The State of Ultrabooks

ProspectiveDarkness on 10/03/2014 - 00:21
Last edited 10/03/2014 - 00:32

The state of ultrabook here is atrocious. Pretty much the only options that are good value for money are Macs, and the Surface devices - neither of which technically qualify as ultrabooks. I don't know if it's entirely the manufacturers to blame or the retailers, but 90% of what I can see is just overpriced, mid range crap with nary an SSD, thin profile or decent display to be seen. Here's hoping things look up after Computex in June - though it'll probably all be overpriced and will subsequently drop off the shelves when, amazingly, it doesn't sell well.
There's absolutely no competition whatsoever.

  • Samsung hasn't released much at all since 2012, with the exception of the mid range Ativ Book 9 Lite and the atrociously priced Ativ Book 9 Plus ($2400, really?) - neither of which are widely available. They announced a single model earlier this year, but we've seen nothing of it and if their previous 15" model is any indication, it'll be expensive.
  • Sony's VAIO department is now dust and echoes.
  • Asus seems to be putting out a million and one low to mid range models in the hopes of fooling you into buying one - their ZenBooks are nowhere to be seen. They've been on the verge of releasing a new model for what seems like a year.
  • HP isn't doing anything.
  • Lenovo only just got the Yoga 2 Pro to Australia, and even then it's only one configuration at $2000.
  • Dell's XPS 13 line is only sold on their site and starts at $1800 - the smaller models are terrible value for money.

Whatever actually does get manufactured, it seems like the retailers go insane with their markups and make everything prohibitively expensive. Looking on half the retailers now is like stepping back in time. So what are we left with? What happened to the good old quality 13", 128GB/i5/4GB for -$1300 of 2012? Seems like everyone just gave up.
/rant

Computing Ultrabook

Comments

      • jacknthebeanstalk on 12/03/2014 - 21:15

        graysonline - haven't bought anything from them though. They have mixed reviews.

        and

        Wireless1.

        This website also helps http://www.staticice.com.au/

        type in the model of whatever electronic product you're after and it lists current prices found at different retailers.

    • Astro551 on 12/03/2014 - 09:35

      How long does the batt life last in the end?

      • jacknthebeanstalk on 12/03/2014 - 21:16
        +1

        I get 3.5 hours. Maybe 4 hours with no backlight keyboard and low brightness.
        It's good enough for me, I mean my lectures don't go any longer than 2 hours.

        I read the Toshiba z930 has a 6 - 7 hour battery life.

    • BaryGusey on 25/03/2014 - 15:25

      Was going to buy one of these yesterday for $550 - (refurbished z930, decided to sleep on it and it's gone up $140 overnight!

  • OBone on 11/03/2014 - 22:24

    At the risk of getting flamed, I'll toss up the LG Z360 as a possible contender.
    http://www.lg.com/au/laptops/lg-Z360
    Not my first brand choice by a long shot, but I was offered a near new one for a good price reduction so I took a punt.
    Harvey Norman also had them on discount for $1100 or so a few weeks back which originally attracted my attention.
    FHD IPS display, 128GB SSD, 4GB ram, but Ivy Bridge cpu and no touch screen (not a bother for me though).
    For the price I am happy with it so far.
    From what I read recently there is also a replacement on the way with even higher resolution screen and Haswell cpu.

    • mrmarkau67 on 12/03/2014 - 10:27
      +2

      I'm not going to flame you, but I think you kinda prove what the OP said.
      * You can't find that model on Shopbot or Staticice
      * It runs a 3rd gen i5
      * 4MB RAM and 128GB SSD
      * 1080p
      * Intel 4000 graphics
      * All for $1800 RRP

      For $1850 RRP you can get a Macbook Pro with Retina display
      * Easily available at Apple Stores and retailers all over the place
      * 4th gen i5
      * 8MB RAM and 256GB SSD (and the SSD is PCIe, which is faster)
      * Intell 5000 graphics
      * 1600p

      The Mac is basically twice as good in every spec, easily available, and …. if you had a "near new" one you needed to get rid of in a hurry, you'd get almost what you paid for it. Did you get your LG for around $800-$900?

