Cheapest bargain car (station wagon) to keep and run

Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 09:00

Hey guys,
My mother in law is moving out to Aus and wants a station wagon in the sub-$2000 category.

I was looking at an old Volvo 240 because I've heard these run forever, but I've had some european cars in the past and the minute something goes wrong it costs a fortune, even for a service.

A friend recommended an old falcon or commodore wagon, but all I can find are backpacker cars that I'm worried will have been thrashed about the country.

Does anyone have any experience or recommendations in this area?

Thanks heaps.

Automotive

Comments

  • onlyletters on 07/05/2014 - 09:06
    +19

    Anything Toyota.

    • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 09:08
      +2

      Interesting. Is that because of reliability or parts/servicing costs?

      • StewBalls on 07/05/2014 - 10:24
        +17

        The answer is (D) All of the above ;)

    • mskeggs on 07/05/2014 - 09:10
      +5

      I agree, except Toyota seem to have a price premium at the very low end that makes it hard to get a good deal. Unbeatable, though, in my opinion for reliability and minimal repair/maintenance issues.

      • [Deactivated] on 07/05/2014 - 09:23

        I've recently bought a sub $2000 Toyota. Alot of people I have spoken to have spruiked their longevity.

        • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 09:28

          Do you mind sharing what year and model?
          Thanks :)

        • [Deactivated] on 07/05/2014 - 11:03

          1988 Camry… It has only done 94,000 kms! Although mine is a sedan, I have heard alot of positivity regarding Toyota.

        • Azn310 on 07/05/2014 - 13:03
          +8

          1988 with 94,000km? Either its 1,094,000km or someone winded it back especially just for you.

          Regardless, I agree Toyotas are the best, easy to maintain, cheap and will last a long time

        • nikey2k27 on 08/05/2014 - 08:09

          my nan has 2000 corolla with only 32,000 on the clock. she can no longer drive it. but still want to keep it. get service every year.

        • rawm on 08/05/2014 - 10:04
          -1

          You need to 'acquire' that thing ASAP and sell it before its 15 years old. It will still fetch a pretty sum. Buy nan a Box set of the Young and the Restless TV series.

        • uniqualz on 08/05/2014 - 11:08
          +1

          My Nan would spew if I bought her Y&TR, the feisty old bitch would insist on a Tolkien epic, or no car!

        • altomic on 10/05/2014 - 15:44

          spoke to an old guy at my local servo last night driving a 1979 liftback 4 door toyota corona. was in excellent condition with 90,000 kms. still had the plastic on the doors.

        • [Deactivated] on 12/05/2014 - 16:20

          Could of happened. I think it was owned by an old man and woman who didn't drive it. I found full records of the owners through the car, including a photocopy of their license. Been running pretty smooth too, but time will tell

  • mskeggs on 07/05/2014 - 09:08
    +3

    Consider also the Mitsubishi Magna wagon. We had one that kept going a long time. They are deeply unpopular/untrendy, so sell for even less than the holden/fords and parts and service are similarly readily available.

    • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 09:10
      +1

      Thanks! There seem to be about 3 generations of these pre-2001. Which did you have?

      • mskeggs on 07/05/2014 - 09:13
        +1

        A TF. We sold ours 5 or so years ago. If you are looking at an auto, make sure it goes into gear readily. If it makes a 'clunk' it indicates the transmission will need attention, although I have heard reports of them going another 100,000kms before they finally needed repair.
        Mind you, the same comment is true for all auto cars of this vintage.

        • montorola on 07/05/2014 - 10:47
          +4

          Can't go wrong with a Manual Transmission for older model cars

    • Speckled Jim on 08/05/2014 - 09:09

      My neighbour had a TN wagon (manual) for 12 years. He replaced it with a VT Commo wagon and was filled with much regret. Every time I saw him he'd have a whinge about it.

      A 91 TP manual wagon should be cheap as chips. It seems they all ended up in Tassie though.

