if you spend $200 at Coles, you get FlyBuys points to the value of, at the very most, $2.

  • chill on 21/10/2014 - 02:13
    +2

    This is not fraud and or a moral dilemma from an employment POV.

    The cash rewards affiliate marketing is a third party. If anything you may be breaking their terms and conditions but not your employers/you obligation to your employer.

    Your employer is obviously comfortable with the prices Dan Murphy's charge or they would be dealing direct with a wholesaler.

    Personally I am not so sure about the whole cash rewards thing anyway. Some of the discounts seem too large and I think this is only going to be a short term arrangement until they are either reduced, once more people know about it (such as the OP's boss) or cash rewards goes into administration with everybody's cash.

    How much would Dan Murphy's be paying cash rewards on a 10% discount?

  • Geewhizz on 21/10/2014 - 07:32

    The ethical issue aside, I don't see how you could be getting it in your name to get the cash rewards, while your employer also gets the necessary invoices etc for their own book keeping.

    Something else to consider is that if the tax dept ever got wind of it you'd be dead meat.

    • [Deactivated] on 25/10/2014 - 16:05

      Cash rewards are a 3rd party. Dan Murphy's invoices would say full price. Bonus money comes from cashrewards as they track the transaction.

      • Geewhizz on 26/10/2014 - 07:10
        -1

        … relevance? Surely, to qualify for the cashback you'd have to be logged in in your name? Employer needs receipts in their name.

        And however you want to look at it it would be income, so you'd have a shipload of undeclared income if the tax dept ever caught wind of it.

  • Elitebhy on 25/10/2014 - 14:35
    +1

    You could get 5% discount wishcards and save an extra 5% for your employer and ask for a bonus etc.

    • mmd on 26/10/2014 - 17:15

      Thats a better idea to test the water. If your boss does give you a pay rise, then you can further suggest the cashback scheme. If not, then you know how stingy your boss is…

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