      • OBone on 12/03/2014 - 21:13
        +1

        I think LG are dreaming with that RRP. Of course, you'd have to be bonkers to pay that.
        I'd set my own price at $1200 for such a device and the OP is right, there's nothing with decent spec. for that amount.
        But the actual price at Harvey was <$1200, which is why I noticed it initially and mention it now. That was marked down from their regular price of $1399. I think Harvey might be the sole supplier which is why you won't find it on staticice, etc.
        Even at that discounted price I was still eyeing off the Sony Vaio Pro as LG is not my first choice, for anything.
        But the LG had one feature that I really liked and that is 2x microSD slots.
        I'd even considered the Macbook Pro (briefly) but for my own reasons I just couldn't bring myself to do it.
        Then by coincidence I heard about this LG that I bought through a friend, and yes, it was a bit less than $800 (1 month old and 11months warranty).
        Of course I would've liked Haswell too if I could get it, but there's still very few with it right now.

        • mrmarkau67 on 12/03/2014 - 21:43

          Less than $800 was a great price for that. Just goes to show that if you are patient and prepared to go "pre-loved" there is some real value to be had.

        • Astro551 on 29/03/2014 - 15:37
          +1

          I'd thought I'd comment on this seeing as I saw this in a recent catalogue. I was intrigued by LG's entrance into the ultrabook market. It was priced at ~$1400 in the catalogue, but I've seen it ~$1k on ozb before.

          Doing more research it looks like a piece of junk. While it has been updated with Haswell graphics, I had to double check I wasn't reading the review wrong when it talked about battery life.

          Sure, it’s a thin and light laptop with loads of power, but that unfortunately results in a terrible battery result on the other side of the equals sign. Idle battery tests (where the computer is left in a low-power state with most of its ancillary systems turned off) garnered a result of just four hours and 14 minutes of juice. A stress test (where the CPU and integrated GPU are stretched by constantly refreshing an OpenGL animation) meant that the device only got one hour and 31 minutes. And that’s a problem.

          I had to double check this:

          It managed a time of only 3hr 34min in our rundown test, in which we disable power management, enable Wi-Fi, maximise screen brightness, and loop a video file.

          source - PC World

          Did I read that right? 4 hours on their IDLE test. This is a freaking Haswell device. oh dear, LG please stop. Go back to making TV's or something.

          I remember when all the Windoze users (myself included) bashed Apple for their elaborate pricing and insane profit margins. Hey, at least they know how to make a quality product. What in the world is the state of Intel Ultrabooks, think I'm just gonna buy an inferior product because it has that label slapped on it, think again.

        • OBone on 21/10/2014 - 22:44

          @Astro551:
          I realise this is a bit late, but I'll point out a couple of things that might make a difference to those test results. I have the earlier i3 version as mentioned above (not Haswell.)
          First thing I found was that the brightness level was eye watering when turned up to maximum. I have it set to something less than 1/3 of full brightness and still find it more than adequate for my purposes. Brightness is probably the biggest drain on the battery under normal use. The PC World test had the brightness set to full and I don't think that's a fair test to use to compare any laptop as "full" will be something different on each one.
          When I first got mine I did a video loop test from 100% charge with a comfortable brightness level and got around 4 hours, if I recall. Further down in the comments, the reviewer all but agrees that 7 hours might be possible, with good management. In any case, they still gave it a 4.5 out of 5 rating.
          Secondly, I don't know if this is normally the case when purchased brand new, but when I got mine the battery was set to charge only to 80% capacity. It can be changed from within Windows or BIOS, if needed. But apparently, charging only to 80% or so is a way to extend the service life of the Lithium battery when it is continually plugged into the mains. What those reviews don't say is whether their test laptop was charged to 100% or 80% before they ran their tests. I did actually pose the question in the PC World comments but didn't get any reply. To this day, I still charge mine only to 80% as it's almost always plugged in.

