Advice for accounting graduate?

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  tanoshiiki on 27/02/2014 - 16:57

  Why are you focusing on firms and not industry/commercial or public sector? Just a question.

  • 

    hahaboy on 27/02/2014 - 17:40

    As a graduate, those things are quite open. You start specialising over time into a particular industry/sector as you gain the skills and work with more clients/projects etc.

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  ThePistonHead on 27/02/2014 - 17:46

  I am in a similar position, recently beginning work at an accounting/FP practice with ~40 staff, and the culture is much better than what you describe.

  If I were you, I would NOT resign unless i had another job secured. With that in mind, speak to some recruiters, who may be able to refer you to contacts in smaller firms. I would mention a summary of what you posted here (pump yourself up) in discussions with recruiters, and see what they say.

  Be prepared to take a decent pay cut.. 5-10k.

  • 

    hahaboy on 27/02/2014 - 18:00

    Thanks for your reply!

    Ah that's good to hear. Can you give some insight into what you find culturally different?

    I'll see if I can have a chat with some recruiters too. Any starting points? or just CA/networking nights?

    I've been keeping a look-out for roles, and I did notice the slight drop in pay. Tbh, I'm fine with that currently in life, as I don't have any substantial loans/debts. Also, the over-time hours as well as travel to/from work probably evens out the actual hourly rate between roles.

    Any idea how much the gap increases over time, as you get promoted/change roles?

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  Almost Banned on 27/02/2014 - 18:20

  I commend you for starting to look at the big picture so early in your career.

  What I suggest is you start to think about where you want to be when you are 50 - career wise - and then work out the pathway which will best get you there.

  I know I probably spent too long at the place I work and am now wondering if I missed my jumping off point.

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  [Deactivated] on 27/02/2014 - 18:43

  There are a couple of good threads for accounting grads on whirlpoolforums, you might want to do a search.

  I would generally recommend sucking it up for a few more years till you get a promotion or two, and then heading over to a smaller firm with your cpa/ca in hand. (Basically, finish your cpa/ca asap)

  At the end of the day, I think end salaries are still higher at the bigger firms, but the (terrible) lifestyle doesn't change. Things may have changed recently though.

  Another alternative is to move to somewhere with better work hours (smaller firm, govt) and run a tax (or whatever) business on the side. Especially good with govt jobs - I know an accountant who runs his tax business on the side of his govt job, and basically takes heaps of sickies and annual leave during peak tax season. Of course, this might not lead to an immediate work/life balance improvement, but in time you can quit your job and focus on your business.

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  horsome on 27/02/2014 - 19:40

  Unfortunately if you wanna keep your options open you will need to stick it out at the big 4 firm. Recruiters, HR depts from any industry will take the fact you are from big 4 in high regard, not that its justified, just a fact of life.

  Small firms are not worth it IMO, and you'll be thriving for the corporate culture once you experience small business owner culture, not to mention sub par training and experience.

  You still have so much to learn and need to find a way to ignore all the BS, if you just focus on doing a good job, the rest will take care of itself as you will be known as someone who can get the job done, and hence respected.

  See this for the opportunity and not the $$$, you are putting in the hours to invest in yourself to be a better and worthy professional. It beats laying bricks.

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  nevbuster on 27/02/2014 - 21:09

  +2

  Get pissed and laid. You're young, stop taking life so seriously !

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  blueskyfridays on 27/02/2014 - 21:12

  +1

  Are you in External Audit? Irrespective all the Big 4 firms have an element of brown nosing. I doubt you are overqualified. Some people prefer the smaller firms as they are less about you being a 'resource' and more about being a person.

  I'm a CA myself and would give you the following advice:

  • Don't leave before a year - won't look good on your CV
  • Besides the options you list, moving into commerce in a grad rotational program is still an option for you in large companies
  • Having worked at a Big 4 myself, the training is fantastic and you won't get this in Commerce to that extent
  • The mid-tier and smaller firms don't necessarily have the same progression opportunities but there are lots of examples of Snr Mgrs etc moving across to smaller firms and being partner.

  Make your choices when you're in your 20's. When you get to your 30's and you get a decent salary, mortgage, commitments etc it is very hard to change without a drastic change in lifestyle.

  Your questions:

  Questions for everyone:
  1) Where does option c lead me in 3-5 years? Am I on par with a grad from a top/mid-tier firm in terms of applying to manager roles etc? Yes you would be but it is dependent on which area you are in. You'll need to do the CA. Probably on the upper end scale of the 3-5 years …
  2) Can I go back to the bigger companies/industry if I need higher income as my life unfolds? Yes - very common for people to leave once they get CA qualified.
  3) How wide is the income gap between option a and c over time? Is the income gap significant enough I ignore work-life balance for financial security? - Depends where you are. E.g. audit vs M&A or consulting
  3) Should I toughen up for a couple years; take the crap from the big firms and continue? - Depends what your values are and if you need the money and security.
  4) Am i throwing away a perfectly good career, when i have worked hard all my life? If you do the CA, you need to like really like accounting to do it as a career otherwise seek alternative pathways in Consulting, Strategy, Decision Support etc…

  Hope this helps

  • 

    Realsteel on 28/02/2014 - 09:43

    This is brilliant advice.

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  donbot on 28/02/2014 - 09:00

  Wear it for a few years - be it at a Big 4 or Mid-Tier (I went the Mid-tier path) and then by the time you're done your CA, you'll have 3-4years experience behind you at a reputable firm and moving into a decent job - be it within a big/med/small firm or commerce/government will be a lot easier than if you shuffle around firms without it. Plus - the training and support in the larger firms is there - I've worked at a smaller firm after gaining CA and the graduate (yes, 1) had little in way of specific training/support whereas at the larger firm there was a group of grads that had a much better support/training situation.

  TL,DR: Stick it out and get your CA at a Big4/Midtier. Regardless of its merit - people view experience with big firms very positive and will only help you down the track.

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  tokziktigah on 28/02/2014 - 10:08

  My advice would be not to leave now given it's only been <1 year. If you leave now, it would raise more questions from your job history rather than give you the boost that most people slog out those years in a Big 4 for. Wait until you finish your CA and if you can, make senior accountant. The pay rise from accountant to senior accountant can be around 20% (depending on your ratings) which only takes about 2-3 years. This also gives you a lot more bargaining power if you decide you want to jump to role in commercial. I'm not sure about the pay rises in mid or smaller tier firms.

  After 3 years and you want to leave, you'll find it very easy to leave if that's what you still want to do and find a role elsewhere. Most companies want people with CA and 3-5 years of experience and recruiters will come calling as well.

  If you don't like life outside the Big 4 you can always return but the rate of return of people who have worked less than 1 year as a graduate are probably much lower than a senior or manager leaving and returning.

  And if you're thinking about commercial, the pay rises and promotions can be smaller and less frequent. At least with the Big 4 you know each year you'll be rising up the ranks and getting a pay increase with promotions paying close to 20% more and progressions a bit less.

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  No ONE on 09/05/2015 - 17:33

  Hey op,
  interested to know if you are still working at Big 4.

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    hahaboy on 09/05/2015 - 19:12

    +2

    Nope. Not sure what i'm doing in life, but moved from big4 to a smaller private company (~$20m year turnover) for a little while. Really enjoyed it. Great hours, good people, and mental health improved.

    Managed to land another graduate role in industry (another huge firm), so i decided to take it up as I can always come back to a smaller company if i like, but i can't always do it the other way around. Enjoying the current role more than Big4 and getting paid better too.

    Message me, if you've got any other questions :)