      • Pizdets on 08/05/2014 - 15:36
        +2

        as a VT Commo owner, he is right. i'd avoid VT

        • Cheshire Cat on 09/05/2014 - 00:39

          As a VF calais station wagon owner I can say they have really hit their stride now….shame we won't have them for much longer:(

        • Jackson on 09/05/2014 - 22:42

          Or a VR, VS, or any common over a 10 year period. Too many problems, you will constantly have your hand in your pocket

    • zeomega on 08/05/2014 - 19:51

      Stay away from the V6 Magnas, they have a decent number of known problems. The V6 manifold makes it a pain to get to the spark plugs on one bank… and usually does not get touched cause of that.. or it'll cost more to service due to extra time needed.

      • Speckled Jim on 09/05/2014 - 09:47
        +1

        Platinum or Iridium plugs — problem solved.

        • pao2x on 09/05/2014 - 13:13

          True. Long life iridium is 90k or 6 yrs in my car handbook

        • zeomega on 09/05/2014 - 15:35

          Platinum or Iridium plugs — problem solved ….Until the next required spark service

          FTFY

          Problem would also be people bad maintenance by the previous owners as well. I've had a friend who changed out his FTO sparks, found the rear bank almost corroded away with the front bank fresh. The previous owner had his car regularly serviced at different places with log books.

          Some food for thought.

        • Speckled Jim on 10/05/2014 - 10:15

          Yes, for an old car it's often too late to lavish exxy plugs on them. BUT…if there's service records and you can determine regular copper plugs were changed regularly or they used better ones, it's a preferred candidate.
          For such a car, to save yourself the hassle of access to the plugs, it's worth spending a bit extra.

          Strictly DIY, I must add. Would you trust a mechanic to fit the good plugs? You could remove to check, but supposedly once they're seated they should be left as they can't be reseated properly. So as it's DIY I'd want the longest service life from them I could afford.

          But I stand by my original recommendation of a TP wagon (2.6 4 cyl). The current fuel excise issue means gas six or petrol four.

  • cvas on 07/05/2014 - 09:58
    +10

    I reckon a subaru liberty wagon. You can pick up the old 2WD non-turbos for pretty cheap. They are feckin reliable cars. I used to own the sedan version. It was perfect for maccas trays drifting

    • subywagon on 07/05/2014 - 10:14
      +2

      Obviously I agree with cvas ;) I've owned 10+ Subaru's. Very reliable. Very comfortable. And a very nice almost luxury ride when compared to other vehicles in it's class. You can pick up a nice Gen 1 or even Gen 2 AWD Wagon for around $2000 these days. Just watch out for ones with overheating problems, mostly means the head gasket is failing.

      Fords and Commodores would have been flogged, and Magnas have a bad rep, their version of the Mitsubishi motor is apparently weak and prone to failure - I looked into this when I needed a new motor for my Mitsubishi ute as there are a lot of cheap Magnas out there… for a reason.

      • StewBalls on 07/05/2014 - 11:12
        +5

        My last experience with Subaru involved prohibitively expensive servicing costs, has that changed somehow of late?

        • subywagon on 07/05/2014 - 14:08
          +1

          Oh I forgot about servicing as I service my own cars… general maintenance parts are normally more expensive than Ford, Commodore and Mitsubishi I think.

        • Speckled Jim on 08/05/2014 - 09:10

          Flat four, mounted low.

        • Jackson on 09/05/2014 - 22:44

          And I hear the outback have drive train issues, although it's every 250k qnd you may be able to live with that

        • Geewhizz on 10/05/2014 - 15:12

          Really? We're seriously considering leasing one: shall look into this. Thanks ….. I think.

      • ESEMCE on 07/05/2014 - 11:54
        +2

        The Magna 3.5L engine is superior to the older 3L. Has a very good reputation.

      • Gdsamp on 07/05/2014 - 19:45

        Hence your name.

      • TheOneWhoKnocks on 08/05/2014 - 18:44
        +2

        Once you feel that Subaru AWD power you will be hooked forever.

  • Almost Banned on 07/05/2014 - 11:11
    +1

    While I love the Subarus (still sad I sold my old Liberty) I drive a 2000 Ford Falcon AU II wagon and it just keeps going with no problems. Got a friend who drives a similar vintage Magna wagon and that seems to be ok too.