  • striker5950 on 12/03/2014 - 15:15
    +2

    Great post mate, ive been refreshing ozbargain every couple of hours for the past 2 weeks in hopes for an ultrabook deal, i really need one for uni coz the ipad just aint gona cut it, this is my 4th semester and im really starting to need one to take to class with me.
    And you are right mac book air is the best bang for buck, but it being osx just dosent work for me, people who said do a duel boot, even if you do that its still not gona function as a real windows machine.
    Other competitors are insane with their pricing,
    $2000 for a samsung ativ nine plus, what the hell am i gona do with a 13 inch 3200x1800 res screen!
    Next is the acer s7 cheapest atm is 1614 from DS which is still way over priced and medicore battery life.
    The last option which is the closest contender to the mac price wise is the sony vaio pro 13,
    Now the price in Christmas holidays was $1099 from shopping express, cheapest now is a whopping $1350. One would think it would go down but its the opposite.
    it has all the specs of mac book plus more, full hd touch screen, made from carbon fiber, the best price for the vaio pro 13 is $1350 atm and ive already ordered one, ill be picking it up in 1 hour:p

    • ozhunter on 12/03/2014 - 15:18

      its still not gona function as a real windows machine

      how does it not?

      • striker5950 on 12/03/2014 - 15:24

        Because it will lack the drivers and hardware to fully utilise windows 8 and its features, almost all windows ultrabook with windows 8 utilise the touch screen which would be non existent on a mac air

        • ozhunter on 12/03/2014 - 18:51

          Apart from hardware limitations(which I think is only no touchscreen), I don't see any other way it doesn't function as a real windows machine.

      • Riczter on 12/03/2014 - 15:56

        What are the windows drivers for Mac like these days? Just curious.

        • ozhunter on 12/03/2014 - 18:52

          Not sure, but once I installed windows via bootcamp, everything was working fine.

  • tanksinatra on 12/03/2014 - 20:32

    Great post. This echoes the concerns I had over two years ago. Finding a quality well built rigid ultrabook with good battery life at a price less than a macbook air was almost impossible. They were either shitty plastic, heavy or expensive.

    It doesn't make any sense… surely a non-premium pc should be cheaper than the sleek aluminium mac?

    Anyway, we ended up settling for a HP Folio 13.

    • mrmarkau67 on 12/03/2014 - 20:36

      It doesn't make any sense… surely a non-premium pc should be cheaper than the sleek aluminium mac

      That's what you'd think. But never mind, just wait 18-24 months. A secondhand non-premium PC is way cheaper than a secondhand Mac.

  • misu p on 13/03/2014 - 08:55
    +1

    This one would suit you fine except I do not know the battery performance
    http://www.logicalblueone.com.au/store/557-horize-w230st-cle…

    However having a video card and a hungry i7 might have a big impact on the battery performance.

    They also have a 11" http://www.logicalblueone.com.au/store/523-horize-w110er-not… that might be a interesting start (the resolution is not the best but it is a 11"), just make sure you get an SSD.

    Not quite ultrabooks because of the battery but good priced i believe.

    • mrmarkau67 on 13/03/2014 - 09:20
      +2

      The 13" W230ST is a beautifully specified beast of a notebook, but it its expensive ($1500 with Windows) and it is a very long way from being an Ultrabook.
      * Ultrabooks are 20mm or less in thickness, and this one is 32mm
      * Ultrabooks use low voltage Intel processors, and this one doesn't
      * Ultrabooks have 6+ hours battery life and this one would be lucky to do 3 hours

      I would personally prefer a PC like this to an Ultrabook or a Mac (upgradeable RAM and space for 3 SSDs!), but its a different kind of beast.

  • seele on 13/03/2014 - 16:39

    i am actually looking at the acer c720 chrome book as an alternative, i hear u can run linux pretty smoothly and the battery is great, its no ultrabook, but pretty close. just a bit sad that its 400 bucks here.