  • Cheeper on 07/05/2014 - 11:36
    +4

    With a budget of $2000 you want to focus on the car in the best condition for the money and not so much the make/model of the car.
    Toyota is the way to go but finding a good one under $2k will be a big ask.
    Sometimes it is far cheaper to spend a bit more on a newer car in better condition than to be paying out continuously for repairs to a bomb.

  • YTW on 07/05/2014 - 11:47

    I love my Volvo's and 240's are awesome if you can get a good one, 850's are pretty good too. I find with Volvo's you get more car for the price initially as most Australian's won't touch them. That said - you are right about the higher maintenance costs. A lot of mechanics don't know their way around a Volvo and if they do need a part they tend to order new - so cost a fortune. If you can find a local Volvo mechanic who does wrecking and second hand parts it will make it a lot cheaper though, and possibly worth your while.

    • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 13:12

      Yeh a friend had a 240 that he ran to 600,000km and more. The 940s he also swore by but said once the electronics came in around the 850s things got too unpredictable and expensive.
      Funnily enough the 240 sedans are often found for a bargain but wagons are snapped up fast.

      • YTW on 08/05/2014 - 16:36
        +1

        We had a 240 that was up to 450,000 when the odometer broke. Went for years after that. The body slowly wore out, but the engine never did. Never missed a beat.

        I'd agree on the unpredictability of the electronics, just your luck with the computers in the old, more modern cars. That's a big repair and not much you can do to get round it if it goes.

  • p1 ama on 07/05/2014 - 12:18
    +1

    At such a low price point, two things are going to matter most:

    1) Odometer reading
    2) Price of parts

    No matter how "reliable" a certain car is, if it has substantially more kilometers than another "reasonably reliable" car, then it won't be able to keep up in the long run.

    I would almost recommend sticking with the tried and true brands, the Falcons, Commodores, Camrys, Corollas…etc. because they are all known to be very reliable and their parts are cheap and widely available.

    Do your servicing at home and save yourself a few bucks too, but focus on looking for cars with low kms.

    • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 13:14

      Yeh I guess it's cost of parts that I'm worried about as well as even two of the same car with same km can encounter different problems.
      I thoroughly regret our purchase of an old A class Mercedes as it costs a mint to service or even have the smallest item of work done :(

  • Azn310 on 07/05/2014 - 13:06
    +3

    Toyota Camry comes in wagon, corolla hatchback is also good. Never touch old Falcon and Commodore, they are money pits when they age, you will go insane

  • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 13:19

    Seems like a Toyota is the winner, maybe Subaru a close second. And a manual at that.
    What's the view on Km?
    Normally I wouldn't look at anything over 150,000 but seems like these things are still going into the 350s so maybe a 200,000+ would be ok. Depending on service history I guess

    • ESEMCE on 07/05/2014 - 13:34
      +3

      Also depends where those KM's have been done.. If it's a country car or a rep car, the KM's have been on long stretches of 100Km/h so vastly preferable to a city car of the same Odo reading but stop/start increasing wear on everything.
      Do not understand the Falcon/Commodore comments.. Taxi's have been Falcons (with some Commodores) for many, many years for a reason. They go lot's of Km's with minimal servicing issues.
      The main problem with them will be that they're popular with Teenagers/twenty-somethings who drive them hard and don't maintain them. But there's still plenty that have been family/retiree workhorses. A Huge advantage for Falcon/Commodore is that they're Rear Wheel Drive, so no CV joints that WILL need replacing (fairly expensive job) if not already done so.

      Ditto Magna.. Thoroughly under-rated and therefore available at bargain prices, but Front Wheel drive. Popular with retirees.

      • mskeggs on 07/05/2014 - 17:00

        At about 200kms the Toyota service manual says a timing belt change is required, which is >$1000 service by the time all the other bits are done as well.
        If you are looking in this range, if it has been done you could happily look at 250k+. If it hasn't, it will fail badly at some point, leading to an unrepairable mess.

  • billy_bob on 07/05/2014 - 15:04
    +1

    If you care at all about safety, space, reliability, cheap parts then you should be looking at a BA Falcon Wagon. Check out howsafeismycare, 2002 Falcon gets 4stars and can be bought pretty cheap. Also come in a factory LPG variant, which is cheaper to run again:

    http://www.howsafeisyourcar.com.au/2002/Ford/Falcon/

  • mskeggs on 07/05/2014 - 17:01

    You haven't said how long you expect to keep the car. Is it for a few months for a visit, or for a few years?