  • Rodgort on 13/03/2014 - 16:56

    I'm strongly considering the Horize W550SU-1 Ultranote, or the Horize W650SJ Ultranote. It looks like a really good Ultrabooks to me, thoughts?

    • Lions44 on 13/03/2014 - 19:15

      Look up the 840SN, it can be marketed as Clevo. Bought one a month ago and very happy so far, only complaint is some screen bleed but it's unnoticeable when something is on the screen. It only weighs 1.8kg as well.

      EDIT: Blue Logical One (who I got mine through with the ozbargain deal in January) don't seem to stock it anymore but here's a link for another place. http://www.affordablelaptops.com.au/contents/en-us/d454_meta…

      • bhm133 on 18/03/2014 - 14:36

        How is the battery life??? Do you get the 9 hour advertised life?

  • striker5950 on 13/03/2014 - 20:05

    macbook air 13" is 1124 now at DSE 10% off
    also macbook pro retina 13" is 1439 10% off
    if you can be bothered with duel boot its worth waiting because there are rumors that a new macbook air is coming out in june refresh with a retina display so its worth waiting 3 months..

  • jace88 on 14/03/2014 - 04:07

    I think you need to try a mac running windows on boot camp before you make a call like that- I've been using boot camp since white MacBook days (07) and right from the start it's been pretty much flawless- especially now with all the drivers for every feature ready for you (originally some less important things were missing but now you even have your advanced trackpad and keyboard features).

    As mentioned elsewhere on this thread, apart from non touchscreen hardware limitations, windows runs perfectly. It's native after all and all the drivers are spot on. If anything, I've found max hardware having such limited variability in components has made it much easier because driver packages work and it's not hard to isolate an issue if you have one. If you want to totally rid yourself of mac, you could always format as some companies do.

    • striker5950 on 14/03/2014 - 14:56

      yeah i guess you have a point there, ill wait and see what the next itteration of macbook air has to offer

  • [Deactivated] on 14/03/2014 - 16:00

    Samsung 14 inch is pretty good. But you need to get the pro version otherwise the battery life is poor.

  • cheepwun on 15/03/2014 - 07:30
    +1

    Intel really should make their own "reference" devices and sell them. Similar to what Google does with their phones. Get someone else to build to their specs.

    After all, shouldn't they be leading the charge?

    • jace88 on 15/03/2014 - 08:47

      They could do that… but can't help but think that if their ultimate goal is to push more chips, this seems like a pretty expensive marketing exercise.

      • cheepwun on 15/03/2014 - 08:56

        If Google is doing it (getting others to make their own branded devices for them), I think Intel are pretty capable of doing the same thing pretty easily and cheaply since they have massive distribution networks already built up along with manufacturing partners (for their own branded desktop mainboards, etc).

        The result of them doing something like this (of course) would be selling more chips and showing the others in the biz "how it's done" by leading the charge in the very segment they are trying to push. They don't have to sell a quadzillion for this to be a success and to get many others emulating or trying to beat them in some area, pushing the whole segment forward. I see it as a pretty cheap exercise, all things considered. Their brand is known worldwide and they could push the 'ultrabook' into the public consciousness more.

        • Feepitee on 16/03/2014 - 19:33

          Intel is comparable to Snapdragon, not Google. I'm pretty sure all Snapdragon has ever built outside of mobile phone chips is a smartwatch. What you're asking for by using Google as an example is for Microsoft to provide reference devices, which they have, it's called the Surface and it sold horribly.

        • ProspectiveDarkness on 16/03/2014 - 20:16

          Snapdragon

          Qualcomm*

          And the situation doesn't really boil down so simply. Intel might provide the chips as Qualcomm does, but it also specifically created the ultrabook branding itself and sets the criteria for the branding. Intel has a stake in ultrabooks' success just as much as Google does Nexus devices - whereas Microsoft doesn't have much stake in it at all. Their Windows licenses will be sold on high end or low end devices, it's all the same to them.

          Intel and Google are different in their purposes, yes, but both would benefit from the success of reference devices in driving the market forward. Comparisons aside, the succes of the platform is all that matters to them.