    • Hoju on 07/05/2014 - 18:17
      +6

      Nah she's looking to move out here. So potentially an eternity. Or it could feel like it

  • Dr Techno on 07/05/2014 - 18:17

    Japanese anything should be good. Always research potential issues on google.. Some cars of certain years have time bomb issues waiting to happen. European cars will be more costly to maintain and dont go the distance.

  • Gdsamp on 07/05/2014 - 19:51
    +2

    A quick search on Whirlpool reveals many hits for Ford Falcons on Gas. Little wonder.
    Look for one AUII and above, as the AUs solved many of the head gasket problems of the E series. BAs are said not to handle well, can't comment as I only have a BF. Some find the AU ugly = depreciation.
    Had an EF Falcon w/Gas, ended up selling for scrap as the head gasket went. Unsure if the gas had anything to do with it, and Falcon taxis do >1 000 000km with regular servicing.

  • Wallyt99 on 07/05/2014 - 20:39
    +1

    I would second an AU series 2 on LPG. Good cheap car.

    Subarus are $$$ to fix - and Toyotas hold their value too well. By the time they are $2000 they are ready for the scrap heap.

  • cannedhams on 07/05/2014 - 20:47
    +1

    I grew up in a volvo 240. Reliable yes but they chew through the juice. Back then fuel was sixty cents so we didn't care too much. Bigger deal now though.

    If you want one second hand look out for rust and also the rear suspension which wasn't volvos best work.

  • BartholemewH on 07/05/2014 - 23:36
    +1

    I agree about the Falcon wagon. However, a BA wagon would likely be more than $2000 unless completely rooted, a mate paid $4k for a not perfect example a month ago. An AUII or AUIII is possible if you keep an eye out. I have an AUII as a spare car that was formerly my daily that has 220,000 k's on it and despite the wear on the steering wheel and the bubbled paint (some colours affected more than others) it is still a very comfortable vehicle with air con, power steer, power windows, ABS and dual airbags. It's much lazier to drive and rides more comfortably than my G6E Turbo.

  • rapoot6 on 08/05/2014 - 00:40

    I bet your mother in law would love an audi rs6 avant. Might have to stretch that budget though.

  • billp on 08/05/2014 - 03:22

    like 1000s b4 me 1) falcon, 2) townace/hilux, ive owned many for work, they are very reliable. one of my cars is a 94 hilux, 10 different people have driven it every week for 2years. Done the clutch & a few other bits, its incredible. I think the commercial toyotas are more robust & over engineered than most anything, but no, not strictly s/w, tho you could add a canopy

    cheers

  • Hoju on 08/05/2014 - 07:15

    Thanks everyone you guys are great.
    I hadn't considered a gas falcon so the AUii sounds like a good option. It seems that everything will have well over 200,000 but so do most taxis.

    If I can find a good Camry or liberty wagon they sound good too, but worry is that they hold their value well and so anything under $2000 will be a ticking time bomb or already a bomb

  • rickxs on 08/05/2014 - 08:17

    VT Commodore 1998-2001 LPG ? stick with petrol if she does low KM's

    http://goo.gl/vcPFd4 had to shorten the url to carsales .com.au

  • akpv on 08/05/2014 - 08:36
    +1

    Toyota AE95 Corolla! One with < 300k km Ugly but very very very very robust cars.

  • tanksinatra on 08/05/2014 - 09:02
    +1

    Bear in mind that registration is like $650-850/year. And then you'll also want third party property (TPP) insurance which is another ~$250/year. Thats about a grand a year. Older cars tend to be heavier on fuel, especially if its a six cylinder (ford falcon, holden commodore, mitsubishi magna). I used to average ~11.5L/100km in my falcon. Gets pretty expensive at $1.60 a litre. Beat-up cars will also need more parts replaced and maintained. Especially if the car hasn't been looked after.

    Make sure you factor all those costs in. If you're planning on keeping the car for a few years, buying a sub-$2k bomb doesn't really save a lot of money in the long run.

    If you do buy a <$2k car, make sure its been looked after (service history etc) and avoid buying any european (especially italian & french) cars. Parts can cost a fortune, if you can get them.

    A word of warning, a friend of mine bought a cheap sub-$2k peugeot. Admittedly a nice little car but the timing belt suddenly snapped and the car was a write-off. That same friend then bought a cheap alfa(sub $4k). Engine seized, probably due to skipped oil changes. Spent thousands on rebuilding the engine. Still didn't run well and they on-sold the car for a pittance.

    Cheap cars can be a false economy.

    • Hoju on 08/05/2014 - 15:43

      True, but I've kind of been burnt by cars in the $8000 range. A volvo, mercedes and VW all requiring >$2000 repairs within a year of purchase.
      Seems like I'd have been just as well off buying an older car and incorporating likely repair costs into the price :(

      • ESEMCE on 08/05/2014 - 16:14
        +3

        $8000 can get you an awesome, low mileage Japanese/Korean/Australian car..
        Your mistake is buying Euro Brands.
        Meaning they were
        1) older
        2) more expensive parts

        If budget isn't really an issue, I'd definitely be looking at the $8-10,000 range, for less than 100,000Km or less than 7 years old choices. You'll get a safer, more reliable and generally nicer vehicle.

  • The tiger on 08/05/2014 - 09:49
    +2

    Hi, a pity you are a bit too late. I had just disposed off my 2.4 l.Toyota Camay to a certain used car dealer. I bought this car in year 2001 and the mileage clocked st 180,000 plus, and timing belt had been changed . I sold this car as I had bought a new one and the new car deler was crazy by offering me $500.00 for trade in.Indeed it is a good car , free from maintenace, still drive on almost soundlessly.Funny the dealer did not try test my car at all. He just tuned on the engine and gave me an offer of $1,700.00 . I bargained a bit more but he stood on his ground..Much better then $500.00, so accepted it with appreciation.Warning an old Toyata ,like other types too, generally consumes more petrol than usual.

    • Hoju on 08/05/2014 - 15:42
      +1

      Nooooooooo!

  • septimus on 08/05/2014 - 16:09
    +1

    Ford AU falcon wagon on LPG. Cheap parts, cheap to run and they just keep driving.

  • jzx100 on 08/05/2014 - 16:16
    +1
    1. Toyota
    2. Donkey and carriage
    3. Everything else
  • doubleclutching on 08/05/2014 - 19:11
    +2

    Falcon on gas.

  • UncommonName on 09/05/2014 - 07:58
    +1

    Strange that nobody is mentioning Honda!

    • mskeggs on 09/05/2014 - 08:11
      +2

      Any honda under $2000 will have something wrong with it, or at the end of its life. Same comments made about Toyota price premium apply.

  • Hoju on 09/05/2014 - 08:16
    +1

    This toyota price premium thing has me worried! If I see a $1500 98 camry wagon with under 200,000km I now think there is something wrong with it and someone's offloading it. :(

    • Dr Techno on 09/05/2014 - 13:02
      +2

      Learn how to fix cars and then not so much an issue unless the engine is on its last legs.

      RWD Falcon/Commodore are easier to work on but wear out faster than Japanese cars.

  • RobotWizard on 09/05/2014 - 17:19
    +1

    Dude finding a good car with low price is just about luck,I've owned few cars, 94 toyota camry my first car, 94 festiva, falcon AU 99, mazda 626 94, also had a 94 suburu liberty wagon for a while, and my current daily drive BA falcon Wagon 2004, I am just sharing my experience, toyota camrys are great cars but bit over rated I guess, and it won't be easy finding old one in good condition at this price range no matter what car it is always look for newer model you can find had terrible experience with my mazda 626 parts coat 3 times more then ford/holden,suburu was a great car fun to drive but died at 450000 k's , if you want cheap parts and service go for ford or holden, they're bulletproof cars,people thrash these cars all the time, taxi's are good example, sorry for long comment but I think you should go for ford or holden you'll be one hapoy man, my car has 270xxx k's and drives like a dream.

    • Hoju on 10/05/2014 - 09:12

      Thanks!

  • effgee on 09/05/2014 - 17:46
    +1

    Forget the volvo, or anything euro, simply too expensive to fix when the inevitable happens.