        • cheepwun on 17/03/2014 - 13:34

          And the situation doesn't really boil down so simply. Intel might provide the chips as Qualcomm does, but it also specifically created the ultrabook branding itself and sets the criteria for the branding. Intel has a stake in ultrabooks' success just as much as Google does Nexus devices

          This is exactly my point, thanks.

    • mrmarkau67 on 17/03/2014 - 15:21

      Intel does do reference designs, but they don't sell them.

      http://www.extremetech.com/computing/145024-intel-at-ces-has…

      They do make and sell NUC, so I am thinking that they may be staying out of notebook market out of respect for their customers. Ummmmn. Maybe out of respect for their biggest customer. Apple.

  • Callison on 16/03/2014 - 14:54

    I've got an Acer Aspire S7. You can get it used relatively cheap off gumtree but the battery isn't good (but you can't expect it to be great when it's so thin and has decent specs).

    • mrmarkau67 on 17/03/2014 - 15:25

      Love the idea of an Ultrabook with an SSD RAID array in it. Aren't you getting 6 hours plus battery life?

  • saneo on 24/03/2014 - 10:38

    Anyone have any idea/theories when this might turn around? Haswell has been around for over (?) a year now - is the market going to be getting a bunch of new products soon?

    I was looking at the Toshiba z930 which looked pretty good. Most websites sell it for $1,300 but it can be had for a little over $1k. Unpleasantly surprised to read in whirlpool that the lower price was acheivable almost two years ago. Wow.

    • Riczter on 24/03/2014 - 11:01

      Broadwell (the successor to Haswell) is being released later this year (Q3). So we will start to see manufacturers updating their product lines and stores clearing the old stock at reduced prices. So that will give us some more bargains, but beyond that, I'm kind of expecting more of the same unfortunately :/
      The release hit some production issues and was delayed one or two quarters so I'm guessing this could lead to a period of stagnation in the market as manufacturers hold off releasing new models until the new chips are available.

    • saneo on 26/03/2014 - 16:02

      I got so sick of waiting (almost two years). I just managed to buy a Samsung 9 series (i5 3rd gen, 128gb ssd) at Online Computer for $999 today. Knowing my luck, i'm sure prices will start dropping in the next month!

  • murkywater on 21/10/2014 - 20:39

    Not sure if i should bump this, but what the heck, it's still relevant.

    Looking for an ultrabook for my friend, the only ones that aren't a total ripoff are the Macs and Surface Pro. This is so pathetic…

    Will probably have to go hunting at dell outlet.

    • Riczter on 21/10/2014 - 21:59

      I was going to talk about how broadwell is being released later this year…. but realised I already did 7 month ago haha…. see above. Not much seems to have changed in the past 7 months, I'm still holding out hope that the release of new broadwell laptops will give us something to look forward to, but maybe i'm being naiive.

      • mrmarkau67 on 22/10/2014 - 00:09
        +2

        The brutal economics haven't changed. Apple can make Ultrabooks cheaper than the other manufacturers, so they sell more, so they can get components cheaper, and so on.

        Plus they only sell about 5 different models, which sell with only minor changes for years, so their engineering would be cheaper.

        If Apple was feeling any kind of competitive pressure, Macbook Airs would have slimmed down their horrible huge bezels and gotten Retina screens.

        • murkywater on 22/10/2014 - 01:55

          I don't think it's really a matter of only Apple being able to offer those prices. If you look overseas, most of these competitors have fairly competitive pricing - Lenovo, Acer, Dell, Samsung, etc.

          They just don't seem inclined to offer us those prices.

        • mrmarkau67 on 24/10/2014 - 11:58

          @raven2000: \

          Which markets? There are always occasional bargains, but what market has perennially cheaper Lenovo or Samsung Ultrabooks?

      • lambsie on 24/10/2014 - 10:04

        The Yoga 2 Pro seems decently priced at the moment at JB I believe. Though I do realise Yoga 3 now has Broadwell…Decissions decissions…

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