    I've got an '89 Camry wagon (model SV21). It's been incredibly reliable, done 240k, the only thing major was gearbox in 2001. Very cheap motoring, but due for some work so I'm keen to get rid of it. I assume I'll get next to nothing for it. You still see plenty of them around - you should definietely be able to pick one up sub $2000

    Otherwise +1 to comments about Commodores, not quite as reliable, a little cheaper to fix but higher fuel cost

    Whatever you buy:
    1/ do your research first so your know what common faults to look for
    2/ make sure you check it out properly first, something like needing a clutch might cost $700 on top of what you pay for it.
    3/ condition counts for more than odo km, plenty of people out there still giving 'hair cuts'

  • AMLagonda on 09/05/2014 - 23:02

    I had my fair share of old Camrys (SV21) and I would never touch one again, but they sure are reliable (except the alternator!!) Really this thread will go nowhere as any old car will do as long as its been looked after and the Kms arnt too high.

  • figarow on 10/05/2014 - 09:22

    Any ex taxi falcon wagon on gas ftw

  • mousie on 10/05/2014 - 10:07
    +2

    I've bought a few cheap cars from auction. In 2004 a Ae92 corolla my93 @ $2500, did over 90,000km in it and it only cost me a $300 clutch. An Ea falcon for 1000, which did 70,000, but had computer problems and needed a suspension overhaul which cost $450. This is how the dealers respond on older trade ins and why red book stats seem ridiculous for pricing.

    Go for a manual if you can, you'll get a better feel for how the transmission health

    Disagree with comments on early Hondas and subies, Older jap cars except for Toyota seem to have head gasket problems of this vintage, until around 94 where it's all equal. Lancer wagons are great.

    • Speckled Jim on 10/05/2014 - 10:26

      Lancer wagons are great.

      +1
      Forgot about these!

      • Hoju on 11/05/2014 - 19:46

        Man they are seriously cheap. 98-2000 models seem to have no value, and sit at around $1000-2000? What gives - is it just because they are pretty hideous? I've seen a manual admittedly with 260,000km but only $900.

        Most of them are from dealers though, which I would plan to stay away from like the plague…

        • Geewhizz on 12/05/2014 - 05:58

          Yeah, they don't really hold their value. We're currently leasing one - the lease runs out end of next month, and the residual value will only be around 2 to 2.5K, and that's just 7 years old.

        • Speckled Jim on 12/05/2014 - 09:19

          Regardless of paint colour, they're very "beige" cars.
          Basic, built down to a price to compete with Korean product. Engineering is ok, but mainly because they're not high performance cars (non Evos).

          My only regret with getting an old Lancer is it's a carby fed model. I STILL haven't sussed it properly.

  • cannedhams on 12/05/2014 - 16:52

    Taxi services don't buy Ford Falcons because they're reliable. They buy Falcons because its a platform thats been around for a hundred years and never changes much and therefore its easy to keep their fleets looking relatively uniform. Also, the Japanese makers weren't making large sedans for a long time so taxi companies went with Ford and Holden largely by default and stuck with them because in the end Taxi companies are also pretty bloody conservative.

    UK taxi services sometimes use Skodas, basically because large Skoda sedans can be had fairly cheap. Take your chances if you think that means that Skodas are reliable.

    • ESEMCE on 12/05/2014 - 19:41

      Awesome theory apart from the fact that taxi's are privately owned businesses, not corporate owned.
      Time off the road = no money, so Taxis have to be reliable and reliable over huge distances. They also have to be cheap to run and maintain.
      Camry has been wide body for years but have only become taxis since the Hybrids. Falcons came in a Taxi pack which definitely sways their numbers, but there's still plenty of Commodore Taxis around.

      • cannedhams on 14/05/2014 - 20:52

        If anything taxi driving extends the life of a vehicle. A German mechanic who used to work in Stuttgart told me that Mercedes 300d diesels were used in Germany as taxicabs and they commonly did a million ks before conking out. This was because diesels are pretty efficient at idle and so those cars spent their lives sitting in taxi ranks gently turning over. I used to drive a 300d and the thing lost compression at the rate of knots reliable car my arse.

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